ESPN goes after Patriots throat.

[The King]

http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/9/8/9275433/espn-patriots-spygate-deflategate-roger-goodell-bill-belichick

[Night Train]

God, I just want to beat the Pats week 2 and sack Brady until he cries. I am so sick of them.

[Turf]

http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/9/8/9275433/espn-patriots-spygate-deflategate-roger-goodell-bill-belichick

Been listening all morning about it and reading. Patriots look like venom, Kraft, Bellicheck, Goodell, maybe Brady? The QB's never knew?
What a farce of an operation. I hope they become if they are not already, the most hated team in football.
What Spartacus, did you say something you idiot?

[Forward_Lateral]

I wonder how much of all of it is true. If even half of it is, the NFL is majorly corrupt. How Roger still has his job is beyond me. That guy should've been fired about 10 times.

[Strongman]

So the Cheatriots taped 40 opposing teams that Goodell promptly destroyed. That's quite a bit more than the 6 tapes Goodell said were destroyed in 2007.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/25294235/report-patriots-taped-40-opposing-teams-nfl-destroyed-tapes

[Mad Bomber]

My favorite line in that article was:

"Stealing signals wasn't always an advantage, but it did help them against the less sophisticated teams, like the Dolphins and Bills."

[DynaPaul]

I've been saying this since it originally happened and most people think I sit around at home with a tinfoil hat on. They haven't stopped cheating and never will as long as Belichick and Adams are around. Since SpyGate they've only figured out better methods to hide what they're doing. Goodell tried to finally lay the hammer down on them with the deflated balls, mainly to quell the other owners, and that blew up in his face. The enemy here isn't the commissioner, it's this team and their owner who don't give a flying $%#^ about sportsmanship and stopping the NFL from becoming the MLB and NBA.Well, too late - the shield is tarnished now mainly because Goodell covered up SpyGate to try and NOT tarnish the shield. Once those lies spin out of control it becomes a bigger disaster down the road and he should have taken the hit back then.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

"Looking back on it, several former Patriots coaches insist that spying helped them most against less sophisticated teams -- the Dolphins and Bills chief among them -- whose coaches didn't bother changing their signals."

ughhhhh

[Strongman]

I love this paragraph:

"In fact, many former New England coaches and employees insist that the taping of signals wasn't even the most effective cheating method the Patriots deployed in that era. Several of them acknowledge that during pregame warm-ups, a low-level Patriots employee would sneak into the visiting locker room and steal the play sheet, listing the first 20 or so scripted calls for the opposing team's offense. (The practice became so notorious that some coaches put out fake play sheets for the Patriots to swipe.) Numerous former employees say the Patriots would have someone rummage through the visiting team hotel for playbooks or scouting reports. Walsh later told investigators that he was once instructed to remove the labels and erase tapes of a Patriots practice because the team had illegally used a player on injured reserve. At Gillette Stadium, the scrambling and jamming of the opponents' coach-to-quarterback radio line ... occurred so often that one team asked a league official to sit in the coaches' box during the game and wait for it to happen. Sure enough, on a key third down, the headset went out."

[Parzival]

http://deadspin.com/bombshell-espn-report-the-patriots-were-huge-cheaters-1729286402

Tony Dungy stated on the Dan Patrick show a few weeks ago that while he was the coach of the Colts, Peyton Manning would refuse to talk strategy in the locker room convinced it was bugged. To clarify he was not stating whether or not the room was actually bugged, but that Manning and other coaches were suspicious enough to actually only talk game planning outside the room.

[Strongman]

Patriots owner Robert Kraft mingled with Judge Richard Berman, who overturned the NFL suspension of Tom Brady over his alleged role in Deflategate, at a Hamptons Labor Day party full of media and business power brokers.
Kraft was chatting with Berman at Discovery Communications chief David Zaslav and his wife Pam’s party at their East Hampton estate, also attended by Oprah Winfrey, Martha Stewart, Harvey Weinstein, Lloyd Blankfein, NY Giants co-owner Jon Tisch and wife Lizzie, Katie Couric, and Hilaria and Alec Baldwin.

http://pagesix.com/2015/09/06/robert-kraft-deflategate-judge-chat-at-hamptons-media-party/

[Novacane]

A couple well timed penalty flags is all the NFL needs to do to settle the score. There's not a damn thing any judge can do about that

[trapezeus]

alot of people have been saying this for years. there have been books on it. their stats are complete outliers. it's clear as day they are doing stuff that no other team is doing. and frankly, i don't think they've really found the thing they are doing.

in the end, the nfl should just hold them to the same rules the other 31 teams face on game day. no more momentum turning 3rd down flags and 4th down flags. the NFL can ensure the refs call a fair game. and that hasn't been the case during this run.

i think it will be interesting to see how the pats are treated by the zebras. if nothing changes, then i'm sure it's going to be the same old same old and the NFL converted a disasterous story into more money. they literally just have to keep the fickle pat fans engaged. the other 31 teams actually have football fans for decades. and we've stayed with the league even as we know its rigged.

[Skooby]

Well obviously the Pats wouldn't of deflated any balls for an advantage.

[Turf]

The soon most hated franchise and sports team in the history of American Sports, the New England Patriots with their "oh gosh I don't know I just get the plays and balls and run them" Brady.

[Strongman]

alot of people have been saying this for years. there have been books on it. their stats are complete outliers. it's clear as day they are doing stuff that no other team is doing. and frankly, i don't think they've really found the thing they are doing.

in the end, the nfl should just hold them to the same rules the other 31 teams face on game day. no more momentum turning 3rd down flags and 4th down flags. the NFL can ensure the refs call a fair game. and that hasn't been the case during this run.

i think it will be interesting to see how the pats are treated by the zebras. if nothing changes, then i'm sure it's going to be the same old same old and the NFL converted a disasterous story into more money. they literally just have to keep the fickle pat fans engaged. the other 31 teams actually have football fans for decades. and we've stayed with the league even as we know its rigged.

There is no way the officials didn't know about this since it appears to be pretty common knowledge throughout the league. They'd have to be living in a vacuum to not know. It leads me to believe they are paid off in some way.

[Turf]

Goodell needs to go. I've been behind him trying to keep the integrity of the game, but clearly he lacks his own. He should never have swept this under the rug. Then the next time he tries to do the right thing and gets screwed. He can't win either way. He should have fully exposed this the first time. and what's the ruling judge doing hanging out with the owner??

[trapezeus]

dolphins and bills got it the worst? so 4 wins a season in the division isn't a huge advantage?

also shame on the bills hiring coaches who couldn't adapt to a changing league. when jauron barely had audibles, they went and got another dinosaur.

what is amazing is that people think a cheating scandal would create a huge visible dominance. the steroid guys in baseball still struck out on occassion, but when they made contact, they launched it. sometimes, you don't get the play call right, but when you do, it's a huge advantage. for a league that always has announcers say that "it's a game of momentum" that would seem to be a pretty big advantage if you got momentum at the right time each time.

i just want to see brady knocked out in a game with an illegal hit and the league absolutely powerless to suspend the guy because of brady's lawsuit.

[chris66]

I've been saying this since it originally happened and most people think I sit around at home with a tinfoil hat on. They haven't stopped cheating and never will as long as Belichick and Adams are around. Since SpyGate they've only figured out better methods to hide what they're doing. Goodell tried to finally lay the hammer down on them with the deflated balls, mainly to quell the other owners, and that blew up in his face. The enemy here isn't the commissioner, it's this team and their owner who don't give a flying $%#^ about sportsmanship and stopping the NFL from becoming the MLB and NBA.Well, too late - the shield is tarnished now mainly because Goodell covered up SpyGate to try and NOT tarnish the shield. Once those lies spin out of control it becomes a bigger disaster down the road and he should have taken the hit back then.
No such thing as ethics or sportsmanship in a multi billion dollar business. Its either legal or illegal. At the time taping signals wasnt illegal

[IlluminatusUIUC]

dolphins and bills got it the worst? so 4 wins a season in the division isn't a huge advantage?

also shame on the bills hiring coaches who couldn't adapt to a changing league. when jauron barely had audibles, they went and got another dinosaur.

What makes it even stupider is that the article specifically points out that Bledsoe was involved in it early on. If the Bills still didn't change their signals after trading for Bledsoe, either he never told them New England was doing it or they knew and didn't anyway. We might have the stupidest coaching staffs of all time.

[Mr. Miyagi]

The NFL is as corrupt as Russia.

[chris66]

The NFL is as corrupt as Russia.
Name me a multi billion dollar company that isnt

[DesertFox24]

Look you can blame the pats but the bills were stupid. A team should change signals and have multiple people calling signals anyway. I also would bring my own radio system on a different freq than what was provided for opponents. This is all information assurance stuff and I am not happy that they choose to be bad sports but this is how stuff happens in the real world. I would also have commercial grade encryption on my radio system because they could easily listen in since it is broadcast over the air. All that being said the part that bothers me is the jamming of the radio and the going through the locker room before games. If you are stupid enough to leave playbooks, information in the hotel, or not change your signals shame on you is all I can say.

[CommissarSpartacus]

:rofl:

Nothing like those anonymous former players and employees!

BTW, I'm preparing a report where anonymous former Bills2one members and employees admit Ralph Wilson worshipped Satan, and the Bills never winning was a quid pro quo for making him a billionaire and that Jim Kelly was a child molester and diddled a number of right-wing members of the board.

[chris66]

:rofl

Nothing like those anonymous former players and employees!

BTW, I'm preparing a report where anonymous former Bills2one members and employees admit Ralph Wilson worshipped Satan, and the Bills never winning was a quid pro quo for making him a billionaire and that Jim Kelly was a child molester.
Touche'

[Oaf]

My favorite line in that article was:

"Stealing signals wasn't always an advantage, but it did help them against the less sophisticated teams, like the Dolphins and Bills."

Yeah, WTF was this about?

[Skooby]

The Pats considered us an ongoing joke, so hopefully we can take out our anger on them.

[Turf]

:rofl:

Nothing like those anonymous former players and employees!

BTW, I'm preparing a report where anonymous former Bills2one members and employees admit Ralph Wilson worshipped Satan, and the Bills never winning was a quid pro quo for making him a billionaire and that Jim Kelly was a child molester and diddled a number of right-wing members of the board.


Why the mods tolerate you I'll never know. You're a ****ing ******* and quite frankly, ruin this site.

[notacon]

Here's the full story. It's long and detailed.

From Spygate to Deflategate: Inside what split the NFL and Patriots Apart (http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/13533995/split-nfl-new-england-patriots-apart)

I read most of it, and it's a devastating indictment on the long history of undeniable cheating by the Patriots.

Only the hopeless biased Pat's sycophants will still deny that the Patriots were unjustly branded as cheaters. The rest of us normal people know what's going on.

[Skooby]

Here's the full story. It's long and detailed.

From Spygate to Deflategate: Inside what split the NFL and Patriots Apart (http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/13533995/split-nfl-new-england-patriots-apart)

I read most of it, and it's a devastating indictment on the long history of undeniable cheating by the Patriots.

Only the hopeless biased Pat's sycophants will still deny that the Patriots were unjustly branded as cheaters. The rest of us normal people know what's going on.

Holy crap, how will the Pats overcome the lies / deceit ?? It also explains many backdoor things that have kept them at or near the top for this long.

[Victor7]

There aren't enough words to describe my hatred for that POS organization. From top to bottom with honorable mention to Bobby Kraft, Tom lying sack of **** Brady and the mastermind of it Bill Belichik. A worthless piece of **** that only steals oxygen from the rest of us.

This whole thing was a system. They had it all figured out. How to dress, what to tell to security if caught, what to do. Unreal.

Then they also sent people to steal form locker rooms, the well documented signal outages at key moments of games. The list is long and condemning.

I don't usually hope bad things on people. But BB does deserve some sort of karmic death.

[Oaf]

And they still get off (relatively) scot-free, yeah?

[Turf]

Somehow Goodell loses and is the bad guy, like the Ray Rice decision. He's damned no matter what he does. But in this case he really blew it by protecting the game and not being forthcoming about the extent of their tampering.
I hope Thursday all everyone talks about pregame is what a bunch of cheating bastards the entire Patriots organization is, and that they become despised forever n the annals of football.

[Joe Fo Sho]

And they still get off (relatively) scot-free, yeah?

Yup.

What have they actually lost after all of this cheating? A couple of draft picks, less than $2 million, and respect? Then take into account what they've gained...4 Superbowl rings and how many millions of dollars? 100 million?

It's actually quite the business model. Well, only because of how spineless the NFL commissioner is.

[Victor7]

Yup.

What have they actually lost after all of this cheating? A couple of draft picks, less than $2 million, and respect? Then take into account what they've gained...4 Superbowl rings and how many millions of dollars? 100 million?

It's actually quite the business model. Well, only because of how spineless the NFL commissioner is.

Yup

No consequences. That's why they keep finding ways to cheat.

[Oaf]

Well, only because of how spineless the NFL commissioner is.

Though we can't say this because of deflategate, right?

[EricStratton]

Look you can blame the pats but the bills were stupid. A team should change signals and have multiple people calling signals anyway. I also would bring my own radio system on a different freq than what was provided for opponents. This is all information assurance stuff and I am not happy that they choose to be bad sports but this is how stuff happens in the real world. I would also have commercial grade encryption on my radio system because they could easily listen in since it is broadcast over the air. All that being said the part that bothers me is the jamming of the radio and the going through the locker room before games. If you are stupid enough to leave playbooks, information in the hotel, or not change your signals shame on you is all I can say.


There are actual rules against using non league approved and provided electronics during a game.

And as far as changing signals throughout the game, if the expectation is that teams can not film your signals and evaluate that film during a game to make changes it's hard to fault teams that didn't change during a game. Between games is a different issue all together but during I can't find to much fault with.

[Night Train]

The "cheaters " chants just became louder. Kraft can't control that :up:

[POTLAND PSILBYLO]

Patriots owner Robert Kraft told reporters he will reluctantly accept the league’s punishment for his organization’s role in the Deflategate scandal on Tuesday. “I don’t want to continue the rhetoric that’s gone on for the last four months — I’m going to accept, reluctantly, what he has given to us, and not continue this dialogue and rhetoric, and we won’t appeal,” he said at a meeting of the NFL owners in San Francisco.
The NFL fined the Patriots $1 million (http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/2015/05/11/tom-brady-suspended-games-deflategate/vjlRYSYTda20zSkolsff5L/story.html) and docked them their 2016 first- and 2017 fourth-round picks.

[trapezeus]

Yup.

What have they actually lost after all of this cheating? A couple of draft picks, less than $2 million, and respect? Then take into account what they've gained...4 Superbowl rings and how many millions of dollars? 100 million?

It's actually quite the business model. Well, only because of how spineless the NFL commissioner is.

$100MM??? are you kidding. look at what kraft bought the team for and what it's worth now that he miraculously has a fanbase. if the bills, a small market team went for $1.4BN, he's got a $2BN organization. and all the other teams benefitted from it as well.

the real question will be if the league is just doing this lip service to create an easily hateable team and see if people keep tuning in. they've essentially made it the WWE. We have a team we all hate and yet somehow they get to do more miserable things to the disgust of the crowd. yet fans keep tuning in to see how it plays out.

until shown otherwise, i am firmly expecting the league to call games in the pats favor and let them run their program unchecked to keep this villian story up.

[Miami_Vice]

Miami Dolphin fan here. I'm with you folks. Absolutely HATE the Pats. Its insane what they have gotten away with. Here's hoping one of our teams takes them down a notch and beats them down. I am really hoping Suh breaks Brady in half when we play them.

[Forward_Lateral]

Congress is going to step in soon, I can guarantee it. A full investigation will be launched on the Pats and Goddell. I wouldn't be surprised to see someone end up in jail.

[trapezeus]

Miami Dolphin fan here. I'm with you folks. Absolutely HATE the Pats. Its insane what they have gotten away with. Here's hoping one of our teams takes them down a notch and beats them down. I am really hoping Suh breaks Brady in half when we play them.
not if we can break him first!

[stuckincincy]

Congress is going to step in soon, I can guarantee it. A full investigation will be launched on the Pats and Goddell. I wouldn't be surprised to see someone end up in jail.
I hope those self-promoting grandstanders leave it alone.

[Joe Fo Sho]

$100MM??? are you kidding. look at what kraft bought the team for and what it's worth now that he miraculously has a fanbase. if the bills, a small market team went for $1.4BN, he's got a $2BN organization. and all the other teams benefitted from it as well.

Right, I don't actually know how much they've gained, that's why I put the question mark after guessing they've gained $100MM. You're probably right, that number is too low. However, there is probably a bunch of undocumented money that should count as a loss for paying off Goodell, the refs, the judge, Kraft's mistresses...so who really knows.



Friggin' cheaters.

[stuckincincy]

Right, I don't actually know how much they've gained, that's why I put the question mark after guessing they've gained $100MM. You're probably right, that number is too low. However, there is probably a bunch of undocumented money that should count as a loss for paying off Goodell, the refs, the judge, Kraft's mistresses...so who really knows.

Does it really matter?

No.

There's but a handful of non-sellouts, the tv ratings soar.




Friggin' cheaters.

[chris66]

Congress is going to step in soon, I can guarantee it. A full investigation will be launched on the Pats and Goddell. I wouldn't be surprised to see someone end up in jail.
No reason for Congress to stepin.NFL gave up their anti trust exemption earlier this year.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I've cleaned up all the BS out of this thread.

Cease fire, all of you.

[Night Train]

I've cleaned up all the BS out of this thread.

Cease fire, all of you.

:btm::btm::btm::btm::btm:

[IlluminatusUIUC]

No reason for Congress to stepin.NFL gave up their anti trust exemption earlier this year.

The NFL receives billions upon billions of public subsidies. If there is the concern that the games are not on the level, that is a public issue.

[Skooby]

Congress is going to step in soon, I can guarantee it. A full investigation will be launched on the Pats and Goddell. I wouldn't be surprised to see someone end up in jail.
Then you memorialize the Pats fans saying they're out to get us.

[swiper]

Oh, if McKelvin only would have held on to that kick.

[better days]

Miami Dolphin fan here. I'm with you folks. Absolutely HATE the Pats. Its insane what they have gotten away with. Here's hoping one of our teams takes them down a notch and beats them down. I am really hoping Suh breaks Brady in half when we play them.

The AFC East will no longer be the cakewalk it was for Brady & the Pats* all these years.

The Bills, Fins & Jets will all have top 10 defenses & I expect all three teams to put the pressure on Brady this year.

And the CHEATERS have suspect lines on both offense & defense.

[Strongman]

Right, I don't actually know how much they've gained, that's why I put the question mark after guessing they've gained $100MM. You're probably right, that number is too low. However, there is probably a bunch of undocumented money that should count as a loss for paying off Goodell, the refs, the judge, Kraft's mistresses...so who really knows.



Friggin' cheaters.

I'm actually glad Putin walked of with one of Kraft's rings.

[Skooby]

The AFC East will no longer be the cakewalk it was for Brady & the Pats* all these years.

The Bills, Fins & Jets will all have top 10 defenses & I expect all three teams to put the pressure on Brady this year.

And the CHEATERS have suspect lines on both offense & defense.

And our playbooks / signals, what a POS group.

[DynaPaul]

Now you all know this article by ESPN was put out at the behest of the league right? If Kraft and Brady had kept their word and accepted the suspension all would have gone on as it usually does. Instead they embarrassed Goodell by taking it to court and now a fecal storm of dirty secrets is being leaked out. None of this is really new though for those of us paying attention. I expect a rough year for the Cheaters.

[Strongman]

Now you all know this article by ESPN was put out at the behest of the league right? If Kraft and Brady had kept their word and accepted the suspension all would have gone on as it usually does. Instead they embarrassed Goodell by taking it to court and now a fecal storm of dirty secrets is being leaked out. None of this is really new though for those of us paying attention. I expect a rough year for the Cheaters.

I think a rogue owner or NFL brass probably leaked it because it makes Goodell look pretty bad as well.

[chris66]

The NFL receives billions upon billions of public subsidies. If there is the concern that the games are not on the level, that is a public issue.

The games havent been on the level since the nfl turned into a multi million dollar business.
There is nothing new in that article as far as taping goes. BB already admitted that the taping went back to 2000.

[chris66]

Now you all know this article by ESPN was put out at the behest of the league right? If Kraft and Brady had kept their word and accepted the suspension all would have gone on as it usually does. Instead they embarrassed Goodell by taking it to court and now a fecal storm of dirty secrets is being leaked out. None of this is really new though for those of us paying attention. I expect a rough year for the Cheaters.
Kept their word? When did Brady ever say he was going to accept that punishment.

Kraft accepted because he didnt want to sue his partners but he said flat out he didnt accept the wells report.

[swiper]

Don't make excuses for blatant cheaters.

[YardRat]

No reason for Congress to stepin.NFL gave up their anti trust exemption earlier this year.

I believe they gave up their tax exempt status, which is different. The motivation behind dropping the blackout rules was to maintain the anti-trust.

[Forward_Lateral]

No reason for Congress to stepin.NFL gave up their anti trust exemption earlier this year.

It almost happened in 2008.

[chris66]

I believe they gave up their tax exempt status, which is different. The motivation behind dropping the blackout rules was to maintain the anti-trust.
Yes you're correct. I got the two confused.

[CommissarSpartacus]

So far, this seems to be a bunch of allegations by anonymous sources.

Can someone point me to a new allegation that's backed up by someone willing to reveal their identity?

[FlyingDutchman]

Teams were so convinced that the Pats were stealing the scripted plays, that they would leave fake plays....

Can you imagine how bad Buffalo's fake plays were?

[Bill Cody]

So far, this seems to be a bunch of allegations by anonymous sources.

Can someone point me to a new allegation that's backed up by someone willing to reveal their identity?

ESPN called Roger Goodell. He told them publish anything that's more probable than not or even if it isn't probable then anything that sounds really bad for NE and could they publish soon?

[feldspar]

Teams were so convinced that the Pats were stealing the scripted plays, that they would leave fake plays....

Can you imagine how bad Buffalo's fake plays were?

They couldn't have been THAT much worse than the real ones.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

So far, this seems to be a bunch of allegations by anonymous sources.

Can someone point me to a new allegation that's backed up by someone willing to reveal their identity?

The description of how Goodell ordered his people to destroy the tapes without even watching them all or showing them to Goodell comes from Robyn Glaser, the Patriots counsel.

There are descriptions of meetings with Goodell and Walsh in Arlen Specter's notes.

Mike Martz alleges the league doctored the written statement he gave them

Those are the three I noticed.

[chris66]

The description of how Goodell ordered his people to destroy the tapes without even watching them all or showing them to Goodell comes from Robyn Glaser, the Patriots counsel.

There are descriptions of meetings with Goodell and Walsh in Arlen Specter's notes.

Mike Martz alleges the league doctored the written statement he gave them

Those are the three I noticed.

All that stuff we already knew.

Its the taping practices, stealing playbooks, extra radio frequencies thats all hearsay.

[Skooby]

The Pats have always looked like they knew what positions to be in and it was obvious that either Bill is a coaching genius or he had inside knowledge. The Pats legendary no fumble record accrued over the past 8 seasons at home is not an anomoly.

Usually the simplest answer is the right one, Pats had systems in place to give them an advantage (right or wrong).

[chris66]

The Pats have always looked like they knew what positions to be in and it was obvious that either Bill is a coaching genius or he had inside knowledge. The Pats legendary no fumble record accrued over the past 8 seasons at home is not an anomoly.

Usually the simplest answer is the right one, Pats had systems in place to give them an advantage (right or wrong).
If you guys truly believe that why bother watching any games. If the nfl is fixed you then have to know that a small market like buffalo has no chance in hell of contending.

- - - Updated - - -


The Pats have always looked like they knew what positions to be in and it was obvious that either Bill is a coaching genius or he had inside knowledge. The Pats legendary no fumble record accrued over the past 8 seasons at home is not an anomoly.

Usually the simplest answer is the right one, Pats had systems in place to give them an advantage (right or wrong).
If you guys truly believe that why bother watching any games. If the nfl is fixed you then have to know that a small market like buffalo has no chance in hell of contending.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

All that stuff we already knew.

Its the taping practices, stealing playbooks, extra radio frequencies thats all hearsay.

Goodell's minions not even viewing the full tapes (and Goodell himself seeing them not at all) and the league doctoring Martz' press release were not things I knew.

[trapezeus]

PAts fans have gone from saying it never happened, to that everyone cheats somehow, to now wanting the undisclosed sources to reveal themselves.

once that happens, they'll smear the guys who publically said the truth, then when it goes to court and more proof is provided but ultimately settled out of court with the championships revoked, we probably will see the pats fan assuming their pre-2000 identity.

[chris66]

PAts fans have gone from saying it never happened, to that everyone cheats somehow, to now wanting the undisclosed sources to reveal themselves.

once that happens, they'll smear the guys who publically said the truth, then when it goes to court and more proof is provided but ultimately settled out of court with the championships revoked, we probably will see the pats fan assuming their pre-2000 identity.
You're insane if you think any of that is going to happen

[Joe Fo Sho]

You're insane if you think any of that is going to happen

Yeah, we'll all have to just settle with the implied asterisk on all of the Patriot's/Belichick's/Brady's accomplishments.

[paladin warrior]

:clap: :dance2:GOOD.. It about time :dance::bf1:

[BLeonard]

If you guys truly believe that why bother watching any games. If the nfl is fixed you then have to know that a small market like buffalo has no chance in hell of contending.

I watch pro wrestling and know that the outcome is predetermined... I watch movies and TV shows and know that they aren't real...

Like pro wrestling, movies and TV shows, football is entertainment. I watch all of them for entertainment, not because I believe that any of them are 100% legit, 100% of the time.

Granted, I believe that the NFL is much LESS fixed than pro wrestling, but that doesn't mean that it's 100% legit sports competition, either.

-Bill

[BuffaloRedleg]

Didn't we all used to yell this at the TV in the mid 2000's back when we weren't used to being terrible yet?

Now I just assume we are going to lose, but back then I really thought they were cheating.

I guess now we know.

[Skooby]

If you guys truly believe that why bother watching any games. If the nfl is fixed you then have to know that a small market like buffalo has no chance in hell of contending.

- - - Updated - - -


If you guys truly believe that why bother watching any games. If the nfl is fixed you then have to know that a small market like buffalo has no chance in hell of contending.
Bills went to 4 straight Super Bowls, is there any chance it's our time to shine again??

[DetDannyWilliams]

Reed still thinks that the cheating started before Bellichicken became head coach, that it started when Pete Caroll was the coach of the Patriots


Bledsoe fired a 10-yard pass to Shawn Jefferson, who caught the ball at the sideline. The Bills disputed that the receiver had first down yardage and was in bounds, but the officials ruled a Patriot first down. In postgame interviews, both Reed and Flutie claimed they overheard the refs say, "just give it to them."

http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2011/6/16/2225057/buffalo-bills-walk-off-foxboro-patriots

[BLeonard]

Reed still thinks that the cheating started before Bellichicken became head coach, that it started when Pete Caroll was the coach of the Patriots



http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2011/6/16/2225057/buffalo-bills-walk-off-foxboro-patriots

Pshhhh... It at least goes back to 1982... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snowplow_Game


The following year, the NFL banned the use of snowplows on the field during a game. In a 2007 interview for an NFL Network segment about the game, Shula recalled protesting the "unfair" act, to which Commissioner Pete Rozelle responded that, while he agreed wholeheartedly, without a rule explicitly barring such use of the plow, there was nothing he could do.

Does the bolded sound familiar...?

-Bill

[Meathead]

the snow plow and the eligible/ineligible receiver tricks quite honestly are fair game if you ask me. they are holes in the rules where they can do something right in front of you and theres nothing you can do about it at the time. thats just being ballsy and/or smart and/or both. taping signals/practices, deflating balls, and the other things we didnt catch them at are full blown cheating of the highest order

i really dont get why pete is banned for life for betting yet marcia modified the actual ball for her teams exclusive benefit and so far shes got nuthin. seems like crazy brain damaged opposite day

[CommissarSpartacus]

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xat1/v/t1.0-9/11993293_948807608514094_828526396483425255_n.jpg?oh=b18ccf9dfe2f41effabf54fe7c1a8958&oe=56A22B45

[CommissarSpartacus]

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/11988502_890930980943157_7194945386036229078_n.jpg?oh=7dfa1ccd3bea96e2d63f9a243f5c8647&oe=565E6C5A

[feldspar]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/xT9pygVQwgk?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Turf]

Anyone wonder how Vinatieri yanked that field goal so far right in last years playoff game against NE? A simple FG for the guy that never misses. Who supplied that ball.

[Joe Fo Sho]

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/11988502_890930980943157_7194945386036229078_n.jpg?oh=7dfa1ccd3bea96e2d63f9a243f5c8647&oe=565E6C5A

You forgot to include a photo of yourself in that group.

[Ginger Vitis]

Tom brady is Elis *****

[Historian]

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/12004940_10153565493983774_119119070691987831_n.jpg?oh=9897094de57605e28319c2c69bdcf81b&oe=5676BAE3

[Historian]

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpl1/v/t1.0-9/11952032_887933344634015_1001270902076917449_n.jpg?oh=8a45a5c4889f4d2055806b8db6e00142&oe=56A935D3

[Night Train]

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpl1/v/t1.0-9/11952032_887933344634015_1001270902076917449_n.jpg?oh=8a45a5c4889f4d2055806b8db6e00142&oe=56A935D3

:bf1: Best post ever.

[Strongman]

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpl1/v/t1.0-9/11952032_887933344634015_1001270902076917449_n.jpg?oh=8a45a5c4889f4d2055806b8db6e00142&oe=56A935D3

Just a ticket? At the very least, the officer should have tazed the dumb mofo!

[coastal]

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xat1/v/t1.0-9/11993293_948807608514094_828526396483425255_n.jpg?oh=b18ccf9dfe2f41effabf54fe7c1a8958&oe=56A22B45
This is what the NFL has become except I think the WWE is more entertaining.

[chris66]

Bills went to 4 straight Super Bowls, is there any chance it's our time to shine again??
Not if you think its fixed.

Also why isnt the nfl looking into those other allegations.
There are only 2 possbilities. Either those allegations never happened or the nfl is rigged.

[CommissarSpartacus]

If it's fixed, was David Tyree's horseshoes up his ass catch part of the plan?

[CommissarSpartacus]

So, any speculation abou how much stuff TV is going to have to censor tonite?

Im wonder if the crowd chants have been choreographed already?

You all know the commissioner isn't showing up for the opening of the season because he's worried about his personal safety, don't mou?