Rob Ryan's problems in New Orleans

[swiper]

Twins are alike. Rex was known to be sloppy, bombastic and terrible with in-game calls as head coach of the Jets. Now when Rob opened his big mouth and claimed the defense in New Orleans wasn't really his, Sean Payton tells it... Rob & his unit were sloppy with fundamentals.


“The idea that it wasn’t his defense, or he wasn’t in charge of it, is silly,” Payton said.

Payton said the Saints’ defense repeatedly struggled with fundamentals like getting the right calls and the right players on the field.

“When you’re struggling as bad as we’re struggling for two years, and some of the same problems keep coming up — you know, 10 guys on the field — those are things that just are hard to live with,” Payton said.

An earlier piece by PFT reminded everyone of the epic bad defenses Rob oversaw in Dallas.


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/05/27/sean-payton-rob-ryan-saying-it-wasnt-his-defense-is-silly/

[kscdogbillsfan1221]

Yea. Like most I am soooooo happy rob is here. Especially given his stellar tract record over the last few years.

thats sarcasm..

[streetkings01]

Maybe him and his twin will do great things for us together.

I'm not gonna complain about it because what's done is done and it's out of my control.

I think the Ryan brothers will work great together........I know I'm in the minority but that my opinion.

[Mr. Pink]

Rob hasn't done jack since he left Cleveland as a DC.

Funny part is his successor in Cleveland, Dick Jauron, was an improvement.

[justasportsfan]

That goes to show what kind of teacher he is if his players cant get it. He may be in over his head as a DC.

[feldspar]

Rob hasn't done jack since he left Cleveland as a DC.

.

That's just not true.

The year before Rob Ryan became Defensive Coordinator of the Saints, New Orleans was ranked dead last on defense in terms of yardage. The saints were also 31st in points allowed.

In Rob Ryan's first year as DC of the Saints, he took that dead-last defense to the 4th ranked defense in the league. The Saints went from 31st in points allowed to 4th.

Dallas' defense made significant improvements in his first year there, too.

Do these things not count, or does it somehow just make you feel better to think that everything Rob Ryan has ever touched has turned to ****?

He's just an assistant here anyway. He has the recent trend of helping teams in year one as DC. This is his first year here...I think there is a good chance he helps this team this year; in fact, I'd be surprised if he didn't.

[YardRat]

He's also the assistant head coach, I believe.

[Mr. Pink]

That's just not true.

The year before Rob Ryan became Defensive Coordinator of the Saints, New Orleans was ranked dead last on defense in terms of yardage. The saints were also 31st in points allowed.

In Rob Ryan's first year as DC of the Saints, he took that dead-last defense to the 4th ranked defense in the league. The Saints went from 31st in points allowed to 4th.

Dallas' defense made significant improvements in his first year there, too.

Do these things not count, or does it somehow just make you feel better to think that everything Rob Ryan has ever touched has turned to ****?

He's just an assistant here anyway. He has the recent trend of helping teams in year one as DC. This is his first year here...I think there is a good chance he helps this team this year; in fact, I'd be surprised if he didn't.

My bad he did have that one good year in New Orleans, his first year there.

Thanks for the correction.

Here's how stellar he is, he's had 2 seasons where his defenses have been in the top half of the NFL points allowed wise and 3 seasons where his defenses have been in the top half of the NFL yards allowed wise. His defense has been in the top half of the NFL turnovers wise 1 season.

Problem is, he's been a DC for 12 seasons.

[swiper]

LOL. Just like his brother. He who took the Jets to 2 AFCE championship games with aa team that Tannenbaum and Mangini built. So he is good 8% of the time and sucks royally 92% time. We should hang our hat on the 8%. Ok. Got it.

[Mace]

There's a plus side though. If Rex tries yelling at him like Payton did on the sidelines during games, Rob will take it to him, believe you me. That chaplain might jump in on Rex' side, but Rob is literally twice the man both of them are. Once they all get ejected, we'll see how the staff can really do.

[feldspar]

My bad he did have that one good year in New Orleans, his first year there.

Thanks for the correction.

Here's how stellar he is, he's had 2 seasons where his defenses have been in the top half of the NFL points allowed wise and 3 seasons where his defenses have been in the top half of the NFL yards allowed wise. His defense has been in the top half of the NFL turnovers wise 1 season.

Problem is, he's been a DC for 12 seasons.

Yeah well, I'm not going to sit and talk up Rob Ryan as a defensive coordinator. Stats are one thing and don't necessarily tell the story. But overall, his defenses have been mediocre...probably at best. How much of that was his fault, I don't know...probably quite a bit. I honestly don't understand how the man was a defensive coordinator for 12 consecutive seasons in the NFL with those results, to be honest.

But he isn't the DC here. I actually like the role they put him into in Buffalo, and that's my opinion. If ReX, Rob, and Dennis Thurman together can't turn this defense around this year, I can't see how any of those guys ever will.

[Mace]

If ReX, Rob, and Dennis Thurman together can't turn this defense around this year, I can't see how any of those guys ever will.

Brace yourself.

[swiper]

Jim Schwartz turned the defense around in a single season. All I am hearing is apologetic excuses for this clan of clowns.

Watch the Eagles this year. They have good coaches. Doug Pederson, Jim Schwartz, Frank Reich.

[feldspar]

Jim Schwartz turned the defense around in a single season. All I am hearing is apologetic excuses for this clan of clowns.

Watch the Eagles this year. They have good coaches. Doug Pederson, Jim Schwartz, Frank Reich.

Jim Schwartz turned the #10 ranked defense into the #4 ranked defense. The Bills defense was already pretty good under Pettine. People forget that the Bills all-time sack record still stands from the 2013 season, when Pettine was the DC. The Bills already had a good pass defense when Schwartz got here...that didn't change much. What Schwartz helped turn around was the rush defense which, among other things, helped the Bills allow much fewer points. So, yeah, Schwartz did do a great job in his one season in Buffalo.

But if you look at Schwartz's entire body of work, it's not really that impressive...not consistently good by a longshot. For example, in his first season as defensive coordinator in Tennessee, all he did was turn the #1 defense from the previous year and turn it into the #25 defense. He helped take the #2 ranked team in points allowed, and turned it into the #25 team in points allowed...the team gave up almost 200 more points than the year before he got there.

In other words, I wouldn't go about hoisting Jim Schwartz on your shoulders and parade him around the town square just yet. Bad seasons happen, like the time Jim Schwartz's defense was ranked dead last in 2006 in Tennessee, with only one other team allowing more points.

Hell, if you want to justify demonizing Rex Ryan and aggrandizing Jim Schwartz, then compare their entire track records. Compare their results as Head Coaches, defensive Coordinators, and even their defenses when they were Head coaches. I guarantee you that Rex comes out way ahead in just about every category in the end. Here, these two links two links will make that pretty easy to do...one link for Ryan, and the other link for Schwartz:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/SchwJi0.htm

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/RyanRe0.htm

Again, I realize that stats aren't the end-all, but c'mon now.

[justasportsfan]

Jim Schwartz turned the #10 ranked defense into the #4 ranked defense. The Bills defense was already pretty good under Pettine. People forget that the Bills all-time sack record still stands from the 2013 season, when Pettine was the DC. The Bills already had a good pass defense when Schwartz got here...that didn't change much. What Schwartz helped turn around was the rush defense which, among other things, helped the Bills allow much fewer points. So, yeah, Schwartz did do a great job in his one season in Buffalo.

.

What????

He took a 10 and made it 4 and the other took that 4 and made it 19. Pettines 10 wascranked up in sacks, it was the worst run D. Schwartz improved both stats in a different scheme. The sacks were better without blitzing.


Maybe you are right. Schwartz is not as good , that just means Rex sucks.


Youre only as good as your last performance. Rex destroyed that 4th ranked D. Fact!

What excuse are you going to make now rhat he has the players ro run his scheme if he doesnt even make top 10 in his 2nd year?

Theyre rookies? We wouldnt have needed to depend on rookiesnif Rex wasnt a scheme person. He does not know how to use players to their talent. Drop back Dareus!!!!!

[justasportsfan]

Btw, Rexs D got owned by EJ Manuel and Marrone. .

[feldspar]

What????

He took a 10 and made it 4 and the other took that 4 and made it 19. Pettines 10 wascranked up in sacks, it was the worst run D. Schwartz improved both stats in a different scheme. The sacks were better without blitzing.


Maybe you are right. Schwartz is not as good , that just means Rex sucks.


Youre only as good as your last performance. Rex destroyed that 4th ranked D. Fact!

What excuse are you going to make now rhat he has the players ro run his scheme if he doesnt even make top 10 in his 2nd year?

Theyre rookies? We wouldnt have needed to depend on rookiesnif Rex wasnt a scheme person. He does not know how to use players to their talent. Drop back Dareus!!!!!

I'm sorry, but when did I make any excuse for Rex? Everything I said was fact. I was talking mainly about Schwartz, and then dared anyone to compare his track record to Rex's. Go ahead and do that, why don't ya?

Schwartz chose not to remain as DC last year. Some people wanted him as Head Coach after Marrone took his money and headed for the hills. But Schwartz's record as Head Coach is 29-51. The Lions improved on defense dramatically the year after he left, ironically enough...more so than the Bills did with him as DC. The Lions went 11-5 after he left, too.

And Rex did not "destroy" the defense. They had a not-so-good year, but the defense is still there. I personally expect them to be much better this year. The damage is hardly irrevocable.

If you want excuses I'll point to injuries...Schwartz had little, and Rex had big ones. Mario dogged it and made waves. Players have recently come out saying that they felt that the defense would just automatically be better because Rex was coach, and therefore didn't put in the required work. Admittedly, that could be a reflection of coaching. The ridiculous amount of penalties last year could be coaching too, but that's a different debate. Rex also wasted a lot of time during the season trying to blend his scheme with the things that worked for Schwartz the year before...that didn't work, so that was a mistake. Enough with the "dropping into coverage crap," too...that didn't happen all that much. Are those excuses? Maybe. But these things DID happen.



Btw, Rexs D got owned by EJ Manuel and Marrone. .

lol, where did you get that? It's a bit of a stretch. Geno Smith imploded in that game, and he turned the ball over FOUR times before he was yanked from the game. He was truly beyond awful in every way, and that's basically what happened in that game.

Please...

You know what Rex Ryan's defense did? It beat Peyton Manning and Tom Brady in consecutive road games in the playoffs. Why not bring THAT up?

[Ginger Vitis]

Btw, Rexs D got owned by EJ Manuel and Marrone. .

In 2014 Rexs D was owned by Kyle Orton

[justasportsfan]

Feldspar, taking the same D and making it better is what Wade Philipps did. Taking a very talented defense and making it worse is what Rex did.. these are facts .

Trying to use injury as an excuse is hogwash. Making Mario and Dareus drop is worse than using injury as an excuse. We could have had Clay Mathews and making him cover would be idiotic.

[justasportsfan]

I would take Oettines defense from a few years ago over Rexs D from last year.

[feldspar]

In 2014 Rexs D was owned by Kyle Orton

Lol. Bull****.

Kyle Otron was efficient and threw 4 TDs, but the Jets QBs turned the ball over a whopping SIX TIMES in that game. That is the story of that game. Geno Smith threw three interceptions on three consecutive drives in the first quarter alone before he was yanked again. Remember that? Total snowball effect. Then Michael Vick replaced him, and he proceeded to turn the ball over another three times himself.

Geno Smith and the Jets QB problem happened again.

I'm not really too much of a Rex apologist, but please tell the truth or at least know what you are talking about.

[feldspar]

Feldspar, taking the same D and making it better is what Wade Philipps did. Taking a very talented defense and making it worse is what Rex did.. these are facts .

Trying to use injury as an excuse is hogwash. Making Mario and Dareus drop is worse than using injury as an excuse. We could have had Clay Mathews and making him cover would be idiotic.

Does your hatred of Rex stop you from listening to what I said?

I think so.

[YardRat]

Jim Schwartz turned the #10 ranked defense into the #4 ranked defense. The Bills defense was already pretty good under Pettine. People forget that the Bills all-time sack record still stands from the 2013 season, when Pettine was the DC. The Bills already had a good pass defense when Schwartz got here...that didn't change much. What Schwartz helped turn around was the rush defense which, among other things, helped the Bills allow much fewer points. So, yeah, Schwartz did do a great job in his one season in Buffalo.

But if you look at Schwartz's entire body of work, it's not really that impressive...not consistently good by a longshot. For example, in his first season as defensive coordinator in Tennessee, all he did was turn the #1 defense from the previous year and turn it into the #25 defense. He helped take the #2 ranked team in points allowed, and turned it into the #25 team in points allowed...the team gave up almost 200 more points than the year before he got there.

In other words, I wouldn't go about hoisting Jim Schwartz on your shoulders and parade him around the town square just yet. Bad seasons happen, like the time Jim Schwartz's defense was ranked dead last in 2006 in Tennessee, with only one other team allowing more points.

Hell, if you want to justify demonizing Rex Ryan and aggrandizing Jim Schwartz, then compare their entire track records. Compare their results as Head Coaches, defensive Coordinators, and even their defenses when they were Head coaches. I guarantee you that Rex comes out way ahead in just about every category in the end. Here, these two links two links will make that pretty easy to do...one link for Ryan, and the other link for Schwartz:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/SchwJi0.htm

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/RyanRe0.htm

Again, I realize that stats aren't the end-all, but c'mon now.

I'll re-iterate...Schwartz did far more than a "#10" ranked defense to number four, improving the units performance in 10 of 11 major statistical categories, the only exception being interceptions. By contrast, Wrecks took the squad three steps backward finishing worse than both Pettine and Schwartz in seven of the 11.

Schwartz--(Pettine)--Wrecks. GREEN is better than Schwartz (notice there are none)...BLUE is better than Pettine (only three)...RED is worse than both (seven of eleven categories).

Points per game--4--(20)--15
Yards per game--4--(10)--19
Yards per point--3--(6)--9
1st downs allowed per game--5--(12)--20
3rd down % allowed--1--(14)--23
Fumbles recovered--10--(25)--22
Rush yards per game--11--(28)--16
Passing yards per game--3--(4)--19
Sacks--1--(2)--31
Interceptions--6--(2)--6
QB rating--2--(3)--10

Yards per game, which is where the #10 and #4 rankings come from, is just a very small part of the entire picture.

[feldspar]

I'll re-iterate...Schwartz did far more than a "#10" ranked defense to number four, improving the units performance in 10 of 11 major statistical categories, the only exception being interceptions. By contrast, Wrecks took the squad three steps backward finishing worse than both Pettine and Schwartz in seven of the 11.

Schwartz--(Pettine)--Wrecks. GREEN is better than Schwartz (notice there are none)...BLUE is better than Pettine (only three)...RED is worse than both (seven of eleven categories).

Points per game--4--(20)--15
Yards per game--4--(10)--19
Yards per point--3--(6)--9
1st downs allowed per game--5--(12)--20
3rd down % allowed--1--(14)--23
Fumbles recovered--10--(25)--22
Rush yards per game--11--(28)--16
Passing yards per game--3--(4)--19
Sacks--1--(2)--31
Interceptions--6--(2)--6
QB rating--2--(3)--10

Yards per game, which is where the #10 and #4 rankings come from, is just a very small part of the entire picture.

I'm taken aback by your shocking display of color coded figures.

The only problem is that I never said Rex did a good job with this defense in any way, and agreed that Schwartz did a great job in his one year.

Feel free to read back through my recent posts in this this thread and address what I actually DID say.

[YardRat]

I'm taken aback by your shocking display of color coded figures.

The only problem is that I never said Rex did a good job with this defense in any way, and agreed that Schwartz did a great job in his one year.

Feel free to read back through my recent posts in this this thread and address what I actually DID say.

Sometimes you just have to pull out the crayons.

[Mace]

I'm taken aback by your shocking display of color coded figures.

Imho he loafed. Could have made it way more confusing with a little time and effort by giving Schwartz and (Pettine) their own colors.

[swiper]

Jim Schwartz turned the #10 ranked defense into the #4 ranked defense. The Bills defense was already pretty good under Pettine. People forget that the Bills all-time sack record still stands from the 2013 season, when Pettine was the DC. The Bills already had a good pass defense when Schwartz got here...that didn't change much. What Schwartz helped turn around was the rush defense which, among other things, helped the Bills allow much fewer points. So, yeah, Schwartz did do a great job in his one season in Buffalo.

But if you look at Schwartz's entire body of work, it's not really that impressive...not consistently good by a longshot. For example, in his first season as defensive coordinator in Tennessee, all he did was turn the #1 defense from the previous year and turn it into the #25 defense. He helped take the #2 ranked team in points allowed, and turned it into the #25 team in points allowed...the team gave up almost 200 more points than the year before he got there.

In other words, I wouldn't go about hoisting Jim Schwartz on your shoulders and parade him around the town square just yet. Bad seasons happen, like the time Jim Schwartz's defense was ranked dead last in 2006 in Tennessee, with only one other team allowing more points.

Hell, if you want to justify demonizing Rex Ryan and aggrandizing Jim Schwartz, then compare their entire track records. Compare their results as Head Coaches, defensive Coordinators, and even their defenses when they were Head coaches. I guarantee you that Rex comes out way ahead in just about every category in the end. Here, these two links two links will make that pretty easy to do...one link for Ryan, and the other link for Schwartz:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/SchwJi0.htm

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/RyanRe0.htm

Again, I realize that stats aren't the end-all, but c'mon now.

For someone who claims not to be a Rex apologist you certainly sound like one. We all realize Schwartz's overall record. But the fact was he took a good defense, one we all liked under Pettine, and raised it. You seem to be forgetting all the angst here and in Bills fanworld about Schwartz when he came. He came to town with a lot of criticism. His trouble in Tennessee was personnel related mostly.

The fact is this. The Bills defense, personnel-wise, changed very little from 2013 (under Pettine) to 2015 (under Ryan).

Schwartz lifted that defense higher than fans expected he would and Ryan took it down. Trying to tell people that Ryan's overall record is good is a joke. In Baltimore it was the personnel that made the buffoon look good. He hasn't been good elsewhere. That makes your feeble attempt at a retort disingenuous and lame.

[Topas]

...
Schwartz lifted that defense higher than fans expected he would and Ryan took it down. Trying to tell people that Ryan's overall record is good is a joke. In Baltimore it was the personnel that made the buffoon look good. He hasn't been good elsewhere. That makes your feeble attempt at a retort disingenuous and lame.

I agree with most what you said. And I also think Rex is not a very good coach and he totally ruined the D. AND THEN he finds lame excuses (if Mario did not play well then bench him, you idiot). AND THEN he signed his brother who looked over the worst D last year. AND THEN of yourse his brother finds lame excuses ... That does not look good.
But I disagree with the bolded part. He improved the Jets D quite a bit in his first year and had very good Ds for the first two or three years. And the Jets D was not that good prior to him. And they were number one in his first year. That is impressive. Unfortunately the change in the ranking during his first year with the Bills was just as impressive. Only in the wrong direction ...

[trapezeus]

These two are just the Worst. They have no manner of self reflection and or ability to see what they've done wrong. They just go on the offensive and double down that they might get it right next time for no other reason that they get the next shot

Rex Ryan's game day coaching was forever questioned for me in the KC game. They didn't go back to Watkins and he listened to his people instead of his eyes on he hogan catch.

He will always be this clown until he decides not to be. By picking his bro instead of picking someone that could actually help shows how blind he is. I really hope it goes south in a hurry so that we can can him at the end of this season and not wait Til the next one

[cookie G]

These two are just the Worst. They have no manner of self reflection and or ability to see what they've done wrong. They just go on the offensive and double down that they might get it right next time for no other reason that they get the next shot

Rex Ryan's game day coaching was forever questioned for me in the KC game. They didn't go back to Watkins and he listened to his people instead of his eyes on he hogan catch.

He will always be this clown until he decides not to be. By picking his bro instead of picking someone that could actually help shows how blind he is. I really hope it goes south in a hurry so that we can can him at the end of this season and not wait Til the next one

**Yes, the post will come out sounding negative****

You know, if Rex had ended up with, say the Broncos last year, and did to their defense what he did to the Bills, and then brought in the caretaker of the worst defense in NFL history to "right the ship"...people here would be laughing at the Broncos. And they would be laughing at what they said in the interview. (I laughed a lot, myself).

The ones who would be laughing the loudest would be the ones who now defend these 2.

If Michael Spinks and Trevor Berbick went public and blamed their Mike Tyson beat downs on their trainers..it would probably sound like that interview.

[trapezeus]

"I could beat mike. I believe in myself and my abilities. I know the numbers don't suggest that I can do it, and I've cherry picked a few stats here. can't wait for mynext chance to take on the champ."

[Mr. Pink]

I would take Oettines defense from a few years ago over Rexs D from last year.

I would take Jaurons 2006 defense over last years.

[justasportsfan]

lol, where did you get that? It's a bit of a stretch. Geno Smith imploded in that game, and he turned the ball over FOUR times before he was yanked from the game. He was truly beyond awful in every way, and that's basically what happened in that game. and the bills defense had nothing to do with that?


Please...

You know what Rex Ryan's defense did? It beat Peyton Manning and Tom Brady in consecutive road games in the playoffs. Why not bring THAT up?aside from getting owned by Marrone, his D just got owned by the Jags last year who happens Marrone on the coaching staff again.


Lol. Bull****.

Kyle Otron was efficient and threw 4 TDs, but the Jets QBs turned the ball over a whopping SIX TIMES in that game. That is the story of that game. Geno Smith threw three interceptions on three consecutive drives in the first quarter alone before he was yanked again. Remember that? Total snowball effect. Then Michael Vick replaced him, and he proceeded to turn the ball over another three times himself.

Geno Smith and the Jets QB problem happened again.

I'm not really too much of a Rex apologist, but please tell the truth or at least know what you are talking about.once again, the bills D had something to do with that.


Does your hatred of Rex stop you from listening to what I said?

I think so.

I don't hate Rex. If you look into my posts when we first got here, I was one of those who defended and gave him the benefit of a doubt. Hating him is wishing for him to fail and I am actually wishing he changes things around. So far , he hasn't done squat but yap his mouth while the D got worse. I am simply bashing his

He had the worst D out of Pettine , Schwartz and himself.

[Joe Fo Sho]

aside from getting owned by Marrone, his D just got owned by the Jags last year who happens Marrone on the coaching staff again.

Well, our offense got owned by the Jags not our defense. We held the Jags to under 300 total yards of offense, and even had a pick 6. Our defense basically had a net of -6 points that weren't directly the result of an EJ turnover. That should have been enough to win by 20 points.

[Bill Cody]

If you gave Rob and Rex two million dollars to manage they would turn you into millionaire's

Good news though for the Ryan apologists: if it really wasn't Rob's defense when he was DC in NO he can REALLY hide from ANY responsibility here, he's just an assistant. But if things go well he was the difference. See how that works? Just like last year wasn't Rex fault it was lazy Mario and the failure of the players to tell him they thought his scheme sucked for 2 months. Otherwise things would have been great.

[justasportsfan]

Well, our offense got owned by the Jags not our defense. We held the Jags to under 300 total yards of offense, and even had a pick 6. Our defense basically had a net of -6 points that weren't directly the result of an EJ turnover. That should have been enough to win by 20 points.

No doubt that EJ had the worst game , but the bills had the lead but the Jags' O finished/closed the game. Our D folded like a cheap tent at crunch time. I would understand that if it was against the Pats, but this is the jags.

[Joe Fo Sho]

No doubt that EJ had the worst game , but the bills had the lead but the Jags' O finished/closed the game. Our D folded like a cheap tent at crunch time. I would understand that if it was against the Pats, but this is the jags.

That's far from 'getting owned' like you said. It also took a phantom pass interference call on 3rd and long (15?) to keep that drive alive, so they didn't 'fold like a cheap tent' either. The defense played well that game, you can't deny it.

[feldspar]

and the bills defense had nothing to do with that?

aside from getting owned by Marrone, his D just got owned by the Jags last year who happens Marrone on the coaching staff again.

once again, the bills D had something to do with that.



I suppose you not just look at the stat sheet and revisit the games and watch what happened.

[justasportsfan]

That's far from 'getting owned' like you said. It also took a phantom pass interference call on 3rd and long (15?) to keep that drive alive, so they didn't 'fold like a cheap tent' either. The defense played well that game, you can't deny it.

when your top D from a season ago with a head coach who is supposedly a defensive master could not close against the worst team in the league who has qb is in his 2nd year , you get owned. You may not agree with my definition but I see it as getting owned. This was Bortles and the jags.

[Joe Fo Sho]

when your top D from a season ago with a head coach who is supposedly a defensive master could not close against the worst team in the league who has qb is in his 2nd year , you get owned. You may not agree with my definition but I see it as getting owned. This was Bortles and the jags.

You're using one drive which included a phantom call that resulted in a touchdown to claim that the entire defense got owned for an entire game. Your definition of getting owned is trash. The defense gave up 13 points that weren't directly the result of EJ and they had a pick 6.

Bortles is no slouch, the guy threw for 4500 yards and 35 touchdowns, with 300 rushing yards and 2 more TDs. If we had a QB with close to those numbers you wouldn't be talking like that about him.

Did you actually watch any of these games that you're trying to discuss?

[justasportsfan]

You're using one drive which included a phantom call that resulted in a touchdown to claim that the entire defense got owned for an entire game. Your definition of getting owned is trash. The defense gave up 13 points that weren't directly the result of EJ and they had a pick 6.

Bortles is no slouch, the guy threw for 4500 yards and 35 touchdowns, with 300 rushing yards and 2 more TDs. If we had a QB with close to those numbers you wouldn't be talking like that about him.

Did you actually watch any of these games that you're trying to discuss?Yes I did. I also know that the jags were horrible . Never stated Bortles was trash but he is a 2nd year qb Rex couldn't close out in crunch time. Phantom call or not, we got beat by a very bad team that the D couldn't finish.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Yes I did. I also know that the jags were horrible . Never stated Bortles was trash but he is a 2nd year qb Rex couldn't close out in crunch time. Phantom call or not, we got beat by a very bad team that the D couldn't finish.

Using this game to try to show that Rex's defense was bad is such a terrible choice. There are soooo many other examples, and this one actually disputes your point. The defense last season was not good overall, I agree with that. They were not bad during this game, though.

Don't forget that Corey Graham's pick 6 was the reason we took the lead late in the 4th. It was a pretty good play by a defense that played pretty good all day.

[stuckincincy]

Using this game to try to show that Rex's defense was bad is such a terrible choice. There are soooo many other examples, and this one actually disputes your point. The defense last season was not good overall, I agree with that. They were not bad during this game, though.

Don't forget that Corey Graham's pick 6 was the reason we took the lead late in the 4th. It was a pretty good play by a defense that played pretty good all day.

Here's the NFL official Gamebook:

http://www.nfl.com/liveupdate/gamecenter/56595/JAC_Gamebook.pdf

Have fun, you two... :drive:

[Mouldsie]

Rob's had what, 1 top 15 D in his career (yards, pts, turnovers, or DVOA)? Great job.


The Bills also struggled with getting play-calls in. This should be fun.