Those that say the bills will be sub .500, what teams in the conference are better?

[Buffalogic]

Most people on this forum are projecting a 1-7 win season for the bills.

Along with what is going on inside the bills organization, I'd like to see what external factors are contributing to that outlook.

Name the 6 AFC playoff teams and why exactly that the bills have no shot versus any of them. Every other team has warts, so let's focus on that for a change and maybe, just maybe, we aren't as far off as most would think.

[sukie]

well there need only be 3 since division winners are "in" automatically.

[k-oneputt]

I agree with you Buffalogic.

If Brady or Roethlisberger goes down they are right in the middle with everyone else.

[OpIv37]

I agree with you Buffalogic.

If Brady or Roethlisberger goes down they are right in the middle with everyone else.
NE won 11 games with Matt Cassell. They're still a threat even without Brady.

[OpIv37]

Most people on this forum are projecting a 1-7 win season for the bills.

Along with what is going on inside the bills organization, I'd like to see what external factors are contributing to that outlook.

Name the 6 AFC playoff teams and why exactly that the bills have no shot versus any of them. Every other team has warts, so let's focus on that for a change and maybe, just maybe, we aren't as far off as most would think.

This is short sighted. It's the wrong question.

The Bills were 8-8 last year. Middle of the pack. What did we do to improve more than the teams already ahead of us improved? The answer is very little. We were in cap jail for the most important period of free agency and our top 2 draft picks are injured.

[Mr. Pink]

New England, Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, Denver, Indy are virtual locks for the playoffs. So that's 5 spots.

Same ole, same ole around here...

This team is fighting with the Chiefs, Ravens, Texans, Jets for the final playoff spot.

[Skooby]

West coast trips for Buffalo Bills = losses, every year. I'm not sure why but we travel like crap.

[Ingtar33]

Most people on this forum are projecting a 1-7 win season for the bills.

Along with what is going on inside the bills organization, I'd like to see what external factors are contributing to that outlook.

Name the 6 AFC playoff teams and why exactly that the bills have no shot versus any of them. Every other team has warts, so let's focus on that for a change and maybe, just maybe, we aren't as far off as most would think.

doesn't work like that. Look at the schedule.

losses to AZ and Sea, loss to NE (with brady), losses to Pit, Cinn and Baltimore. That right there is 6 losses guaranteed; Now you have likely losses to LA Rams and Oak Raiders (both road games) and if you don't buy those losses we also have to sweep the jets and dolphins, we also have to assume we're betting the pats once, of course a brady-less pats team is exactly the game we've lost consistently since 2000, so thats no write in. Granted the rest of the schedule isn't all that tough, but I just don't see us getting more then 8 wins. There is a hard ceiling on this schedule. The only way we break through 8 wins is if we're a superbowl caliber team, in which case 10-6 or 11-5 is possible. I just don't think we're near that level.

[k-oneputt]

NE won 11 games with Matt Cassell. They're still a threat even without Brady.

Yeah five years ago.
This current Pats team isn't close to that team personal wise.

[justasportsfan]

New England, Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, Denver, Indy are virtual locks for the playoffs. So that's 5 spots.

Same ole, same ole around here...

This team is fighting with the Chiefs, Ravens, Texans, Jets for the final playoff spot.

If OPiv can go as far as Matt Cassel winning, I think it's safe we can use our beating Denver and Indy recently as a barometer to beat them again no?

BTW, I'm om the 8-8 group.

- - - Updated - - -


Yeah five years ago.
This current Pats team isn't close to that team personal wise.

What? They have Hogan!!!!

Matt Cassel's team was stacked.

I think we can use Jim Kelly's team too. Might as well.

[Ingtar33]

as for AFC teams i'd rank them like this

*NE
*Balt
Pitt/Cinn (there goes the wildcard spots)

---------------------------
EVERYONE ELSE - including
*(AFCS winner / probably the Colts or Texans)
*(AFCW winner / probably the Raiders or Chiefs)

We probably could compete for the AFCS championship, heck i'd probably say we'd be a fav for that division, however we're not in the AFCS
We probably could compete for the AFCW championship, heck i'd probably say we'd be a fav for that division, however we're not in the AFCW

To get to the playoffs we need to be better then 3 teams. NE and the 2 wildcard teams coming out of the AFCN. We aren't and we won't be.

[OpIv37]

If OPiv can go as far as Matt Cassel winning, I think it's safe we can use our beating Denver and Indy recently as a barometer to beat them again no?

BTW, I'm om the 8-8 group.

- - - Updated - - -



What? They have Hogan!!!!

Matt Cassel's team was stacked.

I think we can use Jim Kelly's team too. Might as well.
Cassell is the only example we have of Bellicheck with a no-name QB while Brady was out. And he won 11 games.

[OpIv37]

Yeah five years ago.
This current Pats team isn't close to that team personal wise.
Yeah I've been hearing about the Pats' lack of talent and impending demise for 10 years now.

[Mr. Miyagi]

doesn't work like that. Look at the schedule.

losses to AZ and Sea, loss to NE (with brady), losses to Pit, Cinn and Baltimore. That right there is 6 losses guaranteed
Guaranteed huh? Then why don't we just forfeit those games? Why bother playing them and risk injury? Are you one of the football gods that control the outcome?

[justasportsfan]

Cassell is the only example we have of Bellicheck with a no-name QB while Brady was out. And he won 11 games.

So 1 qb is enough example for you? You arguing with yourself again? Their back up qb is NOT Cassel and while you may think it meant nothing, the bills beat the pats Garapolo playing QB. That game is more recent than you Matt Cassel era.

[OpIv37]

So 1 qb is enough example for you? You arguing with yourself again? Their back up qb is NOT Cassel and while you may think it meant nothing, the bills beat the pats Garapolo playing QB. That game is more recent than you Matt Cassel era.

Is it enough? No but it's all we have.

And you can't say that Garrapolo isn't Cassel because we don't know that yet. He may completely suck but he may be far better.

And NE was resting starters in that game so it is ridiculous to try to draw any conclusions from it.

The point is that it isn't safe to assume Bellicheck can't win without Brady because he's done it in the past.

[Mahdi]

Teams that are clearly ahead of Buffalo:

New England
Pittsburgh
Cincinnati
Indianapolis

The only reason I have those 4 teams ahead is because of QBs and Belichick. That being said TT might put himself ahead of Andy Dalton if he shows improvement over last year. That is TBD though so Cincinnati stays ahead on what we know now.

After that its really a toss up:

Buffalo, NYJ, Denver, Oakland, KC, San Diego, Houston, Tennessee, Jacksonville, Baltimore are all in the same boat.

[sukie]

Teams that are clearly ahead of Buffalo:

New England
Pittsburgh
Cincinnati
Indianapolis

The only reason I have those 4 teams ahead is because of QBs and Belichick. That being said TT might put himself ahead of Andy Dalton if he shows improvement over last year. That is TBD though so Cincinnati stays ahead on what we know now.

After that its really a toss up:

Buffalo, NYJ, Denver, Oakland, KC, San Diego, Houston, Tennessee, Jacksonville, Baltimore are all in the same boat.

Sorry but one of the 4 (KC OAK DEN SD) are in so you are left with 1 team. One of those teams HAS to win their division.

Is everyone writing off Miami that easily?

[justasportsfan]

Is it enough? No but it's all we have.

And you can't say that Garrapolo isn't Cassel because we don't know that yet. He may completely suck but he may be far better.

And NE was resting starters in that game so it is ridiculous to try to draw any conclusions from it.

The point is that it isn't safe to assume Bellicheck can't win without Brady because he's done it in the past.


Ah NO. All we have is that game that Garapolo played in vs. the bills. Thats more recent than Cassel. I never said he sucked but he wasn't Tom Brady when we played him either. We actually agree in the end as far as the Pats still being the team to beat but just took the different paths. Mat Cassel has nothing to do with today's Pats other than BB and McDaniels.

[Mahdi]

Sorry but one of the 4 (KC OAK DEN SD) are in so you are left with 1 team. One of those teams HAS to win their division.

Is everyone writing off Miami that easily?

I wasn't predicting a playoff bracket. Just stating which AFC teams are the top and where the rest are.

[sukie]

I wasn't predicting a playoff bracket. Just stating which AFC teams are the top and where the rest are.

but one of those teams we will NOT be battling for a playoff spot with...

[Mr. Pink]

If OPiv can go as far as Matt Cassel winning, I think it's safe we can use our beating Denver and Indy recently as a barometer to beat them again no?

BTW, I'm om the 8-8 group.


While we may be on par by using the logic we've recently beat both Denver and Indy, those are likely division winners.

If not Indy in the South then it's Houston
.
I don't see the Chiefs being able to overtake the Broncos in the West and the Chargers and Raiders have no shot at winning that division nor making the playoffs for that matter.

That's why I put we're fighting with the Texans and Chiefs for the final wild card spot.

As Ingtar stated if the Bills were in either the South or West, we'd have a better chance because we could theoretically challenge for the division title. Don't think we're better than the Chiefs nor Broncos but in the South it would be a legitimate chance to take the division.

The Colts, Texans and Bills are all pretty average middling teams and if the battle was between just those 3 teams for a playoff spot whoever got the better bounces during the year would emerge. I'd still put my money on a healthy Luck and the Colts though.

[pmoon6]

While we may be on par by using the logic we've recently beat both Denver and Indy, those are likely division winners.

If not Indy in the South then it's Houston
.
I don't see the Chiefs being able to overtake the Broncos in the West and the Chargers and Raiders have no shot at winning that division nor making the playoffs for that matter.

That's why I put we're fighting with the Texans and Chiefs for the final wild card spot.

As Ingtar stated if the Bills were in either the South or West, we'd have a better chance because we could theoretically challenge for the division title. Don't think we're better than the Chiefs nor Broncos but in the South it would be a legitimate chance to take the division.

The Colts, Texans and Bills are all pretty average middling teams and if the battle was between just those 3 teams for a playoff spot whoever got the better bounces during the year would emerge. I'd still put my money on a healthy Luck and the Colts though.BS. The Raiders have a good chance to beat out Denver or KC.

[sukie]

While we may be on par by using the logic we've recently beat both Denver and Indy, those are likely division winners.

If not Indy in the South then it's Houston
.
I don't see the Chiefs being able to overtake the Broncos in the West and the Chargers and Raiders have no shot at winning that division nor making the playoffs for that matter.

That's why I put we're fighting with the Texans and Chiefs for the final wild card spot.

As Ingtar stated if the Bills were in either the South or West, we'd have a better chance because we could theoretically challenge for the division title. Don't think we're better than the Chiefs nor Broncos but in the South it would be a legitimate chance to take the division.

The Colts, Texans and Bills are all pretty average middling teams and if the battle was between just those 3 teams for a playoff spot whoever got the better bounces during the year would emerge. I'd still put my money on a healthy Luck and the Colts though.

While this seems to be logical. Denver is worlds away from a lock with THAT QB situation / potential dumpster fire.

[Mr. Pink]

BS. The Raiders have a good chance to beat out Denver or KC.

Based on what?

They have one of the worst defenses in football.

They'll need to score at least 25 points a game to get above .500 which still won't be enough to win their division.

Or is this based on the fact they went 1-3 vs the Chiefs and Broncos last year?

[Mr. Pink]

While this seems to be logical. Denver is worlds away from a lock with THAT QB situation / potential dumpster fire.

Meh, they went 5-2 with Brock Osweiler.

They can win with Siemian.

[Ingtar33]

Guaranteed huh? Then why don't we just forfeit those games? Why bother playing them and risk injury? Are you one of the football gods that control the outcome?

it's close enough. a lifetime of football has taught me that it will even out in the end. Even if we beat one of those teams we'll probably lose to someone we have no right losing to like Jax in exchange. Those 6 teams WILL win, mostly because half of those 6 games are on the road; furthermore those 6 teams are all legit superbowl contenders.

[The Beef]

Yeah as noted the division isn't happening so you got 2 wild card spots.

It's almost a lock one of those is Pitt or Cincy.

From the South Indy is likely, Houston and Jacksonville can both contend.

The west honestly is wide open. Denvers D is elite, KC will be in the hunt, the Raiders have a ton of talent. San Diego has been bad for awhile but with Rivers they have a chance to steal games.

Essentially the Jets, Phins, Bengals/Steelers, Indy/Hou/Jax, and KC/Den/Oak are all fighting over 4 spots. Every team is flawed the NFC West is no cupcake.

The Bills have 4 virtual automatic losses, NE x 2 Seattle and Arizona, and 2 highly unliklies at Cinci and vs Pitt.

Games on the road at Baltimore, NYJ, Miami and Oakland are all must wins.

I believe the offense will be better based on health and continuity. The defense was so bad last year for the majority of the season I feel they can't help but be better.

That schedule is brutal though and this team is going to have to beat top flight competitin at least 40% of the time to contend for a wildcard. IF!!!!! they start 2-0 which is possible, and steal week 3 vs Arizona then they have a chance. 1-2 is likely though, which is par for the course.

[sudzy]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/p3-eavMSBnk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[YardRat]

Patriots are in.
The Dolphins and Jets are with the Bills on paper, but I wouldn't be surprised if both finish ahead of Buffalo this season.
The rest of the conference doesn't really matter, because fourth place is 100% assured of not going to the playoffs.

[Mace]

Ok, I'll play. The 6 playoff teams.

Division winners (imho):
- New England, Indianapolis, Denver, Cincinnati

Wild cards or possibilities (imho):
-Kansas City, Oakland, Pittsburgh, Baltimore, San Diego

That's 9.

I'll start out by saying I'm sure we can beat Indianapolis. Luck feasts on his division and is mostly lost outside of it. That's proven by his wins/losses record (to date, I don't think that changes this year).

Of all the rest, there's a common thread. They are better coached, more talented, more disciplined, more battle tested, even when they have injuries, solidly quarterbacked. To date we are none of those, and those qualities win crunch games when you add them together.

Of the others :
Oakland has dramatically improved, Carr is coming into his own, their defense is going to be mean. They rebuilt, we retoooled, I think they did better.
San Diego up or down ? I think Rivers has something to prove, if they're unreplenished, they fall off the list, but it still leaves 8 better teams.

To date, the Bills do not rise to occasions, overpower teams with talent, even reliably beat weaker teams. They do not win with savvy coaching and discipline, they have not proven they have more than a 19th ranked defense, that they can execute an even marginally brisk 2 minute offense, avoid stupid penalties at important moments, use the middle of the field on offense, or outgun a team in a high scoring game.

All of this leads me to believe we are not good enough to play with the big kids, and last year I didn't see them good enough to sometimes even play with the not so big kids. Makes me think we undeniably have a ways to go.

[DraftBoy]

Is everyone writing off Miami that easily?

Yes, they had an even less impressive off-season than we had.

[DraftBoy]

Based on what?

They have one of the worst defenses in football.

They'll need to score at least 25 points a game to get above .500 which still won't be enough to win their division.

Or is this based on the fact they went 1-3 vs the Chiefs and Broncos last year?

True, but the Raiders have plenty of talent on defense if Del Rio can figure out how to get them to play together. I don't think scoring 20-25 points a game is going to be a problem for the Raiders.

[Historian]

Chiefs win the Conference. Maybe even the SB.

North: Cincinnati
South: Houston
West: KC
East: NE

Wild Cards: Oakland, Denver

[gebobs]

I feel really good about the Bills chances based on what I saw yesterday. The Ryan boys look hungry.

[Forward_Lateral]

Chiefs aren't winning crap.

[Mahdi]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000693404/article/2016-afc-playoff-predictions-south-west-appear-wide-open

No one has Bills in Playoffs...

[SkinnyBully]

I'm apparently not able to apply "thanks" to posts yet, but I would for this one. It's right on the money.


Ok, I'll play. The 6 playoff teams.

Division winners (imho):
- New England, Indianapolis, Denver, Cincinnati

Wild cards or possibilities (imho):
-Kansas City, Oakland, Pittsburgh, Baltimore, San Diego

That's 9.

I'll start out by saying I'm sure we can beat Indianapolis. Luck feasts on his division and is mostly lost outside of it. That's proven by his wins/losses record (to date, I don't think that changes this year).

Of all the rest, there's a common thread. They are better coached, more talented, more disciplined, more battle tested, even when they have injuries, solidly quarterbacked. To date we are none of those, and those qualities win crunch games when you add them together.

Of the others :
Oakland has dramatically improved, Carr is coming into his own, their defense is going to be mean. They rebuilt, we retoooled, I think they did better.
San Diego up or down ? I think Rivers has something to prove, if they're unreplenished, they fall off the list, but it still leaves 8 better teams.

To date, the Bills do not rise to occasions, overpower teams with talent, even reliably beat weaker teams. They do not win with savvy coaching and discipline, they have not proven they have more than a 19th ranked defense, that they can execute an even marginally brisk 2 minute offense, avoid stupid penalties at important moments, use the middle of the field on offense, or outgun a team in a high scoring game.

All of this leads me to believe we are not good enough to play with the big kids, and last year I didn't see them good enough to sometimes even play with the not so big kids. Makes me think we undeniably have a ways to go.

[Buffalogic]

Ok a few points brought up:

Lots are anointing PIT and CIN as virtual locks for the playoffs. One probably, not both.

Both those teams have major flaws. Everyone on offense in suspended for PIT and they have one of the worst defenses in the NFL. CIN lost their number 2 and 3 receivers. Both of those teams are going to have to prove they can win in 2016.

Division winners are probably:
Jacksonville
KC
CIN
NE

I don't see any locks for a wildcard at this point for any team in the AFC. Also, it's not a certainty NE wins the division. They have some major challenges to overcome. History says they will, but it's not a lock.

Point is there's really no reason outside of our constant year after year suckage to write off this current bills team.

The AFC is pretty wide open this year. Every team has some serious flaws.

[Cleve]

The Ryan boys look hungry.

They didn't get those big fat guts by eating like birds, that's for sure. More like ravenous pterodactyls from the look of things. The Wildman of Borneo, Rob, looks like he's well along in his last trimester.

[Mr. Pink]

True, but the Raiders have plenty of talent on defense if Del Rio can figure out how to get them to play together. I don't think scoring 20-25 points a game is going to be a problem for the Raiders.

Last year they scored about 23 points a game, they do have the potential to put up more than 25 however they also have the potential to give up almost 28.

They are a team that is gonna go as far as Carr, Crabtree and Cooper can take them.

They'll definitely be fun to watch though.

[Forward_Lateral]

I don't understand how anyone is picking the Chiefs to win that division.

Denver won the superbowl, and has pretty much the same team. Yes, they don't have Manning, but he was hardly Manning last year.

Oakland has the potential to put up some big numbers on offense.


As for the rest of the Conference, it's wide open, IMO. If Tyrod can play at a higher level than he did last year, the Bills will have a legit shot at the playoffs. If he gets hurt, or sucks, it will be another womp womp season.

Anyone crowning any team a champion this early in the season is merely throwing crap at the wall and hoping it sticks.

[DraftBoy]

Last year they scored about 23 points a game, they do have the potential to put up more than 25 however they also have the potential to give up almost 28.

They are a team that is gonna go as far as Carr, Crabtree and Cooper can take them.

They'll definitely be fun to watch though.

Don't forget about Murray at RB either. Went over 1,000 yards last year and he could see double digit TD's this season with how open their passing attack is.