Is Tyrod's game correctable?

[Wally The Barber]

This is a good question, glad you asked

He needs to fix vision problems, most come from taking off when he can't find an open WR.

He then runs, but while running he totally givens up on the pass. Guys wide open are waving their arms but Tyrod is looking to avoid tacklers

Small adjustment.....Just stay in the pocket and run North or south only. Warren Moon had the same problem but corrected this in Canada.

Who ever started the rumor that Tyrod can't read a defense is just plain wrong. It may seem that way but he didn't have the option to change plays under Rex Ryan OR very limited permission

Some say he can't throw to the center of the field, not true, he is NOT TO SHORT but he was is schooled not to force passes. Correctable

If it wasn't correctable problems the Bills would have passed. I think you are looking at a MUCH BETTER QB in 2017.

If I am wrong then Shoot me, I don't give a ****.

[swiper]

Um, no. No more so than EJ's game was correctable. Taylor is nothing more that the current version of Michael Vick. Bound to end up with a mangled or broken lower extremity.

[kscdogbillsfan1221]

This is a good question, glad you asked

He needs to fix vision problems, most come from taking off when he can't find an open WR.

He then runs, but while running he totally givens up on the pass. Guys wide open are waving their arms but Tyrod is looking to avoid tacklers

Small adjustment.....Just stay in the pocket and run North or south only. Warren Moon had the same problem but corrected this in Canada.

Who ever started the rumor that Tyrod can't read a defense is just plain wrong. It may seem that way but he didn't have the option to change plays under Rex Ryan OR very limited permission

Some say he can't throw to the center of the field, not true, he is NOT TO SHORT but he was is schooled not to force passes. Correctable

If it wasn't correctable problems the Bills would have passed. I think you are looking at a MUCH BETTER QB in 2017.

If I am wrong then Shoot me, I don't give a ****.

you sound like Cali512 and i sincerely hope you two are right. I'm not optimistic he'll be much better but am hopeful

[Joe Fo Sho]

This is a good question, glad you asked

He needs to fix vision problems, most come from taking off when he can't find an open WR.

He then runs, but while running he totally givens up on the pass. Guys wide open are waving their arms but Tyrod is looking to avoid tacklers

This is the most infuriating thing to watch him do. Our receivers get visibly upset.


Small adjustment.....Just stay in the pocket and run North or south only. Warren Moon had the same problem but corrected this in Canada.

Tyrod is no Warren Moon.


Who ever started the rumor that Tyrod can't read a defense is just plain wrong. It may seem that way but he didn't have the option to change plays under Rex Ryan OR very limited permission

Nothing liking putting the end to a rumor by creating another one.


Some say he can't throw to the center of the field, not true, he is NOT TO SHORT but he was is schooled not to force passes. Correctable

Another excuse for Tyrod. Were there no routes run over the center of the field all season? Are you saying they were just decoy routes?


If it wasn't correctable problems the Bills would have passed. I think you are looking at a MUCH BETTER QB in 2017.

You're overestimating this Bills Front Office.


If I am wrong then Shoot me, I don't give a ****.

I hope you're right.

[kscdogbillsfan1221]

Um, no. No more so than EJ's game was correctable. Taylor is nothing more that the current version of Michael Vick. Bound to end up with a mangled or broken lower extremity.

i said it before I'll say it again.

Tyrod isn't and will never be a world beater. But at least he looks and plays like a solid NFL player.

EJ will never take another snap in the NFL again in the regular season I predict

[Wally The Barber]

Um, no. No more so than EJ's game was correctable. Taylor is nothing more that the current version of Michael Vick. Bound to end up with a mangled or broken lower extremity.Normally I would agree but A Smart Head coach will design plays and build an offense limiting outside running by the quarterback.
If he continues to run then he will be injured by mid season.

There is no real need to run because from what I see he can make every throw

[Joe Fo Sho]

Normally I would agree but A Smart Head coach will design plays and build an offense limiting outside running by the quarterback.

I wonder why Anthony Lynn got promoted to Head Coach in LA if he was so terrible at designing plays?


There is no real need to run because from what I see he can make every throw

Now that's funny. Stick with the Tyrod homerisms, they're much better than that old guy routine that you gave up on already.

[Wally The Barber]

I wonder why Anthony Lynn got promoted to Head Coach in LA if he was so terrible at designing plays?




Now that's funny. Stick with the Tyrod homerisms, they're much better than that old guy routine that you gave up on already.


I am not a real big fan but till someone better comes along he might surprise you

We will see

[WagonCircler]

This is a good question, glad you asked

He needs to fix vision problems, most come from taking off when he can't find an open WR.

Or maybe his vision isn't the problem, but processing the visual information is.

That's a gift. It's like foot speed. You either have it, or you don't. And you can only improve incrementally.

[daryls61]

No.

[YardRat]

We're going to find out.

[Mouldsie]

I think he has room to grow because he played with a lot more aggression in college and I think he was coached into/tries too hard to be conservative at times. If he can find a balance, get some support from the defense, and also have his top 3 WR's actually be known commodity's he can be more productive and be a playoff QB.

Would I have moved forward with him? Probably not, but I am also not going to pretend he's absolute trash or that it would be so easy for the ****ty Bills FO to do better. He's the best QB we've had since Jimbo (minus Bledsoe's first 8 games --but his weapons were also tremendous). Sad but true.

[Wally The Barber]

We're going to find out.

I am not completely sure he will start.

**** happens

[Bill Cody]

He needs to fix vision problems, most come from taking off when he can't find an open WR.

He then runs, but while running he totally givens up on the pass. Guys wide open are waving their arms but Tyrod is looking to avoid tacklers

Small adjustment.....

Completely agree, small adjustment and very easy to do.

Sincerely,

Vince Young

[Thurmal]

Um, no. No more so than EJ's game was correctable. Taylor is nothing more that the current version of Michael Vick.
I would consider it a huge positive for him if he ended up like Michael Vick. Unfortunately, I think his ceiling is more like Aaron Brooks.

[Arm of Harm]

I think he has room to grow because he played with a lot more aggression in college and I think he was coached into/tries too hard to be conservative at times. If he can find a balance, get some support from the defense, and also have his top 3 WR's actually be known commodity's he can be more productive and be a playoff QB.

Would I have moved forward with him? Probably not, but I am also not going to pretend he's absolute trash or that it would be so easy for the ****ty Bills FO to do better. He's the best QB we've had since Jimbo (minus Bledsoe's first 8 games --but his weapons were also tremendous). Sad but true.

In Ryan Fitzpatrick's best season for the Bills (2011), he threw for over 3800 passing yards (http://www.nfl.com/player/ryanfitzpatrick/2506581/profile). In 2012 Fitzpatrick threw for 3400 passing yards. He threw for 3900 passing yards in 2015 for the Jets. Taylor threw for 3035 passing yards in 2015, and 3025 passing yards in 2016 (his two best in the NFL). Kyle Orton threw for 3000 passing yards for the Bills back in 2012, and did so in only 12 starts (http://www.nfl.com/player/kyleorton/2506444/profile). Neither of those quarterbacks had the same kind of OL that Taylor has, nor the same kind of running game to take pressure off the passing game. As passers, Fitzpatrick and Orton were better than anything Taylor has shown us thus far.

Edit: Doug Flutie was better than Taylor as well.

[Wally The Barber]

Completely agree, small adjustment and very easy to do.

Sincerely,

Vince Young

I won't trash Vince Young. There is a guy who couldn't read a defense

[Joe Fo Sho]

I won't trash Vince Young. There is a guy who couldn't read a defense

It was probably his coach's fault.

[Mouldsie]

In Ryan Fitzpatrick's best season for the Bills (2011), he threw for over 3800 passing yards (http://www.nfl.com/player/ryanfitzpatrick/2506581/profile). In 2012 Fitzpatrick threw for 3400 passing yards. He threw for 3900 passing yards in 2015 for the Jets. Taylor threw for 3035 passing yards in 2015, and 3025 passing yards in 2016 (his two best in the NFL). Kyle Orton threw for 3000 passing yards for the Bills back in 2012, and did so in only 12 starts (http://www.nfl.com/player/kyleorton/2506444/profile). Neither of those quarterbacks had the same kind of OL that Taylor has, nor the same kind of running game to take pressure off the passing game. As passers, Fitzpatrick and Orton were better than anything Taylor has shown us thus far.

Edit: Doug Flutie was better than Taylor as well.
Taylor also helps said running game directly and indirectly and doesn't turn the ball over. He's the only guy since Jimbo with a .500+ record for us, hes the only only since Jimbo with a QB rating above 90 for us. There's other stats like that I'm too lazy to look up. He's better than Fitz and Orton. Orton also had a much better D

[Joe Fo Sho]

He's the only guy since Jimbo with a .500+ record for us, hes the only only since Jimbo with a QB rating above 90 for us.

He's definitely the best piece of trash in the bin.


There's other stats like that I'm too lazy to look up.

My favorite stats like that are how he threw 56 more passes in 2016 compared to 2015 and had 12 less yards, 3 less touchdowns, and a QB rating 10 points less. It's great.

[Mouldsie]

I told you I wouldn't have moved forward with him. I also am fair about assessing him though. He's not the trash pile some of you say.

[Joe Fo Sho]

I told you I wouldn't have moved forward with him. I also am fair about assessing him though. He's not the trash pile some of you say.

But when you compare him to the list of QBs we've had since Jim Kelly, you're directly comparing him to garbage.

Compare him to good QBs and see what you come up with.

[SpikedLemonade]

IF HE CAN LEARN TO RUN ON 4" PLATFORM SHOES...SURE.

[endzone]

It's the lack of NFL quality receivers that makes correctability even an issue.

[PrimeTime]

This is the most infuriating thing to watch him do. Our receivers get visibly upset.
Tyrod is no Warren Moon.
Nothing liking putting the end to a rumor by creating another one.
That's Fact.. no rumor
Another excuse for Tyrod. Were there no routes run over the center of the field all season? Are you saying they were just decoy routes?
Not an excuse man.. Tyrod was left to be killed many Times. You're overestimating this Bills Front Office.
I hope you're right.
I do to

[Wally The Barber]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=toasMKQ5ivc

[Arm of Harm]

Taylor also helps said running game directly and indirectly and doesn't turn the ball over. He's the only guy since Jimbo with a .500+ record for us, hes the only only since Jimbo with a QB rating above 90 for us. There's other stats like that I'm too lazy to look up. He's better than Fitz and Orton. Orton also had a much better D


He helps the running game directly, by running the ball himself. He does little to help it "indirectly," because defenses know that they should focus on stopping the run when Tyrod is on the field.

It is false to assert that he's the only QB since Jimbo with a .500+ record for us. The Bills made the playoffs in 1998 and 1999, with Doug Flutie getting most of the starts both years. Also, the Bills went 9-7 in 2004 with Drew Bledsoe as QB, barely missing the playoffs.

You are also incorrect to claim that Taylor is the only QB since Jim Kelly to put up a QB rating of 90 or above for us. In 1998, Rob Johnson (http://www.nfl.com/player/robjohnson/2501452/profile) had a QB rating of 102.8, and had a QB rating of 119.5 in 1999. I'll grant that Rob Johnson's QB rating overstates the quality of his play. Just as Tyrod Taylor's QB rating overstates the quality of his.

Tyrod Taylor is the fourth-best QB we've had in the post-Kelly era; with Kyle Orton, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and Doug Flutie being the top three.

[Joe Fo Sho]

He helps the running game directly, by running the ball himself. He does little to help it "indirectly," because defenses know that they should focus on stopping the run when Tyrod is on the field.

You could argue that he indirectly hurts the running game because defenses can stack the box without fear of Tyrod throwing.

Although I do wish the Pro-Tyrod group would stop talking about how much he helps the running game and start talking about how much he hurts the passing game. Ya know, because he's a quarterback.

[Historian]

Yes.

His long ball is great, when he has the cojones to throw it.

It's the short stuff he needs to work on.

That is fixable to an extent.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

Maybe. Good coaching is all about playing to a player's strengths and masking his weaknesses. Tyrod could be coached up to being a competent game managing qb, but you are never getting deep into the post season with him and nor does a good coach place the responsibility of winning a game on Tyrod's shoulders. Therein lies the problem, to win in the league you generally need a qb who can take over a game. We have not had that since Bledsoe.

[Bill Cody]

I won't trash Vince Young. There is a guy who couldn't read a defense

I think you just did

It's a pity the NFL ain't the Rose Bowl

[Mouldsie]

He helps the running game directly, by running the ball himself. He does little to help it "indirectly," because defenses know that they should focus on stopping the run when Tyrod is on the field.

It is false to assert that he's the only QB since Jimbo with a .500+ record for us. The Bills made the playoffs in 1998 and 1999, with Doug Flutie getting most of the starts both years. Also, the Bills went 9-7 in 2004 with Drew Bledsoe as QB, barely missing the playoffs.

You are also incorrect to claim that Taylor is the only QB since Jim Kelly to put up a QB rating of 90 or above for us. In 1998, Rob Johnson (http://www.nfl.com/player/robjohnson/2501452/profile) had a QB rating of 102.8, and had a QB rating of 119.5 in 1999. I'll grant that Rob Johnson's QB rating overstates the quality of his play. Just as Tyrod Taylor's QB rating overstates the quality of his.

Tyrod Taylor is the fourth-best QB we've had in the post-Kelly era; with Kyle Orton, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and Doug Flutie being the top three.

I'm talking career with us, not a season.

[Mouldsie]

You could argue that he indirectly hurts the running game because defenses can stack the box without fear of Tyrod throwing.

Although I do wish the Pro-Tyrod group would stop talking about how much he helps the running game and start talking about how much he hurts the passing game. Ya know, because he's a quarterback.
The D has to put a defender on him. That's also why Seattle suddenly had a better running game when they acquired Russel Wilson behind that **** OL and how their run game got better late in this season as well when RW got healthy.
RW is a far superior passer though. I wanted RW badly. It's on the record.

Who is in the Pro Tyrod group? I want names.

[Joe Fo Sho]

The D has to put a defender on him. That's also why Seattle suddenly had a better running game when they acquired Russel Wilson behind that **** OL and how their run game got better late in this season as well when RW got healthy.
RW is a far superior passer though. I wanted RW badly. It's on the record.

Marshawn probably had nothing to do with their running game getting better.

I still wish the argument would turn to Tyrod's throwing ability, not his running ability. If running ability won championships, Vick would have both hands full of rings.


Who is in the Pro Tyrod group? I want names.

The Pro-Tyrod group is anyone who didn't want to cut him loose this offseason. There are a good amount of folks in that group. Cali is probably the most outspoken.

[Cali512]

I really believe Tyrod suffered from a coach who was pounding in his head to not make a mistake. Due to that I believe he was hesitant to throw the ball in the middle of the field or in traffic. Our coach came out so many times and said that he wants a low risk run offense that will allow his defense to win the game. We also were without most of our weapons every game it seemed.

This would explain why Tyrod played so well the Miami game, along with why we would go into a shell when we would get the lead. Tyrods game would literally completely change some halftimes when we were winning which I believe is something our coach would order. It would also explain that KC game where Sammy got like 7 catches for 150 yards than we went into a shell in the second half. Sammy was double covered that first half in it didn't matter, Tyrod threw the ball.

[Mouldsie]

Marshawn probably had nothing to do with their running game getting better.

I still wish the argument would turn to Tyrod's throwing ability, not his running ability. If running ability won championships, Vick would have both hands full of rings.



The Pro-Tyrod group is anyone who didn't want to cut him loose this offseason. There are a good amount of folks in that group. Cali is probably the most outspoken.

Marshawn was there for a couple seasons before RW. The line was/is the worst in the league every year. His presence is worth a full yard per carry. Stop trying to pretend that's not a reality and stick with the second half of your argument about throwing prowess.


The presence of a running threat at QB has a proven effect on the YPC of the tailbacks. This is seen across the league and across seasons very consistently with high causation.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Marshawn was there for a couple seasons before RW. The line was/is the worst in the league every year. His presence is worth a full yard per carry.

Seattle has a top rushing attack but the worst offensive line every year? Yeeesh.

[Mouldsie]

Seattle has a top rushing attack but the worst offensive line every year? Yeeesh.

Yes

[Joe Fo Sho]

Yes

You'd think run blocking would factor in to their overall rating. On second thought, maybe they rank lineman by their ability to tackle. Kind of like how some people rate quarterbacks by their ability to run.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

I would stop this "fix" idea. You can't expect Tyrod to function as a prototype QB because he has not been that guy his entire life, including college.

In my mind, "effective" should be the focus. To convert a 3rd & 5, throwing over the middle is one way. But there are other options. maximize those options may have a bigger impact than expecting Tyrod to throw like Brady's expectation and accuracy.

[Cali512]

You'd think run blocking would factor in to their overall rating. On second thought, maybe they rank lineman by their ability to tackle. Kind of like how some people rate quarterbacks by their ability to run.


Yeah Rawls 3.2 ypc were really freaking impressive

[Cali512]

I would stop this "fix" idea. You can't expect Tyrod to function as a prototype QB because he has not been that guy his entire life, including college.

In my mind, "effective" should be the focus. To convert a 3rd & 5, throwing over the middle is one way. But there are other options. maximize those options may have a bigger impact than expecting Tyrod to throw like Brady's expectation and accuracy.


Like Cam. He's had horrible CPT his whole career, so they let him run a lot and give him easy throws to complete. That's what we need to do with Tyrod. Cam always has 2-3 checkdown to 10 yd options, then a couple deep routes. Buffalo last year would either have everyone run deep or everyone do a stop route

[Cali512]

You could argue that he indirectly hurts the running game because defenses can stack the box without fear of Tyrod throwing.

Although I do wish the Pro-Tyrod group would stop talking about how much he helps the running game and start talking about how much he hurts the passing game. Ya know, because he's a quarterback.


He doesn't hurt the passing game? Yes he's had some issues in his first 2 years as QB, but does anyone not remember how pathetic Cam looked in his first couple seasons? His accuracy was down right terrible

Also even with them stacking the box, his deep ball prevents any sort of exact game plan vs our team

[Joe Fo Sho]

Yeah Rawls 3.2 ypc were really freaking impressive

I know, right? It's almost like Russell Wilson didn't have such a profound affect on their run game last year.

[Joe Fo Sho]

He doesn't hurt the passing game? Yes he's had some issues in his first 2 years as QB, but does anyone not remember how pathetic Cam looked in his first couple seasons? His accuracy was down right terrible

Were there ever any QBs in the history of the NFL that have had issues their first 2 years and then continued to struggle? If there are, then I would site that incredibly large group vs your 1 example of Cam Newton.


Also even with them stacking the box, his deep ball prevents any sort of exact game plan vs our team

What deep ball? The one he refused to throw or the one that he couldn't complete?

[Mouldsie]

I know, right? It's almost like Russell Wilson didn't have such a profound affect on their run game last year.

Exactly. A gimpy RW caused a huge dropoff in their run game production until the last couple weeks of the year when it rebounded a bit as he was getting his mobility back.... (but still was recovering and not as much of a threat.)

Thanks for coming around!

[Joe Fo Sho]

Exactly. A gimpy RW caused a huge dropoff in their run game production until the last couple weeks of the year when it rebounded a bit as he was getting his mobility back.... (but still was recovering and not as much of a threat.)

Thanks for coming around!

Almost like running quarterbacks get hurt a lot. Which appears to be a positive to the Pro-Tyrod crowd.

[Mouldsie]

You'd think run blocking would factor in to their overall rating. On second thought, maybe they rank lineman by their ability to tackle. Kind of like how some people rate quarterbacks by their ability to run.

Educate yourself a bit:
**** OL: https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-lines-this-season/


and here:
https://www.numberfire.com/nfl/news/2399/do-rushing-quarterbacks-help-running-back-success
^running QB's strengthen RB success


That was the math, here's just one paragraph:
https://www.profootballfocus.com/college-football-breaking-down-the-rise-of-running-qbs/
"The running game comes down to simple mathematics. Once the ball is handed off, 11 players on defense are deployed to stop 10 players on offense, everyone has a gap to play, and in theory, there should be an extra man available to tackle the ball-carrier. The running quarterback has changed the math in defensive football as he essentially evens up the game and the threat to run the ball makes it 11-on-11, negating the defense’s advantage."

[Mouldsie]

Almost like running quarterbacks get hurt a lot. Which appears to be a positive to the Pro-Tyrod crowd.

Oh well nobody really mentioned that yet in the whole inane "Tyrod doesnt help the running game argument" we're having.
It's def a risk factor!

[Joe Fo Sho]

Educate yourself a bit:
**** OL: https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-lines-this-season/

What about 2011-2015? Which is when the running game was actually good.


and here:
https://www.numberfire.com/nfl/news/2399/do-rushing-quarterbacks-help-running-back-success
^running QB's strengthen RB success


That was the math, here's just one paragraph:
https://www.profootballfocus.com/college-football-breaking-down-the-rise-of-running-qbs/
"The running game comes down to simple mathematics. Once the ball is handed off, 11 players on defense are deployed to stop 10 players on offense, everyone has a gap to play, and in theory, there should be an extra man available to tackle the ball-carrier. The running quarterback has changed the math in defensive football as he essentially evens up the game and the threat to run the ball makes it 11-on-11, negating the defense’s advantage."

It's the same math that made people think that the wildcat was going to work, but was only successful for 1 season. If we play a good defensive team, Tyrod is countered easily. It's happened in almost every game where he's played against a playoff team.

I'm not going to say that Russell Wilson didn't help their running game, I just don't think it was as much as an entire yard per carry for the running backs. I think the effect is much lessened with Tyrod, as he doesn't have close to the throwing ability of Wilson. Not to mention Wilson uses his legs to buy time to throw, whereas Tyrod panics and takes off only to run out of bounds around the LOS. Once in awhile Tyrod will break free, but it's not enough for me to get excited about.