Buffalo Bills & Sabres long-term plans, you won't like it

[Skooby]

Team Pegula parked money in Buffalo Sports franchises knowing that the values will rise drastically over the coming years. They could sell the Bills to Toronto investors down the line & the Sabres could head back to Quebec or Hartford. So basically we're a big boy holding station and there's no long-term plan for either franchise to stay in Buffalo. The stadium plan was deferred indefinitely and the talk you hear of 5-6 years is complete bullshjt. Pegula's plan is to minimally redress both venues (some public and his own) keep playing there until it's time to close out his position.

The talk of him being our savior to keep the Bills in town is simply just a cover for his financial goals, which are virtually insatiable (Billions to show for it). There's not going to be a new stadium in Buffalo with him, ever. The other power players in town basically offered him land for free and we know about the decade long tax advantage (which he could probably make decades) on improvements including building and equipment which he is skipping over.

Moral is, don't expect the team to win anymore than it has too again or even get out of it's own way. Selling a party to a bunch of alcoholics is an easy sale at a low price, big city money isn't going to work here. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I usually try to forewarn of incredibly negative things to come, this being terrible news that I wanted to share. Sorry.

P.S. If they spent all the money on a new hard venue for the Bills, we'd stay in town but you'll never get past simple banter. They wanted to redress both pigs (they did) and stay even between income and box office, letting time appreciate the holdings. Kim Pegula's nest egg, nothing more. Buffalo gets the final shaft, a dying town with a few minor league teams (kinda like what we have now because we can't win sh**).

[WagonCircler]

The talk of him being our savior to keep the Bills in town is simply just a cover for his financial goals,.

Financial goals? He wastes money like a drunken sailor on leave.

And you post like a person with a massive head injury.

Your idiotic ramblings are based on nothing, least of all, logic.

[SpikedLemonade]

Team Pegula parked money in Buffalo Sports franchises knowing that the values will rise drastically over the coming years. They could sell the Bills to Toronto investors down the line & the Sabres could head back to Quebec or Hartford. So basically we're a big boy holding station and there's no long-term plan for either franchise to stay in Buffalo. The stadium plan was deferred indefinitely and the talk you hear of 5-6 years is complete bullshjt. Pegula's plan is to minimally redress both venues (some public and his own) keep playing there until it's time to close out his position.

The talk of him being our savior to keep the Bills in town is simply just a cover for his financial goals, which are virtually insatiable (Billions to show for it). There's not going to be a new stadium in Buffalo with him, ever. The other power players in town basically offered him land for free and we know about the decade long tax advantage (which he could probably make decades) on improvements including building and equipment which he is skipping over.

Moral is, don't expect the team to win anymore than it has too again or even get out of it's own way. Selling a party to a bunch of alcoholics is an easy sale at a low price, big city money isn't going to work here. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I usually try to forewarn of incredibly negative things to come, this being terrible news that I wanted to share. Sorry.

P.S. If they spent all the money on a new hard venue for the Bills, we'd stay in town but you'll never get past simple banter. They wanted to redress both pigs (they did) and stay even between income and box office, letting time appreciate the holdings. Kim Pegula's nest egg, nothing more. Buffalo gets the final shaft, a dying town with a few minor league teams (kinda like what we have now because we can't win sh**).

Once again Mitch you speak the truth.

[YardRat]

I could see that happening. The teams are going to get sold eventually, almost all of them do at some point, it's just matter of when.

[SpikedLemonade]

I could see that happening. The teams are going to get sold eventually, almost all of them do at some point, it's just matter of when.

The underlying business/economic fundamentals have NOT changed in Buffalo despite some of the comments of the delusioned here.

[coastal]

I could see the bills getting sold off and moved.

The Sabres... sold and stay.

[Skooby]

Want to see a team stay in town for the long-term ?? Spend ~$1.5 Billion on a stadium financed with Pegula's own money, then you'd have a team that stays. They put lipstick on a pig (New Era), selling it as some upgrade. It's an old era and built way too many years ago. It's a poster child of functional obsolescence, pretending like it's nothing but a hold me over is willful blindness. Time to wake up folks, Pegula isn't making the commitments the NFL expected. Toronto would if had a new stadium built or near ready by now, we got a new gift shop. Gee wow, they painted the place. Better food, and a higher price. This is fancy.... yeah not.

[Skooby]

The underlying business/economic fundamentals have NOT changed in Buffalo despite some of the comments of the delusioned here.
It kills the deal unless we give the wealthy Toronto people easier access to the stadium, which would be downtown with a better highway access and modified peace bridge to handle traffic. It's been ~90 years (June) since it was built, boy does it show like that. NY state is broke and wants to be a sanctuary city, that'll drain any remaining resources to inspire the liberals to do nothing (thank you Chuck).

Let's get our head out of the sand and demand a financial commitment from Pegula or don't show up to the games, force his hand to spend. No more excuses, time's near up.

[Dr. Lecter]

Once again Mitch you speak the truth.

That's about as good as saying "hey BillsImpossible, you are spot on here".

[Yasgur's Farm]

Want to see a team stay in town for the long-term ?? Spend ~$1.5 Billion on a stadium financed with Pegula's own money, then you'd have a team that stays. They put lipstick on a pig (New Era), selling it as some upgrade. It's an old era and built way too many years ago. It's a poster child of functional obsolescence, pretending like it's nothing but a hold me over is willful blindness. Time to wake up folks, Pegula isn't making the commitments the NFL expected. Toronto would if had a new stadium built or near ready by now, we got a new gift shop. Gee wow, they painted the place. Better food, and a higher price. This is fancy.... yeah not.Not enough that he spent $1.5B on a franchise worth $750M, is it?
It's this sort of BS from you skooby that makes you look like an attention starved whore.

[SpikedLemonade]

Want to see a team stay in town for the long-term ?? Spend ~$1.5 Billion on a stadium financed with Pegula's own money, then you'd have a team that stays. They put lipstick on a pig (New Era), selling it as some upgrade. It's an old era and built way too many years ago. It's a poster child of functional obsolescence, pretending like it's nothing but a hold me over is willful blindness. Time to wake up folks, Pegula isn't making the commitments the NFL expected. Toronto would if had a new stadium built or near ready by now, we got a new gift shop. Gee wow, they painted the place. Better food, and a higher price. This is fancy.... yeah not.
The Dumb Polack says he can just dig another hole to make money.

Well, isn't that exactly what The City of Buffalo is -- A HOLE.

[SpikedLemonade]

It kills the deal unless we give the wealthy Toronto people easier access to the stadium, which would be downtown with a better highway access and modified peace bridge to handle traffic. It's been ~90 years (June) since it was built, boy does it show like that. NY state is broke and wants to be a sanctuary city, that'll drain any remaining resources to inspire the liberals to do nothing (thank you Chuck).

Let's get our head out of the sand and demand a financial commitment from Pegula or don't show up to the games, force his hand to spend. No more excuses, time's near up.

So, in other words, Buffalo is NOT a NFL city without Canadians from Toronto.

Oh, the people from Rochester will be crying when they read this unless they are still waiting for the ferry to Toronto.

[SpikedLemonade]

That's about as good as saying "hey BillsImpossible, you are spot on here".

NOT even close.

Hey, the catnip is for the cats dude.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yuw1W_AN1zk

[SpikedLemonade]

Not enough that he spent $1.5B on a franchise worth $750M, is it?
It's this sort of BS from you skooby that makes you look like an attention starved whore.

Mitch may be a *****, but he is dead on right here with his assessment Homer.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWiT4jT1NWU

[elroy16]

So in the next 5-6 years, the Pegula's are going to sell the Bills and/or Sabres with the Bills moving to Toronto?

10 years?



Seems like a pretty messed up way to make some money. The Simpsons references seem appropriate, this sounds exactly like something Mr. Burns would do.



Yes, I'm aware that the Pegula's have made their money in a way that is ethically debated.

[SpikedLemonade]

So in the next 5-6 years, the Pegula's are going to sell the Bills and/or Sabres with the Bills moving to Toronto?

10 years?



Seems like a pretty messed up way to make some money. The Simpsons references seem appropriate, this sounds exactly like something Mr. Burns would do.



Yes, I'm away that the Pegula's have made their money in a way that is ethically debated.

The Bills will NEVER move to Toronto.

NEVER.

What a hairbrained idea.

What is next -- the Raiders moving from Oakland to Las Vegas?

[elroy16]

The Bills will NEVER move to Toronto.

NEVER.

What a hairbrained idea.

What is next -- the Raiders moving from Oakland to Las Vegas?



Lol, I never said it was never going to happen. I'm just curious to know what you guys think the timeline will be.


I think the last year has taught all of us that anything can happen.

[SpikedLemonade]

I think Toronto will get a NFL team elsewhere (perhaps a new franchise when London gets its team).

I don't see the Bills moving to Toronto.

San Antonio -- Maybe.

[Bill Cody]

It kills the deal unless we give the wealthy Toronto people easier access to the stadium, which would be downtown with a better highway access and modified peace bridge to handle traffic. It's been ~90 years (June) since it was built, boy does it show like that. NY state is broke and wants to be a sanctuary city, that'll drain any remaining resources to inspire the liberals to do nothing (thank you Chuck).

Let's get our head out of the sand and demand a financial commitment from Pegula or don't show up to the games, force his hand to spend. No more excuses, time's near up.

Not sure I'm buying this part. If Buffalo had a new stadium they would have no issue selling out assuming the product was good. Attendance is quite respectable now with a rotten product for 17 years. The NFL is not hard to sell. Russ Brandon is no genius it's just not hard to market a product people want to find a reason to buy, although to be fair the Bills are certainly testing that theory. As for what Peg's plans are I have no idea. Not sure you do either.

[trapezeus]

The two worst posters debating the ten year plan of buffalo. A real must read.

Bills could move. But I think the NFL sees that they don't have a real fanbase at the prices they want.

Sabres are one of the nhl's strongest markets by every measurable metric

And if pegulas are want to bleed the bills of money, why spend money on big contracts and fire coaches with term on their contract.

Sounds likes scooby's friend in the org is a little jaded. Hopefully it's Brandon because he's on the way out

[SpikedLemonade]

The two worst posters debating the ten year plan of buffalo. A real must read.

Bills could move. But I think the NFL sees that they don't have a real fanbase at the prices they want.

Sabres are one of the nhl's strongest markets by every measurable metric

And if pegulas are want to bleed the bills of money, why spend money on big contracts and fire coaches with term on their contract.

Sounds likes scooby's friend in the org is a little jaded. Hopefully it's Brandon because he's on the way out


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrgpZ0fUixs

[Skooby]

So in the next 5-6 years, the Pegula's are going to sell the Bills and/or Sabres with the Bills moving to Toronto?

10 years?



Seems like a pretty messed up way to make some money. The Simpsons references seem appropriate, this sounds exactly like something Mr. Burns would do.



Yes, I'm aware that the Pegula's have made their money in a way that is ethically debated.

You don't get ~$5 Billion in your bank by being the nice guy & in case anyone was wondering, the banks now make it punitive to leave huge sums of money in them (they actually charge you).

[Dr. Lecter]

You think he has $5 billion in a bank?

[SpikedLemonade]

You think he has $5 billion in a bank?

It is an expression Lecter.

Try to keep up.

The Dumb Polack is NOT that liquid -- no one is.

He has a net worth of over $5B.

He can however become liquid in a hurry by selling the Sabres and/or Bills as Mitch suggests.

[Dr. Lecter]

I think most of Skooby's meals are that liquid, based on his posting history.

[Historian]

:spam:

[SpikedLemonade]

Oh deer -- Mitch has hit the hornet's nest with a big stick.

[Skooby]

I think most of Skooby's meals are that liquid, based on his posting history.

Soft foods or bust.

[SpikedLemonade]

Soft foods or bust.

You have pissed off the citizens of Buffalo Mitch.

[OpIv37]

The Bills will NEVER move to Toronto.

NEVER.

What a hairbrained idea.

What is next -- the Raiders moving from Oakland to Las Vegas?

You know, I used to think moving the team to TO was a huge threat, but the Bills in Toronto series was such a disaster that it doesn't seem nearly as attractive now. Also, Toronto would need a new stadium to host an NFL team permanently.

[Skooby]

You know, I used to think moving the team to TO was a huge threat, but the Bills in Toronto series was such a disaster that it doesn't seem nearly as attractive now. Also, Toronto would need a new stadium to host an NFL team permanently.
So would the Bills committing over a Billion to the area secure the team for the foreseeable future or does redressing the pig with lipstick show the true colors of the owner ?

[SpikedLemonade]

You know, I used to think moving the team to TO was a huge threat, but the Bills in Toronto series was such a disaster that it doesn't seem nearly as attractive now. Also, Toronto would need a new stadium to host an NFL team permanently.

The series was meaningless -- Toronto will not support/root for a Buffalo based team. Would the citizens of Buffalo necessarily support the Toronto Maple Leafs if the Sabres are no more?

Toronto is the 4th largest city in North America. It can easily support its own NFL team at ticket prices 4 times that of the current Bills ticket prices.

Yes, it needs a new stadium and that could cost well over $2B if located in downtown Toronto.

[elroy16]

So would the Bills committing over a Billion to the area secure the team for the foreseeable future or does redressing the pig with lipstick show the true colors of the owner ?

So building the Harbor Center, buying the Bills, spending for renovations for the Ralph are all just putting lipstick on the pig that is Buffalo, all so they can pull the rug out from under WNY, sell/move the teams, make a ton of money, and ride off in the sunset with a middle finger waving goodbye?



One of the following will happen before the Bills are no longer in Buffalo, Terry and Kim die or the NFL folds.

[OpIv37]

I think there is a big piece being missed here: Kim Pegula is from Buffalo. If she and Terry do anything that results in the Bills or Sabres leaving town, she will essentially be banished. And they're already rich- they're not gonna get banished from her hometown to be somewhat richer.

[THATHURMANATOR]

What idiot created this thread?

[OpIv37]

The series was meaningless -- Toronto will not support/root for a Buffalo based team. Would the citizens of Buffalo necessarily support the Toronto Maple Leafs if the Sabres are no more?

Toronto is the 4th largest city in North America. It can easily support its own NFL team at ticket prices 4 times that of the current Bills ticket prices.

Yes, it needs a new stadium and that could cost well over $2B if located in downtown Toronto.

The citizens of Buffalo would never support the Maple Leafs because there's been way too much bad blood between them and the Sabres. If the Raptors played a few games a year in Buffalo, I think people would embrace it. But I think it's a different mentality. People in Buffalo know that Buffalo's too small to have their own NBA team and would appreciate a few chances a year to see top-level hoops close to home. I think people in Toronto didn't appreciate getting a scrap of football from a smaller city when the TO is big enough to have it's own team, and I also think people are protective of the CFL and worried about the competition.

[SpikedLemonade]

I think there is a big piece being missed here: Kim Pegula is from Buffalo. If she and Terry do anything that results in the Bills or Sabres leaving town, she will essentially be banished. And they're already rich- they're not gonna get banished from her hometown to be somewhat richer.

Where do the Pegulas live again?

--------------------------------------

He currently lives in Boca Raton, Florida, along with his second wife, Kim Pegula (née Kerr),[25] a graduate of Houghton College and whose hometown is Fairport, New York.[26] Kim was born in Seoul, South Korea, and at age 5 was adopted in 1973 by Ralph and Marilyn Kerr.[27] He has five children, two from a previous marriage (Michael and Laura) and three with Kim (Jessica, Kelly and Matthew).[28]

-----------------------------------------------------------

[SpikedLemonade]

What idiot created this thread?

Mitchthe*****TM did and I support him.

Sometimes the news is NOT always good.

MtB brings the truth.

[SpikedLemonade]

The citizens of Buffalo would never support the Maple Leafs because there's been way too much bad blood between them and the Sabres. If the Raptors played a few games a year in Buffalo, I think people would embrace it. But I think it's a different mentality. People in Buffalo know that Buffalo's too small to have their own NBA team and would appreciate a few chances a year to see top-level hoops close to home. I think people in Toronto didn't appreciate getting a scrap of football from a smaller city when the TO is big enough to have it's own team, and I also think people are protective of the CFL and worried about the competition.

You had it right until the last line.

There is NO CFL protection when it comes to a team in Toronto.

Toronto already thinks that they are too big/good/important for the lowly CFL.

The government will NEVER get involved in pro sports in Canada again.

[swiper]

League isn't threatening Buffalo, they're just threatening Buffalo....


Last June, NFL commissioner Roger Goodell said that the Bills “have to stay up with” other teams in the league in terms of their stadium in what seemed like a suggestion that it was time for the team to move forward with a push for a stadium to replace New Era Field.

Giants co-owner John Mara sent similar vibes earlier in 2016 when he said the Bills would need a new stadium to keep pace financially with others in the league. It didn’t take much to remember both sets of comments as 31 of the league’s owners (including Terry and Kim Pegula) voted to approve the Raiders’ move to Las Vegas. That adds up to three teams moving in a relatively short span of time after failing to secure new stadiums, but NFL executive vice president Eric Grubman said there was no message for Buffalo to take away from the vote, however.

“This certainly is not intended to send any message and I don’t believe anyone should take any message in it,” Grubman said. “Buffalo’s fans are legendary and ranked right up there with the greatest fans in the NFL. Ownership there is evaluating their options and those options are very long-term in nature."

Read between the lines folks. Toronto will rise again into this topic.

[YardRat]

**** Goodell, he's a douchebag.

[SpikedLemonade]

**** Goodell, he's a douchebag.

A high paid one at that.

[swiper]

A high paid one at that.

You will like licking his dirty rectum in that case.

[SpikedLemonade]

You will like licking his dirty rectum in that case.

No thank you.

You have me confused with Tebow.

[swiper]

No thank you.

You have me confused with Tebow.

Like I don't recognize that all Jamaican women are fat tubs of lard?

[SpikedLemonade]

Like I don't recognize that all Jamaican women are fat tubs of lard?

Yes, the same.

Smelling ass all day will definitely kill brain cells so don't be too hard on yourself.

[GreedoII]

effing morons

[Skooby]

League isn't threatening Buffalo, they're just threatening Buffalo....



Read between the lines folks. Toronto will rise again into this topic.

If you heard what I heard (which you did in this thread), we need to get a much bigger commitment on the ground that cannot be moved and would be punitive for Pegula to vacate.

Who paid the $130 Million for the recent renovations ??

[SpikedLemonade]

If you heard what I heard (which you did in this thread), we need to get a much bigger commitment on the ground that cannot be moved and would be punitive for Pegula to vacate.

Who paid the $130 Million for the recent renovations ??

Mostly from the county as part of a leasehold inducement for the current lease.

[Skooby]

Mostly from the county as part of a leasehold inducement for the current lease.
So he basically got a free house that was newly remodeled, boy it looks good for staying long-term now doesn't it ?? The price he paid for the team is irrelevant because someone else buying it would need to pay more, usually quite a bit more.

[Bills Juggernaut]

So ridiculous. How do you come up with this stuff?

So a Billionaire decides to increase his fortunes by overpaying 1.4 Billion for an NFL team in a small market (with small revenue)........so he can sell the team 10 years later at a mark up? The same owner who bought the Sabres, invested millions in the Harbor Center (which would become basically worthless should the Sabres leave town)? The same owner who donated $88 million to Penn State to build a hockey arena?

What a horrible business guy this is. I'm pretty sure he would get a much better return in 10 years on his $1.4 billion investing in a thousand different ventures that would be way more lucrative than buying a sports franchise in a city in which his wife grew up 60 miles away, where when he sells, he would be universally hated in the press and by the people while having his name and his legacy ruined for years even after his passing. And if you say he doesn't care about that, then why would he give over $88 million dollars to Penn State if not to leave a legacy?

Maybe, just maybe, Terry isn't all about maximizing profits out of this part of his life. Maybe, just maybe, he sees that Western NY is economically depressed and that saddling the taxpayers and the loyal fans of Western NY at this point is just not a good idea for the people of Western NY. Maybe he is ok with staying at the Ralph and making good, but not great money so that the people here can still enjoy the game and the team that they love and have supported without bankrupting them.

We all talk about hating greedy owners and the owners holding cities hostage with threats of moving to get publicly financed stadiums. Maybe, just maybe, he isn't one of them.

[Historian]

The Pegulas just paid a billion and a half for these two teams.

They are in no rush to break the bank to build a new stadium, especially given the 130 million in upgrades to NEF.

The upgrades keep things competitive while the politicos et al try to figure out where to place a new stadium.

This is where the stadium people and the train terminal people need to begin talks.

Personally, I would like to see Bethlehem razed, and the entire waterfront developed down to Hamburg beach, but perhaps the Perry site is the way to go, if we truly want to rebuild the Central Terminal, which is a historical gem of the area, IMO.

But the two concerns need to talk.

[DesertFox24]

Oh my lord, why are you worrying about 10 years in the future.

As Yoda said focus on where you are and what you are doing, not what you might be doing

[Forward_Lateral]

This, kids, is why you don't do drugs

[WagonCircler]

Oh my lord, why are you worrying about 10 years in the future.

As Yoda said focus on where you are and what you are doing, not what you might be doing

Fail to plan, plan to fail.

10 years is like a millisecond when you're talking about infrastructure.

[Skooby]

The Pegulas just paid a billion and a half for these two teams.

They are in no rush to break the bank to build a new stadium, especially given the 130 million in upgrades to NEF.

The upgrades keep things competitive while the politicos et al try to figure out where to place a new stadium.

This is where the stadium people and the train terminal people need to begin talks.

Personally, I would like to see Bethlehem razed, and the entire waterfront developed down to Hamburg beach, but perhaps the Perry site is the way to go, if we truly want to rebuild the Central Terminal, which is a historical gem of the area, IMO.

But the two concerns need to talk.

I'm talking with a few folks and I'll assure you that if we don't get a new stadium on the table soon, the team will be sold off. The delay in this is simply ludicrous, which means there's troubles. Pegula knows the current stadium is very outdated & the very definition of functionally obsolete. I do all of this and source massive financing for a living, it takes a lot of time. Right now, there's currently no normal loans available for major land improvements unless you pay higher rates so Pegula and the county is going to have to go into bonds and other municipal events. That is going to take forever and get political, so add all that time.

Don't make season ticket plans for 2024, unless you plan on flying out of town.

[BertSquirtgum]

Team Pegula parked money in Buffalo Sports franchises knowing that the values will rise drastically over the coming years. They could sell the Bills to Toronto investors down the line & the Sabres could head back to Quebec or Hartford. So basically we're a big boy holding station and there's no long-term plan for either franchise to stay in Buffalo. The stadium plan was deferred indefinitely and the talk you hear of 5-6 years is complete bullshjt. Pegula's plan is to minimally redress both venues (some public and his own) keep playing there until it's time to close out his position.

The talk of him being our savior to keep the Bills in town is simply just a cover for his financial goals, which are virtually insatiable (Billions to show for it). There's not going to be a new stadium in Buffalo with him, ever. The other power players in town basically offered him land for free and we know about the decade long tax advantage (which he could probably make decades) on improvements including building and equipment which he is skipping over.

Moral is, don't expect the team to win anymore than it has too again or even get out of it's own way. Selling a party to a bunch of alcoholics is an easy sale at a low price, big city money isn't going to work here. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I usually try to forewarn of incredibly negative things to come, this being terrible news that I wanted to share. Sorry.

P.S. If they spent all the money on a new hard venue for the Bills, we'd stay in town but you'll never get past simple banter. They wanted to redress both pigs (they did) and stay even between income and box office, letting time appreciate the holdings. Kim Pegula's nest egg, nothing more. Buffalo gets the final shaft, a dying town with a few minor league teams (kinda like what we have now because we can't win sh**).
You're a bigger idiot than I originally thought.

[Ed]

I've really really missed the never ending discussions about how the team is going to be sold and moved. I thought the Pegulas put this topic to bed when they bought the team, but here we are not even a few years in and we get to start all over! This is so exciting.

[BertSquirtgum]

Mitchthe*****TM did and I support him.

Sometimes the news is NOT always good.

MtB brings the truth.
You sounded like a ****** telling everyone they were moving to Toronto before and you sound like a ****** now. No need to be so salty that your dreams of the Bills moving to Canada, eh, didn't come true.

[BertSquirtgum]

If you heard what I heard (which you did in this thread), we need to get a much bigger commitment on the ground that cannot be moved and would be punitive for Pegula to vacate.

Who paid the $130 Million for the recent renovations ??

Your source has been wrong about every single thing you post on here and made you look like a total moron numerous times. Yet, you still trust what your idiot friend makes up in his mind and post it? How can you be this stupid? I have a hunch that your "source" is YOU.

[Skooby]

I've really really missed the never ending discussions about how the team is going to be sold and moved. I thought the Pegulas put this topic to bed when they bought the team, but here we are not even a few years in and we get to start all over! This is so exciting.

Here we are watching a really wealthy guy flop around and fail to bring any real improvements to our Buffalo sports franchises performance. Seen the playoffs lately for either team ?? How about that new stadium idea being thrown around ?? Oh nothing ?? Well then, everything is just fine then isn't it ??

Terry knows he can't earn money at a bank, fracking is not en vogue anymore because of prices so he's taking public money and adding no value to the teams. None. Name one thing that's gotten better for either team or progress for a real long-term commitment ?? There's none and yet I'm crazy.

You guys are naive, can't see past the fan fence. Pegula needs to step up and do something relevant in town that can't be moved, like asap. The NFL will call him out soon for camping, right now that's all he's done.

[elroy16]

Here we are watching a really wealthy guy flop around and fail to bring any real improvements to our Buffalo sports franchises performance. Seen the playoffs lately for either team ?? How about that new stadium idea being thrown around ?? Oh nothing ?? Well then, everything is just fine then isn't it ??


Every owner is wealthy and we all know throwing money at the team doesn't equate to a winning team. So far they've spent money renovating the field house, the stadium, upgrading the facilities, building the Harbor Center (which you keep leaving out), in addition to buying the Sabres and Bills.



Terry knows he can't earn money at a bank, fracking is not en vogue anymore because of prices so he's taking public money and adding no value to the teams. None. Name one thing that's gotten better for either team or progress for a real long-term commitment ?? There's none and yet I'm crazy.


They built a new arena for the Sabres. I think that's kind of a big deal, considering your whole argument for the Bills moving is that they haven't built a stadium. Yes, the arena is much cheaper than a football stadium, but they've owned the Bills for barely over two years. If they start winning, the teams value and profit will go up. They laid an egg with Rex at coach, it happens. If you're giving up on an owner after two years and change, you have a real problem with patience.




You guys are naive, can't see past the fan fence. Pegula needs to step up and do something relevant in town that can't be moved, like asap. The NFL will call him out soon for camping, right now that's all he's done.


Like build an arena and hotel complex for the hometown hockey team?

Is the NFL going to force Pegula to move the Bills because they don't have a new stadium?



It's easy to point to the Sabres and say, look at their lack of improvement. They tanked for two years and are struggling in their second year of actually trying to win. Eichel missed the first 3rd of the year and took a month to get back to playing well. Kane and O'Reilly have missed time. Since February, Jack has been one of the top scorers in the league. They were only a few points out of the playoffs until a rough stretch of 14 games or so the last couple of months. They got too far down in the standings early in the year and were never able to climb back. Clean up the blue line, have a healthy Jack for a full year, and let's see what happens next year.


Implying that since the owner is wealthy and that they should be winning because of that is incredibly naive.

[elroy16]

****, well I was thinking the Harbor Center including Key Bank Center, so I am wrong about the Pegula's building a new area for the Sabres.


Regardless, the Harbor Center is a very large development that brought a lot of business to the area, including the 2016 NHL draft. I was incorrect on a pretty large fact, but still stand by the conclusion that the Pegula's are adding value to the team, aren't just camping, and will keep the Bills and Sabres in Buffalo for the long hall.

[Dr. Lecter]

He also bought the Rochester Americans, so that both teams would be under the same ownership team. he built Harbor Center and 716, all on his own dime with no public funding or tax breaks

The idea that he should have a new stadium by now is laughable. These things take time - a lot of time. New owners generally don't come into an area, especially an area that is not wealthy and immediately demand public funding to build a new stadium. this is especially true when the area just pumped a good deal of money into the existing stadium.

You're making **** up again and are not thinking this out. None of that should surprise anybody.

[Historian]

You're making **** up again and are not thinking this out. None of that should surprise anybody.

Don't forget about the lacross team too.

Yea, you're pissing in the wind on this one, Skoob, sorry.

ANY stadium plan will require massive infrastructure work, especially to the Thruway.

Doesn't happen overnight.

[Goobylal]

The stadium may be outdated, but it allows for games to be played there just fine, and it's infinitely cheaper than building a new one that will require people paying more money; money they don't have. So if this is the basis for believing they will sell the team, I'll wait to see it first.

As for Toronto, those turds don't even support the Argos and their ****ty Canadian version of football. They don't deserve an NFL team.

[BertSquirtgum]

Pegula was just on the news saying that it would be unfair to ask the State to help fund a new stadium so soon after they just spent 100 million to renovate New Era Stadium and that they have a lease for that stadium until 2023. He's right because asking New York State is asking the tax payer. So, yes, it would be too soon to ask New Yorkers to pony up 500 million for a new stadium already. I would be willing to bet my life that a new stadium will be in the making by 2020 after they win the Super Bowl. And be ready for use after the 2023 season.

[swiper]

So ridiculous. How do you come up with this stuff?

So a Billionaire decides to increase his fortunes by overpaying 1.4 Billion for an NFL team in a small market (with small revenue)........so he can sell the team 10 years later at a mark up? The same owner who bought the Sabres, invested millions in the Harbor Center (which would become basically worthless should the Sabres leave town)? The same owner who donated $88 million to Penn State to build a hockey arena?

What a horrible business guy this is. I'm pretty sure he would get a much better return in 10 years on his $1.4 billion investing in a thousand different ventures that would be way more lucrative than buying a sports franchise in a city in which his wife grew up 60 miles away, where when he sells, he would be universally hated in the press and by the people while having his name and his legacy ruined for years even after his passing. And if you say he doesn't care about that, then why would he give over $88 million dollars to Penn State if not to leave a legacy?

Maybe, just maybe, Terry isn't all about maximizing profits out of this part of his life. Maybe, just maybe, he sees that Western NY is economically depressed and that saddling the taxpayers and the loyal fans of Western NY at this point is just not a good idea for the people of Western NY. Maybe he is ok with staying at the Ralph and making good, but not great money so that the people here can still enjoy the game and the team that they love and have supported without bankrupting them.

We all talk about hating greedy owners and the owners holding cities hostage with threats of moving to get publicly financed stadiums. Maybe, just maybe, he isn't one of them.

ROFL at stupid kids.

[Wally The Barber]

ROFL at stupid kids.

Get out of here YOU OLD FART

[SpikedLemonade]

So he basically got a free house that was newly remodeled, boy it looks good for staying long-term now doesn't it ?? The price he paid for the team is irrelevant because someone else buying it would need to pay more, usually quite a bit more.
The mouth breathers do not, will not and refuse to believe the truth.

The reason the price is irrelevant is because according to US tax laws, NFL franchise prices/cost (what you initially paid for the team) can be written off over 15 years. Given there is always profit by a NFL team (guaranteed due to the TV contracts) that means some of that profit, if not all, every year is tax free.

It is a good deal for NFL owners.

[SpikedLemonade]

I guess the idiots now shut up.

[Goobylal]

The mouth breathers do not, will not and refuse to believe the truth.

The reason the price is irrelevant is because according to US tax laws, NFL franchise prices/cost (what you initially paid for the team) can be written off over 15 years. Given there is always profit by a NFL team (guaranteed due to the TV contracts) that means some of that profit, if not all, every year is tax free.

It is a good deal for NFL owners.

Provide a link for this.

[SpikedLemonade]

Provide a link for this.
Yeah.

Sure.

It is called the Missing Link however if you look in the mirror caveman, you will see him.

I knew that post would beckon the idiots from the deep bowels of stupidity.

[Skooby]

Provide a link for this.
Has an NFL team ever been sold for less than purchase ? Since the answer is no, it's profitable.

[Goobylal]

Yeah.

Sure.

It is called the Missing Link however if you look in the mirror caveman, you will see him.

I knew that post would beckon the idiots from the deep bowels of stupidity.

You're like a monkey with a calculus book. You can wave it around proudly, but you have no idea what it means. Because you're a cretin.

[SpikedLemonade]

You're like a monkey with a calculus book. You can wave it around proudly, but you have no idea what it means. Because you're a cretin.
I would put my education up against yours any day knuckle dragger.

[Goobylal]

Has an NFL team ever been sold for less than purchase ? Since the answer is no, it's profitable.

They're profitable at the present time. But what effect do you think that precipitous drop in ratings last season (that they laughably tried to pin on the election) will have on the league long term, assuming they stay flat?

[Goobylal]

I would put my education up against yours any day knuckle dragger.

LOL! You would. Because you're too stupid to realize what it is that you don't know.

[Skooby]

They're profitable at the present time. But what effect do you think that precipitous drop in ratings last season (that they laughably tried to pin on the election) will have on the league long term, assuming they stay flat?
Every prime time game NFL wins it's time slot by a little less, it's meaningless because it still wins it by a large margin. The worst NFL game does better rating wise than the average show with a multi-month season. Tell me exactly how this is so terrible one way or the other ?? You'll also realize that the 18-49 (prized advertising ages) are nearly unaffected as well, they lost the older crowd (so big whoop). This isn't flat too me, it's steady business.

[Goobylal]

Every prime time game NFL wins it's time slot by a little less, it's meaningless because it still wins it by a large margin. The worst NFL game does better rating wise than the average show with a multi-month season. Tell me exactly how this is so terrible one way or the other ?? You'll also realize that the 18-49 (prized advertising ages) are nearly unaffected as well, they lost the older crowd (so big whoop). This isn't flat too me, it's steady business.

That's why I said they're profitable at the present time. Declining numbers are never good to see (even among the older people, who typically have more money than the younger ones), especially when there is no explanation for them. Will it continue? Will they rebound? Time will tell.

[Skooby]

That's why I said they're profitable at the present time. Declining numbers are never good to see (even among the older people, who typically have more money than the younger ones), especially when there is no explanation for them. Will it continue? Will they rebound? Time will tell.
Are you inferring that in someone buys an NFL they could somehow lose money even though it hasn't ever happened in ~97 years.

[BertSquirtgum]

Every prime time game NFL wins it's time slot by a little less, it's meaningless because it still wins it by a large margin. The worst NFL game does better rating wise than the average show with a multi-month season. Tell me exactly how this is so terrible one way or the other ?? You'll also realize that the 18-49 (prized advertising ages) are nearly unaffected as well, they lost the older crowd (so big whoop). This isn't flat too me, it's steady business.
Tell me how this matters in a thread about your lies. In which, the Pegulas, are supposedly already planning on moving the Bills. Take your big red nose off clown. It's making you look really stupid.

[BertSquirtgum]

Read this Boot Skoobin' Boogie. The Bills will be building a Downtown stadium in the next several years after they win a Super Bowl.

Couple of the more important quotes "According to a high-ranking NFL source, the league now believes that Bills owners Terry and Kim Pegula are doing the right thing by taking their time before committing to a move from New Era Field. Although the Bills and the NFL would contribute to the cost of building a new stadium, public money would also be involved. "They want the team to have some success before asking for things," the source told The Buffalo News Monday during the NFL's annual meeting at the Arizona Biltmore."

"I don't want to speak for them, but I think you can see, by virtue of the fact that they're not waiting and have done work on the stadium already, that they care about their fans and they care about Buffalo."

http://buffalonews.com/2017/03/27/bills-want-success-asking-help-build-new-stadium/

[Skooby]

Read this Boot Skoobin' Boogie. The Bills will be building a Downtown stadium in the next several years after they win a Super Bowl.

Couple of the more important quotes "According to a high-ranking NFL source, the league now believes that Bills owners Terry and Kim Pegula are doing the right thing by taking their time before committing to a move from New Era Field. Although the Bills and the NFL would contribute to the cost of building a new stadium, public money would also be involved. "They want the team to have some success before asking for things," the source told The Buffalo News Monday during the NFL's annual meeting at the Arizona Biltmore."

"I don't want to speak for them, but I think you can see, by virtue of the fact that they're not waiting and have done work on the stadium already, that they care about their fans and they care about Buffalo."

http://buffalonews.com/2017/03/27/bills-want-success-asking-help-build-new-stadium/

If they're waiting for success to build then we aren't ever going to build a new one, we have ~decades of nothing and the longest NFL playoff drought ever. So you think this is some revelation ?? As soon as we build a planet Mars lander, we will become Martians. That should happen just about the same time as we start having success, not anytime soon. Getting NY state money when they want to pay for sanctuary status is another dream, tax breaks are a given because they wouldn't of collected much on any new site that was previously empty or abandoned anyways

The we care & end talk is simply fluff, whoever believes that is ready to be rolled. The team will be up for sale when another place really wants to pay for it, probably when oil goes up and Canada lights up again. I'm from a business school that if you're really committed to somewhere, you build something that can't be moved. Right now, this team is pretty much immediately movable, $120 M penalty at worst for taking county money (which would be settled for less). Spend $1.5 Billion for a stadium downtown on the waterfront plus all new infrastructure, you have a team staying for generations. Money talks, BS walks.

[Dr. Lecter]

I guess the idiots now shut up.
I don't care if you and Mitch continue to post. Feel free

[Yasgur's Farm]

I don't care if you and Mitch continue to post. Feel freeI agree... Just don't slip in your own drippings.

[SpikedLemonade]

LOL! You would. Because you're too stupid to realize what it is that you don't know.

Well what I do know is that I am attempting to use Pythagorean Theorem right (conservative) now to figure out the slope I need to send a vector up your ass.

[SpikedLemonade]

That's why I said they're profitable at the present time. Declining numbers are never good to see (even among the older people, who typically have more money than the younger ones), especially when there is no explanation for them. Will it continue? Will they rebound? Time will tell.

Back to your underground bunker big guy.

[Goobylal]

Are you inferring that in someone buys an NFL they could somehow lose money even though it hasn't ever happened in ~97 years.

Never say never. The NFL is facing numerous issues that they never had to face until recently.

[Goobylal]

If they're waiting for success to build then we aren't ever going to build a new one, we have ~decades of nothing and the longest NFL playoff drought ever. So you think this is some revelation ?? As soon as we build a planet Mars lander, we will become Martians. That should happen just about the same time as we start having success, not anytime soon. Getting NY state money when they want to pay for sanctuary status is another dream, tax breaks are a given because they wouldn't of collected much on any new site that was previously empty or abandoned anyways

The we care & end talk is simply fluff, whoever believes that is ready to be rolled. The team will be up for sale when another place really wants to pay for it, probably when oil goes up and Canada lights up again. I'm from a business school that if you're really committed to somewhere, you build something that can't be moved. Right now, this team is pretty much immediately movable, $120 M penalty at worst for taking county money (which would be settled for less). Spend $1.5 Billion for a stadium downtown on the waterfront plus all new infrastructure, you have a team staying for generations. Money talks, BS walks.

The Bills haven't had success for decades because they haven't had a franchise QB in decades. That's it in a nutshell.



Well what I do know is that I am attempting to use Pythagorean Theorem right (conservative) now to figure out the slope I need to send a vector up your ass.

Your anal fixation is scary.

[SpikedLemonade]

Your anal fixation is scary.

Accept the vector -- you know you want to.

[Goobylal]

Accept the vector -- you know you want to.

Sure. Because I'm the one who brought it up.

[SpikedLemonade]

Sure. Because I'm the one who brought it up.

I doubt you remember what a vector is based on your poor American education.

[Goobylal]

I doubt you remember what a vector is based on your poor American education.

Can't say I ever learned about anal vectors. Must be a Canuck thing.

[Bills Juggernaut]

ROFL at stupid kids.

Ok tough guy. You'd rather believe in grand conspiracy theories based Skob's "I'm bored, let me post some of my crap and hope that maybe it will be true, but I'll post so much other crap that I hope nobody can keep track of the fact I'm only right 10% of the time". Go ahead. Give yourself an ulcer thinking about it.

[cookie G]

The mouth breathers do not, will not and refuse to believe the truth.

The reason the price is irrelevant is because according to US tax laws, NFL franchise prices/cost (what you initially paid for the team) can be written off over 15 years. Given there is always profit by a NFL team (guaranteed due to the TV contracts) that means some of that profit, if not all, every year is tax free.

It is a good deal for NFL owners.

Since you probably know more about 197 intangibles property than me, and I don't have time to look it up...

is there a recapture on the amount amortized upon sale?

If so, it creates a pretty hefty tax liability upon disposition, either as ordinary income or capital gain.



But I see this a little different, Mr. Bon Jovi-Rogers (I know you're still really, really bitter that the King of Fracking outbid your Maple Leafed ass.)

I might be wrong, but I don't see the guy as the typical wheeler dealer who amassed a fortune through decades of flipping, buyouts, trades, swaps and other Wall St. oriented dealing.

He is basically an engineer and oil/gas man, who made it big on a process he helped developed.

His fortune came later in life, really towards the tale end of it.

His fortune came suddenly, in business terms, much like a software developer who strikes it rich when their product goes viral.

And after cashing in on several billion dollars, he did what any other red blooded American male would do, he bought his favorite sports team.

Its an expensive toy for him, but in the end, its still a toy.

He likes interviewing coaches.
He likes hanging with the players.
He likes inviting people down to his mansion and taking them for a ride on his yacht.
He likes watching game tape.

I see him as a more subdued version of Marc Cuban or other owner who bought a team as a hobby. ITs why he's so hands on in his management approach. (and something that might hold back his franchise).

But under the Spiked/Skooby theory, his plan isthis:

~Kim, I'm 66...I've made my money..but...I can buy the Bills for a song...well..not a song, I'll have to pay more than anyone has paid for an NFL franchise. But here's what I'll do...I'll keep the team for 10 years, take 10 years of write offs and sell it in 10 years.

If I sell it for $2 billion in 10 years, I'll have another half billion when I'm 76, to go with the $5 billion I already had!

So now he's 76 with 5.5 billion, instead of 5...

Now what?

[Skooby]

Since you probably know more about 197 intangibles property than me, and I don't have time to look it up...

is there a recapture on the amount amortized upon sale?

If so, it creates a pretty hefty tax liability upon disposition, either as ordinary income or capital gain.



But I see this a little different, Mr. Bon Jovi-Rogers (I know you're still really, really bitter that the King of Fracking outbid your Maple Leafed ass.)

I might be wrong, but I don't see the guy as the typical wheeler dealer who amassed a fortune through decades of flipping, buyouts, trades, swaps and other Wall St. oriented dealing.

He is basically an engineer and oil/gas man, who made it big on a process he helped developed.

His fortune came later in life, really towards the tale end of it.

His fortune came suddenly, in business terms, much like a software developer who strikes it rich when their product goes viral.

And after cashing in on several billion dollars, he did what any other red blooded American male would do, he bought his favorite sports team.

Its an expensive toy for him, but in the end, its still a toy.

He likes interviewing coaches.
He likes hanging with the players.
He likes inviting people down to his mansion and taking them for a ride on his yacht.
He likes watching game tape.

I see him as a more subdued version of Marc Cuban or other owner who bought a team as a hobby. ITs why he's so hands on in his management approach. (and something that might hold back his franchise).

But under the Spiked/Skooby theory, his plan isthis:

~Kim, I'm 66...I've made my money..but...I can buy the Bills for a song...well..not a song, I'll have to pay more than anyone has paid for an NFL franchise. But here's what I'll do...I'll keep the team for 10 years, take 10 years of write offs and sell it in 10 years.

If I sell it for $2 billion in 10 years, I'll have another half billion when I'm 76, to go with the $5 billion I already had!

So now he's 76 with 5.5 billion, instead of 5...

Now what?

He gets a statue at the new venue and is remembered as a very astute businessman. Let me be clear about something, he's the richest person in that area and even he can't get the team a new stadium. He's so generous and has so much, yet the long-term solution to assure his favorite team stays in town is getting something to lock them into place isn't done yet. All this building and developing yet after 2 years we haven't heard a word about it. Is he going to sit on the money or line his coffin with it ?? It doesn't make much sense if he was long for the area that he wouldn't of started something at least in the planning stage. This is going to take 7-9 years to finish, waiting for the team to win isn't really viable or in the cards as a milestone for someone with billions unless they had other plans.

Put your money on the table Pegs, start the long process asap.

[Bill Cody]

He gets a statue at the new venue and is remembered as a very astute businessman. Let me be clear about something, he's the richest person in that area and even he can't get the team a new stadium.

He hasn't done so yet doesn't equal can't in my book. I think I'll wait a bit before I join you on the ledge.

[Saratoga Slim]

It kills the deal unless we give the wealthy Toronto people easier access to the stadium, which would be downtown with a better highway access and modified peace bridge to handle traffic. It's been ~90 years (June) since it was built, boy does it show like that. NY state is broke and wants to be a sanctuary city, that'll drain any remaining resources to inspire the liberals to do nothing (thank you Chuck).

Let's get our head out of the sand and demand a financial commitment from Pegula or don't show up to the games, force his hand to spend. No more excuses, time's near up.
$200 Million into Harbor Center isn't a commitment to Buffalo? Spending to the cap every year isn't a commitment?

Your argument is premised on the fact that he's dragging his feet on a new stadium. It's a reasonable question whether we even need a new stadium. And as you point out, there's no money coming from the state. Moreover, if you've paid any attention to what's happened in the energy industry over the past couple years, Pegula has reason to be a little careful with his remaining funds. He's got deep pockets, but forking over $1B of his money for a new stadium that most likely won't dramatically impact the team's revenue stream is, shall we say, something less than a lack of commitment.

While it's not impossible that what you say is true, this is we-faked-the-moon-landing stuff.

Also, he bought the team about 2 and a half years ago, and "Time's near up?" LOL.

[cookie G]

He gets a statue at the new venue and is remembered as a very astute businessman. Let me be clear about something, he's the richest person in that area and even he can't get the team a new stadium. He's so generous and has so much, yet the long-term solution to assure his favorite team stays in town is getting something to lock them into place isn't done yet. All this building and developing yet after 2 years we haven't heard a word about it. Is he going to sit on the money or line his coffin with it ?? It doesn't make much sense if he was long for the area that he wouldn't of started something at least in the planning stage. This is going to take 7-9 years to finish, waiting for the team to win isn't really viable or in the cards as a milestone for someone with billions unless they had other plans.

Put your money on the table Pegs, start the long process asap.

Again..maybe I'm wrong..but I don't remember him promising to build a stadium.

All I remember is him buying the team and keeping it in Buffalo.

And if you're asking him to build a new stadium, he might just say, "I've done enough".

The people who want a new stadium are...

1) the NFL..because greed reigns supreme; and

2) those in Buffalo who believe a downtown stadium will somehow transform it into some entertainment and business mecca..something that rarely happens for a place used 10 times per year.

[Skooby]

Again..maybe I'm wrong..but I don't remember him promising to build a stadium.

All I remember is him buying the team and keeping it in Buffalo.

And if you're asking him to build a new stadium, he might just say, "I've done enough".

The people who want a new stadium are...

1) the NFL..because greed reigns supreme; and

2) those in Buffalo who believe a downtown stadium will somehow transform it into some entertainment and business mecca..something that rarely happens for a place used 10 times per year.
He spends $1 Billion on a stadium, the Bills are there for 25 years minimum. If he keeps playing in the half-century old pig they repainted, they can and will be moved / sold. I'm in big boy business, buying the business is the first step to making the business get real serious. Right now, it's parked money with almost no chance of a loss. Toss a huge sum into infrastructure, you're sticking around for the long-haul.

[WagonCircler]

Again..maybe I'm wrong..but I don't remember him promising to build a stadium.

All I remember is him buying the team and keeping it in Buffalo.

And if you're asking him to build a new stadium, he might just say, "I've done enough".

The people who want a new stadium are...

1) the NFL..because greed reigns supreme; and

2) those in Buffalo who believe a downtown stadium will somehow transform it into some entertainment and business mecca..something that rarely happens for a place used 10 times per year.

OR, it might just be that "waiting for success" is the smart play.

I have no idea if/when that success may come, but I imagine Terry P doesn't think that way.

Asking for stadium money for a team that sucks is a much heavier lift than asking for stadium money for a team that is on a roll.

[Skooby]

OR, it might just be that "waiting for success" is the smart play.

I have no idea if/when that success may come, but I imagine Terry P doesn't think that way.

Asking for stadium money for a team that sucks is a much heavier lift than asking for stadium money for a team that is on a roll.
The Raiders hit the playoffs one-time in a long-time and bang, brand new stadium locked in and hot. Think their moving from Vegas anytime in the next ~25 years ?? Use your heads folks, the one on your shoulders.

[cookie G]

He spends $1 Billion on a stadium, the Bills are there for 25 years minimum. If he keeps playing in the half-century old pig they repainted, they can and will be moved / sold. I'm in big boy business, buying the business is the first step to making the business get real serious. Right now, it's parked money with almost no chance of a loss. Toss a huge sum into infrastructure, you're sticking around for the long-haul.

Well, Mr. Big Boy Business..maybe you can set an appt. with Pegs, and tell him that unless he plunks down $1 billion on a stadium, on top of the $1.5 billion he's spent on the team...that you don't believe he's staying.

I'm sure he'll be crushed at the questioning of his sincerity.

[YardRat]

He gets a statue at the new venue and is remembered as a very astute businessman. Let me be clear about something, he's the richest person in that area and even he can't get the team a new stadium. He's so generous and has so much, yet the long-term solution to assure his favorite team stays in town is getting something to lock them into place isn't done yet. All this building and developing yet after 2 years we haven't heard a word about it. Is he going to sit on the money or line his coffin with it ?? It doesn't make much sense if he was long for the area that he wouldn't of started something at least in the planning stage. This is going to take 7-9 years to finish, waiting for the team to win isn't really viable or in the cards as a milestone for someone with billions unless they had other plans.

Put your money on the table Pegs, start the long process asap.
That could be construed as having vision for the long term, not short term, also.

[cookie G]

OR, it might just be that "waiting for success" is the smart play.

I have no idea if/when that success may come, but I imagine Terry P doesn't think that way.

Asking for stadium money for a team that sucks is a much heavier lift than asking for stadium money for a team that is on a roll.

That's always a possibility, but I don't know how many politicians care about team win/loss success before appropriating public money for entertainment.

[SpikedLemonade]

Well, Mr. Big Boy Business..maybe you can set an appt. with Pegs, and tell him that unless he plunks down $1 billion on a stadium, on top of the $1.5 billion he's spent on the team...that you don't believe he's staying.

I'm sure he'll be crushed at the questioning of his sincerity.

Rather than questioning his sincerity, can we ask him if he believes he is currently THE dumbest owner in North American Professional Sports?

I do NOT question whether he believed he could successfully run the Sabres and then Bills. He was sincere.

The problem is that he has not hired any seasoned professional sports executive to rely on.

Surely, in The Dumb Polack's fracking business he does not decide where to dig a hole without relying on some engineering/geologist/whatever to say the hole should go here and this is why.

No No No, somehow Terry got the idea he could run the Sabres by hiring an inexperienced Assistant GM who would not even have been the NHL if he is uncle did not feel sorry for his rain man nephew.

The same goes with the Bills. Terry honestly believes Kim can help run this team? So I guess Terry also believes those 3 hour private meetings in his bedroom between Kim and Doug are about football?

The DP needs to hire high level people and simply get out of the way.

[Goobylal]

The Raiders hit the playoffs one-time in a long-time and bang, brand new stadium locked in and hot. Think their moving from Vegas anytime in the next ~25 years ?? Use your heads folks, the one on your shoulders.

The Raiders have been looking to bolt from Oakland for over a decade now. And they had a stadium all set to go until the NFL decided it didn't want Adelson involved and he pulled out in January.

[Skooby]

The Raiders have been looking to bolt from Oakland for over a decade now. And they had a stadium all set to go until the NFL decided it didn't want Adelson involved and he pulled out in January.

You want the Bills to probably not leave Buffalo in our lifetime or close ? Get a new stadium built.

[WagonCircler]

The Raiders hit the playoffs one-time in a long-time and bang, brand new stadium locked in and hot. Think their moving from Vegas anytime in the next ~25 years ?? Use your heads folks, the one on your shoulders.

Al Davis' spawn's net worth is a fraction of Pegula's. This is the ultimate apples to oranges example.

And New Era Field is the Taj Mahal compared the Oakland Alameda County Stadium.

Oh, and by the way, the Raiders have been pleading for a new stadium for decades (literally). Pegula doesn't even want one right now.

Your thought process is moronic.

[SpikedLemonade]

I guess it is easier to believe the fairy tale that Pegula is just THE benevolent Fairy Godfather to the City of Buffalo.

Apparently, he wants to take on charity cases because it makes him feel good.

LOL!!!!!!

[jamze132]

The Raiders hit the playoffs one-time in a long-time and bang, brand new stadium locked in and hot. Think their moving from Vegas anytime in the next ~25 years ?? Use your heads folks, the one on your shoulders.

Come one man... Davis and his family have been trying to get a new stadium built for a decade...and they don't have the personal resources that Pegula has.

[Dr. Lecter]

I guess it is easier to believe the fairy tale that Pegula is just THE benevolent Fairy Godfather to the City of Buffalo.

Apparently, he wants to take on charity cases because it makes him feel good.

LOL!!!!!!
No, it's better to believe that he's the spawn of Satan and only using the city while ignoring the actual facts.

But hitch your train to the Skooby engine.

[SpikedLemonade]

No, it's better to believe that he's the spawn of Satan and only using the city while ignoring the actual facts.

But hitch your train to the Skooby engine.


Sometimes even a drunk train conductor is going is on the right track.

[Dr. Lecter]

Until he crashes

[SpikedLemonade]

Until he crashes

Or he doesn't.

[Goobylal]

You want the Bills to probably not leave Buffalo in our lifetime or close ? Get a new stadium built.

At what cost to the taxpayers, and the fans in terms of increased ticket prices?

[cookie G]

Rather than questioning his sincerity, can we ask him if he believes he is currently THE dumbest owner in North American Professional Sports?

I do NOT question whether he believed he could successfully run the Sabres and then Bills. He was sincere.

The problem is that he has not hired any seasoned professional sports executive to rely on.

Surely, in The Dumb Polack's fracking business he does not decide where to dig a hole without relying on some engineering/geologist/whatever to say the hole should go here and this is why.

No No No, somehow Terry got the idea he could run the Sabres by hiring an inexperienced Assistant GM who would not even have been the NHL if he is uncle did not feel sorry for his rain man nephew.

The same goes with the Bills. Terry honestly believes Kim can help run this team? So I guess Terry also believes those 3 hour private meetings in his bedroom between Kim and Doug are about football?

The DP needs to hire high level people and simply get out of the way.

That part I agree with.

I don't follow hockey any more, so I can't comment on the Sabres.

But you'd think the Rex fiasco would have taught them to bring in a bona fide football mind to run things. Its my biggest disappointment in the Pegula's.

idk...

fantasy football
mock drafts
message boards

Everyone has an opinion, so I think to some, it makes them believe they can do the job full time.

There are probably 2 owners with enough knowledge in football to take a hands on approach, Dan Rooney and Clark Hunt. And both of them grew up in the business, and both are smart enough to hire the right people and let them do their jobs.

[Goobylal]

That part I agree with.

I don't follow hockey any more, so I can't comment on the Sabres.

But you'd think the Rex fiasco would have taught them to bring in a bona fide football mind to run things. Its my biggest disappointment in the Pegula's.

idk...

fantasy football
mock drafts
message boards

Everyone has an opinion, so I think to some, it makes them believe they can do the job full time.

There are probably 2 owners with enough knowledge in football to take a hands on approach, Dan Rooney and Clark Hunt. And both of them grew up in the business, and both are smart enough to hire the right people and let them do their jobs.

A bona fide football mind is only as good as his QB is. And there's no magic wand to get one.

[SpikedLemonade]

A bona fide football mind is only as good as his QB is. And there's no magic wand to get one.

Such simple thinking.

Did you get that idea while doing paintings on your cave wall?

[WagonCircler]

That's always a possibility, but I don't know how many politicians care about team win/loss success before appropriating public money for entertainment.

It's not so much about the winning part, it's more about the losing part.

Nobody wants to give money to losers. But if the Bills were ever to make it back to the Super Bowl (believe me, I know this is an extreme long shot), it would be a much easier sell. Tickets and luxury boxes would be more sought after and the perceived value of the team as a civic asset would be a big selling point.

[SpikedLemonade]

It's not so much about the winning part, it's more about the losing part.

Nobody wants to give money to losers. But if the Bills were ever to make it back to the Super Bowl (believe me, I know this is an extreme long shot), it would be a much easier sell. Tickets and luxury boxes would be more sought after and the perceived value of the team as a civic asset would be a big selling point.
No question.

100% true.

[Goobylal]

Such simple thinking.

Did you get that idea while doing paintings on your cave wall?

Cretin. The Pegulas won't burden people with a shiny, expensive, new stadium when the old one works just fine.

[YardRat]

That part I agree with.

I don't follow hockey any more, so I can't comment on the Sabres.

But you'd think the Rex fiasco would have taught them to bring in a bona fide football mind to run things. Its my biggest disappointment in the Pegula's.

idk...

fantasy football
mock drafts
message boards

Everyone has an opinion, so I think to some, it makes them believe they can do the job full time.

There are probably 2 owners with enough knowledge in football to take a hands on approach, Dan Rooney and Clark Hunt. And both of them grew up in the business, and both are smart enough to hire the right people and let them do their jobs.

I think they made the right call this time, and still believe Brandon and/or Whaley convinced them Wrecks was the right hire at the time.

[SpikedLemonade]

Cretin. The Pegulas won't burden people with a shiny, expensive, new stadium when the old one works just fine.

Was that a vision from GOD?

Is that why you feel confidant saying that?

[Skooby]

It's not so much about the winning part, it's more about the losing part.

Nobody wants to give money to losers. But if the Bills were ever to make it back to the Super Bowl (believe me, I know this is an extreme long shot), it would be a much easier sell. Tickets and luxury boxes would be more sought after and the perceived value of the team as a civic asset would be a big selling point.
Waiting for a Superbowl is like waiting for Astronauts to go to Mars, it's a good idea but far away from today.

[SpikedLemonade]

Waiting for a Superbowl is like waiting for Astronauts to go to Mars, it's a good idea but far away from today.

MitchTHE*****TM speaking TRUTH.

[swiper]

PFT seems insistent on pushing this agenda of the Bills being the team at the top of the list likely to move:

Which team(s) will be the next to move? (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/04/01/which-teams-will-be-the-next-to-move/)

[Skooby]

PFT seems insistent on pushing this agenda of the Bills being the team at the top of the list likely to move:

Which team(s) will be the next to move? (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/04/01/which-teams-will-be-the-next-to-move/)
Some of you guys think I'm a crackpot or crazy but I'm warning you that Pegula has a scenario planned to ride the NFL express without much risk. I'm 100% against staying in OP, totally a disaster if that happens with the team moving. If anyone is thinking incredibly financial large commitments for a stadium wasn't discussed when he buying the team, you're nuts. There were plans being discussed and Pegs pulled the plug to see how things go, well that sucks for us as fans.

We have almost zero security of the team staying, have you heard any statements from Pegula discussing the long-term plans of viability ?? It's like a year to deal with no real continuity or consistency, that's shaky s--t in my world. You guys sleep well and bury your head, I'm just warning you.

[Goobylal]

Some of you guys think I'm a crackpot or crazy but I'm warning you that Pegula has a scenario planned to ride the NFL express without much risk. I'm 100% against staying in OP, totally a disaster if that happens with the team moving. If anyone is thinking incredibly financial large commitments for a stadium wasn't discussed when he buying the team, you're nuts. There were plans being discussed and Pegs pulled the plug to see how things go, well that sucks for us as fans.

We have almost zero security of the team staying, have you heard any statements from Pegula discussing the long-term plans of viability ?? It's like a year to deal with no real continuity or consistency, that's shaky s--t in my world. You guys sleep well and bury your head, I'm just warning you.

Have you seen this plan? Or at least heard about it from someone credible? Or is this just speculation based on the fact that he isn't planning on spending everyone's money for a shiny new stadium that does nothing except jack up prices for everyone?

[SpikedLemonade]

Have you seen this plan? Or at least heard about it from someone credible? Or is this just speculation based on the fact that he isn't planning on spending everyone's money for a shiny new stadium that does nothing except jack up prices for everyone?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrgpZ0fUixs

[Skooby]

Have you seen this plan? Or at least heard about it from someone credible? Or is this just speculation based on the fact that he isn't planning on spending everyone's money for a shiny new stadium that does nothing except jack up prices for everyone?

So you see it written just yesterday about Buffalo being most likely to move & I tell you nearly the exact same just days before that yet I need to give you details ?? Have you seen anything recently about the Buffalo Bills moving ?? Since the answer is no, then either I'm incredibly lucky on the timing or it's validated. Then ask yourself, Is anyone from Buffalo or who is cursed to root for them incredibly lucky ??

[swiper]

Buffalo and Cleveland are terrible teams. The NFL cannot afford to abandon the rust belt. They need to put better owners there though.

[Skooby]

Buffalo and Cleveland are terrible teams. The NFL cannot afford to abandon the rust belt. They need to put better owners there though.
Even with Pegula's vast resources and ownership of a rare gem (NFL team), we see no major financial commitments for him to keep the Bills in Buffalo. The perpetual pointing out of his investments downtown & Sabres is nice but let's put the $1.5 Billion or so needed into a real perspective of delays. What incentive does Pegula have to commit huge amount to his NFL franchise ?? He got free money for doing another lease at the oldest NFL facility that polished a turd (Christine) for him and turned off all plans for a new one.

It's just terrible news and leads me to believe that he'lp wait and see how much his investment goes up first before deciding if the team stays for multiple generations, what a nightmare scenario for Bills fans. You're not going to get a much wealthier person to buy the team for local use so all we have now is questions for the future. It's really sad and sickening at the same time, but fools sit here and think the delays are a good delay in business is a bad sign and usually leads to a negative outcome. There's no good delay at all for Pegula to wait and the longer he does, the more likely the team moves. Wake up folks, the clock is ticking.

[Goobylal]

So you see it written just yesterday about Buffalo being most likely to move & I tell you nearly the exact same just days before that yet I need to give you details ?? Have you seen anything recently about the Buffalo Bills moving ?? Since the answer is no, then either I'm incredibly lucky on the timing or it's validated. Then ask yourself, Is anyone from Buffalo or who is cursed to root for them incredibly lucky ??

Florio's a turd and PFT is a joke. If it were written on paper, I'd wipe my ass with it.

Talk is cheap. I've heard annually (including, among other places, from the aforementioned ****blog PFT) about the Bills moving for decades. Hell there was a story several months ago saying they could move, so the timing of your post means little to me. And Jerry Sullivan claimed that Ralph Wilson told him the team would be sold to the highest bidder upon his death and moved. And yet...here they still are. Wake me when they actually do move.

That being said, if the team does move, so be it. Life will go on. The Pegulas likely won't be the ones to move it and they will have kept it in Buffalo for however many years longer than it otherwise would have been. Their efforts to revitalize Buffalo will be of far greater impact.


Buffalo and Cleveland are terrible teams. The NFL cannot afford to abandon the rust belt. They need to put better owners there though.

There are that are just as bad or worse teams than the Bills. Does that mean there are 12 other bad owners? Is Stephen Ross suddenly a good owner because the Dols backed into the playoffs last year?

And Pegula's owned the team for just 2-1/2 years. If that's the time frame for proving you're a good owner...

[ckg927]

Let me add something to this-in a slightly different direction.

Considering the millions poured into New Era Field as part of the conditions for extended the Bills lease 10 more years, are people aware that the citizens of Oakland and Alameda County are STILL paying off the debt for the improvements made to the Raiders' stadium? (For the record, I don't know how long we here will be paying for the improvements-if someone can clarify that, it'd be appreciated.)

[swiper]

There are that are just as bad or worse teams than the Bills. Does that mean there are 12 other bad owners? Is Stephen Ross suddenly a good owner because the Dols backed into the playoffs last year?

And Pegula's owned the team for just 2-1/2 years. If that's the time frame for proving you're a good owner...

Despite what Pegula says (that missing the play-offs during Wilson's final years doesn't matter), it is what it is. No other team has missed the play-offs for so long. Even teams that have changed owners. So there's your bar.

[Goobylal]

Despite what Pegula says (that missing the play-offs during Wilson's final years doesn't matter), it is what it is. No other team has missed the play-offs for so long. Even teams that have changed owners. So there's your bar.

Sorry, but making the playoffs once every 8 years and bowing out in the first game means nothing. And Pegula doesn't own the prior 15 years.

[swiper]

Doesn't matter to Bills fans.

[Goobylal]

Even with Pegula's vast resources and ownership of a rare gem (NFL team), we see no major financial commitments for him to keep the Bills in Buffalo. The perpetual pointing out of his investments downtown & Sabres is nice but let's put the $1.5 Billion or so needed into a real perspective of delays. What incentive does Pegula have to commit huge amount to his NFL franchise ?? He got free money for doing another lease at the oldest NFL facility that polished a turd (Christine) for him and turned off all plans for a new one.

It's just terrible news and leads me to believe that he'lp wait and see how much his investment goes up first before deciding if the team stays for multiple generations, what a nightmare scenario for Bills fans. You're not going to get a much wealthier person to buy the team for local use so all we have now is questions for the future. It's really sad and sickening at the same time, but fools sit here and think the delays are a good delay in business is a bad sign and usually leads to a negative outcome. There's no good delay at all for Pegula to wait and the longer he does, the more likely the team moves. Wake up folks, the clock is ticking.

Just because you have money, it doesn't mean you should waste it. The NFL claimed that without a new stadium, the Bills would be at a financial disadvantage. However Pegula has been able to spend money just fine because he has oodles of it (and why would be spend money if he's merely trying to make as much money as possible?). So that killed that argument. He's also probably seen that the current stadium is fine for playing games in and has made enough in-roads with the owners to tell them to shove their new stadium demands up their collective asses. If anything, they can do a $400M renovation like the Chefs did to Arrowhead.

[BertSquirtgum]

Why is this thread still alive? Most of us realize Skooby made this up and stopped posting. Everyone else do the same. Thanks in advance.

[stuckincincy]

Team Pegula parked money in Buffalo Sports franchises knowing that the values will rise drastically over the coming years. They could sell the Bills to Toronto investors down the line & the Sabres could head back to Quebec or Hartford. So basically we're a big boy holding station and there's no long-term plan for either franchise to stay in Buffalo. The stadium plan was deferred indefinitely and the talk you hear of 5-6 years is complete bullshjt. Pegula's plan is to minimally redress both venues (some public and his own) keep playing there until it's time to close out his position.

The talk of him being our savior to keep the Bills in town is simply just a cover for his financial goals, which are virtually insatiable (Billions to show for it). There's not going to be a new stadium in Buffalo with him, ever. The other power players in town basically offered him land for free and we know about the decade long tax advantage (which he could probably make decades) on improvements including building and equipment which he is skipping over.

Moral is, don't expect the team to win anymore than it has too again or even get out of it's own way. Selling a party to a bunch of alcoholics is an easy sale at a low price, big city money isn't going to work here. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I usually try to forewarn of incredibly negative things to come, this being terrible news that I wanted to share. Sorry.

P.S. If they spent all the money on a new hard venue for the Bills, we'd stay in town but you'll never get past simple banter. They wanted to redress both pigs (they did) and stay even between income and box office, letting time appreciate the holdings. Kim Pegula's nest egg, nothing more. Buffalo gets the final shaft, a dying town with a few minor league teams (kinda like what we have now because we can't win sh**).

Will it be a seller's market in the future?

The NFL is losing some of its' shine. Folks here have many a time complained about the quality of the product these days.

People are using DVRs to zip through games. Younger folks are turning their backs on live news and sports and are spending their time with Netflix and Hulu, Roku etc. Add in the “un-bundling”of cable/dish offerings (i.e., folks can save themselves $ by dumping ESPN).

By the time the brain injury lawsuits are over, the tv ratings have declined (even more), the salary cap ever rising, and whatever other unforeseeable difficulties arise, buyers may not be lining up.

[Skooby]

Just because you have money, it doesn't mean you should waste it. The NFL claimed that without a new stadium, the Bills would be at a financial disadvantage. However Pegula has been able to spend money just fine because he has oodles of it (and why would be spend money if he's merely trying to make as much money as possible?). So that killed that argument. He's also probably seen that the current stadium is fine for playing games in and has made enough in-roads with the owners to tell them to shove their new stadium demands up their collective asses. If anything, they can do a $400M renovation like the Chefs did to Arrowhead.

Stadium is worthless for the area, too far for Canada money & it needs to be in Downtown Buffalo.

[YardRat]

Pegula's own the Wrecks Wryan hire, and that's a pretty piss-poor first step.

[SpikedLemonade]

Why is this thread still alive? Most of us realize Skooby made this up and stopped posting. Everyone else do the same. Thanks in advance.

This thread is highly relevant whether Homers care to acknowledge it or not.

[Goobylal]

Pegula's own the Wrecks Wryan hire, and that's a pretty piss-poor first step.

They do own it. But they realized quickly it was a mistake. And for perspective, Kraft inherited Parcells, ran him out of town, and then hired Pete Carroll, which was a piss-poor hiring. And then they found a franchise QB...

[SpikedLemonade]

They do own it. But they realized quickly it was a mistake. And for perspective, Kraft inherited Parcells, ran him out of town, and then hired Pete Carroll, which was a piss-poor hiring. And then they found a franchise QB...
Protruding forehead logic.

[swiper]

Boom!

[YardRat]

These team's 'long term plans' don't feel as 'long term' as they did 40 years ago. They better step it up, I'm closing in on a 'short term' window of opportunity.

[Goobylal]

Protruding forehead logic.

Nope, cretin.

[swiper]

They do own it. But they realized quickly it was a mistake. And for perspective, Kraft inherited Parcells, ran him out of town, and then hired Pete Carroll, which was a piss-poor hiring. And then they found a franchise QB...

LOL. Pegula apologist. Pegula sucks. Sucks terribly. While everyone could see hiring Ryan in the first place was a terrible idea, he went ahead and did it anyway. He has sucked in numerous ways with the how he's handled the Sabres. The Leaf fans laugh at him. As for the Bills, he let his lousy GM run Doug Marrone out after a winning season then hired the scum of the earth to replace him. He's got a milque-toast version of Michael Vick as his QB. A guy who he sorely overpays. He's got no wide receivers , on and on and on. One can only hope that McDermott makes him look like a genius. But we know he's not.

[Goobylal]

LOL. Pegula apologist. Pegula sucks. Sucks terribly. While everyone could see hiring Ryan in the first place was a terrible idea, he went ahead and did it anyway. He has sucked in numerous ways with the how he's handled the Sabres. The Leaf fans laugh at him. As for the Bills, he let his lousy GM run Doug Marrone out after a winning season then hired the scum of the earth to replace him. He's got a milque-toast version of Michael Vick as his QB. A guy who he sorely overpays. He's got no wide receivers , on and on and on. One can only hope that McDermott makes him look like a genius. But we know he's not.

LOL! First of all, who gives a **** about the NHL and the stupid Laffs, much less their idiot fans? Second of all, the Ryan hire was widely hailed at the time because he took the Jets to 2 AFCCG's with a similar roster to what the Bills had, until the Jets' GM started to dismantle the team. It was assumed he'd keep the defense intact, but that didn't happen and that's on him and him alone, and why he got fired after 2 seasons. Third, don't make me laugh talking about Whaley running off that turd Marrone. He's the same as Ryan: one whose supposed forte was a bust and the reason the team didn't make the playoffs.

As for Pegula, yeah, he'll get a pass from me for keeping the team in Buffalo when it all but looked like the team was going to be leaving. And I'll give him more than a couple seasons.

[YardRat]

I'm starting to think Swiper and Spiked are twins, separated at birth.

[Skooby]

I'm starting to think Swiper and Spiked are twins, separated at birth.

There's logic in what they both write & for many it's difficult to swallow. Pegula has been a terrible owner & regardless of how much money you have, you can't buy more brains. Pegula has surrounded himself with the same cast of under .500 misfits and is expecting a different result ?? As long as Russ / Overdorf / Whaley are around, the Bills are going nowhere. Pegula waiting to ante up after the Bills are winners is a complete pipe dream made up by the press to make people think good things will happen soon.

The stadium fills up because it's the best party on a Sunday & selling a drinking festival to a group of multi-generational alcoholics is not a hard sale. I'd plan on more pain & less winning as the better teams get more fine tuned. Pegula is only good at picking holes to drill. the Bills / Buffalo have already been drilled and filled with S**t. It's going to take a cleaning and dredging to make things better, the song remains the same.

Do you know the difference between a realists and an A-hole ?? The A-hole shares your mirror.

[swiper]

LOL! First of all, who gives a **** about the NHL and the stupid Laffs, much less their idiot fans? Second of all, the Ryan hire was widely hailed at the time because he took the Jets to 2 AFCCG's with a similar roster to what the Bills had, until the Jets' GM started to dismantle the team. It was assumed he'd keep the defense intact, but that didn't happen and that's on him and him alone, and why he got fired after 2 seasons. Third, don't make me laugh talking about Whaley running off that turd Marrone. He's the same as Ryan: one whose supposed forte was a bust and the reason the team didn't make the playoffs.

As for Pegula, yeah, he'll get a pass from me for keeping the team in Buffalo when it all but looked like the team was going to be leaving. And I'll give him more than a couple seasons.

What a joke you are. Ryan was never hailed. And only the loser fan is still hanging on Pegula for keeping the team in Buffalo. Keep it hear and keep it a joke. Shows who you are.

And check me when Marrone takes the Jaguars to the play-offs before the Bills.

[swiper]

I'm starting to think Swiper and Spiked are twins, separated at birth.

Or some of you are too stubborn to see the truth?

[YardRat]

Or some of you are too stubborn to see the truth?

You should re-visit my first post in this thread. But, the possibility of something happening doesn't make it 'the truth'...until it does or doesn't happen.

[Skooby]

You should re-visit my first post in this thread. But, the possibility of something happening doesn't make it 'the truth'...until it does or doesn't happen.
What's happening is someone who's really rich out on a show that getting a new stadium was a concern, he gets ownership and then he shuts all the stadium talk down. Does this seem like a positive position for a long term?

[Goobylal]

I'm starting to think Swiper and Spiked are twins, separated at birth.

Yep. And sharing the one occasionally-firing neuron.

[Goobylal]

What a joke you are. Ryan was never hailed. And only the loser fan is still hanging on Pegula for keeping the team in Buffalo. Keep it hear and keep it a joke. Shows who you are.

And check me when Marrone takes the Jaguars to the play-offs before the Bills.

And what kind of fan thinks it would be better to have the team leave and to stay and be a joke? Yeah, a loser. Grow a pair you pussy.

And the Jags to the playoffs. LOL! Shad Kahn is a bigger moron than you think Pegula is. The Jags were a joke on offense and especially OL, and that idiot promotes Marrone?

[swiper]

And what kind of fan thinks it would be better to have the team leave and to stay and be a joke? Yeah, a loser. Grow a pair you pussy.

And the Jags to the playoffs. LOL! Shad Kahn is a bigger moron than you think Pegula is. The Jags were a joke on offense and especially OL, and that idiot promotes Marrone?

Anytime you want a piece you dumbass, come find me. It's be the last breath you take. And if you could read, I never said the team would be better off moving you loser. But you can't read you stupid piece of *****.

And your statement on The Jaguars seals the fact you are nothing more than a poor Pegula apologist. As much as I have fought with the Canadian, he at least gets understands the point. It's a rudimentary thing that you and the rest of the run-of-the-mill drunkard Bills fans can't seem to grasp. ****ing dumbest fanbase in the NFL.

- - - Updated - - -


Yep. And sharing the one occasionally-firing neuron.

That you would be so lucky to have.

[BertSquirtgum]

Can't believe these mongolians think the Pegulas spent 1.5 billion dollars on the Bills just to sell the team for the same amount in several years. Is it that much fun to **** on the city of Buffalo and the Bills? Get a life.

[Skooby]

Can't believe these mongolians think the Pegulas spent 1.5 billion dollars on the Bills just to sell the team for the same amount in several years. Is it that much fun to **** on the city of Buffalo and the Bills? Get a life.
There's always an upside, it's just the delays of the stadium should scare everyone that wants Buffalo to stay there.

[Goobylal]

Anytime you want a piece you dumbass, come find me. It's be the last breath you take. And if you could read, I never said the team would be better off moving you loser. But you can't read you stupid piece of *****.

And your statement on The Jaguars seals the fact you are nothing more than a poor Pegula apologist. As much as I have fought with the Canadian, he at least gets understands the point. It's a rudimentary thing that you and the rest of the run-of-the-mill drunkard Bills fans can't seem to grasp. ****ing dumbest fanbase in the NFL.

Oooh, I'm shaking! Anyway...

I can read just fine. You've proven time and again, however, that you can't think. Without Pegula, the team moves. Period. Unless you live in a more ****ed-up fantasy world than I thought you did and believe that there was someone else ready to plunk down $1B+ and keep the team in Buffalo. You think Bon Jon Bovi and his merry band of Canuckleheads would have done that? The Donald? Yeah, right! So again, I'll praise Pegula for keeping the team in Buffalo. Even if it always remains a joke under him, which is a joke in and of itself.

More stupidity is holding up the Jaguars, their fanbase and Shat Khan as anything more than what they are: a true joke. When you have to tarp up seats to "sell out" your stadium, and still can't even do it, you should know you have a problem/****ty market and fans. They should have moved years ago. But Shat Khan is a bigger moron than you fancy Pegula is and an even ****tier owner. You see, he bought the team during the 2011 season (Pegs bought the Bills during the 2014 season) and they haven't made the playoffs even once during his ownership. Doh! And you think they have a chance at the playoffs with Luck and Mariota in the division for the next decade? LOL!

And I have no idea what point you think you were making with Marrone. He's no better than Rex. Wait, no, he's not even as good. You see, Rex took a team to the AFCCG not once, but twice. Marrone will never do that. And without that $5M buyout, he doesn't have the balls to storm into Pegula's office and demand more control, only to have his ass kicked out the door to become the OL coach under his former OC.

[Goobylal]

Can't believe these mongolians think the Pegulas spent 1.5 billion dollars on the Bills just to sell the team for the same amount in several years. Is it that much fun to **** on the city of Buffalo and the Bills? Get a life.

No, he'll make $500M on the sale in a decade. Just watch and see.

Back to realty, today I met a guy who worked at ESPN from the very beginning but is now retired. I said you got out at the right time. He said "you're not kidding. It's sad what's going on there." I asked him what he thought the problem was and he said he didn't have to think, he knew. And it's the same thing I knew: they're paying way too much for content. Specifically he mentioned how they're paying the most for the NFL package when they don't have to and they're suffering as a result, having to cut "talent." You think they're going to continue to pay $1.93B/year after their contract ends in 2021-2022? I wouldn't bet money on it. And if they don't and other networks follow suit...

[Skooby]

No, he'll make $500M on the sale in a decade. Just watch and see.

Back to realty, today I met a guy who worked at ESPN from the very beginning but is now retired. I said you got out at the right time. He said "you're not kidding. It's sad what's going on there." I asked him what he thought the problem was and he said he didn't have to think, he knew. And it's the same thing I knew: they're paying way too much for content. Specifically he mentioned how they're paying the most for the NFL package when they don't have to and they're suffering as a result, having to cut "talent." You think they're going to continue to pay $1.93B/year after their contract ends in 2021-2022? I wouldn't bet money on it. And if they don't and other networks follow suit...
TBS will buy it if espn falls down, it's a winner for the networks to bring in a lot of viewers.

[Goobylal]

TBS will buy it if espn falls down, it's a winner for the networks to bring in a lot of viewers.

For $1.93B/year, much less more, which is the only way franchise values are going to increase? Highly doubtful.

[BillsFan4]

I don't see any type of evil plot by the Pegula's. That doesn't even make sense to me. The guy is a multi billionaire and has been spending money on the Bills and Sabres like no owner we have ever had before. All he does is spend money on these teams...

Its prett simple really (IMO) - the Bills just renovated New Era Stadium with a bunch of tax payer money. They have an absolutely iron clad lease there for 6 more years. They couldn't leave before that if they wanted to. So, like Pegula said, what's the rush to build a new stadium? They don't want to make tax payers angry, or make certain politicians look foolish for renovating the Ralph. They are taking their time and build up some good will first, nothing wrong with that. He already said when he bought the team that they will build a new stadium eventually. There's no conspiracy going on here...

All theyve done done since they bought the teams is invest money in them, and in Buffalo. They just bought land around the Bills stadium and are using their own money to build a new practice facility. They used their own money to make upgrade to the Bills stadium. They used their own money to make improvements to the Sabres arena. They used their own money build HarborCenter and the hotel + shops there and 716 food and sport. They just bought another multi million dollar building near the arena.

Just because they are not immediately building a stadium that they couldn't even move to for at least 6 more years, after the team just spent a bunch of tax payer money renovating their current stadium, doesn't mean that the Pegula's are moving the team.

Sometimes the simple explanation staring you in the face is the answer. There is no conspiracy here.

[Skooby]

I don't see any type of evil plot by the Pegula's. That doesn't even make sense to me. The guy is a multi billionaire and has been spending money on the Bills and Sabres like no owner we have ever had before. All he does is spend money on these teams...

Its prett simple really (IMO) - the Bills just renovated New Era Stadium with a bunch of tax payer money. They have an absolutely iron clad lease there for 6 more years. They couldn't leave before that if they wanted to. So, like Pegula said, what's the rush to build a new stadium? They don't want to make tax payers angry, or make certain politicians look foolish for renovating the Ralph. They are taking their time and build up some good will first, nothing wrong with that. He already said when he bought the team that they will build a new stadium eventually. There's no conspiracy going on here...

All theyve done done since they bought the teams is invest money in them, and in Buffalo. They just bought land around the Bills stadium and are using their own money to build a new practice facility. They used their own money to make upgrade to the Bills stadium. They used their own money to make improvements to the Sabres arena. They used their own money build HarborCenter and the hotel + shops there and 716 food and sport. They just bought another multi million dollar building near the arena.

Just because they are not immediately building a stadium that they couldn't even move to for at least 6 more years, after the team just spent a bunch of tax payer money renovating their current stadium, doesn't mean that the Pegula's are moving the team.

Sometimes the simple explanation staring you in the face is the answer. There is no conspiracy here.
Between trying to get state money and incentives / packages, the unions, planning and infrastructure upgrades (including roads / bridges (even the peace bridge) / tunnels. over-passes, stadium design building and final completions from time overruns, 6 years isn't S--t. We're talking about NY here, land of the delay. Even down the little stuff, Every flashbulbs used will need some type of bribe or juice to fly. Things just take forever there, so time is a ticking.

[SpikedLemonade]

No, he'll make $500M on the sale in a decade. Just watch and see....

I believe that.


He will have written off most of the purchase price by then.

[Goobylal]

I believe that.

He will have written off most of the purchase price by then.

If ESPN bails all bets are off.

And he can write off the purchase price, but that only allows him to avoid paying taxes on the revenue the team generates. You figure the team makes about $35M a year in profit and he won't come close to recouping his money in a decade.

[elroy16]

Between trying to get state money and incentives / packages, the unions, planning and infrastructure upgrades (including roads / bridges (even the peace bridge) / tunnels. over-passes, stadium design building and final completions from time overruns, 6 years isn't S--t. We're talking about NY here, land of the delay. Even down the little stuff, Every flashbulbs used will need some type of bribe or juice to fly. Things just take forever there, so time is a ticking.


True, but the current stadium isn't going to fall apart in six years.


It seems foolish to spend $130 million to renovate a stadium only to announce plans to move away two years later. I understand the length of time it takes to get a new stadium approved and built, but spending that much money on a 6-8 year investment, with zero return is a really poor investment. Is the state and county going to be OK with basically flushing that money down the toilet?

[Skooby]

True, but the current stadium isn't going to fall apart in six years.


It seems foolish to spend $130 million to renovate a stadium only to announce plans to move away two years later. I understand the length of time it takes to get a new stadium approved and built, but spending that much money on a 6-8 year investment, with zero return is a really poor investment. Is the state and county going to be OK with basically flushing that money down the toilet?
How long will it take to plan and build from today in everyone's opinion ?? I do very high end real estate around the U.S. everyday but I'd like your opinions.

[Goobylal]

I'd say it would take a couple years to plan and a year and a half to build. And I wouldn't doubt they already have the plan in place, having worked on it since they bought the team.

[SpikedLemonade]

I'd say it would take a couple years to plan and a year and a half to build. And I wouldn't doubt they already have the plan in place, having worked on it since they bought the team.

No way.

5 years minimum only if the planning only takes one year of those 5 years.

[Goobylal]

No way.

5 years minimum only if the planning only takes one year of those 5 years.

Construction I can safely say at most will take about a year and a half. Planning shouldn't take more than a couple years and as I said, they've probably done most of the leg work there.

But again, I think they could just renovate the stadium like the Chefs did, for about a third of the cost.

[YardRat]

http://www.thephinsider.com/2014/6/10/5796114/purchase-price-and-current-value-of-each-nfl-franchise

In 1984, the Broncos were bought for $78mil, the Chargers for $70mil.
In 1994, the Patriots for $172mil, the Eagles for $185mil.
In 2004, the Ravens sold for $600mil. The Falcons, in 2002, for $545mil.
in 2014, the Bills for $1.5 billion. Cleveland an even billion 2 years earlier.

Anybody that thinks this franchise isn't going to be worth $2bil or more in 2024 is kidding themselves.

[Skooby]

http://www.thephinsider.com/2014/6/10/5796114/purchase-price-and-current-value-of-each-nfl-franchise

In 1984, the Broncos were bought for $78mil, the Chargers for $70mil.
In 1994, the Patriots for $172mil, the Eagles for $185mil.
In 2004, the Ravens sold for $600mil. The Falcons, in 2002, for $545mil.
in 2014, the Bills for $1.5 billion. Cleveland an even billion 2 years earlier.

Anybody that thinks this franchise isn't going to be worth $2bil or more in 2024 is kidding themselves.

I think it's a given.

[BertSquirtgum]

http://www.thephinsider.com/2014/6/10/5796114/purchase-price-and-current-value-of-each-nfl-franchise

In 1984, the Broncos were bought for $78mil, the Chargers for $70mil.
In 1994, the Patriots for $172mil, the Eagles for $185mil.
In 2004, the Ravens sold for $600mil. The Falcons, in 2002, for $545mil.
in 2014, the Bills for $1.5 billion. Cleveland an even billion 2 years earlier.

Anybody that thinks this franchise isn't going to be worth $2bil or more in 2024 is kidding themselves.

They won't be if the league continues losing support with its watered down product.

[BillsFan4]

Between trying to get state money and incentives / packages, the unions, planning and infrastructure upgrades (including roads / bridges (even the peace bridge) / tunnels. over-passes, stadium design building and final completions from time overruns, 6 years isn't S--t. We're talking about NY here, land of the delay. Even down the little stuff, Every flashbulbs used will need some type of bribe or juice to fly. Things just take forever there, so time is a ticking.


There here is no reason to believe that the Bills have to have a stadium built by the time their current lease is up at New Era. It's not like they wouldn't be able to renew the lease there for however much longer they want/need to. There were just major renovations done recently, and the Pegula's have continued to put their own money into the stadium and practice facilities. They also just bought more land surrounding the stadium. Why would the Pegula's continue to invest money into property and continue use building things in Buffalo if their plan was to move the team?

But the new LA Rams stadium, which is going to be the most expensive stadium in history, is supposed to be ready for the start of the 2019 season. The Cowboys stadium (which is an amazing, retractable roof stadium) was built in less than 2 & 1/2 years. Most NFL stadiums seem to take 2-3 years to build.

As far as the funding and planning and all that, I don't know exactly how long that will take. But I do know NY did commission a stadium study on location and cost -

http://buffalonews.com/2015/01/18/state-study-focuses-on-three-buffalo-sites-for-bills-stadium-as-well-as-the-ralph/

They were worried about losing the Bills when Ralph Wilson died, which is why they started the initial stadium planning. They had no intention of letting the Bills leave if at all possible. There were many people of power and influence working to make sure the Bills stayed here. That's one thing you have to remember about San Diego and Oakland. Both were very unwilling to work with their teams to build new stadiums and that was a big factor in why they moved. That is not the case here in Buffalo.



NY also decided to decommission the study after its initial findings because they said they were no longer worried that the Bills were going to leave Buffalo, so they felt no need to fast track a new stadium anymore. I'm assuming that they've talked directly to the Pegula's about the Bills future in Buffalo.
I think they all proved that they were willing to act when there was a danger of the team moving.
So if they feel there is no danger of the Bills leaving Buffalo, why should we?

[Historian]

So if they feel there is no danger of the Bills leaving Buffalo, why should we?

Because Skooby can't resist starting these inane threads...

[Goobylal]

I think it's a given.

That's what people thought about housing prices prior to 2008. Nothing is a given.

[Skooby]

That's what people thought about housing prices prior to 2008. Nothing is a given.

Like the Bills staying in town. Using the old turd stadium to dance doesn't make me feel all warm and fuzzy inside for them to stay, it's much more temporary. $1 Billion plus of new money for a new stadium ?? I'm toasty and comfortable that they stay.

[SpikedLemonade]

Like the Bills staying in town. Using the old turd stadium to dance doesn't make me feel all warm and fuzzy inside for them to stay, it's much more temporary. $1 Billion plus of new money for a new stadium ?? I'm toasty and comfortable that they stay.

Mitch, there is another way to feel comfortable -- simply STOP thinking altogether the way the Homers here do.

[Skooby]

Mitch, there is another way to feel comfortable -- simply STOP thinking altogether the way the Homers here do.

Can they really be this naive ??

[BertSquirtgum]

Can they really be this naive ??
Just worry about the swamp your trailer is sinking in. We have a football team up here and it's not going anywhere in the next 25 years.

[SpikedLemonade]

Poor ignorance.

This Bert is smarter....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVLCXtG5HZ8

[Skooby]

Just worry about the swamp your trailer is sinking in. We have a football team up here and it's not going anywhere in the next 25 years.
I keep hearing whispers differently, be afraid.

[Goobylal]

I keep hearing whispers differently, be afraid.

If anything, it's probably from the same chump that the Florio uses. Again, talk is cheap. I'll wait until Terry actually puts the team up for sale before I start getting worried. Worrying now would be as useless as worrying about when I'm going to die.

[elroy16]

How long will it take to plan and build from today in everyone's opinion ?? I do very high end real estate around the U.S. everyday but I'd like your opinions.

In 2010, it was reported that the Falcons were interested in building a new stadium. In early 2011 a comprehensive design was released, construction started in March 2014, and it's supposed to open this year. Like you have said, NY state laws could slow the process down, so I don't think it's that crazy to think it will take 8-10 years from proposal to opening. The current lease for New Era Field ends in 2022. I would assume they start talking or planning a new stadium before the lease is over, so my uneducated guess is a new stadium opens sometime between 2027 and 2032.


I honestly understand where you're coming from and why you think they could very well be sold and moved. If someone else had purchased the team and said the same things about a new stadium the Pegula's have said, I would probably be worried about the team moving until a stadium was put up. This might be the case with any other owner who didn't own the Sabres or have ties to WNY, but I just don't see the Pegula's doing it.




So why the need to be this involved with PSE or any of the other mundane aspects of the Pegula properties? Why not simply leave it all to the hired hands and spend more time living the wealthy-beyond-imagination life she’s able to lead?

“Because our name is on it,” Kim says. “If this was just a generic company selling widgets, or whatever it is, or a marketing firm, or even if it just was a publicly traded company, it’d be different. But for Terry and me, our name is associated with everything that we’re doing. I feel more ownership of being involved because this is our family, this is what we represent, this is our kids’ future.

“I don’t want to lose too much control over what that is.

”Bills. Sabres. Ralph Wilson Stadium. First Niagara Center. The Bandits indoor lacrosse team. The American Hockey League’s Rochester Americans. HarborCenter. (716) Food and Sport. Tim Hortons. Buffalo Marriott HarborCenter. Academy of Hockey. The Rinks. Black River Entertainment in Nashville, Tenn. Impact Sports Performance in Boca Raton, Fla. One Buffalo.

So many brands working in harmony. That, in a fairly large nutshell, is PSE.

http://buffalonews.com/2015/10/18/kim-pegula-buffalos-first-lady-of-sports/



If their ultimate goal was to sell or move the team, why put so much of an emphasis on One Buffalo? Unless they go bankrupt and have to sell the team, I just don't see them moving or selling the team. Call me whatever you want, obviously I'm biased and would be crushed if they moved the team, but I don't believe they're doing all this work just to play the villain and make a bunch of money.

[SpikedLemonade]

In 2010, it was reported that the Falcons were interested in building a new stadium. In early 2011 a comprehensive design was released, construction started in March 2014, and it's supposed to open this year. Like you have said, NY state laws could slow the process down, so I don't think it's that crazy to think it will take 8-10 years from proposal to opening. The current lease for New Era Field ends in 2022. I would assume they start talking or planning a new stadium before the lease is over, so my uneducated guess is a new stadium opens sometime between 2027 and 2032.
Comparing the City of Atlanta to the City of Buffalo is wrong.

The palms that need to be greased in Buffalo are ten-fold of that of Atlanta.

Scratching your ass takes more time in Buffalo than Atlanta.

[Skooby]

Comparing the City of Atlanta to the City of Buffalo is wrong.

The palms that need to be greased in Buffalo are ten-fold of that of Atlanta.

Scratching your ass takes more time in Buffalo than Atlanta.

I could get stuff built in fractional time compared to NY and the infrastructure in place is much newer, you ever drove through the ATL ?? The highways are quite different, not even mentioning the conditions of the roads / bridges.

[BillsFan4]

Can they really be this naive ??

It has nothing to do with me being naive.


I just believe the Pegula's over you. What they have said (and done) makes much more sense to me than the conspiracy theory you've laid out.

They said they are taking their time and there's no rush to build a new expensive stadium, but they would address the issue when the time comes. They also said they want to have some success with the Bills before asking for things (like taxpayer money for a stadium). And they said the the Bills and Sabres are never going anywhere, and that they didn't just buy the teams to buy them. They bought the teams to help revive the city of Buffalo and everything they have done since buying the teams has backed that up

Why would they just continue to buy up things in Buffalo. They bought the Sabres, Bills, Amerks, Bandits, built HarborCenter, a hotel, shops and restaurants, upgraded the arena and stadium with their own money and continue to buy buildings and land around boy the arena and stadium and pour crazy amounts of money into both teams, as I've said in my other posts. That doesn't seem like someone biding his time to move the Bills.

Everyinf the Pegula's have done backs up them saying they are in Buffalo for the long term.

[BillsFan4]

Also, just to add to my above post. Both Kim and Terry are long time Bills and Sabres fans. Kim is from this area and grew up a Bills/Sabres fan, and Terry has been a fan since the early '70's. I mean, we seen him brought to tears by meeting the French connection and the '90's Bills alumni.

That doesn't mean they'd never move the team, but I just haven't seen any evidence that they will. Everyone points to the Bills being here long term.

There's also a rule that owners are not allowed to have professional teams in 2 different markets too. So they'd have to give up control of the Sabres to someone else, and with how involved they've been with the Sabres, I just don't see that happening.

I get get that you want a new stadium built to make it 100% clear the Bills are here to stay. I do too, and I think they will build one when the time is right.
I know it's probably hard to let go of that fear we've had of the Bills moving for many years now. But I truly believe that we have an ownership group that will keep the Bills here long term. Pegula has even talked about how his kids will one day take over these Buffalo sports teams.

[SpikedLemonade]

To summarize, the Homers logic is based on only one thing -- HOPE.

[BertSquirtgum]

I could get stuff built in fractional time compared to NY and the infrastructure in place is much newer, you ever drove through the ATL ?? The highways are quite different, not even mentioning the conditions of the roads / bridges.

Atlanta doesn't have salt eating the black top and steel every winter. Nor does it have water getting into a crack and freezing, in turn making that one crack five cracks afterwards.

[BertSquirtgum]

I keep hearing whispers differently, be afraid.

No. If they move eventually, they move. My life will go on and nothing will change. I just won't be into the whole NFL like I am now. You better go to a psychiatrist and get those whispers checked out.

[DetDannyWilliams]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Report: <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Buffalo?src=hash">#Buffalo</a> is expected to host Frozen Four in 2020. <a href="https://t.co/2bmkt7TuRx">https://t.co/2bmkt7TuRx</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/WKBW">@WKBW</a> <a href="https://t.co/xvvux5l4Qh">pic.twitter.com/xvvux5l4Qh</a></p>&mdash; Jeff Russo (@JeffRussoWKBW) <a href="https://twitter.com/JeffRussoWKBW/status/850146029282439168">April 7, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Skooby]

<iframe id="twitter-widget-0" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" allowtransparency="true" allowfullscreen="true" class="twitter-tweet twitter-tweet-rendered" data-tweet-id="850146029282439168" title="Twitter Tweet" style="position: static; visibility: visible; display: block; width: 500px; height: 501.265625px; padding: 0px; border: none; max-width: 100%; min-width: 220px; margin-top: 10px; margin-bottom: 10px;"></iframe>
<script async="" src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
That'll do it.
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[Goobylal]

To summarize, the Homers logic is based on only one thing -- HOPE.

As opposed to...they're not spending hundreds of millions of taxpayer's money, money they don't have, to build a new stadium, when the old one works fine for its purpose and will for years to come?

[SpikedLemonade]

As opposed to...they're not spending hundreds of millions of taxpayer's money, money they don't have, to build a new stadium, when the old one works fine for its purpose and will for years to come?

How about some honesty?

When you say "taxpayer's money" you mean your own personal money since you believe most of the population does not pay taxes and is sponging off you right?

[Goobylal]

How about some honesty?

When you say "taxpayer's money" you mean your own personal money since you believe most of the population does not pay taxes and is sponging off you right?

Nope. Don't live in NYS.

[Skooby]

How about some honesty?

When you say "taxpayer's money" you mean your own personal money since you believe most of the population does not pay taxes and is sponging off you right?
I'm not sure but if half of the people living around you are driving without any insurance or job, I'd say this is probably fairly accurate.

[Skooby]

Nope. Don't live in NYS.

Smartest thing said this past week.

[BertSquirtgum]

Smartest thing said this past week.
Great job bumping this pathetic attention whoring thread.

[stuckincincy]

Smartest thing said this past week.

Living in the Isle of Man is tops.

[kishoph]

Could we merge this with one of the Ralph Wilson is selling/moving the Bills threads ?

[Skooby]

We already have posters calling for Pegula to sell because he's obviously not helping the team's win.

[Goobylal]

We already have posters calling for Pegula to sell because he's obviously not helping the team's win.

Only the idiots.

[Skooby]

Only the idiots.

Hire new brains that understand sports management & have a background in it. Drilling holes for incalculable cash doesn't give you the ability to navigate professional sports.

Maybe you like seeing our teams suck because right now we are about the worst they've ever mutually been, even our BAnkruptcy time for the Sabres had a great squad. We have nothing now, seriously nothing.

[Goobylal]

Hire new brains that understand sports management & have a background in it. Drilling holes for incalculable cash doesn't give you the ability to navigate professional sports.

Maybe you like seeing our teams suck because right now we are about the worst they've ever mutually been, even our BAnkruptcy time for the Sabres had a great squad. We have nothing now, seriously nothing.

We have 2 teams in Buffalo. That's far from nothing. I'd rather have 2 sucky teams than none at all. If you disagree with that, you can either stop watching football and hockey altogether or go find other teams to root for. Whining like a ***** will get you nowhere.

Again, only an idiot would demand that Pegula sell the team because if he were to do that, the new owner(s) would surely move the team to a better market. Maybe Pegula will do that eventually. Who know? But for now they're here. Hopefully it stays that way until I die, but if it doesn't, like will go on and I'll probably stop watching football.

As for understanding management, look no further than the Cheaters. Without Brady, hell even with a 1st overall pick in Bledsoe, Belichick's record as a HC was dismal. The Bills have had numerous regimes since the SB years and they've all failed to get another franchise QB. Do that and things get better quick and make everyone look like geniuses.

[SpikedLemonade]

We have 2 teams in Buffalo. That's far from nothing. I'd rather have 2 sucky teams than none at all. If you disagree with that, you can either stop watching football and hockey altogether or go find other teams to root for. Whining like a ***** will get you nowhere.

Again, only an idiot would demand that Pegula sell the team because if he were to do that, the new owner(s) would surely move the team to a better market. Maybe Pegula will do that eventually. Who know? But for now they're here. Hopefully it stays that way until I die, but if it doesn't, like will go on and I'll probably stop watching football.

As for understanding management, look no further than the Cheaters. Without Brady, hell even with a 1st overall pick in Bledsoe, Belichick's record as a HC was dismal. The Bills have had numerous regimes since the SB years and they've all failed to get another franchise QB. Do that and things get better quick and make everyone look like geniuses.

Why is that?

[Skooby]

Why is that?
Because after the Pegula's making fools of themselves with the Sabres for the past 6 years there couldn't possibly be a better or more competent owner. Fans are stage 5 clinging in hopes of the teams getting better, while they get worse. Folks, it's ugly right now and the owner is leading the search for a new hockey management. The owner that knows how to drill wells as a background. See in their mind, they have the money so they know what they're doing. Talk about clueless and soon to be disinterested, that's when the problems start and end.

[SpikedLemonade]

In other words, the DP bought the Sabres and Bills as a charity case to the City of Buffalo.

[Goobylal]

Because after the Pegula's making fools of themselves with the Sabres for the past 6 years there couldn't possibly be a better or more competent owner. Fans are stage 5 clinging in hopes of the teams getting better, while they get worse. Folks, it's ugly right now and the owner is leading the search for a new hockey management. The owner that knows how to drill wells as a background. See in their mind, they have the money so they know what they're doing. Talk about clueless and soon to be disinterested, that's when the problems start and end.

I don't follow hockey closely enough to know where the problems are for the Sabres. What I do know is he fired Ruff and Regier (who had success under Golisano) and hired Ted Nolan, like most people thought he should do, and then hired a SC-winning coach in Bylsma. He also expanded the scouting department and spent lots of money on players and the facilities.


In other words, the DP bought the Sabres and Bills as a charity case to the City of Buffalo.

You could say that. And for as long as the team stays in Buffalo, I'll be grateful to them and Ralph Wilson.

[SpikedLemonade]

And for as long as the team stays in Buffalo, I'll be grateful to them and Ralph Wilson.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-YEYOMfXbw

[DetDannyWilliams]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Pegula Sports and Entertainment and Labatt USA will hold a press conference at 10am tomorrow regarding plans to develop 79 Perry Street. <a href="https://t.co/PLAVduqH8P">pic.twitter.com/PLAVduqH8P</a></p>&mdash; Pegula Sports &amp; Ent. (@PegulaSE) <a href="https://twitter.com/PegulaSE/status/856939708819152896">April 25, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Goobylal]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-YEYOMfXbw

Call me what you like, IDGAF. As long as my team stays in Buffalo, I'll fellate anyone that keeps them there.

[SpikedLemonade]

Call me what you like, IDGAF. As long as my team stays in Buffalo, I'll fellate anyone that keeps them there.

That should be on a Buffalo Proud t-shirt.

[Skooby]

That should be on a Buffalo Proud t-shirt.

Right next to a rainbow.

[stuckincincy]

Right next to a rainbow.

LOL!

[elroy16]

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Labatt USA to move operations to Pegula-owned building


http://buffalonews.com/2017/04/25/labatt-usa-move-cobblestone-district/




Don't be fooled Danny boy, it's all part of a grand conspiracy by the Pegulas. Get the people of Buffalo so comfortable with the idea that the Bills and Sabres are save by buying up property, creating partnerships, and building everything but a stadium and them BAM, sell it all and throw up a middle finger to Buffalo while riding off into the sunset. All so Kim can retire with an extra billion.


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[Skooby]

Labatt USA to move operations to Pegula-owned building


http://buffalonews.com/2017/04/25/labatt-usa-move-cobblestone-district/




Don't be fooled Danny boy, it's all part of a grand conspiracy by the Pegulas. Get the people of Buffalo so comfortable with the idea that the Bills and Sabres are save by buying up property, creating partnerships, and building everything but a stadium and them BAM, sell it all and throw up a middle finger to Buffalo while riding off into the sunset. All so Kim can retire with an extra billion.


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The main point you're missing is the Bills and Sabres are being severely mismanaged ongoing, without a full-blown new stadium for them it's a liquid situation. The Pegula's could sell the team incredibly quickly but you can't pack up a new stadium, it's an on the ground commitment. We need a grounding and stability that only a new stadium brings, make no mistakes about it.

P.S. Selling beer to a massive alcoholic base isn't a risky proposition, just about as much as getting a return on an NFL franchise.

[Goobylal]

That should be on a Buffalo Proud t-shirt.

Have some printed up. I'll be the first buyer.


Right next to a rainbow.

Carfeful, the PC police will be after you.

[Goobylal]

Labatt USA to move operations to Pegula-owned building


http://buffalonews.com/2017/04/25/labatt-usa-move-cobblestone-district/




Don't be fooled Danny boy, it's all part of a grand conspiracy by the Pegulas. Get the people of Buffalo so comfortable with the idea that the Bills and Sabres are save by buying up property, creating partnerships, and building everything but a stadium and them BAM, sell it all and throw up a middle finger to Buffalo while riding off into the sunset. All so Kim can retire with an extra billion.

A billion? No chance in hell. Even a couple hundred million is in question. Have you heard about the mass layoffs at ESPN today? Say goodbye to their $1.9B annual payout to the NFL come 2022 with no one even coming close to matching that gigantic overpayment (Fox is next highest at $1.1B, for reference).

[elroy16]

The main point you're missing is the Bills and Sabres are being severely mismanaged ongoing, without a full-blown new stadium for them it's a liquid situation. The Pegula's could sell the team incredibly quickly but you can't pack up a new stadium, it's an on the ground commitment. We need a grounding and stability that only a new stadium brings, make no mistakes about it.

P.S. Selling beer to a massive alcoholic base isn't a risky proposition, just about as much as getting a return on an NFL franchise.


Not really. They haven't been managed well, but severely mismanaged is quite the exaggeration. It's easier to argue the Sabres have been severely mismanaged, but it's clear they have talent, just a suspect system (no more Bylsma, hopefully a new coach fixes this) and a poor blue line. Feel free to disagree, but there's a reason they had the #1 powerplay. A severely mismanaged team wouldn't have the level of talent the Sabres do.



If they had any plans on selling, why get their fingers in so many different areas?

Would you be happier if they didn't buy or develop anything in the area, but sat around and promised to build a stadium ASAP?



The stability of the Bills is a rich owner who continues to grow roots in the area and is honest about the stadium. A new stadium isn't needed right now and neither the NFL or fans are pushing for one. I've been to FedEx, M&T Bank Stadium, and Heinz Field and none of these stadiums are significantly better than New Era Field. Maybe more and nicer bathrooms and food vendors, but I'd bet anything they are closer to what New Era Field is like than they are AT&T Stadium or what Mercedes Benz stadium is probably going to be like.

[Skooby]

Not really. They haven't been managed well, but severely mismanaged is quite the exaggeration. It's easier to argue the Sabres have been severely mismanaged, but it's clear they have talent, just a suspect system (no more Bylsma, hopefully a new coach fixes this) and a poor blue line. Feel free to disagree, but there's a reason they had the #1 powerplay. A severely mismanaged team wouldn't have the level of talent the Sabres do.



If they had any plans on selling, why get their fingers in so many different areas?

Would you be happier if they didn't buy or develop anything in the area, but sat around and promised to build a stadium ASAP?



The stability of the Bills is a rich owner who continues to grow roots in the area and is honest about the stadium. A new stadium isn't needed right now and neither the NFL or fans are pushing for one. I've been to FedEx, M&T Bank Stadium, and Heinz Field and none of these stadiums are significantly better than New Era Field. Maybe more and nicer bathrooms and food vendors, but I'd bet anything they are closer to what New Era Field is like than they are AT&T Stadium or what Mercedes Benz stadium is probably going to be like.

The roots of a new stadium and over a Billion and a half spent on the ground secures the team for several decades. The Rams are a prime example of what not having a new stadium can do & a grass is greener scenario, I know the owners are different but if there was a new stadium in St. Louis, they would of never left.

[elroy16]

The roots of a new stadium and over a Billion and a half spent on the ground secures the team for several decades. The Rams are a prime example of what not having a new stadium can do & a grass is greener scenario, I know the owners are different but if there was a new stadium in St. Louis, they would of never left.


Fair enough, I can't argue with any of that. I think it comes in due time, but that's just my opinion. We'll find out eventually.

[Skooby]

Somebody posted this and just like I mentioned it spot on.

Get ready Buffalo fans. Chapter 1 of the “Kroenke World of Sports Management”. Explain nothing, avoid everyone and if the minions are caught have them deny, deny, deny. You will be moving soon. Has McDermott every been involved in a relocating franchise?

[SpikedLemonade]

Somebody posted this and just like I mentioned it spot on.

Get ready Buffalo fans. Chapter 1 of the “Kroenke World of Sports Management”. Explain nothing, avoid everyone and if the minions are caught have them deny, deny, deny. You will be moving soon. Has McDermott every been involved in a relocating franchise?

That seemed pretty random.

[Goobylal]

Somebody posted this and just like I mentioned it spot on.

Get ready Buffalo fans. Chapter 1 of the “Kroenke World of Sports Management”. Explain nothing, avoid everyone and if the minions are caught have them deny, deny, deny. You will be moving soon. Has McDermott every been involved in a relocating franchise?

Yep, that's proof right there. Because if it's on the internet, it has to be true.

Sounds like a disgruntled Rams fan hoping it also happens to another team. The difference is, outside of owning NFL teams, they're nothing alike.

[BertSquirtgum]

Somebody posted this and just like I mentioned it spot on.

Get ready Buffalo fans. Chapter 1 of the “Kroenke World of Sports Management”. Explain nothing, avoid everyone and if the minions are caught have them deny, deny, deny. You will be moving soon. Has McDermott every been involved in a relocating franchise?
You are a ****ing babbling idiot. Get the **** out of here.

[feldspar]

Just think "The Big Bang Theory."

That is all...

[Goobylal]

Just think "The Big Bang Theory."

That is all...

To be fair, most of the guys on the show are White...

But yeah, ouch. Especially considering the trade was worked out a week before the draft.

[feldspar]

To be fair, most of the guys on the show are White....

Lol, took me a second...