The new turf at Ralph Wilson Stadium

[northernbillfan]

Will be used for the first time in a game setting.

Do you think it will be better for teams to play on this new turf? I hear it's more forgiving thatn the old artificial turf, and actually acts like grass.

[Ð]

I heard a good quote @ turf on one of the sports highlights shows today...

"Turf is like an ugly girlfriend...you can dress her up, put makeup on her, etc, but wheen it comes down to playing, she's still ugly."

[Pride]

ouch...

Fact is, grass wont work in B-lo.

So, I feel this is the best option for a buffalo Stadium.

[LtBillsFan66]

Originally posted by Pride
ouch...

Fact is, grass wont work in B-lo.

So, I feel this is the best option for a buffalo Stadium.

Why not? They have real grass in Chicago and Green Bay.

[Ð]

They got a great deal to be the first to install this new type of turf in the NFL...an offer they couldn't refuse.

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by billsfanone


Why not? They have real grass in Chicago and Green Bay.

I'll take a qtr. please. :D

[LtBillsFan66]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
I'll take a qtr. please. :D

Huh?

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by billsfanone


Huh?

Your were talking about doobies, weren't you?

[LtBillsFan66]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
Your were talking about doobies, weren't you?

lol

[Pride]

Originally posted by billsfanone
Why not? They have real grass in Chicago and Green Bay.

Yeah, and by end of nov, and all december, it is a solid dirt field... and is as hard as concrete. People get hurt on it all the time late in the year.

Walk outside in the middle of december.... (if you live in b-lo) and jump shoulder first into the ground... see if you wanna play on it in december... or be tackled by a 300 lb lineman.

It is amazing favre has played so long, under those conditions.

[LtBillsFan66]

Originally posted by Pride
Yeah, and by end of nov, and all december, it is a solid dirt field... and is as hard as concrete. People get hurt on it all the time late in the year.

Walk outside in the middle of december.... (if you live in b-lo) and jump shoulder first into the ground... see if you wanna play on it in december... or be tackled by a 300 lb lineman.

It is amazing favre has played so long, under those conditions.


I have. I played on grass and on turf. I never played on the new stuff., but from what I hear, it isn't really much better.

[northernbillfan]

Frozen tundra is frozen tundra, no matter what the composition. Hit the turf or sod, or this new fangled field and it still hurts if it's frozen.

[Jan Reimers]

It'll be much better than the old stuff, which was basically indoor/outdoor carpeting over asphalt. I can't wait to see it Saturday night.

[Dozerdog]

Originally posted by Ð
I heard a good quote @ turf on one of the sports highlights shows today...

"Turf is like an ugly girlfriend...you can dress her up, put makeup on her, etc, but wheen it comes down to playing, she's still ugly."

I dated a girl like that once- flat too....


Originally posted by Pride
Yeah, and by end of nov, and all december, it is a solid dirt field... and is as hard as concrete. People get hurt on it all the time late in the year.

Walk outside in the middle of december.... (if you live in b-lo) and jump shoulder first into the ground... see if you wanna play on it in december... or be tackled by a 300 lb lineman.

It is amazing favre has played so long, under those conditions.


Green Bay's turf hasn't been frozen for a football game since the Ice Bowl- and only then because the pipes below the grass field broke down.

They have been using a series of steam pipes under their turf
for close to 50 years now.

It does not solve the age old riddle though- frozen or not- grass goes dormant in November/December and does not regenerate.

The meadowlands replaces it's grass each game- they have giant "trays" of grass that get installed like a parquey basketball floor- and it gets rotated in and out to a green house with other trays of grass. It's slightly better than sod because sod needs mor ethan a week to properly adhere to the ground (grow roots)

[Pride]

:nerd:

[mypoorfriendme]

i have actually played on the field turf that is in the falcons stadium (the stuff that has the tiny rubber shards under the thing pastic grass blades) and i can say it is very forgiving. you can push your thumb like 2 inches under the surface. plus it looks really nice. the only negative i thought was you can get burned from the rubber and the tiny rubber peices in wounds doesnt feel very good. and on sportscenter, sean alexander said field turf is an 8 and astro turf would be a -3....but i have no clue about the stuff the bills have now

[The_Philster]

Originally posted by mypoorfriendme
i have actually played on the field turf that is in the falcons stadium (the stuff that has the tiny rubber shards under the thing pastic grass blades) and i can say it is very forgiving. you can push your thumb like 2 inches under the surface. plus it looks really nice. the only negative i thought was you can get burned from the rubber and the tiny rubber peices in wounds doesnt feel very good. and on sportscenter, sean alexander said field turf is an 8 and astro turf would be a -3....but i have no clue about the stuff the bills have now

If I remember correctly, that's the same substance.

[BillsOwnAll]

its not turf its "fake grass" :)

[mush69]

They installed a surface just like at the new stadium For Cortland state 2 years ago. It is really nice to play on and feels nothing like turf. All the Cortland State players I have talked think it a fabulous surface!

The only people I can think of that don't like this surface is the grounds crew. When they installed it they didn't put in the right drainage and the field actully bubbled up it had so much water underneath it. They have had to tear up the field 2 times in order to correct it. I don't see them having this problem in Buffalo because NY state had nothing to do with the installation. The state actually cheesed out on some of the funding for the field and they cut cost on the drainage portion of the budget.

[LtBillsFan66]

On outside the lines, it was unanimous that players prefer real grass.

It's a shame that the NFL cares more about the way the field looks rather than the way it plays and the way it feels for the players.

They had a bit about Giants Stadium and how they had to resod twice a week. Frigging grow the grass! My the end of the season, who cares if grass is worn out a little.

Even the "grass expert" brought on said that the way they try to quickly plant the grass is all wrong.

[lordofgun]

The players should shut their freaking mouths. :mad:

[LtBillsFan66]

The outside the lines segment was about "Field Turf." I think we have "AstroPlay".

Anyone know the difference?

Philly had installed a Field Turf immitation in their old stadium and it was worse than astroturf.

[lordofgun]

I don't think there's much of a difference.

[LtBillsFan66]

Originally posted by lordofgun
I don't think there's much of a difference.

What brings you to that assessment?

[Billsouth]

why cant we have grass? didnt the old stadium have grass?

[ryven]

I think they would end up replacing the grass every season
because off the climates and all.

[LtBillsFan66]

Originally posted by ryven
I think they would end up replacing the grass every season
because off the climates and all.


From what the "turf expert" said, if grown right, they shouldn't have to. They would for looks only, which I think is pathetic.

[Earthquake Enyart]

Originally posted by Billsouth
why cant we have grass? didnt the old stadium have grass?

:abe: mmmmmmmmmmmm The Rockpile mmmmmmmmmmmmm

[IHateTheDullphins]

the Astroplay is the next best thing than actual grass, and frankly it was the best choice. fact- grass won't work in b-lo. I'm gonna carpet my house in this stuff.

[LtBillsFan66]

Originally posted by IHateTheDullphins
the Astroplay is the next best thing than actual grass, and frankly it was the best choice. fact- grass won't work in b-lo. I'm gonna carpet my house in this stuff.


Is Astroplay any good?

All the rave reviews (which still not as good as natural grass) are for FieldTurf, which is a different product.

[IHateTheDullphins]

Originally posted by billsfanone



Is Astroplay any good?

All the rave reviews (which still not as good as natural grass) are for FieldTurf, which is a different product.



It's been over a decade, but Bill Munson can't squeeze the scene out of his brain.

It's one that nearly any Buffalo Bills fan whose devotion dates back to the early 1980s remembers the game when Don Beebe, the Bills' tough and speedy wide receiver, was whacked so hard that his body twisted 180 degrees in the air and plunged headfirst into the turf.

It was football's version of a wrestling move called the piledriver, minus any of the scripting and protection that aids performers inside the ropes.

Knowing that no one can control the sometimes-violent nature of football itself, Munson has always been willing to find other ways to protect players.

"That's extremely important," he says. "These guys get flipped over. I still have a picture in my mind of Don Beebe falling vertically about five feet and landing on his head."

As the Bills' vice president of stadium operations, Munson can do something about that. It's one of the reasons that he and director of Stadium Operations Joe Frandina spent parts of the last two years touring the country to come up with the best possible field surface for the Buffalo Bills.

They found one - it's called AstroPlay - and it was completed this week.

Now, chances are good that you've already heard about AstroPlay and you are maybe wondering why this is a big deal?

Artificial grass was, well, fake grass - nothing more. Some fans probably heard that the team had settled on installing AstroPlay inside Ralph Wilson Stadium and didn't give it much thought.

But you have to feel it only one time to know this is something special.

During a recent meeting inside the team's training center at One Bills Drive, the media had the opportunity to run their fingers through an AstroPlay sample that is about the size of a cafeteria tray. The first thing that stirkes you is how soft this new stuff feels to touch.

If fans can detect the difference between AstroPlay (made of two-inch synthetic blades that look and feel like real grass) and AstroTurf (which is made of blades that are similar in length to those on a putting green), you know the players can tell.

"No more rug burns - that's the big excitement," safety Pierson Prioleau told the media last month. "You go out there and play hard and forget about all the rug burns."

Let's put this in perspective: Can steely-nerved NFL players deal with the rug burns caused by brushing bare skin across AstroTurf?

Of course. All sources indicate that a rug burn is truly painful, but the players can cope. So in that way, AstroPlay is more of a comfort.

But the safety factor stretches further. Surrounding AstroPlay's synthetic blades are 300,000 pounds of rubber pellets, called "infill." Together with a pad made of crushed tires and gravel, it comprised a bouncy cushion that feels good to the legs and may help lessen the severity of injuries that afflict players who takes hits like Beebe did.

"I think players like playing on grass better for the reason of feel," said Beebe, who has worked on AstroPlay while training the Chicago Bears through his business, House of Speed. "It is easier on your body and over a long season it makes a difference."

The Bills hope that AstroPlay will not only lessen injuries, but lengthen careers.

"We feel that with the way the AstroPlay is laid out, it is going to help us," Munson said.

After visiting various pro, college and youth-level fields in 10 - 15 cities, Munson and Frandina settled on AstroPlay for a variety of reasons. One of the biggest was the field's "G-max" rating, which measures the hardness of a ground surface based on vertical-drop tests.


A measurement of zero is extremely soft; a measurement of 200 is extremely hard. Natural grass is an 85, and AstroPlay is close, "around an 85 to a 95," Munson says.

"That's very important for us to consider," he adds. "The AstroPlay people were able to give us a test and result on that."

The Bills were also happy with the durability of AstroPlay. After having it installed last summer on 50 yards of the team's outdoor practice facility, the team found that the surface was still soft and playable even in the harshest winter weather.

"The rubber infill doesn't freeze together," says Rich Splean, a supervisor from SRI Sports, the Texas company that manufactures and installs AstroPlay, AstroTurf, and other field-surface products.

Splean has overseen a crew of eight workers who have spent the last month installing AstroPlay inside Ralph Wilson Stadium. They've worked 10 hours a day, seven days a week, often battling the rainy weather that's pelted Buffalo this spring.

When the rain stops, the work begins - "The field drains wonderfully," Splean says - and the turf will be ready for the Bills' open practice this Friday.

Though you probably won't notice, the players will actually sprint a split-second slower. Beebe said the rubbery cushion underneath AstroPlay isn't as fast as AstroTurf - but in the end, it all equalizes.

"There is nothing that will compare to Astroturf, but it is all relative to everyone playing on the field anyway," he said. "But it does feel faster than regular grass though."

Like many teams, the Bills have played on AstroTurf for decades. In fact, it's the only surface the team has had since Ralph Wilson Stadium opened in 1973.

In the northeast, that makes sense. But technology has affected everything - even turf.

"The only reason (teams) went to turf in the first place was maintenance," Beebe said. "Weather didn't affect turf as much. Now with this new grass turf they feel they get the best of both worlds."

Which is why Munson will so proud when the AstroPlay sees its first plays this Friday.

"We're extremely excited about it, and we feel it's the best surface for the Buffalo Bills," Munson says. "We've done so much research and feel so confident that it will add to the life of our players' careers and just the same time, add to the game day experience for our fans."

[The_Philster]

Originally posted by billsfanone
The outside the lines segment was about "Field Turf." I think we have "AstroPlay".

Anyone know the difference?

Philly had installed a Field Turf immitation in their old stadium and it was worse than astroturf.

The big problem with that was the seams. Those cookie cutter stadiums had bad surfaces no matter what was put down.

[LtBillsFan66]

Good article IHateTheDullphins.

What is a cookie cutter stadium phil?

[The_Philster]

Originally posted by billsfanone
Good article IHateTheDullphins.

What is a cookie cutter stadium phil?

Those stadiums that are dual-use stadiums for both baseball and football with some kind of artificial turf. Most of the major problems with the Vet, 3 Rivers, and Riverfront were because of the seams along the basepaths not being properly secured. The Vet was always the worst.

[Nighthawk]

Wow, billsfanone has all the answers, but doesn't know what a "cookie cutter stadium" is? Hmmm, the wonders of life. :-)

[LtBillsFan66]

Originally posted by Nighthawk
Wow, billsfanone has all the answers, but doesn't know what a "cookie cutter stadium" is? Hmmm, the wonders of life. :-)

I have all the answers? I asked a lot.