Beane End of the Season Presser

[ghz in pittsburgh]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tvd94omhc1c

"Both lines were dominated" is noted against Cinci.

"Burrows is on his rookie deal; Chase is on his rookie deal. We are paying Diggs a hefty number; we are paying Josh a hefty number" is also mentioned.

"We are not going to go all in on one year", "I don't want to be in situation like 100 million over the cap in two years like some teams have to deal with."

I think OBD knows their pushing all-the-chips-to-the-middle years are over. It will be in the mode of drafting well, finding diamonds in low-cost FAs, hoping one of those years you hit one or two blue chips having career years to get them over the top.

This team is NOT going to have talent overwhelming teams like the Chiefs and the Bengals. The more likely scenario is that they peak at the right time like 2021 to get on a run and over those teams. Beane said at the beginning of the presser what we have seen: towards the end of the season, this team was barely finding a way to get by; we were not hitting on any (let alone on all) cylinders for offense and defense.

[sahlensguy]

Yawn

[Forward_Lateral]

They've never "pushed all of their chips to the middle".

[Novacane]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tvd94omhc1c

"Both lines were dominated" is noted against Cinci.

"Burrows is on his rookie deal; Chase is on his rookie deal. We are paying Diggs a hefty number; we are paying Josh a hefty number" is also mentioned.

"We are not going to go all in on one year", "I don't want to be in situation like 100 million over the cap in two years like some teams have to deal with."

I think OBD knows their pushing all-the-chips-to-the-middle years are over. It will be in the mode of drafting well, finding diamonds in low-cost FAs, hoping one of those years you hit one or two blue chips having career years to get them over the top.

This team is NOT going to have talent overwhelming teams like the Chiefs and the Bengals. The more likely scenario is that they peak at the right time like 2021 to get on a run and over those teams. Beane said at the beginning of the presser what we have seen: towards the end of the season, this team was barely finding a way to get by; we were not hitting on any (let alone on all) cylinders for offense and defense.



So Cinci built a better team with less money!

[sahlensguy]

So Cinci built a better team with less money!

And less time/shots at the draft than Beane.

[Novacane]

Hitting on Josh Allen has covered up a lot of poor drafting. I still give him credit for hitting on a QB that lots of people thought would bust. Burrow was a no brainer for Cinci but after QB they've obviously drafted better. Beane can't rest on Josh anymore.

[sahlensguy]

Hitting on Josh Allen has covered up a lot of poor drafting. I still give him credit for hitting on a QB that lots of people thought would bust. Burrow was a no brainer for Cinci but after QB they've obviously drafted better. Beane can't rest on Josh anymore.

Not just poor drafting and missing on who he picked, but Beane's overall drafting strategy of not building around Josh has been a failure.

[OpIv37]

So Cinci built a better team with less money!

I read it pretty much the same way: "They have a better team and more cap space, so don't expect us to be able to catch them."

[Forward_Lateral]

I read it pretty much the same way: "They have a better team and more cap space, so don't expect us to be able to catch them."
NO.

They have 2 franchise players still on rookie contracts. Burrow is going to get ultra paid this offseason or the next. Chase will be right behind him. That's what he's saying.

The only reason they were even in any position to get both of those guys is because they went 2-14 and 4-11-1.

You would have an absolute bird if the Bills got 6 wins in the next 2 seasons.

[OpIv37]

NO.

They have 2 franchise players still on rookie contracts. Burrow is going to get ultra paid this offseason or the next. Chase will be right behind him. That's what he's saying.

The only reason they were even in any position to get both of those guys is because they went 2-14 and 4-11-1.

You would have an absolute bird if the Bills got 6 wins in the next 2 seasons.


Their 2 franchise players are cheap (at least for now). Our two franchise players are expensive. Translation: at least for now, they have more cap space to put talent around those franchise guys than we do. That's just basic math. And your assumption of my reaction to a hypothetical event has nothing to do with it.

[Forward_Lateral]

Their 2 franchise players are cheap (at least for now). Our two franchise players are expensive. Translation: at least for now, they have more cap space to put talent around those franchise guys than we do. That's just basic math. And your assumption of my reaction to a hypothetical event has nothing to do with it.
Of course it's basic math. Beane was pointing out that he doesn't want the Bills to SUCK BAD ENOUGH to get a top pick. He was commenting on how the Bengals were A.) able to rebuild and B.) hit the bullseye twice.

[sahlensguy]

"I don't want to suck bad enough to have to get Ja'Marr Chase"

Well Beane...you may have come close if you didn't luck out on drafting Josh Allen.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

"I don't want to suck bad enough to have to get Ja'Marr Chase"

Well Beane...you may have come close if you didn't luck out on drafting Josh Allen.

Odell

[BuffaloBlitz83]

Jordan Addison, WR

[TacklingDummy]

The Bills remind me of Green Bay with Rodgers. GB was lucky enough to get 1 though.

[Woodman]

The Bengals had the 1st and 5th overall picks I sure hope they ****ing hit.

That's to their advantage for now of course.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

"They (Cinci) had some lean years ... and they got Burrows #1 over all and Chase pretty high ..."

Hindsight is 20-20. And it's true I'm not saying it's all Beane's fault. 2017 to 2018 FA movement, trades, and draft are brilliant for McDermott/Beane. The Bills had one lean year after getting Josh and they got Ed Oliver (what if they had gotten Jeffrey Simmons or Christian Wilkins). Then if they had drafted Jefferson instead of trading for Diggs, they might have a bigger window because you don't have to account for Diggs cap for 14+ to 25 million in the first 5 years.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

Bottom line super bowl winners typically have a few HOF performers on their team. The Bills have Josh, maybe a half (Miller in his twilight career). Until they draft one big timer, we might be in this also-run for awhile.

[Historian]

Yea, I mean, come on let's not go off the deep end.

It's still the Bengals, and they're still owned by Mike Brown.

Remember fraidy cat?

Won't be long before he's back.

http://www.mikebrownsucks.com/images/fraidycat_header_01.gif

http://www.mikebrownsucks.com/

[notacon]

So Cinci built a better team with less money!

THAT is what you get from his presser????

Uhhhhhh.....no.

I talked about this subject yesterday, before I read abuot what he said. Seems like Beane and I are thinking the same way.

Here is what I said....


Yeah....they got them (Burrow and Chase that Lexwhat mentioned in this post (http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?p=4999955#post4999955)) because they were worst team in the NFL n 2019....dead last with a dismal 2-14 record, and 4th worst team in the NFL in 2020, with another dismal record of 4-11-1.

We like to bemoan how “terrible” the Bills were during the drought, but they were NOT even close to that bad as Cincy was those two seasons.

In FACT, the last time the Bills had such a dismal multi-year record was 1984 to 1986. 2-14, 2-14 & 4-12.

Of course that fueled their rise to a 4-time AFC Champion with advantageous draft picks.

And today, having high draft picks is even more critical than it was in the 80’s, because of the cap, and virtually dictated rookie contracts depending on draft placement and playoff position. There are NO holdouts of draft picks anymore.

...snip....

It takes more skill to field a perennial contender after the rookie contracts are over, especially for a franchise QB, but is not even close to impossible (no matter that Opi says), and we are about to find out if Beane has that skill.

I suspect he does, and then some.


This is what Beane said (https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/01/25/brandon-beane-bengals-have-advantage-of-joe-burrow-and-jamarr-chase-on-rookie-contracts/)....




Bills General Manager Brandon Beane says one of the reasons it’s tough to keep pace with the Bengals is that Cincinnati has its best players on inexpensive rookie contracts, while Buffalo does not.

<o:p></o:p>
“They right now are on the advantage of a rookie quarterback contract,” Beane said of Joe Burrow (https://www.nbcsportsedge.com/football/nfl/player/57910/joe-burrow). “They had some lean years, and without getting too much into their build, I don’t want to suck bad enough to have to get Ja’Marr Chase. He’s a heck of a talent, I’d love to have him, but you got to go through some lean years to do that. They were able to get Burrow No. 1 and Chase [No. 5] and those guys are on their rookie deals. We’re paying Stefon Diggs (https://www.nbcsportsedge.com/football/nfl/player/9728/stefon-diggs) a pretty hefty number. We’re paying Josh Allen a pretty hefty number. So there is the constraints of the cap. They have a really good team and they’ve got some good young players. We’re gonna try to get as many players as we can through the draft and through free agency, but again, our cap situation is a little different.”<o:p></o:p>

No, it’s not a case of "Cinci built a better team with less money”, but more accurately Cincy built a good team because they SUCKED so badly, got extremely high draft pick positions, and now have these stars on NFLPA/NFLCBA imposed below market value for players on rookie contracts.

The Bengals had the #1 overall pick in 2020 (Joe Burrow, 1st pick 1st round, Tee Higgins, 1st pick, 2nd round, Logan Wilson, 1st pick, 3rd round) and the #5 pick in 2021 (Ja’Marr Chase 5th pick 1st round) because they sucked so badly.

The last time the Buffalo Bills had a draft pick in the top 5 (without trading up) was 2011, Marcell Darius, 3rd pick, round #1.

The last time the Buffalo Bills had the #1 overall pick was 1985, Bruce Smith.


The only reason the Bills were able to draft Josh Allen with the #7 pick is that they had to wheel and deal for TWO SEASONS to get into that position.

The NFL is dedicated to lifting up teams that suck, and holding down teams that are good. And the cap makes it very difficult to maintain consistent Super Bowl winning (or even getting there) teams.


Burrow’s cap number is $11.5M for 2023. When they pick up his fifth year option, it will be around only $30M for 2024. Ja'Marr Chase’s cap number for 2023 is only $8M...9.8M for 2024. His fifth year option number will probably be in the mid-teens for 2025.


Burrow AND Chase cap number for 2023....combined....$19.9M

Josh Allen & Diggs cap number for 2023....combined....$59.9M....THREE TIMES MORE!!!

That’s the reality of the NFL today.

[Forward_Lateral]

Yea, I mean, come on let's not go off the deep end.

It's still the Bengals, and they're still owned by Mike Brown.

Remember fraidy cat?

Won't be long before he's back.

http://www.mikebrownsucks.com/images/fraidycat_header_01.gif

http://www.mikebrownsucks.com/
I forget who told the story, but it was an ex Bengal on someone's podcast saying how the Bengals were so cheap that they had Gatorate/Water machines in the locker room that players had to pay for if they wanted to drink anything. I also remember something about used jocks. All kinds of stories about Brown being the cheapest a-hole walking.

[notacon]

"I don't want to suck bad enough to have to get Ja'Marr Chase"

Well Beane...you may have come close if you didn't luck out on drafting Josh Allen.

Jesus. There was no “luck” in drafting Josh Allen....that was all skill by Brandon Beane.

There was no “luck” in Cincy being able to draft Joe Burrow. That was a no brainer. Any 13 year old would have made that pick.

They just had to SUCK TO HIGH HEAVEN. Something the Buffalo Bills have not SUCKED so badly to get the #1 pick in THIRTY SEVEN YEARS.....1985.

[Joe Fo Sho]

They've never "pushed all of their chips to the middle".

I don't know... In the months leading up to the 2009 season, the Bills extended Dick Jauron, Lee Evans, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Terrence McGee and signed Terrell Owens.

If that's not all in then I don't know what is..

[Mace]

My biggest, and atm, only gripe with Beane is how he made a point of saying this year was intended to protect Josh Allen, and then he went out and collected a bunch of discards to do it, again. This has been pattern for 6 years, look, if there is something wrong with your OL college scouting, address it already, because your pro personnel scouting isn't doing any better.

[Woodman]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/qN4ooNx77u0" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Mace]

I don't know... In the months leading up to the 2009 season, the Bills extended Dick Jauron, Lee Evans, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Terrence McGee and signed Terrell Owens.

If that's not all in then I don't know what is..

Well....ah....."Dick Jauron". It starts and ends there. Bad bet.

[TacklingDummy]

Jesus. There was no “luck” in drafting Josh Allen....that was all skill by Brandon Beane.

There was no “luck” in Cincy being able to draft Joe Burrow. That was a no brainer. Any 13 year old would have made that pick.

They just had to SUCK TO HIGH HEAVEN. Something the Buffalo Bills have not SUCKED so badly to get the #1 pick in THIRTY SEVEN YEARS.....1985.

The Bills weren't even good at sucking.

[notacon]

I forget who told the story, but it was an ex Bengal on someone's podcast saying how the Bengals were so cheap that they had Gatorate/Water machines in the locker room that players had to pay for if they wanted to drink anything. I also remember something about used jocks. All kinds of stories about Brown being the cheapest a-hole walking.

Reminds me of Ralph Wilson. Who let the first three years of Jim Kelly’s career go to waste in the USFL because he refused to pay him (no NFLPA/NFL CBA to force him to pony up)

Wilson ran the team with a bean counter in control. The counting of the beans was WAY more important than fielding a consistent contender. Bill Polian was fired because of a power struggle between him and the bean counter from Detroit, who was NOT a football man.

The bean counter won.

The Bengals are lucky that today, it’s hard to be a cheapskate when rookie contracts are literally forced on the team via draft and player position and the CBA.

[Forward_Lateral]

The Bills weren't even good at sucking.
So true.

They were good at going 6-10 or 7-9 and winning just enough to both give us fans "hope for next season" and ruin their draft position, always ending up in the middle of the first round and then missing on about 19 first round picks in a row

[Joe Fo Sho]

Well....ah....."Dick Jauron". It starts and ends there. Bad bet.

https://cmates.blob.core.windows.net/cmmaterial/21_4_28_chswm.jpeg

[Lexwhat]

For decades, the Bengals were the laughingstock of the league (yes, the Bills were right there too), and probably have the worst owner in the NFL (Mike Brown). They have never won a Super Bowl.

Yes, we had some horrible head coaches - but imagine having Marvin Lewis as your head coach for over 15 years... I guess time will tell if we have the white Marvin Lewis as our HC.

After 3 decades the Bengals finally hit on the right players. Good for them. The Bills should focus on their own issues and how to fix them.

[notacon]

Well....ah....."Dick Jauron". It starts and ends there. Bad bet.

Those were the good times.

Joe Collier....1966 to 1968....he was fired two games into the 1968 season (0-2), and replaced by Bills personnel director as interim HC....Harvey....

Harvey Johnson....TWICE first in 1968 (1-10-1) (to replace Joe Collier) and then brought back in 1971 (1-13) after.....

John Rauch (the brilliant coach that wanted to use OJ Simpson as a “decoy” instead of having him run the ball)...1969 (4-10) and 1970 (3-10-1). He was not fired after those two **** season....he resigned on July 20, 1971 (the day before training camp opened) after a “heated discussion" with Wilson because Rauch complained, in public, about Wilson trading Ron McDole and cutting Paul Maguire (without telling Rauch).


Harvey gets his second stint for 1971 season (1-13). “It was speculated (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvey_Johnson_(coach)) that Johnson’s love of thoroughbred horse racing, a passion he shared with owner Ralph Wilson, allowed him to stay on the Bills payroll despite his poor performance in coaching"

Jim Ringo - 1976 - replacing Lou Saban who resigned after 5 games in....guess what....a disagreement with Ralph Wilson. He proceeded to end the 1976 season 0-9. 1977 he “led” the team to a 3-11 record.

Kay Stephenson - 1983 (8-8) 1984 (2-14) Fired after going 0-4 to start 1985 season....replaced by....

Hank Bullough - 1985 & 1986. Named HC in October of 1985 after Kay was fired. Hank went 2-10 after taking over from Stephenson, and 2-7 in 1986 before being fired and replaced by Marv Levy.

All of those slugs (expect Levy) make Dick Jauron look brilliant. :rolleyes:

[YardRat]

I'm not being critical of the move because I like Diggs, but if Beane didn't pull the trigger on the trade he'd have Jefferson on his cheaper rookie deal still. So, he pretty much made that bed himself.

[sahlensguy]

I'm not being critical of the move because I like Diggs, but if Beane didn't pull the trigger on the trade he'd have Jefferson on his cheaper rookie deal still. So, he pretty much made that bed himself.

The Diggs trade brought legitimacy to this offense which benefited Allen's development greatly. It was the right trade at the time.

Diggs' extension? Now that's another story.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

I'm not being critical of the move because I like Diggs, but if Beane didn't pull the trigger on the trade he'd have Jefferson on his cheaper rookie deal still. So, he pretty much made that bed himself.

Are you certain he takes Jefferson as aiyuk and higgins were the next 2 taken

[YardRat]

The Diggs trade brought legitimacy to this offense which benefited Allen's development greatly. It was the right trade at the time.

Diggs' extension? Now that's another story.


Are you certain he takes Jefferson as aiyuk and higgins were the next 2 taken

I'm not criticizing the trade, just pointing out Beane could have a stud receiver with a rookie contract on the roster right now if he had done things differently so he really can't use "yeah, but" as an excuse.

[Historian]

I think the argument is silly.

I'm not giving back all the wins achieved thanks to Digg's skills, not to mention all the thrilling catches, just because he costs more than the guy from Cinci.

I like the team we have, but Davis has not panned out, so my first pick would be the best WR on the board at 27.

[Forward_Lateral]

I think the argument is silly.

I'm not giving back all the wins achieved thanks to Digg's skills, not to mention all the thrilling catches, just because he costs more than the guy from Cinci.

I like the team we have, but Davis has not panned out, so my first pick would be the best WR on the board at 27.
I agree, except for the draft a WR in the first part.

IF there's one that they can't pass up on, then I will be fine with it. If they just draft one for the sake of drafting one, I won't be.

[Jeff1220]

It's too difficult to compare things with hindsight. As for Diggs vs. Jefferson, does a rookie (Jefferson) come in an help Josh's development, or does sugar-high Josh stunt Jefferson's development? As it was, Josh had a vet WR in Diggs to help him and Jefferson had a vet QB in Cousins to help his.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

Allen Lazard is a perfect slot wr. If Rodgers moves on... I can see a GB rebuild and not paying a slot wr

[ghz in pittsburgh]

It's too difficult to compare things with hindsight. As for Diggs vs. Jefferson, does a rookie (Jefferson) come in an help Josh's development, or does sugar-high Josh stunt Jefferson's development? As it was, Josh had a vet WR in Diggs to help him and Jefferson had a vet QB in Cousins to help his.
I've seen it too many times. QB makes WR, not other way around. But there are stud WRs wherever they go, like Randy Moss.

I pointed out that John Brown, Cole Beasley, Diggs all had their best year with Josh. That's enough evidence for me. If the Bills didn't trade for Diggs but got Jefferson instead, I'd imagine Josh would still be where he is today. I'd argue Jefferson would be an even bigger star than he's today. And I firmly believe that is how the Bills will get their next big star WR in Josh's career here.

I don't quite blame Beane on this one because no one, even the Vikings, envisioned Jefferson to be where he is today at the time. There is luck. I hope our luck is not all used up in the draft for Allen.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

I've seen it too many times. QB makes WR, not other way around. But there are stud WRs wherever they go, like Randy Moss.

I pointed out that John Brown, Cole Beasley, Diggs all had their best year with Josh. That's enough evidence for me. If the Bills didn't trade for Diggs but got Jefferson instead, I'd imagine Josh would still be where he is today. I'd argue Jefferson would be an even bigger star than he's today. And I firmly believe that is how the Bills will get their next big star WR in Josh's career here.

I don't quite blame Beane on this one because no one, even the Vikings, envisioned Jefferson to be where he is today at the time. There is luck. I hope our luck is not all used up in the draft for Allen.

That is true I didn't think about that. All the receivers improved here

[Canadian'eh!]

Soooooo. We are going to lose guys, can’t sign high end players and keep the same staff too?

awesome. Glad we peaked in a loss to KC in a divisional game.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

Soooooo. We are going to lose guys, can’t sign high end players and keep the same staff too?

awesome. Glad we peaked in a loss to KC in a divisional game.

Hey At least both of these teams will lose to the Eagles. Great D, Great run game, and bad ass O Line.

[notacon]

I'm not being critical of the move because I like Diggs, but if Beane didn't pull the trigger on the trade he'd have Jefferson on his cheaper rookie deal still. So, he pretty much made that bed himself.

I cannot fault Beane for that trade.


Diggs was (and still is) a known entity. He has not disappointed whatsoever.

Jefferson, like every first round (and just about every draft pick) was NOT a sure thing. We have seen this year after year after year. First round busts are common.

FOUR WR’s were selected before Jefferson...

#12 - Henry Ruggs
#15 - Jerry Jeudy
#17 - CeeDee Lamb
#21 - Jalen Reagor

None of those are better than either Diggs or Jefferson.

Beane made the right move. It transformed the Bills offense, and Josh Allen, from below average to one of the best offenses in the NFL.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

Beane made the right move.

That is going too far. I understand his thinking, thus not faulting him. But you can't say it is the right move, because clearly, drafting Jefferson, you would have a cheaper and better WR than Diggs while still have the additional draft picks you gave up in the trade.

If they had done the home work on Jefferson to the level of evaluating Josh and convinced that he can be a now-looking HOF level player, things would be very different. Josh was drafted 7th because not many was buying into what he can become like Beane, McDermott believed.

[notacon]

That is going too far. I understand his thinking, thus not faulting him. But you can't say it is the right move, because clearly, drafting Jefferson, you would have a cheaper and better WR than Diggs while still have the additional draft picks you gave up in the trade.

If they had done the home work on Jefferson to the level of evaluating Josh and convinced that he can be a now-looking HOF level player, things would be very different. Josh was drafted 7th because not many was buying into what he can become like Beane, McDermott believed.


Hindsight is 20/20.

There was ZERO guarantee that Jefferson would become what he did.

Four WR’s being drafted ahead of him proves that fact.

[sahlensguy]

Hindsight is 20/20.

There was ZERO guarantee that Jefferson would become what he did.

Four WR’s being drafted ahead of him proves that fact.

Would have been nice to just draft the wr they liked and spent the Diggs' money on a FA. I'll take the 2 for 1 anyday.

[notacon]

Would have been nice to just draft the wr they liked and spent the Diggs' money on a FA. I'll take the 2 for 1 anyday.

Nope.