Things I didn't know about Gilbride [Archive] - BillsZone.com

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socalfan

11-02-2003, 05:51 PM

In the Bflo Evening news story, is the most condemning write up of Gilbride to date. The statistics would even wow Wys.

Gilbride Statistics (http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20031102/2012140.asp)

Did you know -

1 - The Bills have passed on all 56 3rd down plays they've had this year between the 20 yard lines?

2 - Did you know that in the Greatest Comeback Game - Gilbride while OC of Houston called more passing plays in the second half and overtime then the Bills did....even though at half Houston lead 35-3?

3 - Did you know that the Bills ran the ball more than Houston did on that day?

4 - Did you know that Gilbride has never got a team beyond the first round of the playoffs.

There is more in the article.....

Also everyone knows that Buddy Ryan tried to punch out Kevin Gibride during a game, .....did you know Buddy also connected with another assistant coach, who happened to also coach for the Bills...

SABURZFAN

11-02-2003, 06:00 PM

:eek:

we need buddy ryan.he could smack Gee Dubya around too.:snicker2:

socalfan

11-02-2003, 06:02 PM

It's no wonder Buddy quit Houston after that year. I don't think he could hit KG hard enough to satisfy him.

11-02-2003, 07:50 PM

How come nobody picked up on this a couple of weeks ago when I pointed out that like 48 drives had ended on third down passing plays, yet it takes an official article to grasp that reality?

:shakeno:

Poor, poor Bills fans....

11-02-2003, 07:52 PM

Originally posted by socalfan
In the Bflo Evening news story, is the most condemning write up of Gilbride to date. The statistics would even wow Wys.

Gilbride Statistics (http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20031102/2012140.asp)

Did you know -

4 - Did you know that Gilbride has never got a team beyond the first round of the playoffs.

There is more in the article.....

Also everyone knows that Buddy Ryan tried to punch out Kevin Gibride during a game, .....did you know Buddy also connected with another assistant coach, who happened to also coach for the Bills...

On 4, yes, yes I did! Did you know that I pointed that out when we hired him and was lambasted for "being an idiot"...

:D

Do you know why Ryan punched out KG?

That answer won't shock you at all....

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 07:58 PM

Not to defend Gilbride in the Comeback game, but the RUN AND SHOOT offense is designed around throwing the ball 75% of the time. it has no tight ends- it has 4 wides for every play- including goal line formations.

The ONLY running play in the run and shot is the draw play. That's it.

socalfan

11-02-2003, 08:00 PM

Originally posted by Dozerdog
Not to defend Gilbride in the Comeback game, but the RUN AND SHOOT offense is designed around throwing the ball 75% of the time. it has no tight ends- it has 4 wides for every play- including goal line formations.

The ONLY running play in the run and shot is the draw play. That's it.

It seems to be that the run and shoot aka chuck and duck is probably not the best strategy to use throughout a game. Otherwise the defensive coordinator might deck ya.

11-02-2003, 08:06 PM

A strong rushing game combined w/ solid D are the hallmarks of championship teams. Passing games are an added plus, but rarely the reason why teams win conference or league championships.

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 08:09 PM

Originally posted by socalfan
It seems to be that the run and shoot aka chuck and duck is probably not the best strategy to use throughout a game. Otherwise the defensive coordinator might deck ya.

Again, not to defend it- but it did take 2 teams to the playoffs numerous years (Oilers, Lions and the Falcons employed it as well.

It racked up 500 yards and 50 points on a lot of teams. Eventually, DB's and defenses evolved to handle it.

socalfan

11-02-2003, 08:11 PM

Originally posted by Dozerdog
Again, not to defend it- but it did take 2 teams tot he playoffs numerous years (oilers, Lions0 and the Falcons employed it as well.

It racked up 500 yards and 50 points on a lot of teams. Eventually, DB's and defenses evolved to handle it.

Zone blitzing in particular caused it plenty of problems.

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 08:18 PM

Hmmm... And Dick LeBeau supposedly is the father of the Zone blitz-

....and here I was led to beleive by folks that LeBeau was a complete bum....

11-02-2003, 08:23 PM

Why then, w/ his marvelous "invention", were his Ds consistently ranked in the bottom few of the league?

Not bottom half, but 3 times dead last if I'm not mistaken and usually amongst the worst 3 or 4?

Guess while he invented it, he doesn't know how to use it, eh. ;)

And we were led to believe he did...

socalfan

11-02-2003, 08:23 PM

Well in MA you can't be getting the Buffalo papers, so it must be rumors from the BZ that you are referencing. I thought most still think highly of him as a defensive coordinator. I wonder how good the Bills would be if he were calling the defensive plays?

11-02-2003, 08:26 PM

Originally posted by Dozerdog

Again, not to defend it- but it did take 2 teams to the playoffs numerous years (Oilers, Lions and the Falcons employed it as well.

It racked up 500 yards and 50 points on a lot of teams. Eventually, DB's and defenses evolved to handle it.

Fans put way too much emphasis on "making it to the playoffs" instead of concerning themselves with whether or not they have the talent to win the big one.

No one knows better than Bills fans that simply winning a conference championship is not that much better than winning a divisional PO game if you can't "punch it in!"

Yet, it often seems that those are lessons long forgotten...

Besides, in today's league, "making it to the playoffs" often happens by accident for one or two teams each season. Other teams "backing out", or injuries late in the season, etc.

Why is "making it" to the POs such a great feat, especially when you're one of the last ones in?

11-02-2003, 08:28 PM

Originally posted by socalfan
Well in MA you can't be getting the Buffalo papers, so it must be rumors from the BZ that you are referencing. I thought most still think highly of him as a defensive coordinator. I wonder how good the Bills would be if he were calling the defensive plays?

How do you know he isn't?

Seems to me this D was nearly this good last year. Why, with Spikes now, Adams, Posey, Milloy, are we only marginally better? We should be incredibly better, no?

Perhaps the reason we aren't is b/c of LeBeau. It's quite possible.

loyal2dagame

11-02-2003, 08:30 PM

i think the game has passed gilbride by. this isnt the late 80's/early 90's. most teams have schemes that defend against the style of playcalling he makes. shouldnt this o-system be caled the "run, and shoot, shoot, shoot, shoot, run(as long as it isnt 3rd and short), shoot,ect..."

i just find it funny that greg williams, who pretty much said he was going to be a defensive guru when he got hired, doesnt realize that gilbride's playcalling is predictable and total crap.

maybe g.w. is going for the "we'll be so predictable that other teams wont be able to predict plays" approach

i may have to start wearing a bag over my head when i go to games.

if i were ralph wilson, i'd be embarrassed that all the money i spent in the offseason looks to be going to waste.

thanks bills coaching staff.

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 08:34 PM

Originally posted by Wys Guy
Why then, w/ his marvelous "invention", were his Ds consistently ranked in the bottom few of the league?

Not bottom half, but 3 times dead last if I'm not mistaken and usually amongst the worst 3 or 4?

Guess while he invented it, he doesn't know how to use it, eh. ;)

And we were led to believe he did...

Please specify-

His Super Bowl DB's from the Bengals in 1988? They had 22

His Super Bowl DB's from the Steelers in 1995? They had 24

From everything I've read from you- posts, articles- rantings- you have fixated only on his post Steelers career with a franchise that has refused to improve itself in the past decade.

You would never know that he ever held a job prior to his HC stint under the worst ownership this side of Bill Bidwell.

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 08:36 PM

With this logic, I'm suprised you think Marv Levy was a decent coach considering his less than stellar performance in Kansas City in the late 1970's.

socalfan

11-02-2003, 08:42 PM

loyal2dagame

11-02-2003, 08:55 PM

thanks for the welcome socal

11-02-2003, 08:57 PM

Originally posted by Dozerdog
With this logic, I'm suprised you think Marv Levy was a decent coach considering his less than stellar performance in Kansas City in the late 1970's.
Just look at the title of this thread;

"Things I didn't know about Gilbride"

I pointed all the same things out about Gilbride long before anyone thought they were important.

Now, and before we hired LeBeau, I'm pointing the same exact type of things out about LeBeau. You on the other hand are dismssing them just as everyone dismissed the same things brought up by Socal that I brought up back then.

What, do we never learn?

Am I some sort of genious or something? No, but I'm sure that's the tone you'll get outta this. But I, and many others here, can daggonedly, :scared:, surely read some stats and see that LeBeau's team were CRAP!

What is so difficult to see about that? Just go look at the rankings of his "inventive" Defenses, that's all you need to do. You don't have to be a genius, all you need to be able to do is to read numbers and text at what I'm guessing to be a 4th or 5th grade level.

Instead, you completely ignore the same exact types of stats about LeBeau that Socal brought up about Gilbride and that I mentioned as well, and more BTW, before and during when we hired him!

I'm no wonder man, but I am observant and detail oriented and I don't go running down the hallway to the Bills store to buy fresh PJs of whoever the latest coach or player is that TD say, in "Simon Says" fashion, is gonna be our next hero when there are plenty of indications as to why not to believe it.

Feel free tho. Feel free to believe that in spite of his continually leading his defenses, whether as DC or HC, to last or near last finishes, that somehow, for some unexplained reason he's gonna change all of his ways, and do all the things that he's never done before and lead us into being a top 5 or 10 D/team.

Feel free. If htat happens, then at the midway mark of next season, we're gonna be having the same exact conversations again, yet it'll be over LeBeau and not GW and Gilbride.

Why can't we hire winning coaches here? Coaches w/ a proven track record of something positive! I know that's foreign in Buffalo, hiring coaches w/ a proven positive track record. Instead, everyone mindlessly laps up everything the TD metes out to us in a trough like sheep simply and presumably, b/c he's some sort of genius and knows better than us.

Sure didn't seem like he knew any better than a bunch of us who foretold that Gilbride, and now in hindsight in posts such as this, had no track record of anything more than underachieving w/ the talent he had and by negating good defense, ala the Ryan/Gilbride incident, thru his completely bumbling ways.

I'm tired of drinking the TD koolaid and being led like sheep to slaughter. I'm tired of driving 7 hours and spending hundreds of dollars to see us struggle against teams that don't have a prayer of making the playoffs. I'm tired of going to games to see us get whooped by mediocre teams. I'm tired of barely beating teams and keeping them in games in the 4th Q when if we were even mediocre, then we should have been able to put them away by the half. I'm tired of being told all sorts of nonsense that I'm supposed to believe b/c TD's supposed to be a genius. I'm tired of our team's braintrust fixing all the secondary issues in the offseason and nearly all but ignoring the real issues.

I'm tired of losing and then taking more stupid chances with failure written all over them simply to be happy ala the "ignorance is bliss" phenomina.

Feel free tho!

As I said, if Gilbride is with the team next year, if LeBeau is promoted to HC, or if Drew is extended beyond '04, then I'm not renewing my seasons and I'll wager dollars to donuts that under those same circumstances there'll be another 5-7,000 people who vote with me and do the same.

Yeah, that's what I really want, is half unsold out games, two or three more seasons of us just "trying to make the playoffs" without any hopes beyond simply making them at all!

I WANT A SB CHAMPIONSHIP AND WE'RE NOT GONNA GET IT THIS WAY!!!

If we want to win, then let's do winning things. There's an idea, eh!

11-02-2003, 08:59 PM

Hey loyal, welcome indeed!

;)

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 09:01 PM

I know, I know, it's all about you.

Yes, you did strike gold with Gilbride.

But for every Gilbride prognostication, there is a Travis Brown should start thread, Take away Henry's best runs and he stinks thread, and Shaun Bryson is god thread.

:rolleyes:

Even blind squirrels find nuts.

socalfan

11-02-2003, 09:08 PM

Originally posted by Dozerdog
..... Take away Henry's best runs and he stinks thread,.....

Bun Bun .... I calculated Ricky Williams YPC based on dropping his top 10 and lowest 10 runs. I thought that would be fair since the top ten can probably be attributed to the offensive line, or poor defensive line play, or missed tackles etc... and the lowest ten can be attributed to the offensive line, or good defensive line play, or good tackling. And based on the results, I would take Bryson any day of the week over Ricky. Ricky is a dog....only a 3.2 YPC average. Geesh, why pay the guy big bucks? :rofl:

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 09:11 PM

If you took away Bryson's top ten runs last season, and his bottom 10 runs last season- did Bryson wind up with any runs?

11-02-2003, 09:17 PM

And you say I'm belittling...

;)

See, here's the kicker;

About Brown we knew little. Nevertheless, I find it tough to believe that he couldn't do what Bledsoe's doing. Bledsoe's play is easily amongst the bottom half of QBs this year and only destined to get far worse if historical trends hold true. And why shouldn't they? Drew's play is like clockwork there.

But again, w/ players you know nothing about you have to take chances. Brown, Pucillo even, Sullivan last year, Denney. But once you figure out that they aren't performing, then you cut your losses. Too bad we can't seem to do that w/ our DL.

But with players that there's a HUGE history on, you can look at those and see what has happened. With LeBeau there's a loooong history of "a lack of success" to be polite to him. W/ Giblride, there's been a long history of Os that breakdown in the most important games and in the playoffs. W/ Bledsoe, there's a whole history of his being almost completely unable to beat better teams, do well in the second half of seasons, and play a decent playoff game. But we all stick our fingers in our ears and blame everything but Drew for that! W/ Adams there was an entire season of underachievement last year that anyone only had to watch three Raider games to see. W/ Posey there was 6 years of history suggesting that he only played well in one of those 6 prior seasons and on a team who's D was on the field more than any, by a long shot, in the league and one w/ a scheme so vastly different than the one we brought him here to play in. Yet, we're all "shocked" to find out that he's "not working out nearly as well as we'd hoped" here. Gee!

By your philosophy, why even draft a player? We have absolutely no reason to believe that a player will do anything unless he has some sort of NFL credentials.

Use some common sense here. That's free. You don't need to rely on TD or OBD to apply it. I can tell you this, that if more fans voted or threatened to vote w/ their purchasing tickets, then I guarantee you that the FO and OBD would listen. But as long as there's support for Drew playing like crap in all but a handful of games in most cases against horrible teams, and support for him that as long as we replace 5 guys around him he'll be fine, then the FO won't make those moves. And we will continue to lose and not have a realistic chance of making it past the first round of hte playoffs if in fact we even make them.

As for me, I'd rather be winning games and be playing such football that suggests that we can beat any given team on any given Sunday. As it now stands, I don't think there's a majority of fans by a long shot who believe we'll beat Tennessee in Nashville, or NE ont he road, or Indy even at home, or even the Jets w/ Pennington and likely not Miami or Dallas either. Oh sure, we have a shot at Houston, but frankly, IMO if we win that it'll be a squeaker too.

Are we trying to pound our fans into utter frustration and depression by continually selecting crappy coaches after a brief propaganda "recycling" and whitewashing so as to pull the wool over our fans eyes?

Buffalo's fans deserve better!

11-02-2003, 09:18 PM

Originally posted by Dozerdog
If you took away Bryson's top ten runs last season, and his bottom 10 runs last season- did Bryson wind up with any runs?

Great comeback...

That sure proves that LeBeau is worth keeping...

:deadhorse:

Ooops! Sorry, that one's yours...

:D

11-02-2003, 09:19 PM

If you look at Drew's four best games since he got here he's awesome!

Works two ways, eh....

;)

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 09:22 PM

Without LeBeau- Bills Bottom 5 2002 in defense

With LeBeau- Bills top 5-10 in defense

I like those stats.

socalfan

11-02-2003, 09:24 PM

Originally posted by Dozerdog
If you took away Bryson's top ten runs last season, and his bottom 10 runs last season- did Bryson wind up with any runs?

No, no....I only did that for Ricky, cause I knew Bryson got everything he deserved. :rofl: But Ricky didn't earn or deserve the results of all of his runs. I tried to mimic Wys's statistics to see what would happen.

11-02-2003, 09:27 PM

Originally posted by loyal2dagame
i think the game has passed gilbride by. this isnt the late 80's/early 90's. most teams have schemes that defend against the style of playcalling he makes. shouldnt this o-system be caled the "run, and shoot, shoot, shoot, shoot, run(as long as it isnt 3rd and short), shoot,ect..."

i just find it funny that greg williams, who pretty much said he was going to be a defensive guru when he got hired, doesnt realize that gilbride's playcalling is predictable and total crap.

maybe g.w. is going for the "we'll be so predictable that other teams wont be able to predict plays" approach

i may have to start wearing a bag over my head when i go to games.

if i were ralph wilson, i'd be embarrassed that all the money i spent in the offseason looks to be going to waste.

thanks bills coaching staff.

Hey loyal,

I don't think it ever "Passed Gilbride by", I don't think it was ever a winning formula. If you remember, the entire reason why Ryan slugged Gilbride, it was b/c Ryan's D held an opponent, forgot who, to 3 and out. With only minutes remaining Gilbride threw the ball three straight times to give the ball right back where then opponent then turned around and scored the winning score. Again, not sure if it was a FG or TD. But that's when Ryan slugged Gilbride for being an idiot and not running the ball to run the clock out. If I remember correctly two of the three throws went incomplete and stopped the clock and the other team had no TOs.

We're seeing more examples of similar nonsense here. After a decade Gilbride still hasn't learned. In fact, he often seems to have gotten worse. I mean the fact that of 56 3rd downs ended, all have been on passing plays, certainly speaks volumes that he's no closer to being a good OC than he was back then.

As to the "times", the Raiders had what was essentially a "run-and-shoot" last year and look what happened in the SB. It was as predictable as the sun rising. Garner was not a feature F/T rusher, he was more a utility back similar to the way White was used in Gilbride's schemes back then, perhaps even moreso.

Besides, I'm tellin' ya, I'm not even sold on the notion that TD seems to think that Gilbride's part of the issue. We have to remember that TD's made all these moves and Gilbride was TD's hire as a former colleague in Pittsburgh and friend. So what makes us believe that TD thinks he needs to go?

If anything, I think there's plenty of evidence to the contrary since much to my disbelief, Gilbride was promoted to QB coach at the end of last season even tho we completely bore out that the more Drew passed the worse the team did. I never understood that and I'd wager anything that it wasn't GW's decision to promote KG. I'm sure it was TD's.

11-02-2003, 09:35 PM

Originally posted by Dozerdog
Without LeBeau- Bills Bottom 5 2002 in defense

With LeBeau- Bills top 5-10 in defense

I like those stats.

Well, unfortunately, and since you're so plugged in to the details of last season even tho I've pointed them out on endless occasions, we had a D that was playing at a top 10, 7 to be precise, over the last 10 games of the season last year and even had several good games in the begining. The D took heat for the O setting up nearly 100 points of opponent scores, usually at the hands of Drew and his wonderarm!

In fact, over our last 10 last season, our D allowed 19.3 PPG if I'm not mistaken. If I am it's only a few tenths off.

This year our team is allowing 18.5.

I don't think that single point or so is worth all the hype over Adams, Spikes, Posey, and Milloy, do you?

Seems to me that if they were all that they were hyped to be, and given the level and caliber of our opponents to date, that we'd have been much better.

And I'll say this, I doubt that we're even gonna meet that 19.x by the time the season ends given our opponents. We'll see tho.

Viva La LeBeau...

:rolleyes:

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 09:41 PM

Originally posted by Wys Guy
Hey loyal,

I don't think it ever "Passed Gilbride by", I don't think it was ever a winning formula. If you remember, the entire reason why Ryan slugged Gilbride, it was b/c Ryan's D held an opponent, forgot who, to 3 and out. With only minutes remaining Gilbride threw the ball three straight times to give the ball right back where then opponent then turned around and scored the winning score.

Incorrect Wys-

With one emotional crest after another, the game most football fans remember from the '93 season was actually the meaningless finale on national television against the New York Jets. The Oilers coasted to a 24-0 shutout for an 11th consecutive win, finishing with a 12-4 record, the best in team history. The defense dominated once again.

But Buddy Ryan was not happy. He had few kind words for the Run and Shoot offense, often calling it the "Chuck and Duck." To him, it wasn't a manly offense nor was it good at running out the clock in close games. When Carlson fumbled with less than a minute remaining in the first half on a typical pass play, Ryan yelled at Offensive Coordinator Kevin Gilbride. Ryan believed that last-minute defensive stands had cost him two players to injury when the Oiler offense could have ran the ball until the clock expired. Gilbride, who had heard this whine before, moved closer, yelling back at Ryan. When they were at arm's length, Ryan unleashed an overhand right at Gilbride's head that was little more than a glancing blow. Two players quickly separated the coaches but ESPN, with little else for drama to cover, replayed the punch for the rest of the game. It was a little rare to see coaches on the same team duking it out while their team was ahead but it was the sort of thing that the media would gladly turn into a phenomenon.

http://www.houstonprofootball.com/log/log14.html

BTW- I have great footage of that on DVD- I wish i could get JJ to make an ever so short "video" of that.

11-02-2003, 09:50 PM

Right, a "typical pass play."

Where was I off? I said pass plays. That's why they lost. If they had simply run the ball, then that likely wouldn't have happened.

I don't see anything at all in there indicating that I was incorrect. I see one single reference to a pass play. I didn't realize that it turned into a fumble, but nonetheless, the point is the same. Why was Gilbride passing then?

My Titans buddy recounted it for me, and I can guarantee you he knows more on this than you do. Just b/c I don't remember all the little particulars aside, again, you still can't seem to grasp the major points.

Gilbride = Pass!

Nothing's changed.

"when the Oiler offense could have ran the ball until the clock expired."

It's in your own post!

Blind are we, or simply lacking the necessary reading comprehension skills...

:jk:

11-02-2003, 09:51 PM

Oops!

Viva La LeBeau!

11-02-2003, 09:53 PM

Oh, and where are my manners!

Thanks for digging that up for all the good Bills fans to see that nothing's changed!

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 09:55 PM

Originally posted by Wys Guy
Right, a "typical pass play."

Where was I off? I said pass plays. That's why they lost. If they had simply run the ball, then that likely wouldn't have happened.

1) The Oilers won 24-0 in a shutout

2) It was halftime, not the end of the game

3) The Jets still failed to score.

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 09:57 PM

I'm not here to defend Gilbride- but as OC, the team had it's best regular season ever. And for a 4- year span, his offense produced more yards than any other team in the league.

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 09:58 PM

Originally posted by Wys Guy
Oh, and where are my manners!

Thanks for digging that up for all the good Bills fans to see that nothing's changed!

Just trying to be accurate in my reporting! ;)

11-02-2003, 10:00 PM

Gilbride still passed when he should have run and there was no reason to pass!

What's so tough to understand about that?

Who cares? So I forgot it cost the Oilers two key injuries instead of the game. Big deal.

You're the one "turning this into me", all I'm saying is that Gilbride's had this tendency ever since he's coached.

I'm not even sure that two injuries are worth a win, are you?

But again, WTH, is this hyperbolic topology? It's common sense and basic reason.

OK, so you think Gilbride is good. What do you want me to say?

I think LeBeau will be great for us. Maybe he can bring those "winning ways" of while he was in Cincy here to Buffalo.

Gosh, I can't wait! Where do I sign up to triple my season ticket purchases....

:rolleyes:

Am I writing in Russian thru an e-translator or something?

Or perhaps you can enumerate for us LeBeau's positive accolades during his what, 8, 10 year tenure in Cincy?

How much space do you need...

:rolleyes:

11-02-2003, 10:02 PM

Originally posted by Dozerdog

Just trying to be accurate in my reporting! ;)

Fair enough. But don't let my mis-recollection detour you from the primary point. :)

In fact, as you posted that I remembered that it was injuries, not the game. But again, it's immaterial. Gilbride had an opportunity to run the clock out w/ a crazy lead and didn't.

It's the same nonsense that's costing us here in B-Lo!

I would have shown a measure of good faith and canned Gilbride this past week since he's more the issue than GW is.

Dozerdog

11-02-2003, 10:05 PM

LOL.... It's the run and shoot! Like it or not- It's a passing only offense! No one is debating the Oiler's offense designed to pass!The Run and shoot Oilers not running? Were they supposed to run in an offense designed around 5 WRs?

I swear you are arguing just to argue.

A professional coach, acting like a child on national TV, punched another coach amist a shutout win and an 11 game win streak. If you want to turn a mentally instable football coach into a hero- that's your business.

You inaccuratly reported almost every circumstance surrounding the incident. I pointed out he facts, yet ya want to twist an event that happened a decade ago to fit an argument today.

Geesh... :deadhorse

Earthquake Enyart

11-03-2003, 07:50 AM

I love Buddy Ryan.

He could coach my team any day.

askabry

11-03-2003, 07:59 AM

Why are we expending so much time over something that happened 10 years ago (the famed Ryan punch), with an offensive system so totally different than ours that there are no comparison?

Oh ... and just a matter of information ... Buddy Ryan is a complete a$$. There's a reason the guy can't get a job in football.

helmetguy

11-03-2003, 03:09 PM

Originally posted by askabry
Why are we expending so much time over something that happened 10 years ago (the famed Ryan punch), with an offensive system so totally different than ours that there are no comparison?

Oh ... and just a matter of information ... Buddy Ryan is a complete a$$. There's a reason the guy can't get a job in football.

The only comparison is that Gilbride is now OUR OC. Whether it is "Run and Shoot" or "West Coast Offense," Gilbride is stuck in the formula mode, rather than tailor his offense to the personnel on hand. The bottom line is that most (if not all) of Buffalo's offensive problems can be traced back to the OC himself. There are those, though, who insist on being "right" even after presenting facts that prove otherwise. Doz was just trying to set the record straight.

And Buddy Ryan is a complete ass!