Attn. Wys and Co. on our RB situation...

[BillsMan80]

You are clamming for Bryson. Well, here's what I think about this. Remember the play in Denver after Henry got hurt on a 3rd and 2 I believe, and Bryson was in the game and got a Toss outside, TO HIS STRENGTH, which plays with his SPEED, and he got chased and brought down short of the marker by Mobley? Yep, I sure do. Henry has the vision, and the ability to wear down a defense. Now argue with me here, but I think you're nuts if you don't agree that one reason Henry isn't getting the ball enough is because Gilbride is too full of the passing game. In that respect, Gilbride is doing average, because he's not UTILIZING the run enough. Yeah, Bryson can take a sweep and go 60 yards or so, but that's not going to happen very often. Bryson can't go up the middle because he lacks the cutback ability and the toughness, and VISION of Travis Henry. That is why Travis is our back. Because we can count on him to gain tough yards. And not to mention he's become a better receiver and blocker by far. Travis Henry offers a total package at RB, and so far we haven't used him.

[Tatonka]

agreed

[WG]

Sorry 80. I disagree that vision is among Henry's strenghts. I see him miss things that are right smack in front of him.

As to the rest, again, you put words in my mouth. I'm not "clamming for Bryson", and that's part of the problem we have here. You Henry fans keep turning this into a Henry v. Bryson thing.

What I am saying is that our running game is defunct! It isn't working, certainly not well. All I'm saying is that we need some changes and that I'm not satisfied to see Henry go thru the season having 2 or 3 big runs each game but not being able to provide any consistency and be counted on when the team needs him the most, not necessarily to gain 20 yards, but just to gain 4 or 5. He cannot do that apparently. That's what we learned last year, all preseason, and for 4 out of 5 games this year.

As a matter of FACT, the ONLY games in which Henry has had over 100 yards since he's been in the league have been v. teams among the worst 4 or 5 rush Ds in the league in the given year.

All I'm saying is fix it! Don't care how. Just fix it. Meanwhile I'm drawing flack from people who seem to think that a 3.5 YPC avg. is just peachy! Combine that w/ all the fumbles and it sucks. It isn't good.

I simply don't see it that way. It may very well be that the solution is to find a decent RB in FAcy or via the draft.

[casdhf]

See the sig.

[casdhf]

Which, by the way....wys won't respond to :rolleyes:

:D

[justasportsfan]

I'm with wys on fixing the run game. I don't think that it's all Henry's fault but yes Henry needs to play better. I don't know if Bryson is any better as well because we haven't played him at all. Let's put it this way, I'm not impressed with our running unit be it Henry, Bryson or Gilbrides system. It needs to be fixed. We are still in it.

[bduff54]

maybe a free agent RB is in order for next year.

[WG]

cas,

It isn't even worth arguing w/ you. You know FULL well that the Jets game is carrying those stats!!!

I'll recalculate those over the last 4 games. You can say that we can't remove this or that and look at this that way, blah, blah, blah...

But the fact of the matter is what Henry did v. a D that is allowing 190 rushing yards per game and almost 1,000 in its first 5 games which must be an NFL historical record, does NOT help us in subsequent games.

Henry's had THREE (3) 100 yard games in his career and not too many good games beyond that. They were against the Jets this year, allowing 190 rush yards per game; against the Jets last year, allowing 135 rush yards per game (28th); and against Carolina, LAST in the NFL in rush yards allowed allowing 144 per game.

So it's VERY FAIR to say that Henry's NEVER had a 100 yard rushing day other than against a rush D ranked at 28th or lower!

He had two other games last year where he had 20 or more carries since you say that will make the difference; he had 22 for 58 and 27 for 63 yards for a combined 49 carries for 121 yards or less than 2.5 YPC!!!

HELLO!!!

Now, I'll go recalculate the same stats that Lori threw out after telling me that I couldn't remove his single best run to make a point as she conveniently seems to have absolutely no problem having the Jets game carry-the-day in her own brand of analysis.

....

[WG]

In the 4 games SINCE the Jets game, Bills' RBs have rushed:

66 times for 232 yards, for a 3.5 YPC avg., 3 TDs, and 5 fumbles, 4 of which we lost.

That's an average of 16.5 carries a game for 58 yards.

IF, you remove the SINGLE best play by an RB, that 29 yard run by Henry on Sunday, ONE SINGLE PLAY, out of 66 runs over the past 4 games, you are left with:

65 for 203 and a 3.1 YPC avg.

That's an average of 16 carries a game for 51 yards.

If you take out the next two runs of 17 and 16, you are left with:

63 for 170 and a 2.7 YPC avg. So for those of you short on math skills, what we can assume is that on 63/66ths or well over 95% of the time, we can hope for an average gain of 2.7 yards on any given rushing play. So I guess if your goal is to rush 40 times in the hopes of having 2 or 3 big runs and nothing else, then that's a good strategy. Otherwise, this isn't going to serve the team very well and it's why Gilbride isn't running more and giving Henry all the carries that many of you suggest will turn him into an all-pro contrary to his past history in the league.

I'm very happy for all of you who are defending that nonsense. But the truth be told, any NFL analyst is going to wholeheartedly disagree with you all that we have anything but a problematic rushing game! That's all there is to it.

Let's see what "Ms. Statistics" has to say about that...

;)

[WG]

BTW,

You most certainly can look at trends and certain portions of games or stats under certain conditions or to look at anomalous conditions.

It's done all the time on NFL shows and on Sundays, etc. It's also a VERY valid tool for looking at certain things.

In any case, when one single play, which is obviously anomalous as Henry had only 1 in 5 games over 20, impacts the stats that much, it does make sense to look at the rest w/o that.

Sorry to say...

[casdhf]

What about your hero, Bryson? He's played the same games against the same defenses.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Henry is our best back!!!! That being said he does need to play a bit better and in order for that to happen Gilbride is going to have to establish the run. So far he hasn't done that besides the opener.

[Ð]

Wys, again I'll restate.

The running game does NOT happen with the RB on an "island," so that stats applied to RB's are directly in their control, like hitting in baseball, etc. TH has been here all of last year with possibly the worst OL in the history of the game. While our OL has improved this year, they are not, I repeat not a bone-crushing, steamrolling unit capable of clearing holes for the running game....maybe capable, but not executing, as witnessed by the massive hits all Bills RB's (including Henry) are taking in the backfield.

Your incessant rants @ TH being soley responsible for the state of the running game in Buffalo are quite frankly getting tired and serve to illustrate that you know sweet FA @ the game of football.

There are no stats to back up OL play...anyone who knows the game knows that. When good OL play comes together with good play-calling, execution and a passing game, then the running game will work itself out....unfortunately it doesn't happen overnight.

[casdhf]

It's not whether Henry can produce or not, I just don't see your obsession with Shawn Bryson. He hasn't done anything in his carries. I don't think he got a carry against the Riaders, and he really doesn't deserve any more anyways.

[Judge]

Originally posted by Wys Guy

As to the rest, again, you put words in my mouth. I'm not "clamming for Bryson", and that's part of the problem we have here. You Henry fans keep turning this into a Henry v. Bryson thing.

I hate this part of the argument. Are people that desperate to repeat Flutie-Johnson that they want to recreate it in the form of Bryson v. Henry?

I agree with Wys 100% (who'd believe that?). I don't care how the Bills fix it- just repair the running game PLEASE. And I think a valid way to try is to use Bryson.

[WG]

Hmmm....

Let's see!

Henry needs 25 carries or it isn't a fair comparison.

But Bryson gets what, 15 carries all season and we can determine how good he is...

Sorry cas!!! Look at last year's performances, will ya. Also, notice that I didn't mention Bryson. It is you who is suggesting the I somehow think Bryson is the second coming of Roger Craig.

All I'm saying is that Henry isn't as good as billed, OR the coaches don't know what they're doing, OR, we have some other issue(s).

But it's gotta be one of those things. It has to!

[casdhf]

I definately think we have other issues. The running scheme is to blame, not the runners.

[WG]

This will all work out in the wash. Henry's gonna keep playing the same way. That much is apparent after he couldn't see a hole in front of him, in one case big enough to drive a car thru it.

The question is how many more games is this gonna continue for and what are we gonna do about it. B/c frankly, I don't wanna waste all of next year too waiting for "Henry to blossom" into the star that many of the fans want to make him. Most RBs don't even get two seasons! He doesn't have it apparently. If he does, then it should come out over the second half of the season and in spades.