Bills add DT Oliver Gibson

[clumping platelets]

The Buffalo Bills will add some experienced depth to their defensive line this week.
The team has agreed to terms of a contract with defensive tackle Oliver Gibson, a nine-year veteran from the Cincinnati Bengals. He is expected to sign the deal in the next couple of days.

http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20040329/1026183.asp


Decent move to add more experience to the DL. The defense suffers when either Sam Adams or Pat Williams are out of the game. Hopefully, this can help. This also means that Bannan and Edwards are battling for the #4 DT

[elltrain22]

can this guy play. I for one, do not know that much about him.

[Tatonka]

good find.. but i cant say that this signing makes ANY sense at all..

so let me get this straight.. we are worried about the 30 and 31 year old DTs that we have on the roster being old.. so we sign one that is 32.. who could potentially cost us some of our youth in bannan, sape, edwards, or any rookie that we draft..

:eek:

[ryjam282]

Me neither....Help us out here Tatonka or someone....Is he at least halfway decent? He's kinda old right?

[Ebenezer]

Originally posted by Tatonka
good find.. but i cant say that this signing makes ANY sense at all..

so let me get this straight.. we are worried about the 30 and 31 year old DTs that we have on the roster being old.. so we sign one that is 32.. who could potentially cost us some of our youth in bannan, sape, edwards, or any rookie that we draft..

:eek:

let's have that argument if he makes the team...at this time of the year I want as much depth as possible...instead of the training camp fodder that is signed at $230K I'll take a roster full of guys like Gibson...remember that only the top 51 count against the cap right now...If I were a GM I would have very few of the $230K guys on the roster.

[TedMock]

Training camp competition. He may be gone by the time the season starts. We always sign a few of these guys in the offseason and more often than not they're released.

[ryjam282]

Originally posted by TedMock
Training camp competition. He may be gone by the time the season starts. We always sign a few of these guys in the offseason and more often than not they're released.


Yeah, like we did with James Jett last year

[Tatonka]

good points..

i will be disappointed if this guy costs us a young guy though.

[DraftBoy]

Hes a decent DT though and if he makes the team he could make some noise this season. Maybe its just me but I dont usually see training camp competition brought in on a 6yr deal.

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by DraftBoy
Hes a decent DT though and if he makes the team he could make some noise this season. Maybe its just me but I dont usually see training camp competition brought in on a 6yr deal.


he got a 6 year deal? sweet... :rolleyes:

i know he is a decent player.. and a very good reserve.. but we need YOUTH... so if we draft a DT, then bannan and sape will be a total waste of a draft pick.

[ryjam282]

Did anyone read the article????
NOT ANOTHER ONE:)

Bills President and General Manager Tom Donahoe drafted Gibson for the Pittsburgh Steelers in the fourth round in 1995. He spent four years as a backup in Pittsburgh, then started four seasons with the Bengals. Each of those four years he was coached by current Bills defensive line coach Tim Krumrie.

[Ebenezer]

where did Oliver Gibson get a 6 year deal?? Link please.

[TigerJ]

I don't think Buffalo looks for a DT in the draft at all with this signing. Forget about Wilfork or Harris, whom a few mocks have had the Bills taking.

[ryjam282]

SO, I guess Rivers is the only logical choice next... :)

[The Spaz]

Originally posted by DraftBoy
Hes a decent DT though and if he makes the team he could make some noise this season. Maybe its just me but I dont usually see training camp competition brought in on a 6yr deal.

Where's the link on a 6 year deal?

[mchurchfie]

Gibson is a solid pickup and probably can outplay any of our so called youth. By youth I assume you mean the guys that have been playing for the last 2-4 years and have progressed very little or showed no signs of grabbing the bull by the horns.:rolleyes: A good veteran like Gibson may be able to help them out. I also think that it sends a message to the younger players to pick up their game or they will be sitting. I applaud the move.:bf1:

[DraftBoy]

misread on my part

[Michael82]

Originally posted by Ebenezer
let's have that argument if he makes the team...at this time of the year I want as much depth as possible...instead of the training camp fodder that is signed at $230K I'll take a roster full of guys like Gibson...remember that only the top 51 count against the cap right now...If I were a GM I would have very few of the $230K guys on the roster.

I agree! Great move! :bf1:

[Dantheman1280]

Originally posted by mchurchfie
Gibson is a solid pickup and probably can outplay any of our so called youth. By youth I assume you mean the guys that have been playing for the last 2-4 years and have progressed very little or showed no signs of grabbing the bull by the horns.:rolleyes: A good veteran like Gibson may be able to help them out. I also think that it sends a message to the younger players to pick up their game or they will be sitting. I applaud the move.:bf1:

This is a good point, but he is 32 years old! He has no future

we cannot give up on Bannan, Edwards and Sape yet!

[mchurchfie]

Originally posted by Dantheman1280
This is a good point, but he is 32 years old! He has no future

we cannot give up on Bannan, Edwards and Sape yet!

Its not giving up on them, its pushing them a little more. Besides, Gibson is a pretty stout tackle, he would be good in the rotation against the run. Edwards has been around for 4 years and hasn't shown himself to be consistent starting material, I wouldn't cry too much if he got pushed out of a job.

[Dantheman1280]

I agree that edwards has not shown much but Sape was only a rookie last year, and if they give Gibson a substantial amount of money he will push out someone

[Tatonka]

so then we did waste a 3rd round pick and a 4th round pick on them.. right church?

[John Doe]

Sape was a 7th rounder - I think. I don't see him being a great loss.

[mchurchfie]

Originally posted by Dantheman1280
I agree that edwards has not shown much but Sape was only a rookie last year, and if they give Gibson a substantial amount of money he will push out someone

If he pushes someone out for their playing time then he must be playing better so that can only be a good thing for the team. The Bills are in the business of winning, they're not a farm team. Sape will get his chance as time goes on.

[mchurchfie]

Originally posted by Tatonka
so then we did waste a 3rd round pick and a 4th round pick on them.. right church?
Could be, time will tell. I think that Edwards is going into his 4th or 5th year and Bannan his 3rd...time to sac up. I'm all for developing young talent for the future but this isn't a developmental squad or a European Football Team that they are on. If they can't show much more than what they have shown in the next couple of years or sooner then they surely could pan out to be a waste of draft picks, especially Edwards. This is the NFL, it's all about "What have you done for me lately?"....know what I mean.:idunno:

[The Quebecer]

Maybe TD is thinking about Edwards in a hypothetical but possible trade...?????
Who knows? There is so many things we are not aware of...

Keep the faith!

Later,
PatQ

[Ebenezer]

Originally posted by mchurchfie
Could be, time will tell. I think that Edwards is going into his 4th or 5th year and Bannan his 3rd...time to sac up. I'm all for developing young talent for the future but this isn't a developmental squad or a European Football Team that they are on. If they can't show much more than what they have shown in the next couple of years or sooner then they surely could pan out to be a waste of draft picks, especially Edwards. This is the NFL, it's all about "What have you done for me lately?"....know what I mean.:idunno:

I want to win a SB...soon...I could care less about Sape. Bring on guys that are going to help win.

[mchurchfie]

:bf1:That's what I'm talking about.:up:

[Romes]

The Gibson deal is official now

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/index.cfm?cont_id=237969&dsp=press

[The Spaz]

Sape was a 6th or 7th round pick that proabably will suck. Gibson got a 2 year deal big ****ing deal.

[The Spaz]

I can careless about who's feelings get hurt if a player is brought in here that will help the team boo- ****ing-hoo that other player better earn his pay on special teams or whenever his name is called upon.

[wbat27]

espn said 2 yr deal

[BigZ]

2 year deal

He's here to push Bannan.

[The Spaz]

Originally posted by zielinski
2 year deal

He's here to push Bannan.

He's here to help us when we dump Sape.

[Hounds]

Takeo played with this guy. Maybe Takeo Spikes wants Gibson on the Team. If Takeo had anything to do with it then I think its a great move.

[madness]

I don't know about you guys, but I want this team to do something this year. If he beats out one of our young guys(based on talent), then they can assist Travis Brown in waterboy duties.

[justasportsfan]

If Krumrie recommends it, I want it.

[ShadowHawk7]

Originally posted by TigerJ
I don't think Buffalo looks for a DT in the draft at all with this signing. Forget about Wilfork or Harris, whom a few mocks have had the Bills taking.

Damn... :cynic:

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
If Krumrie recommends it, I want it.

what has krumrie done that was special for us?

he got no play out of kelsay or denny.. pat williams numbers are down.. sam adams was up and down..

and schobel just continued the same progression that he had..

krumrie hasnt shown me anything personally.. because the dline i not any better than before he got here.

[Dozerdog]

Originally posted by Tatonka
good points..

i will be disappointed if this guy costs us a young guy though.

Won't lookk so dumb if Adams or Williams get hurt. And if Bannan or Sape can't beat out a 32 year old- they don't deserve a roster spot at all.

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka


what has krumrie done that was special for us?

he got no play out of kelsay or denny.. pat williams numbers are down.. sam adams was up and down..

and schobel just continued the same progression that he had..

krumrie hasnt shown me anything personally.. because the dline i not any better than before he got here. Okay, we'll just give all the credit for this D jumping from bottom of the barrel to no. 2 to Jerry Gray and Lebeau. :rolleyes:

Everyones numbers are down but the D ranking went up.

[Ebenezer]

Originally posted by Dozerdog
Won't lookk so dumb if Adams or Williams get hurt. And if Bannan or Sape can't beat out a 32 year old- they don't deserve a roster spot at all.

I thought I read this someplace else...you double posting again??

[Dozerdog]

Originally posted by Tatonka
what has krumrie done that was special for us?

he got no play out of kelsay or denny.. pat williams numbers are down.. sam adams was up and down..

and schobel just continued the same progression that he had..

krumrie hasnt shown me anything personally.. because the dline i not any better than before he got here.

Let's see- a lot of Bills front office detractors (not callling you one Tonk) complained when we Brought in an overpaid Milloy (had the same numbers as Wire) brought in an overrated and overweight Adams , brought in Posey (who apparently isn't a superman) - brought in LeBeau (thought Grey was just fine - WTF did he do in Cincy??) and Krumrie -


Ye this defense jumped from the bottom five in the league to top 5 in the league.

You can pick apart any of the moves made by this team on defense to satisfy whatever argument or agenda you are pushing (Fat Sam- Start Coy) - but the cummulative affect resulted in a dramatic improvement on the defensive side of the ball.

[helmetguy]

Originally posted by Dozerdog
Let's see- a lot of Bills front office detractors (not callling you one Tonk) complained when we Brought in an overpaid Milloy (had the same numbers as Wire) brought in an overrated and overweight Adams , brought in Posey (who apparently isn't a superman) - brought in LeBeau (thought Grey was just fine - WTF did he do in Cincy??) and Krumrie -


Ye this defens ejumped from the bottom five in the league to top 5 in the league.

You can pick apart any of the moves made by this team on defense to satisfy whatever argument or agenda you are pushing (Fat Sam- Start Coy) - but the cummulative affect resulted in a dramatic improvement on the defensive side of the ball.

It probably has something to do with that "Zero-Sum" theory I read about in another article. According to that, bringing Malloy here accounted for two less wins in 2003 than in 2002.

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
Okay, we'll just give all the credit for this D jumping from bottom of the barrel to no. 2 to Jerry Gray and Lebeau. :rolleyes:

Everyones numbers are down but the D ranking went up.


look.. i am not arguing the defense overall..

i am looking at the guys on the defensive line that we were looking to get more out of.. when it comes to position coaches.. that is their job..

we saw nothing from kelsay or denny.. and we were all hoping to.. NO improvement there..

we saw sam and pat basically play the way we expected them too.. the numbers were down a good amount for williams, but i wont say he played bad.

schobel gave us the natural progression that he has every season since coming here.

we got NO help from sape, bannan, mckenzie, edwards.. nobody..

krums job is to develope our talent..

all i am asking is what talent has he developed at all in any way, shape, or form?

[Ebenezer]

Anybody got any numbers...the radio is reporting a 2-year deal.

[Tatonka]

no numbers yet..

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka



look.. i am not arguing the defense overall..

i am looking at the guys on the defensive line that we were looking to get more out of.. when it comes to position coaches.. that is their job..

we saw nothing from kelsay or denny.. and we were all hoping to.. NO improvement there..

we saw sam and pat basically play the way we expected them too.. the numbers were down a good amount for williams, but i wont say he played bad.

schobel gave us the natural progression that he has every season since coming here.

we got NO help from sape, bannan, mckenzie, edwards.. nobody..

krums job is to develope our talent..

all i am asking is what talent has he developed at all in any way, shape, or form? Did you wonder if Bannan, Sape and Mckenzie are scrubs or old ? Kelsay was a rookie.

Players have come out to say a lot of great things about this guy and I've watched him coach and have compared him to others. Yeah, this guy is intense. BTW, last year was his first year.

DL coaches does not just develop players, he also makes them work as a unit. Another thing is that this D has not given up all year compared to the year he wasn't here.

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
Did you wonder if Bannan, Sape and Mckenzie are scrubs or old ? Kelsay was a rookie.

Players have come out to say a lot of great things about this guy and I've watched him coach and have compared him to others. Yeah, this guy is intense. BTW, last year was his first year.

DL coaches does not just develop players, he also makes them work as a unit. Another thing is that this D has not given up all year compared to the year he wasn't here.


if all of our back up defensive lineman are scrubs.. what does that say about our front office.. and why did we keep them? i dont think that is true..

you compaired him to others? what exactly does this mean.. who did you compare him to and what did you find out? i am very interested to hear back on this comparison you did.

as far as the d lines coach being responsible for making the d work together and krumrie being responsible for the defense not giving up.. well.. guess what.. he doesnt even talk with the secondary or the linebackers.. so i seriously doubt that he had anything to do with the d not giving up.. guys like takeo spikes and london fletcher and lawyer milloy are the reason that the d plays hard.

all i am saying is that he has proved nothing.. not that he is horrible.. but his MAIN job is to help the Dline and the players on it get better.. and he really didnt improve anyone last year.. if you disagree.. then tell me.. who did he improve? other than schobel, who was the only one to get better than the previous year.. name one person that got better?

[Tatonka]

where was krumrie's coaching when the colts stuffed the ball into the endzone at the end of the game to win?

[The Spaz]

Originally posted by Tatonka
where was krumrie's coaching when the colts stuffed the ball into the endzone at the end of the game to win?

You can thank th eoffense for keeping the Defense on the field for 90% of the game. There is nothing you can do if you're out of gas schemes etc. aren't going to mean ****.

[Ebenezer]

Originally posted by Tatonka
if all of our back up defensive lineman are scrubs.. what does that say about our front office.. and why did we keep them? i dont think that is true..

welcome to the era of the salary cap...your reserves are either scrubs, rookies or guys like Gibson...who do you want?

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by Ebenezer
welcome to the era of the salary cap...your reserves are either scrubs, rookies or guys like Gibson...who do you want?

eb.. i understand that.. but it is teams like new england that have the coaches that can get above average play out of those backup scrubs and old guys that win superbowls..

i was simply stating that i have not seen that ability from krumrie yet... and for anyone to say that they have is kidding themselves.

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka



if all of our back up defensive lineman are scrubs.. what does that say about our front office.. and why did we keep them? i dont think that is true..

you compaired him to others? what exactly does this mean.. who did you compare him to and what did you find out? i am very interested to hear back on this comparison you did.

as far as the d lines coach being responsible for making the d work together and krumrie being responsible for the defense not giving up.. well.. guess what.. he doesnt even talk with the secondary or the linebackers.. so i seriously doubt that he had anything to do with the d not giving up.. guys like takeo spikes and london fletcher and lawyer milloy are the reason that the d plays hard.

all i am saying is that he has proved nothing.. not that he is horrible.. but his MAIN job is to help the Dline and the players on it get better.. and he really didnt improve anyone last year.. if you disagree.. then tell me.. who did he improve? other than schobel, who was the only one to get better than the previous year.. name one person that got better? I've attended several team camps and have seen what D coaches are like. I too am a certified trainer and can tell another one is good even though it's in another field. You don't need a whole lot of X's and O's to be a good coach.

If this guy hasn't proven anything, who do you give credit to the rise of this D? This being said, Gray, Lebeau hasn't proven anything either.

Just how does one DL coach prove himself? BY developing a player? That's it? The Giants OL was decent but barely anything special so how does Mcnally become such a great OL coach?

Check out this DL, Sam , Pat, Schoebel, Denny. Other than Pat there really isn't a whole lot of talent and yet this D was no. 2 where the D starts upfront. It was serviceable inspite of the lack of talent.

GW flew in to try and take Gray along with Krumrie. He may be a horrible HC but GW is no scrub when it comes to the D .

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
I've attended several team camps and have seen what D coaches are like. I too am a certified trainer and can tell another one is good even though it's in another field. You don't need a whole lot of X's and O's to be a good coach.

If this guy hasn't proven anything, who do you give credit to the rise of this D? This being said, Gray, Lebeau hasn't proven anything either.

Just how does one DL coach prove himself? BY developing a player? That's it? The Giants OL was decent but barely anything special so how does Mcnally become such a great OL coach?

Check out this DL, Sam , Pat, Schoebel, Denny. Other than Pat there really isn't a whole lot of talent and yet this D was no. 2 where the D starts upfront. It was serviceable inspite of the lack of talent.

GW flew in to try and take Gray along with Krumrie. He may be a horrible HC but GW is no scrub when it comes to the D .

mcnally has a history of turning chicken **** into chicken salad.. like with the giants line that got them to the superbowl.. 2 old guys.. ziegler at center.. who was a scrub for us.. and 2 undrafted rookie fa's.. that is what he has done..

i guess when i think of a position coach.. i look at last year.. arizona lost boston and martay jenkins.. they had no one.. and tolbert got a bunch of rookies to play extremely well.. way above expectations..

if krumrie can do that.. i will give him all the credit in the world.. until then.. he is average..

gray gets credit because he is the one calling the plays.. putting guys in position to make plays.. the linebackers performed well.. the secondary was ok.. overall.. it was the scheme that ended up being the biggest factor, i think..

i just dont think the DL contributed much last year.. they stopped the run pretty good.. and other than schobel.. they couldnt get a sack to save their life.. i blame krumrie for that..

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka


eb.. i understand that.. but it is teams like new england that have the coaches that can get above average play out of those backup scrubs and old guys that win superbowls..

so that makes NE's DL coach proven because an entire team seems to respond to Bill Bellichick and yet when an entire D (bills) moves from the bottom of the league to no. 2 Krumrie hasn't done squat?
i was simply stating that i have not seen that ability from krumrie yet... and for anyone to say that they have is kidding themselves. Let's say I am willing to share the credit since players have a lot of respect for and since this D was nothing a year before he came over.

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
so that makes NE's DL coach proven because an entire team seems to respond to Bill Bellichick and yet when an entire D (bills) moves from the bottom of the league to no. 2 Krumrie hasn't done squat? Let's say I am willing to share the credit since players have a lot of respect for and since this D was nothing a year before he came over.


i guess we see the credit differently.. i dont credit a dline coach unless the dline plays very well.. our overall defense was good.. but it could have been great if we had consistent pressure from the front four.. but krumrie was not able to get that out of them..

i give credit to belicheck as well as the dl coach.. their whole team played well.. as well as their dline specifically.. so they both get credit..

if there was a weak spot on the bills defense last year.. it was the defensive line and its lack of consistent pressure by anyone other than schobel.

who do you blame for that? apparently krumrie doesnt take any blame for that, even though it is his JOB to get those guys to play better?

[Ebenezer]

Originally posted by Tatonka
eb.. i understand that.. but it is teams like new england that have the coaches that can get above average play out of those backup scrubs and old guys that win superbowls..

mmm...Belicheck and Romeo vs. Williams and Gray...doesn't matter who your DL coach is...B&R win hands down.

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka


mcnally has a history of turning chicken **** into chicken salad.. like with the giants line that got them to the superbowl.. 2 old guys.. ziegler at center.. who was a scrub for us.. and 2 undrafted rookie fa's.. that is what he has done..

i guess when i think of a position coach.. i look at last year.. arizona lost boston and martay jenkins.. they had no one.. and tolbert got a bunch of rookies to play extremely well.. way above expectations..

if krumrie can do that.. i will give him all the credit in the world.. until then.. he is average..

gray gets credit because he is the one calling the plays.. putting guys in position to make plays.. the linebackers performed well.. the secondary was ok.. overall.. it was the scheme that ended up being the biggest factor, i think..

i just dont think the DL contributed much last year.. they stopped the run pretty good.. and other than schobel.. they couldnt get a sack to save their life.. i blame krumrie for that.. The Giants OL was barely decent but he made a player out of guys like Ziegler, i.e. McNally is a great OL coach? THe salad dressing was awsome but the entire salad was decent.

The bills DL barely had talent and yet barely got ran over compared to the year before ,Krumrie is unproven. Okay.

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
The Giants OL was barely decent but he made a player out of guys like Ziegler, i.e. McNally is a great OL coach? THe salad dressing was awsome but the entire salad was decent.

The bills DL barely had talent and yet barely got ran over compared to the year before ,Krumrie is unproven. Okay.


mcnally did a whole lot more than just help ziegler.. he got glenn parker and lomas brown to play like they were 26 instead of 36.. and he got 2 rookies to all gel into a superbowl quality line.

the bills dline had barely any talent? schobel, denny, kelsay.. all 2nd round picks.. yeah.. they have no talent..

edwards 3rd rounder, bannan 4th rounder.. pat and sam - proven probowl vets..

yeah.. tons of no talent there.. okay.

great.. so we didnt get run on that much.. anything over the prior years run defense was an improvement.. and that had just as much to do with adding good LBs as it did w/ the Dline.. and it wasnt like the bills were tops in the league in run defense by any means..

and we had NO pass rush from our defensive line.. but krumie is awesome and doesnt deserve any of the blame for no pass rush.. because he only had a bunch of second round picks to work with.. and some probowl tackles..

i guarentee you if the dline had put up 15 more sacks.. you would be giving krumie all the credit.. thats for sure..

is the guy your uncle or something.. i dont understand why you feel it necessary to stand up for him.. when all you can point to is the overall defense was improved.. which may or may not be directly related to krumie.. considering that he doesnt even interact with 2/3rds of the defensive personell.

[Tatonka]

it felt like we werent getting run on that much when ricky williams ate our lunch.. and indy ate our lunch.. all on the ground.. krumie must have been sick on those days though, and wasnt at work.. so it is not his fault.

[Tatonka]

/me turns the sarcasm off.

[The Spaz]

I blame our offense!:up:

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka
it felt like we werent getting run on that much when ricky williams ate our lunch.. and indy ate our lunch.. all on the ground.. krumie must have been sick on those days though, and wasnt at work.. so it is not his fault. you hold RW to 3.5 in 40 carries w/ the talent we have and add to the fact the our O goes 3 and out 90% of the time.

This Dl could've been so much better if you O gave them enough time to rest.

The year before for a little bit more than 1 half of the season this O was awsome and yet the D failed inspite of Gray calling the shots.

The D moves up to no. 2 and you give Gray all the credit






where was krumrie's coaching when the colts stuffed the ball into the endzone at the end of the game to win?
gray gets credit because he is the one calling the plays.. putting guys in position to make plays.. you tell me .since you said Gray calls the shots. When the team moves to no. 2 it's all gray, when the colts score a winning TD it's Krumries fault. :rolleyes:

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
1) This Dl could've been so much better if you O gave them enough time to rest.

2) The year before for a little bit more than 1 half of the season this O was awsome and yet the D failed inspite of Gray calling the shots.

The D moves up to no. 2 and you give Gray all the credit

3) you tell me .since you said Gray calls the shots. When the team moves to no. 2 it's all gray, when the colts score a winning TD it's Krumries fault. :rolleyes:

1. i agree..

2. the defense sucked for half of the first season.. then the second half of the first season they were doing great while our offense went in the tank... it is obvious that it took time for the team to learn and perform in the new defense.. it took half a season..

3. your right.. that is not fair.. good point..

look.. gray is not perferct.. and neither is krumrie.. i dont expect either too be... but gray has done something with the defense.. he is the DC, so if the whole defense is doing good he deserves the credit.. just like he will be the goat if the defense drops to 25th this year..

same premis with the DL.. i just think they are underperforming.. and the excuse that they dont have any talent is the biggest pile of horse**** ever... they are loaded with guys taht were drafted high because of talent.. and it is Krumries job to get them to do their jobs better.. which they have not yet..

why is that so difficult to understand..

i mean, are we disagreeing on fundamentals here.. do you believe that the defensive line had more sacks than it really had or what?

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka



same premis with the DL.. i just think they are underperforming.. and the excuse that they dont have any talent is the biggest pile of horse**** ever... they are loaded with guys taht were drafted high because of talent.. and it is Krumries job to get them to do their jobs better.. which they have not yet..

why is that so difficult to understand..

i mean, are we disagreeing on fundamentals here.. Sam Adams was underperforming the year he left the Raiders. It's no secret that is why TD signed him to a incentive type of contract. I do understand your point however, you seem to blame their lack of performance on Krumrie and yet fail to see what Dozer said, it's a commulative effort.

Just because a player is not playing to his expectations based in where he was drafted (Denny)does not mean the coach is at fault here Leaf, Mike Williams,etc.

Did you expect Kelsay to have a Julius Peppers type of impact in his rookie year ? I doubt Kelsay would even been considered a 1st rd. pick in this years draft class.

Maybe if Gray put him in for more downs, we could've really seen if this kid is any good but I don't think he's a JP. I'm sure TD would've wanted to try his draftee (Denny) first before he calls him a mistake.
do you believe that the defensive line had more sacks than it really had or what? NO, but it surely didn't open holes as much as it did the year before inspite of the addition of Sam Adams who you don't think much off in the first place.

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
NO, but it surely didn't open holes as much as it did the year before inspite of the addition of Sam Adams who you don't think much off in the first place.

are you kidding me? i am one of sam's biggest supporters.. i am happy that he is on this team.. your thinking of wys.. who always dogs him.. i like sam and think that he was probably our second best lineman last year asside from schobel.

i also think he will be better this year.

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka


are you kidding me? i am one of sam's biggest supporters.. i am happy that he is on this team.. your thinking of wys.. who always dogs him.. i like sam and think that he was probably our second best lineman last year asside from schobel.

i also think he will be better this year. My bad, what makes you think he'll be better?

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
My bad, what makes you think he'll be better?

because he is another year older and fatter..

:D

just because he will be more aclimated to the defensive style.. and playing next to williams and schobel for another year...

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka


because he is another year older and fatter..

:D

just because he will be more aclimated to the defensive style.. and playing next to williams and schobel for another year... another year playing under Krumrie :laughter:

BTW, do you remember Adams saying he wanted to play for Krumrie and that was part of his decision why he chose to play for the bills. Search the archives. It's there. ;)

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by justasportsfan
another year playing under Krumrie :laughter:

BTW, do you remember Adams saying he wanted to play for Krumrie and that was part of his decision why he chose to play for the bills. Search the archives. It's there. ;)


it was later found out that he was high on crack cocain. :D

look.. i am not dogging krumrie to the point where i think he is a complete waste..

bottom line.. for all the hype the guy receives.. i would like to see him turn our young guys into some beasts... if he does that, i am happy.

[Bert102176]

I heard it was a 3 year deal