Law/Milloy Bills could've waited

[juice]

Did the Bills pull the trigger on the Milloy deal when the Defense had bigger issues. Average play from the DE position and an ageing D-line why was the SS position in such a need of upgrading when Coy and PP had done an acceptable job.

Milloy didn't have that huge of an impact last season and we knew we had an issue with re-signing AW... Would it have been a better move to wait on SS and make a power move on Ty Law or one of the other premier Corners?

I know Vincint was a Pro Bowler but he's not Law, Bailey or Woodson.

Maybe Drew talked Wilson and TD into making an unnecessary deal for a player on the downside of his carreer.

[Lefty2985]

No he is a great leader and helped this defense greatly

[Pride]

The SS is more important when the oposing team is playing catch up.

We didnt score many points last year, so most teams just ran the ball at us all game.

When we are up by 14 this season, you will see more long passes being thrown, and more INTs

[BuffaloRanger]

It would have taken a crystal ball to see that Ty Law would be available this off season- which he still isn't. Signing Milloy was like psychological warfare against the Pats, and it worked great that first game. Too bad the coaches sucked the rest of the season.

The money that was spent on Milloy wouldn't have been spent last year on a DE, because we had 2 x 2nd rd picks at DE and there were no stud DEs available.

All the premier CB's either resigned with their teams or signed for tons o cash with another team this off season.

[juice]

Originally posted by BuffaloRanger
It would have taken a crystal ball to see that Ty Law would be available this off season- which he still isn't.

Ty Law knew last year there would be issues with his contract.. Which he talked about during the Milloy fallout. Milloy didn't effect the outcome of many other games last year besides NE.

Some cash and the thought of sticking it to his old team could have convinced Law to come to Buffalo.. Maybe.

[Jan Reimers]

I liked the Milloy deal a lot better then than I do now. But hindsight is always 20/20.

[Tatonka]

law is not cut yet.. law wants to be paid more than champ, which is about 3x what we are paying milloy. and you would have been freaking out if we didnt sign vincent by now, and had no replacement for winfield at this point.. then what if we didnt get law.. we would really be up **** creek.. td did the right thing by getting vincent.

[RedEyE]

If Law becomes available, who's to say that the Bills wouldn't go after him anyway? I'm syre Milloy and Bledsoe could persuade him to sign on.

The Bills have already discussed the fact that Vincent is getting up there in age and have consdired moving him to FS in coming years. Sign Law now with the money they saved in cap space resigning Drew, move Vincent to FS and the Bills have a powerful shutdown secondary.

Milloy, Law, Clements, and Vincent.

[The Spaz]

Law is is asking for a **** load of money no way can we afford him and expect to re-sign or extend some of our players for next year.

[Ebenezer]

Ty Law has too much baggage...sorry...pass.

[RedEyE]

We don't need the guy. He is too expensive for one thing, and for another, I guarantee he plays out his contract his year with NE. It would be just plain stupid for him sit out this year, it would drive his asking price way down and the Pats would cut a player that doesn't have a commitment to the team...... after the 2004 season.

[juice]

Originally posted by RedEyE
If Law becomes available, who's to say that the Bills wouldn't go after him anyway? I'm syre Milloy and Bledsoe could persuade him to sign on.

The Bills have already discussed the fact that Vincent is getting up there in age and have consdired moving him to FS in coming years. Sign Law now with the money they saved in cap space resigning Drew, move Vincent to FS and the Bills have a powerful shutdown secondary.

Milloy, Law, Clements, and Vincent.


Originally posted by RedEyE
We don't need the guy. He is too expensive for one thing, and for another, I guarantee he plays out his contract his year with NE. It would be just plain stupid for him sit out this year, it would drive his asking price way down and the Pats would cut a player that doesn't have a commitment to the team...... after the 2004 season.

Red, I can see the subject is tearing you apart.

[RedEyE]

Originally posted by juice
Red, I can see the subject is tearing you apart.

:lol: I guess I should have explained myself further to avoid the contradiction. :chuckle:

I was replying in two parts....

1) He may already be a consideration......

2) .......although we really don't need him.

If he was to sign with the team, I can't say that I would be terribly upset.

[helmetguy]

The Malloy deal was just great timing; pure and simple. He gave us more experience at SS for a fairly reasonable price, considering his credentials. TY Law, for all his talent, just doesn't fill a need for us, in that we already have two quality corners. It'll be cheaper, and more prudent in the long run to sign Clements than to break the bank for a Ty Law.

[Stewie]

Originally posted by juice
Did the Bills pull the trigger on the Milloy deal when the Defense had bigger issues. Average play from the DE position and an ageing D-line why was the SS position in such a need of upgrading when Coy and PP had done an acceptable job.




I don't think Wire getting burned every other play was acceptable...

[juice]

Originally posted by paulB
I don't think Wire getting burned every other play was acceptable...

A pass rush might have helped, Plus the entire Defense was pretty bad, remember we did have a 40 yr old linebacker dropping into coverage also.

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by paulB
I don't think Wire getting burned every other play was acceptable...

that is such a horrid exageration.

[Dozerdog]

Originally posted by juice
Did the Bills pull the trigger on the Milloy deal when the Defense had bigger issues. Average play from the DE position and an ageing D-line why was the SS position in such a need of upgrading when Coy and PP had done an acceptable job.

Milloy didn't have that huge of an impact last season and we knew we had an issue with re-signing AW... Would it have been a better move to wait on SS and make a power move on Ty Law or one of the other premier Corners?

I know Vincint was a Pro Bowler but he's not Law, Bailey or Woodson.

Maybe Drew talked Wilson and TD into making an unnecessary deal for a player on the downside of his carreer.

Juice- there are some basic fundamentals when it comes to signing players.


1) Milloy was cut- he was available. We had the cap space.

2) Ty Law was under contract for the next 2 seasons when we signed Milloy- how in the hell are you suposed to make a "power move" on a guy who is not available? While we are at it, let's make a "power Move" for Mike Vick, Marshall Faulk, & Randy Moss while we are at it.

3) Name me one DE or DL we should have signed who was available when Milloy hit the maket worth a damn

All I know is we had cap space, added another piece of the puzzle, and the defense jumped from 28th or so to 2nd. Yeah- it was a dumb move :rolleyes:

[juice]

Dog- All I am saying is that our SS struggles had alot to do with the Defense being bad as a unit, LB's, DL, and DE not just at the SS position.

Wire deserved a chance and someone maybe could have been bought in through the Draft last year.

I dont know if Milloy was the best way to address that positions needs, Izzell Reese didn't play that bad at times. Signing a veteran beyond his prime kind of negated the Wire draft choice.. Doomed him to ST.

Do you think he was worth the $ to this team last season.. You might make the arguement that the SS position was still a liability to this Defense with Milloy. Meanwhile what do you do with Wire?

Signing Milloy eliminated options.

[Dozerdog]

Juice- the best talent plays- period.


If Wire was better- he would have played.

I always laugh when people say "We shoulda done this" or "we shoulda done that" and they don't offer up specifics.


What safety would you have drafted and when?

[juice]

Bad investment in drafting Wire to play the position only to tie up more money when he might have developed.. we may never know.

If you have your draft guide from last year archived maybe I can look through it and come up with a few suggestions on SS available... or at this point maybe just agree that it doesn't matter at this point.. But also agree that Coy Wire is a wasted talent.

[mikemac2001]

Love to have him but we wont get him so dont even bother with the discussion

[Dozerdog]

Originally posted by juice
Bad investment in drafting Wire to play the position only to tie up more money when he might have developed.. we may never know.

If you have your draft guide from last year archived maybe I can look through it and come up with a few suggestions on SS available... or at this point maybe just agree that it doesn't matter at this point.. But also agree that Coy Wire is a wasted talent.


Like i said- if he was better than milloy- he would be playing. The Bills GM isn'tn the business of paying high prices and playing the guy with less talent.

It's football- you put the best guy out there .

[juice]

In Professional Sports you dont tie draft picks up in a position, Then turn around and sign players over 30 yrs old to multi-year contracts. What ever happened to developing the youth.

I hope LM can contribute with some Interceptions or at least be effective in QB sacks.. Wire could at least put pressure on the QB.

[The Spaz]

Originally posted by juice
In Professional Sports you dont tie draft picks up in a position, Then turn around and sign players over 30 yrs old to multi-year contracts. What ever happened to developing the youth.

I hope LM can contribute with some Interceptions or at least be effective in QB sacks.. Wire could at least put pressure on the QB.


I beleive Milloy had 3-4 sacks last year. I think his Int's will come this year seeing he will know th esystem better.

[juice]

Originally posted by The Spaz
I beleive Milloy had 3-4 sacks last year. I think his Int's will come this year seeing he will know th esystem better.

I hope so.. If we could produce some QB pressure I'm sure TV and NC will pick it up.

[Dozerdog]

Originally posted by juice
In Professional Sports you dont tie draft picks up in a position, Then turn around and sign players over 30 yrs old to multi-year contracts. What ever happened to developing the youth.

I hope LM can contribute with some Interceptions or at least be effective in QB sacks.. Wire could at least put pressure on the QB.


1- If TD's crystal ball to Mrs Cleo would have guaranteed him Milloy one season later- I'm sure he might have picked someone else. Or not. This is football. if Bret Favre or Mike Vick knocked on the door of One Bills Drive tomorrow and said he'll suit up real cheap - should we say "Sorry- we just Losman- beat it?"


What happened to signing a player who is bette rthan the guy you have if the opportunity arises? That's called upgrading your roster.

[juice]

Originally posted by Dozerdog
1- If TD's crystal ball to Mrs Cleo would have guaranteed him Milloy one season later- I'm sure he might have picked someone else. Or not. This is football. if Bret Favre or Mike Vick knocked on the door of One Bills Drive tomorrow and said he'll suit up real cheap - should we say "Sorry- we just Losman- beat it?"


What happened to signing a player who is bette rthan the guy you have if the opportunity arises? That's called upgrading your roster.

So you think the LM "Upgrade" was worth the money and Wire based on the way he played the season before could not have gotten 4 sacks and an Int. or Two playing behind Spikes, Adams, Posey. I think Wire would have gotten more tackles and more sacks.

The quality of the players would only help Wire to develope coverage skills.

[helmetguy]

Originally posted by juice
I think Wire would have gotten more tackles and more sacks.



And you know this for an absolute certainty...how?

[juice]

Originally posted by helmetguy
And you know this for an absolute certainty...how?

No.. Thats why I said "I Think".. I Think.


Originally posted by juice
I think Wire would have gotten more tackles and more sacks.



I dont think the influx of FA talent would have hurt his game much.

[helmetguy]

Okay, so you "think" Wire "would have gotten more tackles and more sacks." Based on...what?

[Marvelous]

My take on Milloy /Wire is that Milloy did doom Wire to ST's. But Milloy has more talent so why not start him.
I like Wire alot. But ***** me suzzy we have Milloy, and i thought he played decent and will have a better year ....

[Dozerdog]

Originally posted by juice
So you think the LM "Upgrade" was worth the money and Wire based on the way he played the season before could not have gotten 4 sacks and an Int. or Two playing behind Spikes, Adams, Posey. I think Wire would have gotten more tackles and more sacks.

The quality of the players would only help Wire to develope coverage skills.

Actualy, It's just the opposite. With Eddie Robinson and Newman in front of Wire, more guys got through. With Adams occupying morke blockers, and a better LB corpse in between- there is a lot less getting through to the safety position. The fact that their stats are similar from 2002 & 2003 just tells me Milloy was more active to get the same #s.

Just think- how many deep passes were the Bills torched for in 2002? A ton! I can think of only a handfuul in 2003- A good safety should not be measured on interceptions- it's the support they give the corners that makes the difference.


My big theory why the Bills offense still had trouble generating turnovers is this- with such a pathetic offense- teams were never forced to press the Bills dominant defense- they could afford to nibble away and be patient. In the only three games the Bills offense came out charging- Pats, Jax, Skins- the Defense generated some big turnovers.