Pats fans crying

[Marino13Phins]

The pats fans are already crying about the refs actually calling defensive penalties, and they think the pats are getting screwed over all the time. It's funny, now that penalties are being called the pats are being flagged heavily? It's too funny watching all of them cry over there.

[Jan Reimers]

I hope, unlike hockey, that the NFL officials continue to enforce the no contact rules throughout the regular season.

[Marino13Phins]

I hope, unlike hockey, that the NFL officials continue to enforce the no contact rules throughout the regular season.

If they do this just for preseason, and then change the way they call when the season comes around, I am going to be very displeased. This is giong to be an extremely tough season for the refs, they are going to take a lot of heat, but they need to stick to their guns.

I can already see a week 1 game coming down to a contact call that wasn't called and should have, or was called and shouldn't have.

[Ickybaluky]

I think the rule emphasis is going to help the Pats. So far this preseason, their opponents have been called for interference more than they have. With their small, quick WR, it really works to their benefit. Defensively, the Pats are a veteran group (other than the DL) that has adjusted pretty quickly. They probably will play more zone and less man this year, but overall the rule change is going to make them better.

I'm pretty excited about it, based on what I've seen so far.

[HenryRules]

I just hope the teams in general catch on pretty quickly.

Football that is filled with flags is boring to watch ... but once the defenders/receivers get used to it, it should make for more big plays in the passing game (interceptions and deep completions).

The guys that I really think are going to have the hardest time are the physical receivers ... there's been such a bias towards letting receivers get away with more than the defender in recent years and this is supposed to take that away.

[BAM]

The Pats seconday is ****ed if they keep calling these penalties.

[Bill Brasky]

The pats fans are already crying about the refs actually calling defensive penalties, and they think the pats are getting screwed over all the time. It's funny, now that penalties are being called the pats are being flagged heavily? It's too funny watching all of them cry over there.

It's bad enough they ***** about the Red Sox, now we will have to put up with them *****ing about the Pats all year.

[Ickybaluky]

What *****ing?

From what I've seen the Pats are going to be helped by this. Their defense has adjusted pretty well, and they are a smart team so it shouldn't be an issue. The Pats wills still have one of the best defenses.

Offensively, I think this helps them as much as anyone. The Pats WR are small and quick, so they get grabbed a lot.

I think this whole "rule emphasis" is a whole lot of hot air. I don't see it having a ton of impact, other than a few more pass interference or holding calls. However, at the same time it looks like offensive pass interference is being called more. Really, I don't see it having a big effect.

[Marino13Phins]

What *****ing?

From what I've seen the Pats are going to be helped by this. Their defense has adjusted pretty well, and they are a smart team so it shouldn't be an issue. The Pats wills still have one of the best defenses.

Offensively, I think this helps them as much as anyone. The Pats WR are small and quick, so they get grabbed a lot.

I think this whole "rule emphasis" is a whole lot of hot air. I don't see it having a ton of impact, other than a few more pass interference or holding calls. However, at the same time it looks like offensive pass interference is being called more. Really, I don't see it having a big effect.


Their defense has not adjusted well at all. They kept countless drives alive the other game for the panthers and for the bengals with defensive penalties like that. The bengals killed them, and the panthers barely beat them. This is really going to hurt the pats DB's, because besides Law they aren't all that great, and all the grabbing and holding really helped them.

It may turn around and help them on offense, but I don't think it's going to help them as much as it's going to hurt. They do quick passes. So their WR are still going to have to deal with the 5 yard junk zone, that is still good. They hardly get out of that zone, so they aren't going to get the calls that are going to be going against them.

[Kolbiss]

What *****ing?

From what I've seen the Pats are going to be helped by this. Their defense has adjusted pretty well, and they are a smart team so it shouldn't be an issue. The Pats wills still have one of the best defenses.

Offensively, I think this helps them as much as anyone. The Pats WR are small and quick, so they get grabbed a lot.

I think this whole "rule emphasis" is a whole lot of hot air. I don't see it having a ton of impact, other than a few more pass interference or holding calls. However, at the same time it looks like offensive pass interference is being called more. Really, I don't see it having a big effect.


Not enough to replace you guys at the top.......I don't think you will repeat, just because of how hartd that is to do now days. but it will have nothing to do with the new rule........of course, if I had to pick one team to place my money on, it would still have to be the pats. :(

[Ickybaluky]

Their defense has not adjusted well at all.

I don't think you are watching their games. It really hasn't been a factor. Rodney Harrison had a big P.I. call against him the other night, but that would have been a penalty last year as well. It hasn't been a big deal otherwise. I'd put the Pats top 7 in the secondary (Law, Poole, Samuel, Buckley, Harrison, Wilson, Reid) up against any team in the NFL.

If you've watched the Pats this preseason, the bigger concern has been their run defense (which finally showed improvement against Carolina). They turned over serveral players (Ted Washington, Bobby Hamilton, Anthony Pleasant, Rick Lyle) on the DL and they are very young up front. How quickly the new guys can learn their roles will be a big factor for them this season.

I've watched a lot of the preseason games, including the Bills, and I don't think this new rule emphasis is going to have the dramatic impact people think. Ultimately, the effect will be minimal.

I don't think you will repeat, just because of how hartd that is to do now days.

I don't necesarily disagree, although I hope it is otherwise. I do think it will be harder for the Pats to win a 2nd in a row than it was for them to win last year. If they do lose it will likely be because of their run defense and ST, both of which have some questions. It won't be because of their offense (which looks improved and has great depth) or the new rules emphasis.

[Samphin1]

[QUOTE=NE39]
I don't think you are watching their games. It really hasn't been a factor. Rodney Harrison had a big P.I. call against him the other night, but that would have been a penalty last year as well. It hasn't been a big deal otherwise. I'd put the Pats top 7 in the secondary (Law, Poole, Samuel, Buckley, Harrison, Wilson, Reid) up against any team in the NFL.

QUOTE]

I would take that bet. I don't care about the rule or any of that, I just want to get into it about the secondary. :;

Sam Madison, Pat Surtain, Reggie Howard, Will Poole, Sammy Knight, Arturo Freeman and Antaun Edwards are, in my opinion a lot deeper and younger secondary than New England's. I think Madison is the only one in his 30's and he is just that, 30. I like Buckley and Law, but for my money, Miami's secondary is much better.

[Ickybaluky]

You have an argument, but I'd still take the Pats guys. The Pats definitely have more over-30's, but they also have some young guys and the average age between the units (of 7) is only a year. Nonetheless, my statement had more to do with right now.

If I were to compare, I'd give the Pats a slight edge overall. I'd look at it as follows:

- Reid and Poole are a wash, since both are basically young guys their teams really like and who have flashed real potential, but neither has done anything yet in the NFL.

- The Pats top-3 CB of Law/Samuel/Poole is a wash against Surtain/Madison/Howard.

I have a ton of respect for Surtain, so I'll call him even with Law (a high complement). Samuel looks like he will beat out Poole this year. He is a young guy who can play, with a real nose for the football. His only real weakness is lack of experience, and because of that I would take Madison. Madison is still a top CB, but not nearly as good as his rep. At nickel, I'd take Poole over Howard. Poole gets beat occasionally, but he is really fast and can cover. I don't think much of Howard. He is OK, but is definitely the worst of the 6 guys mentioned. He tackles well, but gets beat a lot. There is a reason a Carolina team that needs help in the secondary let the guy go, probably because they watched the Patriots beat him like a rented mule all during the Super Bowl.

- At S it isn't even close. Harrison and Wilson are better than anything Miami has, by a wide margin.

Harrison was an AP All-Pro last season. A great tackler, initimidating hitter, big-play maker and team leader. Wilson would start at CB for most teams in the NFL, but instead he is playing S at a very high level. It is nice having a S with those kind of skills.

Knight is a big-hitter who had a lot of interceptions with New Orleans, however he gives up a lot of big plays as well, has poor range and can't cover a bed. Arturo Freeman is a try-hard guy I like a lot, but he isn't that good a player. The only reason he may start is because the Dolphin's only other option is Edwards, who was a bust in Green Bay and just plain isn't that good.

Thus, if you look at the 7 guys as a whole, the Pats have a clear edge, IMO (although I understand you probably disagree).

[Ickybaluky]

Incidently, I think the "rule emphasis" effect on the Miami defense is being over-estimated as well. They are still going to be a real good defense.

[Samphin1]

You have an argument, but I'd still take the Pats guys. The Pats definitely have more over-30's, but they also have some young guys and the average age between the units (of 7) is only a year. Nonetheless, my statement had more to do with right now.

If I were to compare, I'd give the Pats a slight edge overall. I'd look at it as follows:

- Reid and Poole are a wash, since both are basically young guys their teams really like and who have flashed real potential, but neither has done anything yet in the NFL.

- The Pats top-3 CB of Law/Samuel/Poole is a wash against Surtain/Madison/Howard.

I have a ton of respect for Surtain, so I'll call him even with Law (a high complement). Samuel looks like he will beat out Poole this year. He is a young guy who can play, with a real nose for the football. His only real weakness is lack of experience, and because of that I would take Madison. Madison is still a top CB, but not nearly as good as his rep. At nickel, I'd take Poole over Howard. Poole gets beat occasionally, but he is really fast and can cover. I don't think much of Howard. He is OK, but is definitely the worst of the 6 guys mentioned. He tackles well, but gets beat a lot. There is a reason a Carolina team that needs help in the secondary let the guy go, probably because they watched the Patriots beat him like a rented mule all during the Super Bowl.

- At S it isn't even close. Harrison and Wilson are better than anything Miami has, by a wide margin.

Harrison was an AP All-Pro last season. A great tackler, initimidating hitter, big-play maker and team leader. Wilson would start at CB for most teams in the NFL, but instead he is playing S at a very high level. It is nice having a S with those kind of skills.

Knight is a big-hitter who had a lot of interceptions with New Orleans, however he gives up a lot of big plays as well, has poor range and can't cover a bed. Arturo Freeman is a try-hard guy I like a lot, but he isn't that good a player. The only reason he may start is because the Dolphin's only other option is Edwards, who was a bust in Green Bay and just plain isn't that good.

Thus, if you look at the 7 guys as a whole, the Pats have a clear edge, IMO (although I understand you probably disagree).

Naturally, I disagree. Reggie Howard sucked so bad that he picked off Brady in the Super Bowl. :funny: Signing Reggie Howard is why we didn't sign Buckley. Buckley is great and in my mind, will always be a phin, but his gambles outweighed Howard's consistancy, at least, at this point in both of their careers. I respect Law and for that reason, will put HIM in the same category as Surtain. :D . Patrick is so good he picked off Brett Favre with his feet. Sure, it was somewhat luck but the dude stuck his foot out in the endzone, kicked it up in the air and snatched it while falling away from the ball. That is just a taste of how good he is. He cuts the field in half ( as does Law, to some extent). Madison is overrated to some degree, at least, he used to be. He still went to the Pro Bowl last year and I think most people agree that Surtain has surpassed Sam as the number one corner for Miami. Will Poole is a rookie and fourth on the depth chart, but a lot of draft exports feel he was a steal where we got him. Knight is a just as big a hitter as Harrison, withouth the penalties. But I give you the edge when put up one on one. Knight plays centerfield very well though and seems to have a knack for where the ball is going to end up. He really didn't give up a lot of plays last year. Marion was mostly responsible for those and he was jettisoned out.

Freeman and Edwards are more than just athletic guys. The Cowboys are currently rumored to try and trade for Freeman and Edwards has already surplanted Freeman form the starting role.

Personally, I think Buckley, Poole and to some extent, even Law, are overrated in their ability. The system they are in helps their strengths shine through and hide their weaknesses. I attribute that to Belicheck and that damn good coaching staff. One thing we can agree one is that the PAts have a WAAAAAAY better coaching staff.

I suppose we will have to agree to disagree on this subject.

[Drive 4 Five]

Isn't this a site for Bills fans?? So what in the hell are chambers84phins and NE39 doing? Sup with that?! NOBODY cares what you have to say! :peace:

[Marino13Phins]

Isn't this a site for Bills fans?? So what in the hell are chambers84phins and NE39 doing? Sup with that?! NOBODY cares what you have to say! :peace:


You know you live on every word I say... :dance:

[The Spaz]

You know you live on every word I say... :dance:

Yes but I would much rather die. :trance: :; :peace:

[Marino13Phins]

Yes but I would much rather die. :trance: :; :peace:

:snicker: I feel the love.

[ShadowHawk7]

Lol, I don't mind watching a pats fan and a fins fan go at it on a Bills message board at all. Go NE39. Law has to be a top 3 CB, while Surtain is top 7 IMO.. After that I think NE39 has explained it all correctly.

[Marino13Phins]

Lol, I don't mind watching a pats fan and a fins fan go at it on a Bills message board at all. Go NE39. Law has to be a top 3 CB, while Surtain is top 7 IMO.. After that I think NE39 has explained it all correctly.


I'd put Surtain higher then top 7.

[ParanoidAndroid]

If the refs call it both ways, on the receiver as well as the D-backs, then we all know who's going to be screwed. Randy "the push-off master" Moss.