For those calling for Losman...

[Ebenezer]

...park it. The kid is a pure rookie from Tulane. He wasn't ready before the injury and we aren't going to see him until at least week 8. In preseason he had happy feet and locked in on receivers (against 2nd and 3rd teamers). He is not ready.

[FTG]

.... In preseason he had happy feet and locked in on receivers .


Bledsoe is doing the exact same things now in the regular season.

[FTG]

and why tell people to "park it" Is'nt the reason for having this place to allow for opinions?

[alohabillsfan]

As much as I had hoped Drew would improve I just do not see it! I will take my chances with anyone else. The PATS were losing when drew got hurt and all of a sudden they are in the super bowl, so don't tell me that some rookie or anyone else for that matter cannot improve this team! SIT DREW and lets see what happens.

[alohabillsfan]

As much as I had hoped Drew would improve I just do not see it! I will take my chances with anyone else. The PATS were losing when drew got hurt and all of a sudden they are in the super bowl, so don't tell me that some rookie or anyone else for that matter cannot improve this team! SIT DREW and lets see what happens.


P.S. Our future is JP and Willis so lets see them together when JP is healed

[chernobylwraiths]

and why tell people to "park it" Is'nt the reason for having this place to allow for opinions?

Yes, just not yours.

:D

[TheGhostofJimKelly]

What is worse, having happy feet and locking on receivers or having stone feet and not being able to see your receivers?

[JJamezz]

Rookie QB's don't have a whole lot of success whether they're ready or not.. I'd rather have gone down with the ship with Losman and get him some experience than sit through this crap another year. It boggles my mind that this team actually looks WORSE than last year.

:crazy:

[juice]

It boggles my mind that this team actually looks WORSE than last year.

:crazy:
It really doesn't surprise me that the offense looks worse than last year when we did nothing to upgrade an already pathetic O-Line.. I cant say that the Vallerial move was an upgrade plus he seems to be injury prone.

[JJamezz]

What surprises me is that the addition of an entirely new coaching staff on the offensive side - 2 of which turned Stewart and Maddox into competent players - 1 of which turned chicken s**t into chicken salad with the Giants line... I realize its only 2 games in, but I thought this offense would look noticeably better right off the bat.

[Tatonka]

i was thinking the same thing on both your post FTG..

and you too Ghost.

i will scream for jp or anyone else until that POS bledsoe is gone.. i cant wait for this miserable run of qbs since kelly has left to end..

it has been NINE YEARS since we have had a single qb that was worth more than a smelly pile of dog doo.

[juice]

What surprises me is that the addition of an entirely new coaching staff on the offensive side - 2 of which turned Stewart and Maddox into competent players - 1 of which turned chicken s**t into chicken salad with the Giants line... I realize its only 2 games in, but I thought this offense would look noticeably better right off the bat.
It all starts with the Blocking up front in Pass and run situations.. We already knew that DB was not very MOBILE from last year, Getting rid of our most experienced Lineman and replacing him with a Ravens practice squad player wasn't the Line upgrade that everyone in Buffalo was expecting from TD.

The GM said the "Line would be fixed" and nothing was done in the off-season to address the issues REALLY.

Bledsoe was put into an almost impossible situation with the Five-up-front.

[LtBillsFan66]

At worst, we would be 0-2 with Losman.

I'm not calling for him to start (if he wasn't hurt). But maybe put him in in situations, to get his feet wet.

[Ebenezer]

i was thinking the same thing on both your post FTG..

and you too Ghost.

i will scream for jp or anyone else until that POS bledsoe is gone.. i cant wait for this miserable run of qbs since kelly has left to end..

it has been NINE YEARS since we have had a single qb that was worth more than a smelly pile of dog doo.
Larry Felser had an article when Kelly retired...he WARNED people not to expect another Kelly for a couple of generations if not their LIFETIME...name me another team with two QBs of that stature in their history (except SF with Montana and Young)...it just doesn't happen...

After Tarkington in Minn...maybe Culpepper.
Denver after Elway?
Miami after Marino?
KC after Dawson?? - -how about that one - - 40 years!!!

[FTG]

I realize its only 2 games in, but I thought this offense would look noticeably better right off the bat.

I think most of us did.

[Ebenezer]

What surprises me is that the addition of an entirely new coaching staff on the offensive side - 2 of which turned Stewart and Maddox into competent players - 1 of which turned chicken s**t into chicken salad with the Giants line... I realize its only 2 games in, but I thought this offense would look noticeably better right off the bat.
not off the bat...look at the OL...shambles...I'm not going to take the time to find it but I said it would take at least 6 games for them to gel.

[Valerie]

If Losman can't play due to injury and Drew just plain sucks, looks like AVP is the only other choice left. But, do you really think they're going to bench Drew?

[Iehoshua]

If Losman can't play due to injury and Drew just plain sucks, looks like AVP is the only other choice left. But, do you really think they're going to bench Drew?
I don't think AVP is coming back at this point...

[TheGhostofJimKelly]

The QB doesn't have to be Jim Kelly. He doesn't have to be that great, he just can't suck.

[Ebenezer]

If Losman can't play due to injury and Drew just plain sucks, looks like AVP is the only other choice left. But, do you really think they're going to bench Drew?
AVP is now a radio broadcaster and had fusion surgery in the offseason...the earliest he can play is December...if he even wanted to...

[Valerie]

Oh, I didn't realize AVP was gone. *I didn't follow pre-season stuff at all* Sorry. My bad. :blush: I think we're in trouble. :(

[FTG]

The QB doesn't have to be Jim Kelly. He doesn't have to be that great, he just can't suck.

:bf1:

[HAMMER]

...park it. The kid is a pure rookie from Tulane. He wasn't ready before the injury and we aren't going to see him until at least week 8. In preseason he had happy feet and locked in on receivers (against 2nd and 3rd teamers). He is not ready.

No he is not, but he couldn't be worse than Bledsoe. When an NFL QB can't throw a decent dump pass it is time for a change. If we aren't going to throw downfield we should start Mathews.

[Ebenezer]

No he is not, but he couldn't be worse than Bledsoe. When an NFL QB can't throw a decent dump pass it is time for a change. If we aren't going to throw downfield we should start Mathews.
why couldn't he be worse??? cause he is mobile??? go back to 85...people didn't think it could be worse without Ferragamo...Dufek, Mathesion...remember those winners?

[MikeInRoch]

I think the point is not that JP would win us more games, but that if we aren't making the playoffs anyway, he should be out there getting experience.

[Ebenezer]

or getting killed...how many rookie 1st round QBs get their career in a dumper because they play behind a terrible line or on a terrible team...

Akili Smith
Cade McNown
David Klingler...and on and on and on and on...

[DraftBoy]

Ok and look at the situations all those QB's are put into....Everybody here will agree and say Buffalo easily has the talent on this team to go 8-8, hell almost all of us thought we had a good shot at the wild card. Now we got **** and our OL and QB are to blame. We know we got a immobile QB and we know we got a bad OL. So I dont see how a moblie QB who can move and throw on the run, can do any worse than an immobile one who cant throw whether he's on the walk or not. Bledsoe cant make a good throw with or without time, in my roundtable discussion I said that Bledsoe had to use whatever time he was given to make a smart decisions and it doesnt look like it clicked, I blame mainly the coaching for that bc this version of offense just isnt working at all...If we only got like 2-3 wins under our belts come week 8 when Losman is back at 100% the future is now!

[The_Philster]

or getting killed...how many rookie 1st round QBs get their career in a dumper because they play behind a terrible line or on a terrible team...

Akili Smith
Cade McNown
David Klingler...and on and on and on and on...
agreed :up: That's why I want to see us bring along Losman slowly...like the Oilers did with McNair...he turned out ok, I think :idunno:

[HenryRules]

or getting killed...how many rookie 1st round QBs get their career in a dumper because they play behind a terrible line or on a terrible team...

Akili Smith
Cade McNown
David Klingler...and on and on and on and on...

How do you know that's the reason they failed? Druckenmiller (that guy for the 49ers) sat for a while and didn't turn out to well.

McNabb, Manning, and Plummer all started right off the bat and are 3 of the best QB's in the NFL right now.

[Marvelous]

Larry Felser had an article when Kelly retired...he WARNED people not to expect another Kelly for a couple of generations if not their LIFETIME...name me another team with two QBs of that stature in their history (except SF with Montana and Young)...it just doesn't happen...

After Tarkington in Minn...maybe Culpepper.
Denver after Elway?
Miami after Marino?
KC after Dawson?? - -how about that one - - 40 years!!!

Stabauch - Aikman
Vinny - Pennington
Cunningham - Mcnabb
Just off top o my head.

[Dozerdog]

Kind of a silly argument to make until the leg heals. I don't want to put him in at 90% for a "learning curve"

[HenryRules]

Stabauch - Aikman
Vinny - Pennington
Cunningham - Mcnabb
Just off top o my head.

Staubach didn't really lead to Aikman, Danny White was in there

Jaworski - Cunningham wasn't bad.
Tarkenton - Kramer (Minny)
Bartkowski and Miller were both pro bowlers in Atlanta I think
Moon - McNair in Houston
Lamonica to Stabler in Oakland

That's all that I can think of off the top of my head.

[Ebenezer]

Stabauch - Aikman
Vinny - Pennington
Cunningham - Mcnabb
Just off top o my head.
Please stop...

I'll give you Staubach and Aikman are HOFers...seperated by almost 20 years...

Neither Vinny nor Pennington are superstars of Kelly, Elway or Marinos caliber...
Cunningham is not a HOFer and neither is McNabb (as of now)...

again, it doesn't happen but ever couple of decades or so...maybe Losman will be the one...I'm not holding my breath though...

[HenryRules]

Please stop...

I'll give you Staubach and Aikman are HOFers...seperated by almost 20 years...

Neither Vinny nor Pennington are superstars of Kelly, Elway or Marinos caliber...
Cunningham is not a HOFer and neither is McNabb (as of now)...

again, it doesn't happen but ever couple of decades or so...maybe Losman will be the one...I'm not holding my breath though...


Bledsoe-Brady???

[Ebenezer]

Staubach didn't really lead to Aikman, Danny White was in there

Jaworski - Cunningham wasn't bad.
Tarkenton - Kramer (Minny)
Bartkowski and Miller were both pro bowlers in Atlanta I think
Moon - McNair in Houston
Lamonica to Stabler in Oakland

That's all that I can think of off the top of my head.
I am not asking for Pro Bowlers...I am asking for HOFers...

again...how many of those guys are HOFers...how many in the Kelly, Marino and Elway class...

[willis_mchenry]

Bledsoe and the Pats started 0-2 in '96 and got to the Super Bowl. I know Bledsoe was younger and maybe better and I'm not saying that it will happen this year or that I think it can happen but the season is not over either. I'm sure a lot of people wrote them off last year but things can change and they snuck up on teams just like the Bills can do if they fix all of their problems.

[HenryRules]

Griese and Marino were back-to-back I think.
Anderson and Esaison were good back-to-back.

That's all that I can think of with reflection.

[FTG]

Please stop...

I'll give you Staubach and Aikman are HOFers...seperated by almost 20 years...

Neither Vinny nor Pennington are superstars of Kelly, Elway or Marinos caliber...
Cunningham is not a HOFer and neither is McNabb (as of now)...

again, it doesn't happen but ever couple of decades or so...maybe Losman will be the one...I'm not holding my breath though...

No ones asking for a superstar hall of famer. We've had nothing but crap since Kelly retired. Finding a good QB can be done. 49ers found Garcia when Young retired. You don't have to have a superstar to win, just something better than dead weight like we have.

[HenryRules]

I am not asking for Pro Bowlers...I am asking for HOFers...

again...how many of those guys are HOFers...how many in the Kelly, Marino and Elway class...

Well, in a normal decade, there's only 3 or 4 QB's that make the HOF. The same can be said about any position (i.e. Henry is no Thurman).

Lamonica - Stabler, I'd say both of them are right up there for best of their era.
Moon - McNair, same thing.

I'm not trying to say it happens often, I was just trying to name names.

[Ebenezer]

Griese and Marino were back-to-back I think.
Anderson and Esaison were good back-to-back.

That's all that I can think of with reflection.
I might give you Griese...he was not a great QB by today's standards but I'll give...

Are either Anderson or Esiason in the HOF?? (I don't think either one is)

Neither Lamonica nor Stabler are in the HOF

Neither Moon nor McNair are in the HOF

[Ebenezer]

Bledsoe-Brady???
Bledsoe is not a HOFer according to the folks around here...and he is nowhere near Kelly's class...but that would be an instance of a HOFer followed by an HOFer...and remember every team in the league passed on Brady 5 times...including NE!

[HenryRules]

I might give you Griese...he was not a great QB by today's standards but I'll give...

Are either Anderson or Esiason in the HOF?? (I don't think either one is)

Neither Lamonica nor Stabler are in the HOF

Neither Moon nor McNair are in the HOF

Lamonica and Stabler may not be in the HOF, but the 12 years or so that those two were starters for Oakland, they had one of the best 3 or 4 QB positions in the NFL. They may not have had HOF careers, but they gave Oakland HOF performances for their time in charge.

McNair is still playing and is one of the top QB's in the game. I think he's on his way to a HOF career if he continues.
Moon I consider one of the bigger oversights for the HOF. The only reason he's not in is because of racisim in the NFL in the 80s - people forget that he missed some of his best years.

[HenryRules]

Bledsoe is not a HOFer according to the folks around here...and he is nowhere near Kelly's class...but that would be an instance of a HOFer followed by an HOFer...and remember every team in the league passed on Brady 5 times...including NE!

That one was meant as a joke.

[Ebenezer]

That one was meant as a joke.
But have I made my point that superstar QBs on the same team doesn't exactly happen ever 20 years or so, if ever?

[Mr. Cynical]

Who says we have to have another Kelly? I'd be happy with a "good" QB and those come around often enough. I mean, 8 years since Kelly and we can't get a good QB? Unacceptable.

As for starting rookie QBs....

P. Manning
McNabb
Bradshaw
Marino

...all seemed to work out ok, so it can happen.

Look at this way...

Drew is gone next year without a doubt.
The season is shot (face it, we're not going to the playoffs)
JP is our QB of the future.
Why waste time with Drew any longer? Why not start preparing for the future now, instead of losing without at least gaining something positive?

[baalworship]

Who says we have to have another Kelly? I'd be happy with a "good" QB and those come around often enough. I mean, 8 years since Kelly and we can't get a good QB? Unacceptable.

As for starting rookie QBs....

P. Manning
McNabb
Bradshaw
Marino

...all seemed to work out ok, so it can happen.

Look at this way...

Drew is gone next year without a doubt.
The season is shot (face it, we're not going to the playoffs)
JP is our QB of the future.
Why waste time with Drew any longer? Why not start preparing for the future now, instead of losing without at least gaining something positive?

Exactly. As soon as Losman can play he needs to start.

[Dozerdog]

Griese and Marino were back-to-back I think.
Anderson and Esaison were good back-to-back.

That's all that I can think of with reflection.


Close enough- 3-4 year gap




Starr- Favre?

[HenryRules]

But have I made my point that superstar QBs on the same team doesn't exactly happen ever 20 years or so, if ever?

I never disagreed with you ... I was just having fun naming names.

[Ebenezer]

Close enough- 3-4 year gap




Starr- Favre?


I'll give you that one...30 years apart...

[Drewpac]

Lamonica and Stabler may not be in the HOF, but the 12 years or so that those two were starters for Oakland, they had one of the best 3 or 4 QB positions in the NFL. They may not have had HOF careers, but they gave Oakland HOF performances for their time in charge.

McNair is still playing and is one of the top QB's in the game. I think he's on his way to a HOF career if he continues.
Moon I consider one of the bigger oversights for the HOF. The only reason he's not in is because of racisim in the NFL in the 80s - people forget that he missed some of his best years.


Moon is a definite hall-of-famer. He is not eligible until next year (He retired in 2000), and he'll get in at that time. Moon IS considered one of the all-time greats.