J.P. Losman should start...here's why.

[RedEyE]

It appears that Losman will be healthy and ready for some football in about 2 to 3 weeks time. Upon his return, I'd like to see Bledsoe take the back seat and let the kid grab the wheel.

1) At 0-4, 0-2 in the division, it's obvious that this Bills team is not playoff bound. While they're not mathmatically eliminated from playoff contention, it would take a strong Bills sweep for the rest of the season, and a crumbling fall from either the Jets or the Pats. Neither which seems probable. While Bledsoe is NOT completely to blame for the Bills record, the offense is STILL FLAT. Mularkey needs to send a statement to his players letting them know that poor performance will not be tolerated. Nothing could make a louder statement then benching Bledose.

2) Is Losman ready? Most likely not, but if this kid is the Bills future, he's not going to get the experience necessary to win by watching Drew on the sideline. Besides, Losman has something that Bledsoe does not have - an extra dimension. Losman has the ability to put blitzing defenses to rest by running out of / or running away from their blitzing schemes. While Losman's inexpereince will cause certain problems, this extra dimension can solve others. With a scrammbling QB, opposing defenses will be forced to play more conservativly, which, in turn, should open up the running game for the Bills. INTs will go up, but sacks and fumbles should technically decrease. The OL gets a break from having to try and pick up a blitz 2 out of every 3 offensive plays.

3) The Bills need a spark...a hot, blazing fire beneath their ass. Rallying around a rookie leader should make others around him to take their game up an extra notch. Will this help the Bills win games? Well, yes and no. JP will make more mistakes than Drew has because of his inexperience, but the move should induce team intensity and increase performance levels.

4) The Fans are restless. If (I strongly emphasis IF)...If the Bills lose to Miami, at home, on Sunday, the Fans will be calling for heads to roll. As if that isn't alredy happening. Desperate times call for desperate measures. I ask you, can Losman be worse for this offense? I think not.

At the very least, Losman will provide a different kind of excitement for ticket holders. A fresh start offers up new opportunites, and while no one will expect Losman to preform miracles, the pure notion that he might, should be enough to keep us all glued to the TV and our seats for the next 1 and 1/2 seasons.

[BillsFever21]

I agree 100%. This team isn't going anywhere. We are looking at another 3 or 4 win season.

The odds of Bledsoe returning as the starter next year are about as slim as one of us scoring a date with the Olsen twins. We midas well use the last 8 games as an opportunity for Losman to gain game experience for next year.

If we're gonna lose this year I'd rather lose with the young guy the Bills braintrust are depending on in the future years.

The game experience Losman could gain this year would do wonders going into next year. If he is a first time starter going into next year we will most likely piss away another season.

I'd rather get some of his growing pains over this year. It's not like we are giving anything up in the process. We're gonna lose anyway.

And hell who knows maybe he could do some damage this year. Ben Rothlesberger is 3-0 and looking tight in his first 3 starts.

[EDS]

I wouldn't mind seeing Loseman get some experience this year.

[RedEyE]

I agree 100%. This team isn't going anywhere. We are looking at another 3 or 4 win season.

The odds of Bledsoe returning as the starter next year are about as slim as one of us scoring a date with the Olsen twins. We midas well use the last 8 games as an opportunity for Losman to gain game experience for next year.

If we're gonna lose this year I'd rather lose with the young guy the Bills braintrust are depending on in the future years.

The game experience Losman could gain this year would do wonders going into next year. If he is a first time starter going into next year we will most likely piss away another season.

I'd rather get some of his growing pains over this year. It's not like we are giving anything up in the process. We're gonna lose anyway.

And hell who knows maybe he could do some damage this year. Ben Rothlesberger is 3-0 and looking tight in his first 3 starts.

Excellent post. Great points. :up:

[BillsFever21]

Is JP's last name pronounced Losman as Lahhh-smon(Like ahhh, that beer tasted good)or is it pronounced as Low-smon?

I've heard it used both ways and always pronounced it Lahhhsmon but I've heard announcers pronounce it Lowsman. They also pronounce it Lowsman on Madden 2005.

[HenryRules]

Is JP's last name pronounced Losman as Lahhh-smon(Like ahhh, that beer tasted good)or is it pronounced as Low-smon?

I've heard it used both ways and always pronounced it Lahhhsmon but I've heard announcers pronounce it Lowsman. They also pronounce it Lowsman on Madden 2005.

I can't remember where ... but somewhere I heard it should be "Loss-men"

[Dozerdog]

I have heard it a bunch of ways

Loze- man

loss-man

lows-man

lahs-man



and "That guy who isn't Bledsoe"

[Tatonka]

great post.. positive rep points coming.

[DraftBoy]

Good points RedEye, any idea on the time table for Losman's recovery? Shouldnt be more than a month away by now correct?

[socalfan]

Los-man as in Los Angeles.

[Mr. Cynical]

I've been saying this as well, but since I'm a Drew hater people see it through colored glasses.

JP needs to start ASAP so that this year is not a total waste. If he gets exp now, we will be that much closer to being a real team again in '05/'06. Every second that Drew is behind center is another second wasted for the future of the Bills.

[JJamezz]

:clap:

[RedEyE]

Good points RedEye, any idea on the time table for Losman's recovery? Shouldnt be more than a month away by now correct?


I read on Yahoo that he would be praticing in 2 weeks. That tells me that he should be ready to go in 3-4.

[The_Philster]

I read on Yahoo that he would be praticing in 2 weeks. That tells me that he should be ready to go in 3-4.
unless Drew and the team make a drastic turnaround, I would hope he's starting then

[Bill Brasky]

Mularkey needs to send a statement to his players letting them know that poor performance will not be tolerated.

So should he bench the entire O-Line too?

[RedEyE]

So should he bench the entire O-Line too?

At this point, it's no longer a question of ability. It's about the future and training Losman into becoming a stronger QB.

[Typ0]

I wouldn't expect to see JP unless DB gets hurt.

[Charlieguide]

So should he bench the entire O-Line too?


At this point, it's no longer a question of ability. It's about the future and training Losman into becoming a stronger QB.

Good point, J. Bad point, Red and the rest.

Look, most of you know I'm not a Bledsoe hater. I try very hard to get to the bottom of the issue, and I see the line as the major problem.

Now, it sounds good that Losman is mobile, and might learn something from starting. But there's an old adage: those who don't know their history are bound to repeat it. History, in this case, is very recent, and very consistent.

As an Ohio resident, I know very well what has happened in Cincinnati the past decade or so. How many #1 quarterbacks have they drafted? Do you really think their scouts were that bad, that one of those guys wouldn't work out?

If that's not enough, look at Steve Young in Tampa Bay. He was a joke, until he got to SF and learned in a stable environment. Michael Vick, though quickly compiling highlights, hasn't put up many W's scrambling, because he hasn't learned the passing game, yet.

On the other side of the coin, look at Peyton Manning and David Carr. These guys were given time to develop behind impressive lines, and over the course of a few years, have become two of the best in the league. Culpepper sat for a year and watched talented vets work behind a decent line, then came in the next year on fire.

According to history, if Losman is put in behind this line, he will most likely be out of the league in five years. He'll never have had the chance to learn the position because he'll have been running for his life every down.

Also according to history, if Losman is given time to watch the game from the bench, and/or is placed behind a sturdy line, he will most likely succeed in the long run.

Take your pick, but if this season is already lost (and "that's why they play the games"), I'd rather not sacrifice our future, too.

[RedEyE]

Good point, J. Bad point, Red and the rest.

Look, most of you know I'm not a Bledsoe hater. I try very hard to get to the bottom of the issue, and I see the line as the major problem.

Now, it sounds good that Losman is mobile, and might learn something from starting. But there's an old adage: those who don't know their history are bound to repeat it. History, in this case, is very recent, and very consistent.

As an Ohio resident, I know very well what has happened in Cincinnati the past decade or so. How many #1 quarterbacks have they drafted? Do you really think their scouts were that bad, that one of those guys wouldn't work out?

If that's not enough, look at Steve Young in Tampa Bay. He was a joke, until he got to SF and learned in a stable environment. Michael Vick, though quickly compiling highlights, hasn't put up many W's scrambling, because he hasn't learned the passing game, yet.

On the other side of the coin, look at Peyton Manning and David Carr. These guys were given time to develop behind impressive lines, and over the course of a few years, have become two of the best in the league. Culpepper sat for a year and watched talented vets work behind a decent line, then came in the next year on fire.

According to history, if Losman is put in behind this line, he will most likely be out of the league in five years. He'll never have had the chance to learn the position because he'll have been running for his life every down.

Also according to history, if Losman is given time to watch the game from the bench, and/or is placed behind a sturdy line, he will most likely succeed in the long run.

Take your pick, but if this season is already lost (and "that's why they play the games"), I'd rather not sacrifice our future, too.

I think you might be reading too much into this. I don't feel the necessity of having Losman scrammble like a Mike Vick. Quite frankly, he's not that style of player. Losman does, however, provide enough running ability to elude defenses better than Bledsoe can currently.

To clarify; What I'm simply implying is that experience from the field of play far out weighs that of the sideline. If Losman doesn't learn from his mistakes this year, he's going to have to learn from them next. It's better to get those rookie mistakes out of the way now, while the stress and performance expectation levels are low. The Bills can utilize their own misfortune to get this kid ready to be the future franchise back we all desire. This type of experience might have him throwing like a champ by the middle of next season.

As for history lessons....

Try this on for size:

A short list of QBs that started at least 8 games their first season...

John Elway
Dan Marino
David Carr
Tom Brady
Jim McMahon
Michael Vick
Boomer Esiason
Drew Bledsoe
Payton Manning
Kerry Collins

..besides Brady, this list depicts only first rounders as far back as 1983. I could continue, but feel it not only unnecessary to prove a point, but the game from that era on is much different from how we view football today.

[HenryRules]

If that's not enough, look at Steve Young in Tampa Bay. He was a joke, until he got to SF and learned in a stable environment. Michael Vick, though quickly compiling highlights, hasn't put up many W's scrambling, because he hasn't learned the passing game, yet..

I was following you until here, but Vick has been very good at getting W's.

This year they're 4-1 with him as a starter (albeit they're defense takes a lot of responsibility for those)
Last year without Vick as a starter: Falcons went 2-10.
Last year with Vick as a starter: Falcons went 3-1 (more wins in 4 games than they had in 12 without him).
2002 with Vick as a starter: 8-6-1.
2001 with Vick as a stater: 1-1

All in all, Vick's record as a starter has been: 16-9-1. That's a lot of W's.

[Charlieguide]

RedEyE, you're missing my point. I wonder how many of the players you list started behind lousy offensive lines. I doubt very many.

It's not just about what year you start. It's about protection and coaching. Yes, this team has some of the best coaches a QB could hope for. But it doesn't have an OL. Put Losman in there, and -- planned scrambling or not -- he'll be either running for his life or getting hit every play. That's not a learning-friendly enviroment, and it won't bode well for his future.

This line is giving up one sack every seven passing plays. Find me one -- ONE!! -- quarterback who EVER came out of a situation like that as a star! Rookie or hall of famer, any QB you put behind this offensive line will fail. The difference is, a veteran can understand, learn, and deal with it better, while a rookie is likely to come out frustrated, confused, and without confidence. That's not a way to build for the future.

[Charlieguide]

I was following you until here, but Vick has been very good at getting W's.

This year they're 4-1 with him as a starter (albeit they're defense takes a lot of responsibility for those)
Last year without Vick as a starter: Falcons went 2-10.
Last year with Vick as a starter: Falcons went 3-1 (more wins in 4 games than they had in 12 without him).
2002 with Vick as a starter: 8-6-1.
2001 with Vick as a stater: 1-1

All in all, Vick's record as a starter has been: 16-9-1. That's a lot of W's.

tou che. So skip that part.
:ontome:

[RedEyE]

RedEyE, you're missing my point. I wonder how many of the players you list started behind lousy offensive lines. I doubt very many.

It's not just about what year you start. It's about protection and coaching. Yes, this team has some of the best coaches a QB could hope for. But it doesn't have an OL. Put Losman in there, and -- planned scrambling or not -- he'll be either running for his life or getting hit every play. That's not a learning-friendly enviroment, and it won't bode well for his future.

This line is giving up one sack every seven passing plays. Find me one -- ONE!! -- quarterback who EVER came out of a situation like that as a star! Rookie or hall of famer, any QB you put behind this offensive line will fail. The difference is, a veteran can understand, learn, and deal with it better, while a rookie is likely to come out frustrated, confused, and without confidence. That's not a way to build for the future.

No, you're the one missing the point. It's not about immediate gratification. You have to walk before you can crawl. If you think that this team is going to wait for the line to get better before putting Losman in, you're sadly mistaken. If they did things your way, the kid will be on the bench for the next 3 seasons, minimum.

The list that I provided for you, gave you plenty of individuals that excelled after learning the game. Most were banged up horribly in their first year, others did not. In other words, Losman WILL face adversity, but it's how he over comes it that will determine his future. Overcoming it positively will determine his level of greatness, but he won't even get to that point, if not put into that situation.

The OL really has nothing to do with this discussion. They're bad, regardless of who plays behind them.

[jbisset]

At this point, it's no longer a question of ability. It's about the future and training Losman into becoming a stronger QB.


And if he gets hurt...or get hit so much that he loses his confidence

[RedEyE]

And if he gets hurt...or get hit so much that he loses his confidence

Then he was never meant to be an NFL QB and the Bills will then know it much sooner than later.

[jbisset]

Jim Plunkett and NE...He came out of college as the next great QB...Got hit so much he could not play...LA benched him for a couple years to get his confidence back...not a good thing

[Iehoshua]

WHAT?! Bench Bledgod? How dare you anti-Bills fans suggest such treason!


I'm with you! GO LOSMAN!:wink:

[DraftBoy]

On the other side of the coin, look at Peyton Manning and David Carr. These guys were given time to develop behind impressive lines, and over the course of a few years, have become two of the best in the league. Culpepper sat for a year and watched talented vets work behind a decent line, then came in the next year on fire.



Please tell me you did not just call the Houston Texans line impressive in Carr's rookie year. Need I remind you that Carr was the most sacked QB his rookie year by far. It has been a big point in Houston to improve the OL for Carr. Sorry man usually your close to right on but here your not. Houston had a horrible line and its just now starting to improve and Carr has been good through it all. Also on a side point Carr did not take nearly as much punishment in college as Losman did. Neither did McNown, Leif, or Akili. Its one thing to say alot of these 1st rounders are rushed and cant handle the hits but Losman got punished enough in college to know what taking a sack feels like. He played behind one of the worst OL in college.

[Tatonka]

Please tell me you did not just call the Houston Texans line impressive in Carr's rookie year. Need I remind you that Carr was the most sacked QB his rookie year by far. It has been a big point in Houston to improve the OL for Carr. Sorry man usually your close to right on but here your not. Houston had a horrible line and its just now starting to improve and Carr has been good through it all. Also on a side point Carr did not take nearly as much punishment in college as Losman did. Neither did McNown, Leif, or Akili. Its one thing to say alot of these 1st rounders are rushed and cant handle the hits but Losman got punished enough in college to know what taking a sack feels like. He played behind one of the worst OL in college.

:up:

[Charlieguide]

Well, you guys have proven me wrong on two of my points.

On Carr, I was thinking of the priority they placed on the OL during the team's innaugural preseason/expansion draft. But yes, that emphasis failed (Boselli retired), Carr was beat up a lot, and came out ok.

I think my concern comes from having seen so many 'promising' QB's have their careers ruined in nearby cities. CIN and CLE have really done a number on several high draft picks over the past 10-20 years, and a lot of the problems here have been tied to OL, supporting skill positions, team attitude, and coaching. We have problems two of those four areas, and I'd hate to see Losman -- or any Bill -- go through that. It's hard enough seeing Drew go through it as a vet, but to bring a guy into the league that way is awful!

Maybe Losman can take it, who knows? I just don't think it's the right thing to do, for his sake, or anyone on the team. Drew isn't the root of the problem, ergo Losman isn't the solution.

And to put JP in because we want to get him reps for next year, what does that tell the players about giving up? Maybe if we end up at 0-10, you start thinking that way, but one major lesson this team needs to learn -- badly -- is how to fight tooth and nail for every inch, every snap, every game, no matter the situation.

[snow1989]

I agree, Losman should get the experience. The second question is : Will DB willingly take a back-up role and handle like a man, or want out. Not to mention the money issue.
Not matter who ends up behind center, its going to be a long day on any given Sunday unless the O-line is straightened out.

[Halbert]

I definitely don't think Bledsoe is the problem on this team right now, but I would still like to see Losman play asap.

The Bills would need to rip off a huge string or two of wins to be a legit playoff contender and I just don't think that's going to happen. We should have an even clearer view of that by the time JP is ready.

Let Bledsoe go to Dallas next year and light it up, if he can. My guess is that he will but with this season in the tank it's an investment to let JP play.

[alohabillsfan]

RedEyE, you're missing my point. I wonder how many of the players you list started behind lousy offensive lines. I doubt very many.

It's not just about what year you start. It's about protection and coaching. Yes, this team has some of the best coaches a QB could hope for. But it doesn't have an OL. Put Losman in there, and -- planned scrambling or not -- he'll be either running for his life or getting hit every play. That's not a learning-friendly enviroment, and it won't bode well for his future.

This line is giving up one sack every seven passing plays. Find me one -- ONE!! -- quarterback who EVER came out of a situation like that as a star! Rookie or hall of famer, any QB you put behind this offensive line will fail. The difference is, a veteran can understand, learn, and deal with it better, while a rookie is likely to come out frustrated, confused, and without confidence. That's not a way to build for the future.


Would all of you please stop!!!

Do we really think we have the absolute worse 5 lineman in the league all to ourselves?

Do you really believe that TH and WM are below avg. running backs?

Do you really believe that as soon as Bledsoe is injured all of a sudden the team jells and wins 2 super bowls with a late round draft pick as QB?

DB is hurt and A. Smith stars as NE running back? All right star is a little much.

The offense centers around the play of the QB. Threat of a run or role protects against the blitz, and will stop the 8 men in the box which in turn will open up some running room for either of the backs.

Good coaches make the tough (not the popular) calls,
Belichek- benched DB in favor of a winning T. Brady (whatever happen to that you don't lose your job when injured)?

I plead to Mularky, give the offense a chance make the call!