Starting Bledsoe in 2005 isn't the right move.

[BF_in_Indiana]

While the Bills are currently 6-6 and "in" the playoff hunt there is a simple fact that can't be ignored when discussing this current "dominating" stretch the Bills are having.

The Bills are 1-4 against teams with a winning record with a win against the Jets and losses to New England (twice), the Jets, and the Ravens.

Against teams at .500 or worse the Bills are 5-2 with wins against Miami (twice), Arizona, Seattle, and St. Louis.

As you can see, against the cream of the crop Drew has performed poorly and against the also rans he has been good/great at times.

Starting Drew is the wrong move for 2005 in my view because this inconsistant play will continue to lead to 8-8, 9-7, and 7-9 types of seasons.

If we go with J.P next year we may take a step back, but in the long run we take a step forward.

[colin]

wrong


we only take a step forward if JP developes very quickly, and stays healthy, so we can take advantage of all the vets on our squad.

even if we only go 8-8, we will finish as a hot team, going into next year we will have positive momentum and a competant coaching staff for the first time in a while. we need a vet QB who can play NOW. unless someone drops into our lap, we will keep bledsoe and that is the right move.

we won against the seahawks and rams, both with winning records at the time.

pointing out our losses to 3 or 4 of the top 6 or 7 teams in foot ball, including the superbowl champs who JUST SET A FREAKING RECORD FOR AN UNBEATEN STREAK and saying we need to ditch our QB because of it is just asinine. Was it in fact his fault entirely? And moreover, who will we replace him with? should ever QB in the NFL be cut for losing to New England? Could the fact that we have a rookie coaching staff have contributed to the loss? Could the fact that nearly no one ever wins in Baltimore and literaly no one has won in New england for years now?

replacing warner, who is worse than bledsoe, with Manning, who is MUCH MORE READY TO PLAY NOW THAN JP BY MILES, hurt the giants.

terrible

[Jan Reimers]

Why don't we see how the remainder of this season plays out before we worry too much about next year?

[SABURZFAN]

i'll worry about it when this season is over.

[ryjam282]

Exactly, let it play out. Who knows what might happen.

[Dozerdog]

If the Bills lose to the Bengals in 2 weeks- the JP losman era might start in San Fran.


I'll leave it up to the coaches best discretion.

[Forward_Lateral]

Uhhhmmmmm. St. Louis and Seattle both had winning records when the Bills beat them, sooooo Buffalo actually has a 3-4 record against winning teams, 2 of the losses can be put on Drew (especially Baltimore, I will never argue that).

[Tatonka]

i have nothing to add to this thread.

:D

[clumping platelets]

I disagree 100%. If Drew continues playing well, he's our man in 2005. Salary cap is not a concern as he would be making starter money. Pennington waited 2 seasons before he took over for the Jets, why can't Losman.

[ryjam282]

i have nothing to add to this thread.

:D


ZB whore :snicker:

[Philagape]

Just let there be an open competition in camp. Shouldn't that be the philosophy at every position? Let the best players at the time start.

JP has to EARN the job.

[justasportsfan]

Drew would have to carry this team on his shoulders and win the remaining games on our schedule for us to believe he's worthy of keeping his job.

Should he play horribly even for just 1 game, he will still be considered a streaky qb who isn't consistent and can blow a game at any given point in the season. He cannot afford to suck against any teams we face and even against the no.1 D which is the Steelers. Even if he plays like a probowl against the browns, bengals and 49'ers but not against the Steelers, he will still be considered a qb who can't beat good teams.

Should this happen, he should not be handed the job next year and should have to COMPETE w/ JP for the no. 1 spot.

We got rid of Flutie even though he was better than RJ but RJ was considered the future. We're in the same situation again but JP would have to be given a chance to compete for the no. 1 spot.

[BillsFanInMass]

You just have to believe the Bills will do the right thing they know more than us . They watch the qbs practice everyday they know who is ready and gives us the best chance to win. GO Bills

[chernobylwraiths]

Buffalo actually has a 3-4 record against winning teams, 2 of the losses can be put on Drew (especially Baltimore, I will never argue that).

I know that I'm in the minority here on this one, but I do not think Drew played as bad in Baltimore as everyone here seems to think, especially for those just looking at the the INT column. I contend that whether thrown a little hard or not, the first INT (that was a TD by Sanders) was right in McGahee's hands. I thought the ball went right through them, up into the air and into Sander's hands. Some feel that it was punched out, either way, I won't fault him on that one. Second one, was a bad throw, that goes on him. I don't know whether he was throwing it up for the receiver to make a play or whatever, it was a poorly thrown ball. Third one we were going to score a FG anyway, I think a false start pushed us back from the one, regardless, the ball was right in Josh Reed's hands on third and goal and Ray Lewis practically raped him to push the ball out and it was intercepted again. I can't fault Drew on that one either. The last one, even the "haters" (just using a term you can all understand :D) would contend should have been caught by Moulds. Yes, he threw behind Moulds on one ball that could have been a TD and another was broken up in the endzone that also was catchable.

I think it was the Raider's game that he played his second poorest game and if any other game could be laid on his shoulders, it was that one.

[TheBrownBear]

While the Bills are currently 6-6 and "in" the playoff hunt there is a simple fact that can't be ignored when discussing this current "dominating" stretch the Bills are having.

The Bills are 1-4 against teams with a winning record with a win against the Jets and losses to New England (twice), the Jets, and the Ravens.

Against teams at .500 or worse the Bills are 5-2 with wins against Miami (twice), Arizona, Seattle, and St. Louis.

As you can see, against the cream of the crop Drew has performed poorly and against the also rans he has been good/great at times.

Starting Drew is the wrong move for 2005 in my view because this inconsistant play will continue to lead to 8-8, 9-7, and 7-9 types of seasons.

If we go with J.P next year we may take a step back, but in the long run we take a step forward.
Great well thought out post supported by facts. TheBrownBear says ignore the "Drewlickers". They cannot be reasoned with.:clap:

[BF_in_Indiana]

In 2005 J.P may not get us to the playoffs but I'm looking ahead to 2006 and beyond. The core of the team will be here a few more years. If you look at Drew and his QB rating in the losses compared with the wins you will notice that he plays horribly against the quality NFL teams and great against the terrible ones. The last time I checked they don't have any 4-12 teams in the playoffs. What we want as fans will never be achieved with Bledsoe as QB. That's the point I'm trying to make basically.

[finsrclowns]

:tired:

[Drive 4 Five]

In 2005 J.P may not get us to the playoffs but I'm looking ahead to 2006 and beyond. The core of the team will be here a few more years. If you look at Drew and his QB rating in the losses compared with the wins you will notice that he plays horribly against the quality NFL teams and great against the terrible ones. The last time I checked they don't have any 4-12 teams in the playoffs. What we want as fans will never be achieved with Bledsoe as QB. That's the point I'm trying to make basically.

Yeah but if the Ravens could win a championship with Trent Dilfer, then I don't see any reason why we can't do it with Bledose. We all know he is capable, and can look to bigger and better things for this team now that Drew Bledose does not have to try and carry the entire team. We have the roleplayers in place now and I expect these guys to keep winning. If we are going to ahve any chance at making the playoffs and beyond (even if it takes next year), our chances live and die with Drew Bledsoe.

[Mr. Cynical]

i have nothing to add to this thread.

:D
Nor do I. BF said it all. :D

[Ebenezer]

We got rid of Flutie even though he was better than RJ but RJ was considered the future.


Flutie was gotten rid of for one reason: salary cap. The team was being ripped apart. If the Bills has ditched RJ and kept DF they would not have been able to resign Moulds and/or they would have cut more vets. Think 3-13 was bad that year? It could have been worse.

[Ebenezer]

Nor do I. BF said it all. :D
BFD...you guys wouldn't want DB back if the Bills won the SB with him at the helm.

[Mr. Cynical]

BFD...you guys wouldn't want DB back if the Bills won the SB with him at the helm.
Sure we would. JP needs a clipboard holder. :snicker:

[BF_in_Indiana]

I don't hate Drew. I like Drew a lot, but I am honest enough with myself about the team to realize that Drew isn't going to be the guy to get over the hump.

The Ravens did win with Trent Dilfer, they also had one of the greatest defenses of all time and all Dilfer did was not screw up. I am not confident enough in Drew to do that. He screws up at the worst times and chokes when the game is on the line. These are not the qualities we need from the QB position at this point.

The one thing I will say in defense of Flutie.........he was a leader. I'm not sure Drew has ever had that in him, and RJ certainly didn't have it.

[The Predator]

While the Bills are currently 6-6 and "in" the playoff hunt there is a simple fact that can't be ignored when discussing this current "dominating" stretch the Bills are having.

The Bills are 1-4 against teams with a winning record with a win against the Jets and losses to New England (twice), the Jets, and the Ravens.

Against teams at .500 or worse the Bills are 5-2 with wins against Miami (twice), Arizona, Seattle, and St. Louis.

As you can see, against the cream of the crop Drew has performed poorly and against the also rans he has been good/great at times.

Starting Drew is the wrong move for 2005 in my view because this inconsistant play will continue to lead to 8-8, 9-7, and 7-9 types of seasons.

If we go with J.P next year we may take a step back, but in the long run we take a step forward.
Good Post!!! I Agree 100%

GO BILLS>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>04

[NapalmDeath]

i have nothing to add to this thread.

:D

Of course you don't it is a hater thread. You only add to the so called lover threads. And flip out

[NapalmDeath]

Sure we would. JP needs a clipboard holder. :snicker:


See above post

[NapalmDeath]

Against teams at .500 or worse the Bills are 5-2 with wins against Miami (twice), Arizona, Seattle, and St. Louis.

As you can see, against the cream of the crop Drew has performed poorly and against the also rans he has been good/great at times.

Yeah, I forgot it was Drew's fault that they lost to Jax, Oakland and the Jets.



Starting Drew is the wrong move for 2005 in my view because this inconsistant play will continue to lead to 8-8, 9-7, and 7-9 types of seasons.

I just have to laugh at this comment. OK Mr. Cleo. Drew has had 2 bad games this year. TWO. Ah the hell with it lets cut him now! There are 10 other guys on the field the same time Bledsoe is out there. Why not cut Moulds? He has dropped more passes and made more mistakes than he did in his rookie year. London Fletcher? He has made the most stupid mistakes this year then he has entire NFL career. And let's not forget Nate. He PERSONALLY lost the Jax game.



If we go with J.P next year we may take a step back, but in the long run we take a step forward.

Well this season hasn't even ended yet, and since a few you posters think we might as well give up the season, why not give up next years as well. No matter what happens this year, it will be a competition for the starting QB job next year. And I will bet $$ who wins the job.

[BF_in_Indiana]

Yeah, I forgot it was Drew's fault that they lost to Jax, Oakland and the Jets.



I just have to laugh at this comment. OK Mr. Cleo. Drew has had 2 bad games this year. TWO. Ah the hell with it lets cut him now! There are 10 other guys on the field the same time Bledsoe is out there. Why not cut Moulds? He has dropped more passes and made more mistakes than he did in his rookie year. London Fletcher? He has made the most stupid mistakes this year then he has entire NFL career. And let's not forget Nate. He PERSONALLY lost the Jax game.



Well this season hasn't even ended yet, and since a few you posters think we might as well give up the season, why not give up next years as well. No matter what happens this year, it will be a competition for the starting QB job next year. And I will bet $$ who wins the job.

I would be perfectly happy with open competition next year. If J.P can't beat out Drew than he should continue to watch and learn. Drew did not lose us the Jaguars game, but he was horrible in the Oakland game and horrible against the Jets (spare 3 minutes). This offense is capable of doing what they have done the last 3 weeks, but when Bledsoe has an "off" week the offense is a complete non factor. You can't win games like that. I would rather take my chances with the type of QB where even if they aren't on their game we could still put up 17-20 points.

I like Drew as a person and don't think of him the way I did RJ on the field, but he just is not the guy to lead Buffalo any further than we are now.

[ScottLawrence]

I don't understand why some posters think starting Losman next year is giving up on the season.

With our defense?....and our running game(A 100% Willis McGahee)? I see no reason why this team can't be a playoff team next year even with Losman starting.

We have no idea what we have in Losman.

[Mr. Cynical]

See above post
If someone were to present a logical argument refuting what BF said, then I'll add. So far I haven't seen one.

[DaBills]

Why do you guys pick on Drew so much? It's not his fault. It's everyone else around him! When he throws INTs with 4-5 secs in the pocket and an open receiver, that's the wind's fault, don't you know that???!

Overlook his wide open check-off guy in the flat in favor of a double-teamed Moulds downfield? The guy in the flat would have eventually been tackled, so why throw to him!!?

And side-stepping an oncoming blitz is not the right thing to do – stop drop and roll is. Don't you guys know anything???

And besides, Drew never broke a leg taking a sack, so we need him in there!!!! JP would be killed!!!


;-p


Ok, reality check:


"Yeah but if the Ravens could win a championship with Trent Dilfer, then I don't see any reason why we can't do it with Bledose."

In theory, I agree, but the key to that was Dilfer not playing beyond himself, and also not having a problem being for the most part, a QB that hands off the ball and throws medium-range passes.

Dilfer was better at managing drives with a short passing game and good running attack. When Drew fails in the Dilfer role it's because he gets greedy and goes to the deep ball as his only weapon. And when that fails, two or three of those that miss their target have had a huge impact on killing drives for us this year.

DLC will say what they want about how 'it's the WR's fault' in those cases or 'no pass protection', but the fact remains many of those incompletes occurred WITHOUT a rush when he had 4-5 secs and many WERE poor passes off-target.

In those instances, you need to get back to what works when the deep threat missfires, and go with a higher percentage short game with screens and slants.

I admire his resolve to keep firing it deep until he gets it right/connects, but at what point do you say 'hey, the game clock is ticking away and it just ain't working, time for a change.'

Drew's ego will not allow him to reign in that deep-bomb game in favor of the shorter pass attack in those situations. He just can't help himself.

No one in DLC land has an answer for that.

[Mr. Cynical]

...hears crickets...

[DaBills]

You funny long time.

[G. Host]

Should he play horribly even for just 1 game, he will still be considered a streaky qb who isn't consistent and can blow a game at any given point in the season.

EVERY QB has a bad day. Farve just had a terrible game against Eagles. Even Jim Kelly had absolutely terrible games and MOST times fans were not calling for him to be benched but for our QB to play better and game plan to be better. There were some during that period who were edged on by Dickerson to ignite a war but most treated them like morons.

Drew ought to compete when coaching staff feels there ought to be a change and not when edged on by fans. Marv Levy said it best that when you start listening to fans, you start sitting with them.

[colin]

Drew would have to carry this team on his shoulders and win the remaining games on our schedule for us to believe he's worthy of keeping his job.

Should he play horribly even for just 1 game, he will still be considered a streaky qb who isn't consistent and can blow a game at any given point in the season. He cannot afford to suck against any teams we face and even against the no.1 D which is the Steelers. Even if he plays like a probowl against the browns, bengals and 49'ers but not against the Steelers, he will still be considered a qb who can't beat good teams.

Should this happen, he should not be handed the job next year and should have to COMPETE w/ JP for the no. 1 spot.

We got rid of Flutie even though he was better than RJ but RJ was considered the future. We're in the same situation again but JP would have to be given a chance to compete for the no. 1 spot.

So if your vet QB is not completely dominating against every team in the NFL including the best one this year, you cut him and replace him with the rawest rookie QB to come out of the first round, who also broke his leg?

[DaBills]

Why are we talking about Drew like he's a two year vet going through growing pains? He's a 10+ year vet. He's like the stock market. Up one minute, down the next. There's no consistancy, and that's the problem.

I look at Rothlesburger and the dude has what, an 11-game win streak as a rook? You watch him and it's obvious he gets it. Pocket presence (sp), scrambling ability, heads-up play for a rook.



"Originally Posted by justasportsfan
Should he play horribly even for just 1 game, he will still be considered a streaky qb who isn't consistent and can blow a game at any given point in the season. "

Agreed. Because he doesn't have a wealth of great games to his credit to cash in. He needs to win out to show he over whatever problems he had adjusting to the offense. I'll give 3 out of 4. I want him to beat Pitt, but by then, it may be a meaningless game for them.




"So if your vet QB is not completely dominating against every team in the NFL including the best one this year, you cut him and replace him with the rawest rookie QB to come out of the first round, who also broke his leg?"

No, but let's face it, Drew has had the QB spot given to him unchallenged for two years before this season. What QB in this day and age has that??? Maybe a Favre, but he at least won a SB to remain safe as a starter. Short of that, I can't think of any.

It can not be said that Drew has not been given a fair shot as a starter. Based on his up and down play, a three game win streak isn't enough at this point to erase any doubt. Win out, go 3 of 4 and we'll talk. get us into the playoffs, and we'll shut up. Maybe.

Until he wins most games, not all btw, he still has an RJ monkey on his back.

[Demon]

Yeah but if the Ravens could win a championship with Trent Dilfer, then I don't see any reason why we can't do it with Bledose.

But then, couldn't that be also said for JP Losman?

I agree with whoever said JP has to deserve the spot. I disagree with putting JP into the fire with no expierence. If we are out of the playoff run and start JP vs SF and Pitt, then i think he should be starter in 2005. If Drew starts every game this season, i think he should be starting. When 90% of the team is ready to win and be a contender next season, i don't want a QB with no expierence make rookie mistakes that could be costly and lose games.

[BF_in_Indiana]

EVERY QB has a bad day. Farve just had a terrible game against Eagles. Even Jim Kelly had absolutely terrible games and MOST times fans were not calling for him to be benched but for our QB to play better and game plan to be better. There were some during that period who were edged on by Dickerson to ignite a war but most treated them like morons.

Drew ought to compete when coaching staff feels there ought to be a change and not when edged on by fans. Marv Levy said it best that when you start listening to fans, you start sitting with them.

Drew should be forced to compete for the quarterback job next year. He had an excellent 2002, but his 2003-04 has not been very good. 2004 is a big improvement I will admit, but his production has been mediocre at best. I would just like to see a competition for the job. If Drew is the better quarterback in camp next year he will be starting on opening day, if not it's time to move on.

[helmetguy]

If Peyton Manning sucks ass and loses in the playoffs again, will Indy make a play for Philip Rivers in the offseason? Has anyone looked into his "big game" performance record? Just as one point of reference/context?

[DaBills]

You guys keep acting like Drew's been so good to this point that he's above speculation. This ain't Manning or Favre here. Three games in an erratic career. Wow, what a trend.

And as far as competition in camp? Rj and Drew ALWAYS look good — in camp.

[helmetguy]

I'm just trying to close in on a little bit of context. Manning is the fair haired boy right now with the TD record chase and all. Wasn't it just last season that he won his first playoff game? He won two, actually, making him 2-4 all time. Guys wanna throw numbers around, but don't wanna put any in perspective. Come up with a definitive, spin free yard stick. Otherwise, it sound and fury signifying nothing.

[DaBills]

"Come up with a definitive, spin free yard stick."

What the yardstick constitutes is the problem though. (As far as spin, I didn't invent Drew's up and down W-L record. Just when he starts winning, and you think the pieces are falling into place, boom, he falls apart.)

Talking about Favre in a playoff context is easy, since he's been there so often — proven winner. But playoff appearances are also a result of a consistant winning effort during the year.

I think Drew needs to show a consistant W-L record (more wins than losses obviously), in the regular season. That's the yardstick for him at this point. I'm not even thinking about him in the playoffs because he hasn't shown the ability to post consistant winning regular seasons with any reliability.

[FTG]

If Drew continues to play well this year Just have an open and fair competition in training camp and let the winner start! I as a "hater" am fine with that. Why do the "lovers" just want to hand Drew back the job? Whats wrong with an open comeptition. Don't you guys want the best guy to get the job?