Moulds wont take a paycut after seeing this!!

[Tatonka]

Dec 8

Wide receiver Marvin Harrison has agreed to a seven-year, $67 million contract extension that will keep him in Indianapolis—and paired with Peyton Manning—for the foreseeable future. The contract includes $22 million in guaranteed money, according to ESPN's John Clayton, with flexible roster bonuses that allow the Colts to play cap gymnastics as they attempt to sign other players—most notably running back Edgerrin James, who is slated to be an unrestricted free agent following the season.

Views: Harrison and Manning are within five touchdowns of the most potent hook-up in NFL history, Steve Young and Jerry Rice, and this deal all but assures that mark will be shattered. Moreover, it also looks as if Manning and Harrison will spend their entire careers playing catch, which is great news for their fantasy owners.

www.fanball.com

[BAM]

I REALLY hope he doesn't leave us....... :(

[OpIv37]

If you look at numbers and the relative success of their offenses, I don't think Moulds would be wise to use Harrison as a comparison. It depends- he can stay here and win or go finish his career on a crappy team.

How the hell is Indy going to pay the other 51 players and still be under the cap?

[Tatonka]

i guarentee you that moulds is thinking, i got drafted one pick behind harrison.. we have had compairable numbers.. we are both probowlers.. he just has a real qb.. and i never have...

he is not taking a pay cut and he will want a big extension even if he stays..

[mybills]

Moulds shouldn't take a paycut with or without that info.

[RedEyE]

i guarentee you that moulds is thinking, i got drafted one pick behind harrison.. we have had compairable numbers.. we are both probowlers.. he just has a real qb.. and i never have...

he is not taking a pay cut and he will want a big extension even if he stays..


Agreed.

TD will try shopping a trade with him next season if Moulds shows signs of reluctancy.

[Tatonka]

Moulds shouldn't take a paycut with or without that info.


Terrell owens doesnt make the money moulds does next year.. you tell me who is better.

[chernobylwraiths]

Terrell owens doesnt make the money moulds does next year.. you tell me who is better.

Terrell Owens is a selfless player who wants only what is best for the team.

[clumping platelets]

Moulds doesn't deserve a pay cut. He can sign an extension and help the cap. I suspect it will get done before the draft

Also, those Harrison numbers are not what they seem. It's essentially a 2 yr deal with a HUGE roster bonus in 2006. He also has 8 digit salaries the last 3 yrs of the deal which just makes the deal seem larger. Harrison is guaranteed about $15 million total for 2004 & 2005.

[Drive 4 Five]

I hate when teams do that crap. When in the hell are people going to realize that you cannot win a championship when you have two players making all the money. That contract Manning signed was absolutley ridiculous, and now Harrison? Meanwhile, Tom Brady, who already owns two rings takes a cut in pay to help his team. What gives?

[Tatonka]

Terrell Owens is a selfless player who wants only what is best for the team.


i see the sarcasm obviously.. but he is a much more dominant receiver.

[Ebenezer]

Moulds doesn't deserve a pay cut. He can sign an extension and help the cap. I suspect it will get done before the draft

Also, those Harrison numbers are not what they seem. It's essentially a 2 yr deal with a HUGE roster bonus in 2006. He also has 8 digit salaries the last 3 yrs of the deal which just makes the deal seem larger. Harrison is guaranteed about $15 million total for 2004 & 2005.
thanks for beating me to it.

[chernobylwraiths]

i see the sarcasm obviously.. but he is a much more dominant receiver.

Harrison's numbers are also MUCH better than Moulds's numbers. Harrison doesn't seem to take every other year off. I know Moulds has had some injuries but I don't think anybody would say that Moulds is in the same category as Harrison. Even most here would say of the top receivers in the NFL, Moulds just is in that second tier of top receivers.

[Tatonka]

i bet you moulds thinks he is as good as harrison regardless of numbers.. no question .

[Ebenezer]

i bet you moulds thinks he is as good as harrison regardless of numbers.. no question .
doesnt matter...like clump said...he is under contract and the Bills can afford to let him play for that number if they wish...this is a non issue from the Bills standpoint.

[chernobylwraiths]

i bet you moulds thinks he is as good as harrison regardless of numbers.. no question .

I don't care if he thinks he is the second coming of Jerry Rice. Fact is, he ISN'T.

Here's some stats for you.

Harrison career averages:
94 rec/yr (projected through this year)
81 yds./gm.
6.1 rec/gm
.7 TD/gm

Moulds:
66 rec/yr (projected through this year)
4.2 rec/gm
59.8 yds/gm
.33 TD/gm

take out his first two years
78 rec/yr (projected through this year)
5.1 rec/gm
72.8 yds/gm
.41 TD/gm

His stats really aren't close. But even discounting stats, I think 95% of people would prefer to have Harrison on their team than Moulds. I like Moulds, but he doesn't deserve close to as much as Harrison does.

[Forward_Lateral]

I know that Harrison's deal seems bigger than it is, but still, how the hell is Indy going to afford to keep anyone else?

[Ebenezer]

I know that Harrison's deal seems bigger than it is, but still, how the hell is Indy going to afford to keep anyone else?
you got to break down each year and see what the numbers are...then you have to look at the breakdowns and bonuses of each contract...numbers I (nor clump) have not collected

[Mr. Cynical]

Harrison has had Manning throwing to him for the last 7 years.

Moulds has had RJ, Flutie and Drew for the last 7 years.

Apples and oranges IMO.

[justasportsfan]

i bet you moulds thinks he is as good as harrison regardless of numbers.. no question .I don't see that as a problem. When Flutie was the qb Moulds' nos. were the same as Harrisons. I am almost willing to bet that JP could make Moulds' nos. better.

[The_Philster]

Harrison has had Manning throwing to him for the last 7 years.

Moulds has had RJ, Flutie and Drew for the last 7 years.

Apples and oranges IMO.
:faint: OMG!! I agree with Cynical

[tampabay25690]

Terrell owens doesnt make the money moulds does next year.. you tell me who is better.

Well Terrell Owens is the best WR in football!!!!

[dannyek71]

I say trade EM after this season for a 1st round pick. Then use that 1st round pick on somone like wr Mike Williams. We'd basically we reloading for the future.

I could seriously see EM in philly with his pal TO. What a WR combo that would make.

[Captain gameboy]

Moulds' best years are probably behind him, regardless of who is the QB.

While he played well last week, and I still think he is the best blocker of the elite NFL receivers, he has too many drops and too many penalties this year.

On a related matter, is Steve Tasker moonlighting as his agent?
I thought he and Crique were a little over the top while discussing Moulds the past few games they have done.

[The King]

I say trade EM after this season for a 1st round pick. Then use that 1st round pick on somone like wr Mike Williams. We'd basically we reloading for the future.

I could seriously see EM in philly with his pal TO. What a WR combo that would make.

I cant see anyone giving us a first rounder for moulds... and I dont see any recievers on our team ready to take over his spot.

[Mr. Cynical]

I say trade EM after this season for a 1st round pick. Then use that 1st round pick on somone like wr Mike Williams. We'd basically we reloading for the future. An interesting thought. I know he is still under contract although he did make mention that he would "consider his options" in the offseason (this was when the O was putrid beyond words).

I remember Moulds signing that $40M deal a couple of years back when it was thought he could sign for more elsewhere. However he decided to stay to avoid what happened to Meshawn, i.e., once Meshawn left the Jets his numbers started to slip. Call it loyalty or smarts, whichever...but I liked that he stayed for less money.

Now, I don't think he is done by any means. But he is definitely on the back 9 of his career. He probably has 2 more potential pro-bowl years and then will likely move to a #2 spot somewhere else. For some reason I don't see him retiring a Bill as a #2. He'll either go out here as the #1 or move to another team to be a #1 a la Emmitt Smith.

That said, I think it depends on how he feels at the end of the season. If he is pumped about returning, you defninitely keep him. If he is unhappy, I can see where a trade might be a good thing. I sorta feel sorry for him in a way given all he has gone through here. He started with the retiring Kelly and has gone through a slew of mostly bad QBs and bad offenses, never really getting any consistency from year to year. Now he is nearing the tail end of his and he's got to feel cheated in some way. I know, cry me a river...he's got millions. Anyway, all I'm saying is that if he feels cheated it might be a good idea to get fresh blood into the lineup. He is the last Bill (that I can think of) that has any connection to the Kelly era and maybe it's time to finally close that book.

[mybills]

Brady, who already owns two rings takes a cut in pay to help his team. What gives?
Considering Vinateri is the one winning those rings, why wouldn't he? :snicker:

[Mr. Cynical]

I like your sig mybills! :up:

If my prediction comes true, how about you keep that sig up for the entire offseason. I don't want anyone to forget it. :D

[mybills]

:rofl: You don't strike me as the "rub it in your face" type! :evil:

[Mr. Cynical]

:ontome:

[mybills]

:spit:

[DaBills]

Question/clarification for the cap-dudes:

If Moulds tries to leave next year, can he still get the same type deal he has now? I thought contracts are based on averaging together the salaries for the top 5 players at their given position based on performance. If his numbers aren't in the top 5, won't he basically be excluded from asking top dollar?

[BillsFever21]

Moulds is a very good WR but he's a step below the Harrison, Moss, Owens and Holt level.

That is very far from being considered bad but it's just reality. It takes a lot to be ranked with them guys and not many guys will make that list in their individual era.

Moulds is in the group of 2nd Tier WR's like Andre Johnson, Chad Johnson, Hines Wards, ect.

The top elite WR's

1. Moss
2. Owens
3. Moss
4. Holt

The 2nd Tier list factoring in their age and production over the last 1-3 years along with their future production.

High 2nd Tier

5. Ward
6. Walker
7. A. Johnson
8. C. Johnson
9. Moulds
10. Horn
11. Mason
12. R. Wiliams
13. Boldin

Some of these guys who will soon join the elite list or eventually replace the Top 4 in years to come.

Andre Johnson
Chad Johnson
Javon Walker
Roy Williams

The biggest surprise to me from that list is Javon Walker. I've been a Seminoles fan longer then I've been a Bills fan.

Walker was a great ACC player but I never thought he'd develop at the NFL level the way he has. Maybe it's the label certain schools get from not pouring out elite athletes at certain positions even though they had great college careers.

I'm happy to see him excel with Green Bay. We've poured out endless amounts of great DL, LB's, and DB's but nothing major in WR's and nothing at all from the QB position. The best RB we've sent to the NFL has been Warrick Dunn.

ACC kicks serious ass. I'm an ACC fan all the way. FSU in football and UNC in basketball. I don't even need to list all the stars UNC has sent out of their basketball program.


.

[ajsdx]

ACC kicks serious ass. I'm an ACC fan all the way. FSU in football and UNC in basketball. I don't even need to list all the stars UNC has sent out of their basketball program.

Eh? UNC for basketball and FSU for football? How'd that happen?

[BillsFever21]

Eh? UNC for basketball and FSU for football? How'd that happen?I don't have any personal ties to a certain school that would make me like only their programs.

It's hard to explain how it happened. I've liked both of them since I was 8 years old when I started getting into sports and before I even knew they were both ACC rivals.

FSU is no longer a football powerhouse that will be competing for the championship. They are good for a couple losses a year with a Top 15 finish. I had a lot of heartbreaks for years when they kept choking against either the Hurricanes or Gators to cost them a national championship game. Then it seemed like when they were in the big game they would also lose.

I started to wonder if my football teams were just cursed. I had my Bills and Seminoles both crapping the bed when it counted the most. It was a great day when Charlie Ward brought them from behind against Nebraska to finally win the championship.

I have no idea where the program will go when Bowden retires. He's getting pretty old. Hopefully we'll have a credible replacement waiting in the wings when that time comes.

UNC basketball has been some heartbreaks too. Year after year of going to the Final 4/Elite 8 and losing. We have a couple rings to show for it but also a lot of failure. We finally pulled it off against Michigan. I'm sure everyone remembers that game UNC vs. The Fab Five when Webber called the timeout late in the game when they were out of timeouts. That sealed the game for us.

We fell off the map after Dean Smith retired. Dougherty sucked some serious ass. Finally we have another high ranked coach and Roy Williams have put them back on the map.

UNC has produced great talent over the years. Duke has had the last laugh in the standings over the past decade but how many of their players turned out to be NBA stars? Not one great star. Just a bunch of average players. Grant Hill would've good but he can't stay healthy. Coach K. is just an awesome college coach. Elton Brand is probably their best NBA player in years.

The list goes on and on with UNC. Jordan, Wallace and Jamison just to name a few.

I still find it amazing we couldn't win the championship when we had Wallace, Carter and Jamison all leading our team. I thought for sure they would've done it but they failed.

Vince Carter has been a failure. He's money for making the SC highlight film but that's about it. I was thrilled to see my boy Rasheed bring home a ring last year. He's matured a lot over the years.