Where do you think we stack up against other teams in the AFC East?

[Mudflap1]

Obviously there will be a lot of moves to be made all around, free agency, June 1st, draft, training camp, etc. But where do you think the Bills stack up against the other teams in the division if the season started today? And, in accordance, what moves do you think the Bills will make (realistically) compared to the moves the other teams in the division will make before the start of the season?

For instance, I was initially concerned about having a young, unproven quarterback be given the reigns to the offense persona non grata and not be challenged. I thought that was a mistake and could be the recipe for a considerable step backward this year. However, the lack of initiative on the offensive line to this point, and the appearance (while there could be bluffing) by Tom Donahoe to think the offensive line is halfway decent as is takes enormous precedent at this point.

I think, realistically and objectively, that the Bills right now are at best the 3rd team in the division, and probably somewhere near Miami. That's as it stands today. The Jets and Pats have a better offensive line, proven, veteran, playoff quarterbacks, some quality offensive weapons, and solid defenses and special teams. The Bills have a wild card, unproven quarterback, a worse offensive line than last year (as it stands today), three good offensive weapons, and a solid defense (although slightly weaker on the line at this point due to the loss of Pat Williams.) Miami has a very weak offensive line (probably worse than ours), a sub-par quarterback who has some experience and improved a little by the end of last year, decent receivers, no running back, and a solid defense. Overall, the Bills probably have the best defense and the best special teams (although probably the worst place kicker), but arguably the worst offensive line, and an unproven quarterback whom it wouldn't be fair to say is the worst QB in the division, but you can't say he's the best or 2nd best at this point either. The Bills are probably in the middle of the pack in terms of weapons. McGahee is obviously better than whomever Miami has, but Martin and Dillon are nothing to sneeze at. The receivers are probably better than the Jets and Miami, but probably not better than the Patriots (how can you argue three Super Bowls??).

Some realistic moves for Buffalo... Depth at DT through the draft, depth at WR through the draft, maybe a free agent lineman and depth in the draft, maybe a TE and a CB in the draft, and some depth at LB and RB possibly through free agency. I don't see any blockbusters coming here, but maybe we'll be pleasantly surprised.

So I guess making a long story short, I'm wondering what everyones' perspective is on this? I guess right now I have the Bills around 3rd place, possibly 4th because I could see Miami addressing a lot of their needs still through the draft and free agency (running back, maybe another WR, offensive line, maybe another QB), which would make them considerably more formidable. The Patriots will be up there, and the Jets will be competitive again, if not ready for another playoff run.

Jon

[OpIv37]

Miami will clearly be 4th place in the division. They will address their needs, but the team is so depleted and it will take them a season or two to get back on track. I think they'll do better than last year, but I still think we have an advantage.

I agree on the Jets and the Patriots. The Patriots have suffered a few setbacks over the course of the off-season but are still by far the best team in the division. They won't be 14-2 but they'll definitely be playing in January. The Jets are steadily improving and have some good young talent on D- they'll make another strong run at the wild card and there's no reason to believe they won't get it. TD has a lot of work to do- I expect 05 to be another long, disappointing year.

[Patti120]

Definitely 3rd as it stands right now. Miami has made some good moves and with the loss of Big Pat and the emergence (if that's what you want to call it) with JP, you could argue that we are in at least as good position as last year. It's hard to say though, I think Pat's a pretty big loss, he just wasn't worth the $$$.

[Mudflap1]

I'm not out to neg Tom Donahoe or anything with this thing either...

I'm not even saying this with any angst or pissiness, I'm just trying to objectively see where they are at as of today, and if the majority of the people agree and why.

I can see Tom Donahoe's logic to a certain extent saying that Jennings was a little above average and injury prone, so someone like Teague will be just as good (or bad, however you see it). And I can see that he thinks Pat Williams was a good player, but Edwards and Anderson are growing into the role and will be good players. However, LT is something not to be neglected, and there to this point isn't a whole lot of other activity going on where depth is needed (S, TE, WR, RB, etc.).

It's as if the staff sat down and decided Bledsoe was almost the sole reason this team wasn't 11-5 or something.

The teams that win these days are teams with a lot of depth at all of their positions, a good kicker, solid defense, and a quarterback who doesn't make mistakes (Bledsoe did make mistakes).

Right now, there is depth at certain areas, but there are a lot of areas lacking solid depth, and we have an unproven quarterback.

The two seasons that seem comparable to this so far are 1) when Todd Collins got the nod -- the Bills decided their team was good enough all around and stood pat and thought Collins could play, and 2) when the Bills chose Johnson over Flutie, stood pat, cut a lot of guys, and didn't get anywhere.

This is to say, I think Losman is a better prospect than those guys for sure, and I hope he does well and he just may be great, but it's about more than one guy. If he doesn't have the protection or support, he's going to struggle a lot more, and if there's a good defense but thin depth at certain positions, there could be a lot of problems.

Time will tell. Maybe the league is a lot thinner these days, and maybe the Amigos were right, it was mostly Bledsoe's fault. Or maybe there will be some surprise key moves made yet. I just think we're missing some ingredients though, and are sitting around at 3rd to 4th place, as it stands right now, in Year Five of Donahoe's term.

Jon

[RetroRaiders81]

I think they'll finish second. I don't even have to bother saying who's first.

[Mudflap1]

Ok, interesting. But why do you think they'll finish second?

Jon

[ParanoidAndroid]

1. Pats 11-5
2. Jets 10-6
3. Bills 8-8
4. Fins 6-10


too much defense in the division for JP to handle. Still, it should be a much more interesting year offensively, simply because of the newbies at the skill positions. If there is some upgrade to the o-line I would consider switching the Bills and Jets...both 9-7 with Buffalo winning the tie breaker.

[OpIv37]

seriously, I'll be disappointed if we start the season with the team as it is now. There's always the draft, but it's a weak draft and we're short on picks anyway. I think there are some glaring holes- mostly the o-line- and if the season started today we'd be SOL. We're not winning the division because of the Patriots, but we're not poised to make a good run at a wild card.

I'd like our chances a lot more if TD did something about the O line and found a way to bolster the defense with the loss of Big Pat. I'd also like to see some depth at RB and LB and a decent kicker, but that ain't gonna happen.

[gobuffalo2007]

The patriots and jets are both falling apart and Miami is going no were fast which leaves the door wide open for the bills to take #1.
gotta have confidance,baby.
just win bills just win......

[mysticsoto]

I too think we'll finish 2nd.

First of all, it boggles my mind that someone might say that we might finish last. Miami has alot of holes to cover. And if you allude to them going to the draft to fill those holes, then why can't we do the same? It goes both ways. We have a current hole on the O-line and will probably shut it by drafting a Center this year. Moving TT to LT makes the hole go away. Regardless of whether you agree how well he will do there or not, there is no longer a hole. You can speculate on how you think he will do in that position, but despite the changes, I still think our O-line will be better than Miami's. And a mobile QB will only make them look even better.

2nd, Jets haven't really done much in this offseason at all except trade Santana Moss with Coles. In fact, people seem to be avoiding them like the plague. They still have a decent defense, and assuming Chad can stay healthy, they have a good (if somewhat fragile) QB. But we beat them last year with a steady dose of smash mouth football. All JP has to do is pass the ball to WM like DB did. We will probably still run mostly to the right. But defenses can't gang up on the right side, b'cse lo and behold, JP is now a threat himself (hopefully he'll have learned to slide by then). Most likely they will have to assign a spy to JP - kind of like they did to Flutie. That will slow down the MLB's response to runs and will help WM. Oh, and Evans has more experience now also.

I thought the Jets barely won a few games last year and if those games had gone another way - we might have been in 2nd...or if a few of those early games of ours had gone another way (most were close) we might have been in 2nd place.

Similar to last year, our priority needs to be getting a good line and then giving it time to gel (like last year). I'm happy that JP is in Buffalo right now training himself. That shows he has the drive and competitive spirit - I think he might pleasantly surprise some people. While most players are vacationing right now, he's studying and training under Wyche.

I'm looking forward to see what he can do...

[jamze132]

How the hell can anyone put us right up there with Miami? They are in really bad shape. Our team isn't that bad. We already solved our biggest problem on March 3.

[Sportsuser101]

Right now we're the 3rd best team in the division.

We don't have a LT or LG. We need depth at several positions. JP is basically a rookie.

The Patriots got hurt this offseason but I still think there slightly better then us.

The Jets lost Ferguson who imo was an overrated interior lineman. When you have Abraham Ellis and Robertson on the line its not that hard to get to the QB. They lost McKenzie which is going to be a loss but they may make a play for McDougle. They upgraded with Coles over Moss. They downgraded there backup RB spot. Whoever they get at TE its probably an upgrade even if Baker moves up to starter.

The Dolphins didn't address there biggest need yet but got stronger on defense. They still may trade Surtain which will hurt them.

The Bills have lost there LT Jennings, when the line was already weak, lost Williams who probably isn't a huge loss considering Edwards is there but a vet DT is probably needed to rotate in and out. They got better at QB with Losman as starter and Holcomb as backup. They are going to be hurting at backup RB with Shaud Williams as there backup. Gandy was a solid pickup but losing Price, likely to happen, is a loss. I think Price was underrated how many times he came in for Mike and JJ.

[Mudflap1]

I'm saying right now we're not quite in as bad shape as Miami, we're probably 3rd. However, Miami has some gaping holes and can fill some of them very fast. Can we? Yes. Are we? We haven't so far. Maybe we will, but if we stand pat, and Miami gets aggressive with some of their depth issues, Miami could indeed finish ahead of us next year. Remember, before last year Miami had several years in a row of solid records, even with Wannstedt as the coach.

Is it unrealistic to see us move Trey Teague over to LT, go with Edwards and Anderson at DT, draft a couple of depth guys at OL, S, RG, LB, and DL that won't be pushing for a starting job this year and Miami (who has the #2 overall pick -- a lot more cannon fodder than we have, even if it's a weak draft) drafts or signs a big time RB, signs a guy like Burress, and drafts and signs a few offensive linemen? If that happens, Miami probably has a better team than we do.

Now, what would be nice to see (regardless if whether Miami makes some of those aforementioned moves) is we sign someone like DeMulling, sign a LT or draft a REAL solid prospect, sign a veteran DT, a legitimate threat at 3rd WR, maybe a TE of some sort (all of our guys are all medicore at best IMO), and some depth at other positions. If we do this, and maybe come off with a surprise or two (Ty Law?) then we'll definitely be better than Miami, and depending on J.P. Losman's learning curve, could challenge for 2nd.

That's my $.02.

Jon

[SABURZFAN]

we're STILL not a playoff team.


our OL stinks.

[mysticsoto]

I'm saying right now we're not quite in as bad shape as Miami, we're probably 3rd. However, Miami has some gaping holes and can fill some of them very fast. Can we? Yes. Are we? We haven't so far. Maybe we will, but if we stand pat, and Miami gets aggressive with some of their depth issues, Miami could indeed finish ahead of us next year. Remember, before last year Miami had several years in a row of solid records, even with Wannstedt as the coach.

Is it unrealistic to see us move Trey Teague over to LT, go with Edwards and Anderson at DT, draft a couple of depth guys at OL, S, RG, LB, and DL that won't be pushing for a starting job this year and Miami (who has the #2 overall pick -- a lot more cannon fodder than we have, even if it's a weak draft) drafts or signs a big time RB, signs a guy like Burress, and drafts and signs a few offensive linemen? If that happens, Miami probably has a better team than we do.

Now, what would be nice to see (regardless if whether Miami makes some of those aforementioned moves) is we sign someone like DeMulling, sign a LT or draft a REAL solid prospect, sign a veteran DT, a legitimate threat at 3rd WR, maybe a TE of some sort (all of our guys are all medicore at best IMO), and some depth at other positions. If we do this, and maybe come off with a surprise or two (Ty Law?) then we'll definitely be better than Miami, and depending on J.P. Losman's learning curve, could challenge for 2nd.

That's my $.02.

Jon

Don't forget that Miami doesn't have a 2nd rd pick. So after they pick up their RB in the 1st rd...they will have to wait until the 3rd to make another pick. If they do pick up and draft an O-lineman, we'll get a higher valued O-linemen with our 2nd pick...that is, unless TD gets brainwashed by some of these crazy posters here and signs Nugent 1st.