Arizona "never close" to trading for Henry

[Ickybaluky]

According to the Arizona Republic (http://www.azcentral.com/sports/cardinals/articles/0425cardsnb0425.html), the Bills let the Cardinals know they had no interest in OT L.J. Shelton last week. The Bills were willing to take a 3rd round pick for Henry, but Arizona had no interest in giving up one of their 3rds.

[TheBrownBear]

Shelton must really be a bust w/ no upside at this point. I'm guessing that he'll be cut and the Bills still won't bite.

[Bulldog]

Shelton must really be a bust w/ no upside at this point. I'm guessing that he'll be cut and the Bills still won't bite.

As bad as it sucks that the Bills were unable to unload Henry for anything of value, it sucks worse to be the Cards. At least Henry still may be able to contribute something to this coming season and at a reasonable price. While the Cards are stuck with a back-up left tackle making double what Henry is and barring injury will make zero contributions to the team. I really don't blame TD for not pulling the trigger on that trade.

[Dicknoze69]

Seriously...if all they offered was Shelton, and I've never been enamored with him, there's no reason to just give Henry away for someone who may not even play for us.

[BuffaloRanger]

See I don't understand this.

McNally is supposed to be able to take anyone off the street and make him into a good Olineman. That's what all the rose colored glasses wearing "The oline is in good shape now" fans like to say. So why can't the "great molder of men" take a LT that was a 1st Rd pick, and has started over 20 games in the NFL, and make him into a good lineman? Why?

How is a 6th round pick going to do better?

How is Gandy, a journeyman going to do better?

How is Jason Peters, the dumbest guy on the team, up until the moment the Bills seleted Roscoe, going to do better in his first ever season at that position?

How is TT, who allowed 11 sacks with Denver during his last stint at LT, and therefore wasn't resigned, going to do better?

The assumption is that because JP is more mobile the line doesn't need to be dominant. Ask Troy Vincent how mobile JP is.

And there still is a running game to worry about. WM gets tackled in the backfield at least 5 times a game. There is no yardage to be found up the middle.

The weak line is still a major issue.

[Earthquake Enyart]

We'll be able to get Shelton for free after June 1.

[Akhippo]

AZ is just plain dumb. They could have had their second and a rb. I dont understand why they didnt swap picks. They picked a rb with it anyway. At least they could have unloaded Shelton and received a battle tested back, and still have been able to pick for need.

[askabry]

I continue to maintain the Bills did not want to ADD 1.5MM in cap space for the priviledge of giving Zona a Pro Bowl RB and moving up 11 spots.

Widely commented that Bills coaching did not like Shelton as much as TD did.

[mysticsoto]

AZ is just plain dumb. They could have had their second and a rb. I dont understand why they didnt swap picks. They picked a rb with it anyway. At least they could have unloaded Shelton and received a battle tested back, and still have been able to pick for need.
I thought AZ had a great draft. It would not have been good for them to make the trade once they acquired JJ. Travis is backing up here and that's the entire reason he wants to leave. He's not going to want to go somewhere else to backup. Green wants speed and JJ seems to have speed and power. In his shoes, I have to admit that I probably would have done the same.

[BAM]

I don't understand why so many people get a woody over this Shelton guy. He's not even that good!

[mysticsoto]

I don't understand why so many people get a woody over this Shelton guy. He's not even that good!
I guess their position is that somebody average is better than nobodies (that is...people with no experience at the position).

But in an interview with TD, he said Gandy was doing great and that if not for previous injuries, he would be considered a lineman of high caliber. I guess we'll have to wait and see if Gandy is a diamond in the rough that escaped people's notice.

I still think we should draft Erik Pears (OT) and put him in the practice squad. This is a guy with potential!!!

[Michael82]

According to Clump...the Bills didn't even have the cap room available to trade for Shelton. He would have cost too much and TD probably didn't want to do anymore contract stuff right now with the current players.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

See I don't understand this.

McNally is supposed to be able to take anyone off the street and make him into a good Olineman. That's what all the rose colored glasses wearing "The oline is in good shape now" fans like to say. So why can't the "great molder of men" take a LT that was a 1st Rd pick, and has started over 20 games in the NFL, and make him into a good lineman? Why?

How is a 6th round pick going to do better?

How is Gandy, a journeyman going to do better?

How is Jason Peters, the dumbest guy on the team, up until the moment the Bills seleted Roscoe, going to do better in his first ever season at that position?

How is TT, who allowed 11 sacks with Denver during his last stint at LT, and therefore wasn't resigned, going to do better?

The assumption is that because JP is more mobile the line doesn't need to be dominant. Ask Troy Vincent how mobile JP is.

And there still is a running game to worry about. WM gets tackled in the backfield at least 5 times a game. There is no yardage to be found up the middle.

The weak line is still a major issue.

The answer to all of your questions is actually very simple:

All of the offensive linemen that McNally has developed into quality starters in the NFL share one trait in common--they are all hard-working, blue-collar types who will listen to their coach and try to do what he tells them to do.

The knock on LJ Shelton, who came into the league with a lot to learn, is that he has had a tendency not to work as hard as he should and tries to do things his way. This is why, despite having first round physical ability, he has never really developed into the player that a lot of people expected him to be and it is also why D.Green, who wants things done HIS way, hasn't been particularly happy with him and was willing to trade him to the Bills.

While I am one of many who thought that McNally, of all the offensive line coaches out there, might be able to motivate Shelton to get him to finally maximize his potential, it appears that McNally, after meeting with Shelton (remember the Bills did have Shelton in for a visit) must have concluded that either he could not motivate Shelton or that, at 30 and with the attitude that he has had, Shelton wouldn't be willing to do things the way that McNally wants them done.

Now, I can understand it if McNally decided that it would be better, easier and quicker to take a young, hard-working kid with little or no experience and mold him into a player who would do things his way than it would be to get Shelton, with a reputation for being less than hard-working, to do what McNally wants his O-linemen to do---sometimes it is easier to teach someone who doesn't have a clue about how to do something than it is to teach someone who has been doing it the wrong way and has to "un-learn" his bad habits before you can start to teach him how to do things the right way.

While Peters may be "dumber than rocks", he and Gandy and Teague are all hard-working guys and Peters already demonstrated that he is willing to have McNally teach him how to play when he volunteered to work with the offensive line last season when the Bills placed him on the practice squad. Given that Peters, who is in his early 20s, has similar, if not greater, physical talents to Shelton's, maybe that's why McNally would rather work with him instead of Shelton--even though it might take Peters longer to grasp things because of his more limited intelligence!

PS: A couple of weeks ago M.Mularkey talked about Peters possibly being able to contribute this season if he was able to pick up things quickly enough and develop more football awareness and the word from Mularkey and TD was that T.Teague could be moved to LT.

Here's what The Buffalo News reported that M.Mularkey said about the LT spot in an article in today's paper:

"The big question mark on the roster still is left tackle. Coach Mike Mularkey said Mike Gandy, an unheralded free-agent pickup, and Jason Peters, the converted tight end, will vie for the job, and center Trey Teague "would get some snaps over there as well."'
http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050425/1040892.asp

Now, instead of possibly contributing, Peters is going to compete for the starting job with Gandy. And, Teague will get some snaps at LT instead of competing for the starting LT job. What does that tell you?

It tells me that Peters, who McNally described as having all the talent that you would want in a LT, has made enough progress that he is being groomed to fill that position when he is ready to do so and is at a point now where the coaching staff feels that he can compete with Gandy for the job.

Shelton hasn't been anything more than a mediocre LT since he came into the league. Peters has just as much physical ability and has shown a willingness to work hard and learn from McNally. Who is to say, at this point, that Shelton would definitely be that much better than Peters will be? Moreover, with his physical talent, if Peters does just happen to develop under McNally's tutelage, he could fill the starting role at LT for the Bills for several years to come....while Shelton would be in his 30s and it wouldn't be long before the Bills would have to start looking for someone to replace him.

[mysticsoto]

The answer to all of your questions is actually very simple:

All of the offensive linemen that McNally has developed into quality starters in the NFL share one trait in common--they are all hard-working, blue-collar types who will listen to their coach and try to do what he tells them to do.

The knock on LJ Shelton, who came into the league with a lot to learn, is that he has had a tendency not to work as hard as he should and tries to do things his way. This is why, despite having first round physical ability, he has never really developed into the player that a lot of people expected him to be and it is also why D.Green, who wants things done HIS way, hasn't been particularly happy with him and was willing to trade him to the Bills.

While I am one of many who thought that McNally, of all the offensive line coaches out there, might be able to motivate Shelton to get him to finally maximize his potential, it appears that McNally, after meeting with Shelton (remember the Bills did have Shelton in for a visit) must have concluded that either he could not motivate Shelton or that, at 30 and with the attitude that he has had, Shelton wouldn't be willing to do things the way that McNally wants them done.

Now, I can understand it if McNally decided that it would be better, easier and quicker to take a young, hard-working kid with little or no experience and mold him into a player who would do things his way than it would be to get Shelton, with a reputation for being less than hard-working, to do what McNally wants his O-linemen to do---sometimes it is easier to teach someone who doesn't have a clue about how to do something than it is to teach someone who has been doing it the wrong way and has to "un-learn" his bad habits before you can start to teach him how to do things the right way.

While Peters may be "dumber than rocks", he and Gandy and Teague are all hard-working guys and Peters already demonstrated that he is willing to have McNally teach him how to play when he volunteered to work with the offensive line last season when the Bills placed him on the practice squad. Given that Peters, who is in his early 20s, has similar, if not greater, physical talents to Shelton's, maybe that's why McNally would rather work with him instead of Shelton--even though it might take Peters longer to grasp things because of his more limited intelligence!

PS: A couple of weeks ago M.Mularkey talked about Peters possibly being able to contribute this season if he was able to pick up things quickly enough and develop more football awareness and the word from Mularkey and TD was that T.Teague could be moved to LT.

Here's what The Buffalo News reported that M.Mularkey said about the LT spot in an article in today's paper:

"The big question mark on the roster still is left tackle. Coach Mike Mularkey said Mike Gandy, an unheralded free-agent pickup, and Jason Peters, the converted tight end, will vie for the job, and center Trey Teague "would get some snaps over there as well."'
http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050425/1040892.asp

Now, instead of possibly contributing, Peters is going to compete for the starting job with Gandy. And, Teague will get some snaps at LT instead of competing for the starting LT job. What does that tell you?

It tells me that Peters, who McNally described as having all the talent that you would want in a LT, has made enough progress that he is being groomed to fill that position when he is ready to do so and is at a point now where the coaching staff feels that he can compete with Gandy for the job.

Shelton hasn't been anything more than a mediocre LT since he came into the league. Peters has just as much physical ability and has shown a willingness to work hard and learn from McNally. Who is to say, at this point, that Shelton would definitely be that much better than Peters will be? Moreover, with his physical talent, if Peters does just happen to develop under McNally's tutelage, he could fill the starting role at LT for the Bills for several years to come....while Shelton would be in his 30s and it wouldn't be long before the Bills would have to start looking for someone to replace him.
This is exactly what I believe - which is why I'm waiting and promoting a "Let's wait and see" approach. Peters might be farther along than we think - and Gandy is also highly being talked about. Let's not assume that Shelton would have solved any problem - for all we know, he would have been a mistake to bring here at $3 Million a year - and then not perform even as an average LT.

[nidan01]

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?p=998881#post998881

Just exactly how much would you Bills fans know about Shelton ? How many Cardinals hames did you watch with him at LT.

I love the way you assume that because a player is on the Cardinals squad they must be bad.