I just traded Randy Moss for Willis

[Tatonka]

am i an idiot?

league format is 1 rb/ 1 wr/ 3 flex (rb or wr)

moss puts up good numbers but i have depth at wr with steve smith as my number 1, fitzgerald 2, and branch 3..

my rbs (prior to getting mcgahee)
1. kevin jones
2. fred taylor
3. michael bennett (what a total turd burger he is)
4. mewelde moore (i hope he gets the job and runs with it)
5. duce staley
6. ron dayne
7. willie green

this is a long term keeper league as well that has been going on for 6 years.. my keepers this year were moss and kjones. you keep 2, but only one per position.. so next year it looks like willis and smith/fitz.

i was torn.. but i felt like i was getting mcgahee while his value was at its lowest. moss's wont get any higher after starting the season off like he has.

[The last buffalo fan]

Cant tell you at this time, because my Kids are next to me, but as the Governator said ...............................I'll be back!!!!

[Tatonka]

:scratch:

[Kerr]

Not a bad deal if you ask me. It seems that the raiders offense has its own problems. Porter is playing hurt, Curry out for the season, whitted moving to to the 3rd spot, so expect Moss to have a quiet year becuase of so many double teams. . Willis is known to get off to a slow start, and with Mularkey calling Willis out, you should expect his production to go up.

[Crisis]

You got ripped.

[casdhf]

I'm trying to decide between Branch and Joey Porter in one league...I think I'll go with Porter

[Ebenezer]

am i an idiot?

league format is 1 rb/ 1 wr/ 3 flex (rb or wr)

moss puts up good numbers but i have depth at wr with steve smith as my number 1, fitzgerald 2, and branch 3..

my rbs (prior to getting mcgahee)
1. kevin jones
2. fred taylor
3. michael bennett (what a total turd burger he is)
4. mewelde moore (i hope he gets the job and runs with it)
5. duce staley
6. ron dayne
7. willie green

this is a long term keeper league as well that has been going on for 6 years.. my keepers this year were moss and kjones. you keep 2, but only one per position.. so next year it looks like willis and smith/fitz.

i was torn.. but i felt like i was getting mcgahee while his value was at its lowest. moss's wont get any higher after starting the season off like he has.
because it is a long term keeper league i think you are ok...

[BucGuy]

because it is a long term keeper league i think you are ok...
I agree. But you screwed yourself for this year, next year and the year following. After that, you should be ok.

[Tatonka]

Not a bad deal if you ask me. It seems that the raiders offense has its own problems. Porter is playing hurt, Curry out for the season, whitted moving to to the 3rd spot, so expect Moss to have a quiet year becuase of so many double teams. . Willis is known to get off to a slow start, and with Mularkey calling Willis out, you should expect his production to go up.

my thoughts exactly.

[Tatonka]

i think willis and moss will have similar numbers when it is said and done.. how did i screw myself for this year? I only need to start 1 wr.. i have branch, fitz and smith to choose from.. all of which can fill that role easily.

it is not like moss is gonna put up 400 fantasy points this season.. he my slightly outscore willis, but that is not even for sure.. willis scored 11 tds in 11 games last season.. moss played half a season.

[capitolneal]

bad deal who in WR is goin to score what moss does? all tier 1 RB's are close I think u were being a homer on that one

[Tatonka]

yeah, but my rb group overall was not good enough.. moss has had 2 decent weeks.. 100 yards and a 1td.. great.. dont tell me that you dont think mcgahee is capable of 100 yards and td.. he got 100 yards in the second half of the houston game. and how many games last season did he score more than 1 td?

i think he will turn it up a notch. it is my opinion.. not as a bills fan, but as someone who is tring to position themselve to win 1000$ in this league..

[Uncle Jesse]

I wish you were in my fantasy league and i was playing you.

[Tatonka]

I wish you were in my fantasy league and i was playing you.
you guys really dont have to be dicks.

[Tatonka]

why was mcgahee drafted before moss in every single fantasy draft this season? i guess because moss is SO MUCH BETTER? they will both put up similar fantasy numbers.

[Crisis]

why was mcgahee drafted before moss in every single fantasy draft this season? i guess because moss is SO MUCH BETTER? they will both put up similar fantasy numbers.
Well, actually depends on the scoring system for your league.

[Crisis]

Not a bad deal if you ask me. It seems that the raiders offense has its own problems. Porter is playing hurt, Curry out for the season, whitted moving to to the 3rd spot, so expect Moss to have a quiet year becuase of so many double teams. . Willis is known to get off to a slow start, and with Mularkey calling Willis out, you should expect his production to go up.
I hate to break it to you, but Moss has been double and triple teamed his whole career and still done fine.

[Meathead]

Just before all this talk about a Viking RB potentially going to Arizona exploded on the scene, I dropped Mewelde Moore to pick up Tatum Bell. For ten minutes I thought it was a good move, then I saw the news.

Timing is everything in FF.

If the Vikes deal one guy to the Cards then that means they both become featured starters. And I personally believe that both backs would be likely to rebound very well if it happened. I could still end up in good shape if Bell ends up with the featured job in Denver, but right now I’d rather have Moore.

When did you accept the trade? If it was before the news on the trade rumors then I can easily see it. If it was after then I probably would have kept Moss and waited a week. That’s a slightly bigger gamble, but if it happened you’d go from competitive to a league favorite. Steve Smith is good, but he's no Moss fantasy wise.

[Tatonka]

smith is capable of putting up 100 and a td every week. moss is pretty much a 100 and td every week and sometimes he throws up 2 tds. i think that mcgahee is a 100 yard a week back who should put up a td a week and is very capable of having multi td games.. since i dont think losman is going to light it up in the passing game.

[Kerr]

I hate to break it to you, but Moss has been double and triple teamed his whole career and still done fine.

No kidding, but he's on a different team opposite an injured wide receiver(porter not fully healthy) and a depleted depth chart. I think he'll be fine this year, but don't expect the same numbers he posted last year and years before because the offense as a whole has struggled. You should also consider that when he was with the vikes he had healthy solid receivers on the other side(burleson, carter).

[Meathead]

Randy Moss is a freak. You could put Pepsi Machine opposite him and Randy would get his.

He'll get his.

[Lexwhat]

No kidding, but he's on a different team opposite an injured wide receiver(porter not fully healthy) and a depleted depth chart. I think he'll be fine this year, but don't expect the same numbers he posted last year and years before because the offense as a whole has struggled. You should also consider that when he was with the vikes he had healthy solid receivers on the other side(burleson, carter).
Jerry Porter is almost fully healed. Once he gets fully healthy (less than 2 weeks), he will be the biggest threat on the opposite side that Randy Moss has had since Cris Carter. With Carter on the other side in Minnesota, Moss had 53 TDs in 4 years. Even with Curry out for the year, the Raiders still have some of the best depth at receiver in the NFL. Regardless of anything, Moss himself will get better as he gets more time to click with Kerry Collins. Their offense hasn't gelled yet with a new RB and new #1 WR.

As for Willis, I think Willis is gonna put up big numbers too, starting this week against Atlanta. He's mad about those Mularkey comments, and his ego won't allow him to sit back and put up weak numbers. Willis will be going hard all season. I don't know if his numbers will be like Randy's, but we'll just have to wait and see. Tatonka, I don't think you lost that much, if anything, by trading away Moss for Willis.

[BleedinGreenNC]

You got ripped.Im going to have to second that motion. Not taking anything away from Willis, but even an average year from Moss is better than a great year from anyone.

[Tatonka]

so why is moss not selected higher than all those top running backs every year?

moss was not drafted ahead of willis in any draft this year..

must be because wrs are so valuable..

[BillsFanInMass]

Definately a good trade Willis is a keeper he will have many multiple touchdown games exspecially when the bills play weaker teams. Not only that your a Bills fan so that was an awesome trade in my eyes. :bf1:

[LarryBoy]

so why is moss not selected higher than all those top running backs every year?

moss was not drafted ahead of willis in any draft this year..

must be because wrs are so valuable..



Moss was drafted before Willis in my draft.

I would take Moss over Willis right now, IMO Moss/TO/Harrison>>>>>>>any other WR. You had one of the best in his postion and gave him up for IMO right now, a 2nd tier RB, who untill JP gets some exp may be hurting.

For the future, though, this move may really work out well for you, but this year when you compare numbers at the end of week 17 I'm betting Moss>Willis.

Now, that being said Im praying Im wrong!!

[Tatonka]

harrison really isnt that great anymore.. wayne is just as likely to put up better numbers any week.

your one of the very few that actually had moss drafted before willis.. unless you play some weird scoring system, where you get points per reception or something..

regardless.. willis has a low value right now.. but he got 117 in game one.. if he would have gotten 120 yards in game two, and still with no tds.. i doubt the guy trades him.. i offered him edge or moss before the draft for willis and he said no.

[The last buffalo fan]

harrison really isnt that great anymore.. wayne is just as likely to put up better numbers any week.

your one of the very few that actually had moss drafted before willis.. unless you play some weird scoring system, where you get points per reception or something..

regardless.. willis has a low value right now.. but he got 117 in game one.. if he would have gotten 120 yards in game two, and still with no tds.. i doubt the guy trades him.. i offered him edge or moss before the draft for willis and he said no.

Easy Champ, Moss is awesone, but won't give you in a constant way points, that's why you made a pretty good deal. Your Wrs corp won't scare everyone, but all of them would give you alot of points during the season, because their positions on their own teams. So, I guess you are in very good position, if I'm wrong, in your next visit to Mexico, I own you some beers.

Buena Suerte, campeon!!!http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/images/icons/icon14.gif

[Marvelous]

Did he give you a reacharound?

[vicmantak]

Tatonka,

IMO this trade makes 100% sense. Randy Moss is simply the #1 in his role (something way behind on Willis...) and as Bills fans we know that Willis has probably only 3 "big scoring" games more this season (Atlanta included).

On the other hand, I still think that Kevin Jones provides the same expectations as Willis and it's notable that your WR depth was exageratedly mediocre (maybe horrible) and you really needed a challenge there.

[Tatonka]

ok.. you guys are dicks.. sorry i brought it up.

[Uncle Jesse]

why was mcgahee drafted before moss in every single fantasy draft this season? i guess because moss is SO MUCH BETTER? they will both put up similar fantasy numbers.

What the hell kinds of leagues do you play in?

[Tatonka]

standard scoring.

lindell.. you havent answered my question.. why was mcgahees average draft position higher than moss's? because moss puts up way better fantasy points?

[Bulldog]

What the hell kinds of leagues do you play in?

Who in the hell crowned you the king of fantasy football? He asked a question, you don't have to be a ***** about it. For me, it depends on the scoring format. The league that I play in is RB heavy, so the trade would make sense. At any rate, I still say Willis puts up more fantasy numbers than Moss.

[Tatonka]

i think the difference in opinion is based on people here believing that the bills offense is no good..

i dont think that because of one very tough game against a top defense in their home opener, means that willis wont still finish in the top of the league in rushing yards and tds.

this is what footballguys.com, which is, in my opinion, one of the best fantasy information sites, projected as willis's season totals/points.

5 Willis McGahee BUF
330 carries for 1385
4.2 YPC
13 TDs rushing
40 receptions for 290
7.2 YPR
1 TD receiving
251 Fantasy points

here is moss

1 Randy Moss OAK
98 receptions for 1415 yards
14.4 YPC
14 TD
227 Fantasy Points

this was the average draft position of the top players.. it was derived by looking at all the drafts done from 5 different top sites.. and from the three drafts that i did, it is pretty damn close to how things went down.

Overall:
1. RB LaDainian Tomlinson, SD/10
2. RB Shaun Alexander, Sea/8
3. RB Priest Holmes, KC/5
4. RB Edgerrin James, Ind/8
5. QB Peyton Manning, Ind/8
6. RB Willis McGahee, Buf/9
7. RB Deuce McAllister, NO/10
8. RB Domanick Davis, Hou/3
9. RB Clinton Portis, Was/3
10. RB Jamal Lewis, Bal/3
11. RB Corey Dillon, NE/7
12. RB Kevin Jones, Det/3
13. WR Randy Moss, Oak/5


so far this season, moss has had 2 solid games.. 130 yards in both games and 1 td in both games..

willis has had 132 total yards and then 34 total yards.. no tds yet.. his first game was fine.. and he had a bad game.. but i still think overall he is a top 10 fantasy back and will put up numbers compairable to moss..

why is this so hard to phathom?

last season he put up 209 fantasy points in 12 starts.. including 13 tds in that time.. he also had 3 games that he had UNDER 60 yards and no tds.. and actually against cincy, he only had 35 yards.. imagine this though.. he still ended up being a great fantasy back and outscored moss who couldnt stay on the field...

in randy moss's BEST SEASON EVER , he had 1632 yards.. and 17 tds.. that comes to 267 total fantasy points.. i do not believe that he will surpass his best ever season with the raiders.. he will soon have a healthy Jerry porter next to him to dig into his numbers and they also have a strong run game.. in the first two games, he has had 2 50yard + tds that he will NOT get ever game.. if he doesnt have those 2 big catchs ever game, his numbers dont even look like fitzgerald, steve smith, or deon branch's.

basically my point is that i felt like i was getting willis while his value was really low, and moss's was as high as it will get. if you feel like moss is going to EXCEED his best ever season totals and willis is going to totaly suck and underperform his project totals, then that is your opinion, but dont act like it is common ****ing knowledge or fact that it will happen. i asked for your opinions.. not your stupid ass comments insulting me without backing up your assinine statements.

i cant really explain it better than that... if any of you have any more really witty comments about getting a reach around or any other dumb **** like that, you can suck my balls.

[Tatonka]

by the way.. i will also add that i believe willis will have a huge game tomorrow.. 125 yards + and 2 tds at least.

and i dont know that moss will have such a huge game against philly.. i think owens puts up way better numbers between those two head to head.

[Crisis]

Willis won't have many TDs this year since our red zone O sucks.

[Tatonka]

Willis won't have many TDs this year since our red zone O sucks.

that is your opinion.. i am pretty sure the offense will muster up at least 20-30 tds this season. willis will get the lions share of those.. no one else will steal a rushing td from him (other than maybe 1 or 2 by jp)

your obviously one of the people that just thinks because we have started out slow this season on offense that the entire season will have to be the same.. no way the offense could actually improve in the red zone ey? :rolleyes:

[Crisis]

No, I'm not all over JP's jock strap.

If we do score TDs in the red zone, JP will steal alot of Willis TDs. Not only on the ground, but roll outs and boot legs will be used a lot. (See Jason Peters TD)

Not to mention the Ds in our division are scary.

This is coming from someone who drafted Willis ahead of Moss too. My opinion has changed since then. I was too much of a homer in that draft to let him go. He's great trade bait in a Bills fan league though. :snicker:

[LarryBoy]

ok.. you guys are dicks.. sorry i brought it up.



You asked, im sorry I answered in an honest, non attacking method. Next time, please dont bother posting a question like this if your not going to look at both sides.


:down:

[Tatonka]

You asked, im sorry I answered in an honest, non attacking method. Next time, please dont bother posting a question like this if your not going to look at both sides.


:down:

i wasnt referring to your post.. i was referring the reach around type posts.. and the "i wish i played in your league" posts that offered nothing constructive..

sorry.. i should have quoted.

[Al13]

bad move but thats just my 0.02 cents

[MarvLevy]

MY TEAM:
PALMER
MCGAHEE
LEWIS
GATES
MOSS,R.
JOHNSON,C.
LINDELL

[HAMMER]

Shouldn't roto stuff be in a different forum?

[Tatonka]

yeah.. i feel like a real idiot.. mcgahee has 140 and a td..

moss has 26 yards.. in case you want me to do the math.. that is 2 points.

by the way.. i am playing the guy that i just traded with.. it is 96 to 24 right now. me.

[Tatonka]

and vic.. you were saying about my wrs?? steve smith is um.. doing ok i think today.

[Tatonka]

willis 2
randy 0

since i traded for him, willis has outscored moss both weeks. :up:

[vicmantak]

and vic.. you were saying about my wrs?? steve smith is um.. doing ok i think today.Hi Tatonka!

As you said, Steve Smith is surprisingly adding points TODAY but he is way behind to be a constant WR threat.
Unfortunately for you, if you started him this week, he didn't play today but the most important thing in your WR depth is that you can blindly use them against poor or undersized secondary teams.

On the other hand, Moss seems to return to his habitual scoring standard. Doug Gabriel returned succesfully, Porter is simply a beast as a slot WR and Lamont Jordan is constantly stretching defenses.
The only thing that I wonder about Moss is that he is absolutely the only wide recieving threat on Oakland and this is making him nothing more than a constant average fantasy option.

[Meathead]

All that matters are the results.

If it keeps up, you are the undisputed man. For now. lol.

[FinNasty23]

(Not tryin to flame you... just talkin fantasy football)

am i an idiot?

For making that trade? yes... Atleast for this year... Willis will not produce great fantasy numbers like Moss. You could have gotten a better RB for Moss because he has much more value than Willis. Your line is struggling and your QB postition cant keep defenses honest. He will get plenty of carries, but he will be running into a wall... Not to take away from Willis (he is good and will be a great back in the future) but fantasy wise he isnt a great choice... atleast not for this year...

Nasty

[Tatonka]

again.. willis has outscored moss so far both weeks i have traded for him..

so i dont see how anything else matters? if i would have kept moss, i would have scored less points.. period..

wow.. moss had one big catch and did nothing else all game.. super impressive..

vic, you commented on steve smith.. of coarse after he had a poor game.. nothing to say last week.. but that is fine.. well randy did nothing last week either.. all fantasy football players are inconsistent.. other than LT really.

at this point, willis has not done anything to show me that i should have kept moss.. and moss hasnt done anything to show me he is going to consistently outscore willis.

[Uncle Jesse]

I can't see Willis do much this week, we actually play a good defense again.

[The last buffalo fan]

I can't see Willis do much this week, we actually play a good defense again.

Old defense by the way (aren't they the florida bills??), whith a not too good db crew. Willis will have his best game of the season this week.

[FinNasty23]

Old defense by the way (aren't they the florida bills??), whith a not too good db crew. Willis will have his best game of the season this week. What do the DBs have to do with Willis' stats? The fins have one of the top run Ds in the league (I think they are ranked 5 right now and have been challenged by good running attacks: Broncos, Jets, and Panthers)... I guarentee he wont have his best game of the season this week... He might have a good game, but he will definatly put up bigger numbers vs weaker run Ds...

Nasty

[Bert102176]

if they would give him 20 to 35 carries a game which all the other good and great rb's in the league get then it would have been worth it but the O have thier heads up their butt's

[Tatonka]

I can't see Willis do much this week, we actually play a good defense again.

just like the last two weeks.. he will outscore moss again this week.

at seasons end willis will be right there if not ahead in points w/ moss.

[Uncle Jesse]

just like the last two weeks.. he will outscore moss again this week.

at seasons end willis will be right there if not ahead in points w/ moss.
It depends on your scoring style and who gets points for what. He should have outscored moss last week, he played the freakin saints. Moss had to play dallas, with a decent D

[Tatonka]

so not only is mcgahee killing moss every week since i traded for him..

steve smith is now the best wr in fantasy land..

:up:

moss sucks a dick.

[Philagape]

Moss hasn't caught a pass thru 3 quarters ... is he hurt?

[Tatonka]

willis by the week:
1. 13
2. 3
3. 21
4. 15
5. 14
6. 22

Randy Moss
1. 21
2. 20
3. 8
4. 13
5. bye
6. 0 (he had menstral cramps)

[Tatonka]

moss has "cramps"

[Philagape]

Is it that time of the month?

[Tatonka]

they tried to stretch them out but he is basically just a pussy.

i am so glad i made the trade regardless of what happens from here on out.

[BAM]

I was wondering WTF happened to Randy?? He may lose a game for me in one of my leagues...we'll see :mad:

[Philagape]

I was wondering WTF happened to Randy?? He may lose a game for me in one of my leagues...we'll see :mad:

I think that one's against me :D

[BAM]

Yah, damn Fascist Cows. You have a ton of guys going tonight and tomorrow, so it may not even matter, but it'd still be nice to get at least something.

:nervous:

[Tatonka]

so not only is mcgahee killing moss every week since i traded for him..
steve smith is now the best wr in fantasy land..
:up:
moss sucks a dick.


just to update this...

:up:

smith had a bad day but has clearly proven to be the best wr in all of football.. even deion branch has pretty much outscored moss as well.. and even with willis's poor day, he is still kicking ass for me.

and moss still sucks a dick other than his one catch for a TD type day he has had consistently since i traded him.

[vicmantak]

just to update this...

:up:

smith had a bad day but has clearly proven to be the best wr in all of football.. even deion branch has pretty much outscored moss as well.. and even with willis's poor day, he is still kicking ass for me.

and moss still sucks a dick other than his one catch for a TD type day he has had consistently since i traded him.
Tatonka,



Randy Moss: By numbers, I agree that Moss has been a deception to you (specially Raiders fans) but by skills Moss is arguably the best and most dominant NFL receiver and soon or later he will return to his habitual scoring play. The good news for you is that Tampa Bay showed the entire league how to beat Redskins' defense and it seems that Moss is a must starting material next week.
On the other hand, I might accept that I was wrong about Kevin Jones. He is way behind to be the "Willis" I thought and it seems that he is the problem of your trade. Anyway, good or bad, Lions are improving and it seems that the emerge of Roy Williams and Harrington will benefit Jones' performance.

Willis McGahee: Unfortunately for us, he will face the NFL's best ranked run defenses the next two weeks. San Diego and Carolina are facts (Denver not included) and it seems that Willis will face some "scoring" issues for at least the next two weeks.

I don't know but as Jerry Sullivan said, Bills would be admitting they made a big mistake letting Tucker go...
http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20051113/1050745.asp?tbd1050745.asp

[Tatonka]

vic, i am not following you..

the deal was moss for mcgahee straight up.. what does that have to do with kevin jones? he obviously has been a disappointment, but i am still holding out that he will play big come playoff time (weeks 13-16).

my point always was that willis will be better in fantasy football.. moss's talent doesnt win games.. points do.. and willis has killed him in points.

and you pointed out that my wrs were suspect, so i shouldnt have traded moss, but steve smith is the best in the league by a wide margin and branch is a top ten guy.