I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

[OpIv37]

Ok look, so some people have pointed out that it's still early in the season, we lost to two good teams, we came back from 0-4 last year, etc. And all of that may very well be true.

But here's the source of my frustration: lack of improvement. Consider this:

1. QB play has been a problem since Kelly left in 1997 (and he wasn't himself the last few seasons so you could make the case it's been longer than that)
2. The O-line has been a problem since at least the second half of 2002
3. Third-down defense has been a problem since at least 2002- it was acceptable last year and in '03 but now it's back to it's old ways.
4. Gilbride was fired for passing on third and short. But we still pass on 3rd and short. The playcalling has shown signs of improvement but is still not sufficient.

To TD's credit, the D and ST were successfully overhauled, and that's very impressive. But we had a 3-13 season. And an 8-8 season. Those were the "rebuiliding" years. Then we had a setback at 6-10, but that was Gilbride's and Williams' fault. Last year we were almost there- this team is supposed to be ready. It's supposed to be our time. But the same old problems persist, and now there seem to be some new ones thrown in the mix (we all know what they are at this point). When I watch the games, I see a team that looks disturbingly similar to the one that went 6-10 in '03 and started 1-5 in '04. The 2 losses are disappointing, but the lack of progress (and the apparent regression in some areas) is disheartening.

I have a feeling that I'll get some neg rep for this post, but those of you who have been following this team for the last decade or so know everything I've said is true. I'm losing faith in Tom Donahoe, and I hope he either gets his **** together or gets canned before we become Arizona North.

[GBS 18]

everyone needs to CHILL with Losman

Everyone needs to realize that if we were to pull JP like some of you may think we need to do we are going NOWHERE. Is Holcomb really capable of taking us to the playoffs? WE DON'T KNOW if he is or not, and to place him in the starting line up in WEEK 4 is rediculious. Some of you people might forget we are 1-2 right now and its 3 games into the season, if you can judge a quarterbacks career after 3 games like some of you are doing then Peyton Manning, and Brett Favre must be complete busts then right? ill even prove it...here are Mannings stats from his first 3 games in his first season in 1998

week 1. 21-37 302 yards 1 TD 3 INT QB rating = 58.6 game outcome = L
week 2. 21-33 188 yards 1 TD 3 INT QB rating = 51.1 game outcome = L
week 3. 20-44 193 yards 0 TD 2 INT QB rating = 39.3 game outcome = L

source - http://www.angelfire.com/ia3/coltspeyton/1998.htm#q1998


my point is yeah the season off to not such a great start we all know that. But we have to keep JP in there because he can only get better than he is right now...we have to be patient with him because look what has happened to QBs in the past that have been benched early (LEAF, COUCH, AKILI SMITH). IF we bench JP now in favor for Holcomb it may seem good in the short run if holcomb wins us a few games but how its this going to work out down the road when JP plays again with no confidence and no experience?



i rest my case and GO BILLS

and yes i still BillIEVE

[ScottLawrence]

Re: everyone needs to CHILL with Losman

Everyone needs to realize that if we were to pull JP like some of you may think we need to do we are going NOWHERE. Is Holcomb really capable of taking us to the playoffs? WE DON'T KNOW if he is or not, and to place him in the starting line up in WEEK 4 is rediculious. Some of you people might forget we are 1-2 right now and its 3 games into the season, if you can judge a quarterbacks career after 3 games like some of you are doing then Peyton Manning, and Brett Favre must be complete busts then right? ill even prove it...here are Mannings stats from his first 3 games in his first season in 1998

week 1. 21-37 302 yards 1 TD 3 INT QB rating = 58.6 game outcome = L
week 2. 21-33 188 yards 1 TD 3 INT QB rating = 51.1 game outcome = L
week 3. 20-44 193 yards 0 TD 2 INT QB rating = 39.3 game outcome = L

source - http://www.angelfire.com/ia3/coltspeyton/1998.htm#q1998


my point is yeah the season off to not such a great start we all know that. But we have to keep JP in there because he can only get better than he is right now...we have to be patient with him because look what has happened to QBs in the past that have been benched early (LEAF, COUCH, AKILI SMITH). IF we bench JP now in favor for Holcomb it may seem good in the short run if holcomb wins us a few games but how its this going to work out down the road when JP plays again with no confidence and no experience?



i rest my case and GO BILLS

and yes i still BillIEVE

So Manning looked like a typical rookie quarterback in his first season, making bad decisions, but also showing flashes of what could be. Losman hasn't shown me squat outside of one quarter against a terrible football team.Manning could at least throw the ball downfield. The kid threw for 36 yards last week, even as a rookie, that is pathetic.

The guy sucks, and will always suck, IMO.

[GBS 18]

Re: I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

"The guy sucks, and will always suck, IMO."

its been

3

games


RELAX

[OpIv37]

Re: everyone needs to CHILL with Losman

Everyone needs to realize that if we were to pull JP like some of you may think we need to do we are going NOWHERE.

Ummm, I never said anything about pulling JP in this post- just that the 8 year trend of bad QB play continues. And if you go back and read my other posts, I said pulling JP was a bad idea.

[OpIv37]

Re: I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

"The guy sucks, and will always suck, IMO."

its been

3

games


RELAX

dude- this thread is not about JP. It's about lack of improvement. QB play is just one area that hasn't improved over the last 3-4 years. Start your own damn thread if you want to talk about JP specifically.

[casdhf]

Re: I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

I'm all for JP, but those manning stats are getting old.

[X-Era]

Re: I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

Ok look, so some people have pointed out that it's still early in the season, we lost to two good teams, we came back from 0-4 last year, etc. And all of that may very well be true.

But here's the source of my frustration: lack of improvement. Consider this:

1. QB play has been a problem since Kelly left in 1997 (and he wasn't himself the last few seasons so you could make the case it's been longer than that)
2. The O-line has been a problem since at least the second half of 2002
3. Third-down defense has been a problem since at least 2002- it was acceptable last year and in '03 but now it's back to it's old ways.
4. Gilbride was fired for passing on third and short. But we still pass on 3rd and short. The playcalling has shown signs of improvement but is still not sufficient.

To TD's credit, the D and ST were successfully overhauled, and that's very impressive. But we had a 3-13 season. And an 8-8 season. Those were the "rebuiliding" years. Then we had a setback at 6-10, but that was Gilbride's and Williams' fault. Last year we were almost there- this team is supposed to be ready. It's supposed to be our time. But the same old problems persist, and now there seem to be some new ones thrown in the mix (we all know what they are at this point). When I watch the games, I see a team that looks disturbingly similar to the one that went 6-10 in '03 and started 1-5 in '04. The 2 losses are disappointing, but the lack of progress (and the apparent regression in some areas) is disheartening.

I have a feeling that I'll get some neg rep for this post, but those of you who have been following this team for the last decade or so know everything I've said is true. I'm losing faith in Tom Donahoe, and I hope he either gets his **** together or gets canned before we become Arizona North.

You need to read my long post. I talked about many of the things you did.

There simply is no way around this. Sometimes you have to fall to get back up. Your frustration is around when in the hell we will finally get back to the playoffs. That frustration is valid for sure. I think everyone feels it. We have waited so damn long now. But, to the credit of our Front offices, they DID try to make it right. Flutie came out of no where and lit the league on fire for us. Johsnon looked to be a really good QB but yall know what he turned out to be, Bledsoe was a proven QB but simply the wrong fit for this team and his best days are behind him. In a way we would be like standing behind gamblers at Las Vegas and smacking them each time they didnt win. Its all a gamble. There is no sure thing.

Now, many people are ticked this year with the approach to getting us to the SB. They are ticked that we went the route where we grow our own QB stud. My arguement is that 6 of the 8 playoff teams last year had 1st round QB's. So, the odds seem to work. My frustration with them is why slam Losman for the approach? Losman is playing like a 3 start QB, and we slam him for not looking like a seasoned vet? DUH. If you wanted a seasoned vet, that arguement should be headed TD's way, not Losmans.

Nuff on Losman, your point about the o-line is also valid. But, look at frikkin Denver and NE, both have like no 1st round o-lineman. MOST of the good running teams dont have many if any 1st round o-lineman. Again, the recipe seems to look like you just plug em in and make them wokr together. So who makes them work together? the o-line coach. Well, we hired one of the best in the league to do that.

I cant slam 3rd down defense. Its a bit like slamming the o-line, no matter what they look like they always will get crap. I personally feel our D is plenty good enough as a unit to put us in the SB. On Sunday, when I was at the Ralph, I noticed that we did 2 things wrong. 1) we overpursued Vick which left guys open and let him beat us with his feet (thats coaching and schemes) 2) We over contained Vick or tried to. What I mean was there were 2 Spys on several key plays leaving Jenkins wide open for 2 TD's. I blame coaching here, can we really slam Clements, McGee, Milloy, and Vincent? We have a NASTY secondary.

On O playcalling, your right on the money. Denver has managed to run every damn RB clown they put in there for 1000+, my grandmother could run for 1000 yards behind there o-line with NO 1st rounders. WHY? Glenn Parker said it best, zone blocking!!! I will tell you right now that if McGahee was on Denvers team he would lead the league, I have NO doubt about it. Why in the hell wqe dont zone block I have no clue. I never will. As far as the other schemes, I am sick of watching Tom Brady knit a sweater in the pocket before he feels any pass rush. Im also sick of watching Peyton and many other teams throw to completely wide open WR's. Yet on our team, the rush is ALWAYS there fast, and our frikking WR's never seem to get really open or we dont seem to find them. Maybe its just QB, maybe the WR, maybe coaching, maybe its all of it.

Overall, I just have eternal hope. I cant say how many times I felt all doom and gloom and then watched some team, sometime our completely destroy a team they should be blown out by. The thing that keeps me going is knopwing how parity and the salary cap has made this league so topsy turvy where anyone can win any game. If you buy into that theory, then we are never out of anything, it can all change in an instant. Look at how terrible Peyton has been this year, he probably has played as bad as Losman so far. Should the simply cut him? We all know that this guy will rip off another 4 or 5 TD game in just a few weeks or maybe next week. So hang in there, buy into the plan to build our own QB stud, or at least give it a real chance and then review say after the year. And keep the faith, we are too good, too close, not to be excited.

[casdhf]

Re: I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

where's dora to help with your frustration?

[X-Era]

Re: everyone needs to CHILL with Losman

So Manning looked like a typical rookie quarterback in his first season, making bad decisions, but also showing flashes of what could be. Losman hasn't shown me squat outside of one quarter against a terrible football team.Manning could at least throw the ball downfield. The kid threw for 36 yards last week, even as a rookie, that is pathetic.

The guy sucks, and will always suck, IMO.

You gotta love your nebulous, BS response. Supposedly you are speaking for the 1998 INDY fans who actually watched Manning? I bet they felt just as frustrated as you do right now about Peyton back then, go find a few and ask em. Prove me wrong.

Dont pull this BS, its just that BS. Peyton threw 8 frikkin INT's in 3 games, does anybody really believe for one damn minute that some of the fans here wouldnt have gone balistic on Losman if he did the same so far? Who do you think your fooling? If 8 INT's in 3 games is flashes of what could be, then you must be Debbie Gibson who "could have been...a star" NOT.

[The last buffalo fan]

Re: everyone needs to CHILL with Losman

You gotta love your nebulous, BS response. Supposedly you are speaking for the 1998 INDY fans who actually watched Manning? I bet they felt just as frustrated as you do right now about Peyton back then, go find a few and ask em. Prove me wrong.

Dont pull this BS, its just that BS. Peyton threw 8 frikkin INT's in 3 games, does anybody really believe for one damn minute that some of the fans here wouldnt have gone balistic on Losman if he did the same so far? Who do you think your fooling? If 8 INT's in 3 games is flashes of what could be, then you must be Debbie Gibson who "could have been...a star" NOT.

You are the king my friend.

[R. Rich]

Re: I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

2. The O-line has been a problem since at least the second half of 2002

If by "second half of 2002" you mean 1993, when we let Will Wolford and House Ballard go in free agency, you're correct.

[OpIv37]

Re: I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

If by "second half of 2002" you mean 1993, when we let Will Wolford and House Ballard go in free agency, you're correct.

1997-2001 were my undergrad days- I watched the games like always but my memory of them is fuzzy due to extreme hangovers for most of them.

[Mudflap1]

Re: I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

Stop making excuses for Losman. We were told he was given the quarterback job unconditionally because he was ready and would take this offense farther than Bledsoe. It's time for him to start to deliver. He doesn't have to win games by himself, but he's gotta do well enough (like the first game) for the team to be in position to win. We need to give the guy some games, but there is no excuse good enough to justify the toleration of losing. He needs to start to find ways to win games.

Yes, the offensive line is a problem. When the general manager neglects it continuously, that's what happens. We knew it would be a problem, and it is. McNally is not a miracle worker.

Yes, the defense was overpursuing Vick last week. If they settled down a little, they probably would've contained him better. Their run defense has been horrid so far though overall.

Jon

[R. Rich]

Re: I think I've figured out why I'm so damn frustrated...

Yes, the offensive line is a problem. When the general manager neglects it continuously, that's what happens. We knew it would be a problem, and it is. McNally is not a miracle worker.

How would we have known the OL would be a problem? I know I've never said anything about neglecting the OL @ any time in the past 3 years, and I don't think anyone else around here has, either.