Bledsoe is proving a very STRONG point...

[zone]

Holcomb playing and winning today just further proves that getting rid of Drew was a HUGE mistake. Stats today 280 yards and 3 TD's... and the game is not over. Piss on us.

[Philagape]

Just goes to show how much Drew needs an O-line.

[Novacane]

how many of these threads are we going to have :loser:

[Pride]

Bledsoe can be a Pro Bowl QB with a solid offensive line... perhaps the same would be true for JP/Kelly.

They are beating the Eagles handily... he has all day to throw, and his QB rating is 122.... amazing what a good OL will do for a QB

[zone]

Agreed he is making us look like the morons we are. I am very happy for him. He is still an awsome QB anyone that said him/ or Brett were done is a moron.

[Novacane]

The jury is still out. Judge Drew on an entire season. He played like a pro-bowler here for 8 game too

[zone]

EVERY TEAM needs an o-line!!! This is football, learn the damn game.

[711]

The jury is still out. Judge Drew on an entire season. He played like a pro-bowler here for 8 game too
Yep. Drew has an history of only playing great for the fits 8 games! Happened in Highs School too!

kidding!

[zone]

how many of these threads are we going to have :loser:
as many as it takes

Drew just beat the hell out of the best team in the league and has almost 300 yards and 3 td's.

[zone]

We wanted Bledsoe to back up Lossman..... AHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHA

[Philagape]

Holcomb would be doing the same thing right now if he were Dallas' QB. Even JP would be doing OK there. My grandma could complete a few passes back there.

[Novacane]

as many as it takes

Drew just beat the hell out of the best team in the league and has almost 300 yards and 3 td's.


as many as it takes for what? To get him back?

and BTW...............philly ain't the best team in the league

[Romes]

as many as it takes

Drew just beat the hell out of the best team in the league and has almost 300 yards and 3 td's.

as many as it takes to do what? Bring drew back? Or just annoy people with the repetitiveness?

[Philagape]

EVERY TEAM needs an o-line!!! This is football, learn the damn game.

Some QBs need it more than others, and oh my, is Drew one of them

[zone]

Holcomb would be doing the same thing right now if he were Dallas' QB. Even JP would be doing OK there. My grandma could complete a few passes back there.
wow, yup you are right on the money... keep hitting that crack pipe it works wonders for you.

[EDS]

Bledsoe can be a Pro Bowl QB with a solid offensive line... perhaps the same would be true for JP/Kelly.

They are beating the Eagles handily... he has all day to throw, and his QB rating is 122.... amazing what a good OL will do for a QB

Last year Dallas had an equally terrible offensive line. They signed an old and injured Rivera for a lot of coin, and maybe that accounts for the difference this year.

I think the only lesson TD can take away from this game is that he should have traded for Terry Glenn.

[BSXIII]

All good teams have good offensive lines. If we made the playoffs last year we would have had by far the worst O-line of any playoff team. Even the Falcons who supposedly don't need one because of Vick, gave Shaub a lot of time to throw against the Pats today, and he had a great game.

No QB will look good behind a bad o-line, but not all QB's will look good behind a good o-line.

[Ebenezer]

Holcomb would be doing the same thing right now if he were Dallas' QB. Even JP would be doing OK there. My grandma could complete a few passes back there.
not even you can believe that...JP has a lot of growing to do...when he has had the chance to throw the long ball or hit the receiver in the flat he has failed.

[zone]

as many as it takes for what? To get him back?

and BTW...............philly ain't the best team in the league
They were until now.

[casdhf]

Holy Holcomb!!

[Philagape]

wow, yup you are right on the money... keep hitting that crack pipe it works wonders for you.

Wow that post choked like a Drew comeback drive. Typical lack of substance from a Drew fan.

[Night Train]

It also proves the NFC may be a weaker conference than the SEC.

[Philagape]

not even you can believe that...JP has a lot of growing to do...when he has had the chance to throw the long ball or hit the receiver in the flat he has failed.

I was serious about Holcomb, but JP and grandma were just to illustrate the point ;)

[zone]

I was serious about Holcomb, but JP and grandma were just to illustrate the point ;)
Tons of substance in that. Typical idot.

[BSXIII]

It also proves the NFC may be a weaker conference than the SEC.

Yea, we really ran over Tampa, Atlanta, and San Anton.... I mean New Orleans.

[Philagape]

Tons of substance in that. Typical idot.

Career QB rating -- Holcomb 77.3, Bledsoe 77.1

Career completion % -- Holcomb 63.3, Bledsoe 57.1

Career TD/INT ratio -- Bledsoe 1.24, Holcomb .93 (Holcomb has been on worse teams)

Career YPA -- Holcomb 6.65, Bledsoe 6.62

It's like they are twins.

Maybe you should have some clue as to what you're talking about before you embarass yourself with ******ed posts and violate TOS at the same time.

[Cntrygal]

Geesh - I would have thought the topic of the day would be AT LEAST a current Bills player.

[Ebenezer]

I was serious about Holcomb, but JP and grandma were just to illustrate the point ;)

Actually, I agree Holcombe could succeed there....that's why, whether they had kept DB or signed KH there should have been an open competition.

[finsrclowns]

how many of these threads are we going to have :loser:

You LOVE them. Post on every single one. Although you did seem to enjoy the ones from last week more. :D:

[Ebenezer]

and BTW...............philly ain't the best team in the league


or dare we say that Dallas with Bledsoe is better than Philly... :brush:

[711]

Bledsoe's been on better teams? He was on horrible teams in NE, at least they were horrible until he TURNED THE WHOLE FRANCHISE AROUND. Buffalo was a joke the year before Bledsoe arrived, and he responded by leading them to a .500 record, rewriting the record books, and going to the Pro Bowl. Dallas was a bad 6-10 team last year while Buffalo was an up and coming 9-7 team last year. Look at how the fortunes of the teams have changed, and the difference is all Drew. That cannot be denied.
Drew has the "it' that Holcomb does not!

[Novacane]

or dare we say that Dallas with Bledsoe is better than Philly... :brush:



Today they were. That's not a bet I'd make over a 16 game season though

[Philagape]

Bledsoe's been on better teams? He was on horrible teams in NE, at least they were horrible until he TURNED THE WHOLE FRANCHISE AROUND. Buffalo was a joke the year before Bledsoe arrived, and he responded by leading them to a .500 record, rewriting the record books, and going to the Pro Bowl. Dallas was a bad 6-10 team last year while Buffalo was an up and coming 9-7 team last year. Look at how the fortunes of the teams have changed, and the difference is all Drew. That cannot be denied.

Wow I was ignoring this particular poster until he was quoted with this offering so stupid that it's quite entertaining. Where to begin????

"He was on horrible teams in NE." Yeah, Parcells and Curtis Martin made that team really horrible, so bad that they went to the Super Bowl. Okaaayyyy. That's way worse than the mighty Cleveland Browns that Holcomb rode for the past several years.

"leading them to a .500 record." Gee, that's something to brag about. If we were .500, then he brought us down to it too; can't have it both ways

"the difference is all Drew." That's how it is in your creepy world; it's all Drew. We weren't up and coming last year; we had a cream puff schedule. Our O-line is worse than last year, our defense is worse. I guarantee you that we'd have the same record if Drew had stayed. Guarantee. And Dallas would be better anyway now that they have Juliet Jones from the start and a much-improved D.

Thank you for quoting him and reminding me why Drew lovers live on another planet.

[711]

Bledsoe's been on better teams? He was on horrible teams in NE, at least they were horrible until he TURNED THE WHOLE FRANCHISE AROUND. Buffalo was a joke the year before Bledsoe arrived, and he responded by leading them to a .500 record, rewriting the record books, and going to the Pro Bowl. Dallas was a bad 6-10 team last year while Buffalo was an up and coming 9-7 team last year. Look at how the fortunes of the teams have changed, and the difference is all Drew. That cannot be denied.

Wow I was ignoring this particular poster until he was quoted with this offering so stupid that it's quite entertaining. Where to begin????

"He was on horrible teams in NE." Yeah, Parcells and Curtis Martin made that team really horrible, so bad that they went to the Super Bowl. Okaaayyyy. That's way worse than the mighty Cleveland Browns that Holcomb rode for the past several years.

"leading them to a .500 record." Gee, that's something to brag about. If we were .500, then he brought us down to it too; can't have it both ways

"the difference is all Drew." That's how it is in your creepy world; it's all Drew. We weren't up and coming last year; we had a cream puff schedule. Our O-line is worse than last year, our defense is worse. I guarantee you that we'd have the same record if Drew had stayed. Guarantee. And Dallas would be better anyway now that they have Juliet Jones from the start and a much-improved D.

Thank you for quoting him and reminding me why Drew lovers live on another planet.
The super bowl was in 97! He was at NE well before then!

[The_Philster]

Hate to break this to you, Philagape...but Drew's teams in NE didn't always surround him with talent...there's not a QB in the league that can win a game without help...I'd say the Bledsoe-bashing has gotten past the point of stupidity...but it's been past that since it started.
http://www.billszone.com/mtlog/archives/2004/03/23/jim_kelly_and_drew_bledsoe_similar_yet_different.php

[Philagape]

Hate to break this to you, Philagape...but Drew's teams in NE didn't always surround him with talent...there's not a QB in the league that can win a game without help...I'd say the Bledsoe-bashing has gotten past the point of stupidity...but it's been past that since it started.http://www.billszone.com/mtlog/archives/2004/03/23/jim_kelly_and_drew_bledsoe_similar_yet_different.php

The original point was, Drew's been on better teams in his career than Holcomb has. Amazingly, that point was challenged here. Considering Holcomb's starting career has been with Cleveland, that can be said of almost any other QB.

It's also pretty stupid to claim, as was here, that Drew turned NE around all by himself. NE didn't win a championship until Drew was out of the picture, and that's no coincidence. The best thing Drew ever did for NE was get hurt.

Bledsoe bashing requires little room for stupidity because it's all based on fact.

[BAM]

Bledsoe has been looking pretty damn good so far this season! I'm happy for him and wish him continued success. We may have F'd up on this one! EDIT: Actually no I don't wish him anymore success.. he plays for Dallas. F them. :gobills:

[Meathead]

it's obvious the wrong decision was made for this season. jp will be a fine qb for the bills soon but it's not today.

bledsoe was never as bad as he was made out to be but not as good for the bills as he should have been. for whatever reason parcells seems to be able to get the best out of him. i wish him well.

[BSXIII]

bledsoe was never as bad as he was made out to be but not as good for the bills as he should have been. for whatever reason parcells seems to be able to get the best out of him. i wish him well.

It's amazing what bad o-line play can do to a top tier QB. Hopefully our front office will learn that someday. Although I'm sure they are scouting Moulds replacement as we speak...

[The King]

There are three big differences between Drew and JP.

Experience and Poise

O-Line

And Pass Control.

JP is too wet behind the ears right now to lead a team like Drew. He is still getting used to the speed of the NFL and will continue to get used to it as his game "hopefully" improves.

O-Line in Dallas is flat out nasty, these guys know how to pick up a blitz and they are light years away from this mess of a line in Buffalo.

This is my biggest area of concern. Jp's passing has been atrocious. The guy has no time... we know that but what was supposed to make him special was his ability to buy time. He is still young and we will have plenty of opportunities to judge him here but even Drews rookie year he had a much firmer grasp on how to handle the ball as an NFL QB.


Its not the end of the world. Things should level off, I am happy to see so many pulling for Drew. I think its a testament to Buffalo fans, that a player can move on and in most cases still be supported by his former fans. I do feel for the people who dropped 70 bucks on JP shirts. They may be worn a bit less than anticipated.

[BSXIII]

There are three big differences between Drew and JP.

Experience and Poise

O-Line

And Pass Control.

JP is too wet behind the ears right now to lead a team like Drew. He is still getting used to the speed of the NFL and will continue to get used to it as his game "hopefully" improves..[/QUOTE]


Exactly, and playing QB on this team is the old "band-aid on a shot gun wound" analogy. The QB needs to compensate for some serious flaws by other players on the team. Not a positon you want to put a rookie in. Bad o-line play effects everything. The play calling, how the recievers run their routes, and how much the QB is looking over his shoulder rather than looking at his passing outlets.


O-Line in Dallas is flat out nasty, these guys know how to pick up a blitz and they are light years away from this mess of a line in Buffalo.

This is my biggest area of concern. Jp's passing has been atrocious. The guy has no time... we know that but what was supposed to make him special was his ability to buy time. He is still young and we will have plenty of opportunities to judge him here but even Drews rookie year he had a much firmer grasp on how to handle the ball as an NFL QB.


Its not the end of the world. Things should level off, I am happy to see so many pulling for Drew. I think its a testament to Buffalo fans, that a player can move on and in most cases still be supported by his former fans. I do feel for the people who dropped 70 bucks on JP shirts. They may be worn a bit less than anticipated.

Dallas's o-line is light years ahead of this teams. Maybe not quite on par with the other Super Bowl contenders, but getting close. The run blocking could be better, but picking up blitzes is invaluable. As far as JP is concerned, he has a long ways to go. He hasn't had the chance to put up great numbers, but at the same time, he's had chances to hit open receivers and failed miserably. As an NFL QB if you can't hit your receivers, you have no chance at being successful, and as of right now he can't hit them.

As for fans supporting Bledsoe, I agree that it is great to see. With every team i root for I always hope to see the former players do well. Especially when they are unfairly shown the door by management.

[Mr. Cynical]

The short term memory of some people is truly astounding.

[BSXIII]

The short term memory of some people is truly astounding.

Not sure what this means exaclty, but I do remember arguing on this board last year, that the O-line was the problem. I also argued that Drew Bledsoe, when he had an O-line, could play well against elite teams at home and on the road. I gave past examples of this, as did others, and we were written off by some, yourself included as delusional members of the DLC and Ostrich Club. We also argued that replacing him with a rookie would be a huge mistake. Maybe this is long term memory, so it may be irrelevant to this point.

Anyhow, is the argument that Philly and San Diego are not good teams, or that Bledsoe did not play a big role in beating those two teams? Just wondering.

[Mr. Cynical]

At this point all I will say is, "wait". The answer will be clear enough by mid season.

[BSXIII]

At this point all I will say is, "wait". The answer will be clear enough by mid season.


I'd hold off to week 12-16, when Price is comfortable as 4th WR.

[jmb1099]

When Drew first arrived here I had high hopes that he would at least provide us with some spark and give us the ability to hit the long pass which was something we hadn't seen since Jim Kelly. So Drew comes in and sure enough for eight games we were treated to some great football, someting that we hadn't seen in quite some time and for that I will always be thankful. Last year we at least had a shot (legitimate or not is irelevant) to make the playoffs and I am again thankful for the role Drew played in that. But what became painfully obvious to me in the time that Drew was here is that we had gone as far as we could with Drew which for me was sad because I had really hoped he would find a way to get it done. There are far too many factors to list as to why he wouldn't or couldn't, but the bottom line really is he didn't and it was time for a change. It is my personal opinion that Drew will do for Dallas what he did for us his initial year here and that is provide the team with exciting moments, some great games, and hope for the future, but I also believe that he will top out before a championship is won. At any rate we won't know for sure until the smoke of the season clears, gotta love football!

[Philagape]

Drew is capable of playing well. He's done it for about a third of his career.

Maybe Parcells can get through to him ... and that means Drew needs a superb O-line AND a HOF coach to succeed (we'll find out by December if even that is enough). And that also means the Bills still made the right decision to dump him, because we have neither.

I've never known such a needy quarterback.

[The_Philster]

I've never known such a needy quarterback.:rofl:

[Mr. Cynical]

Drew is capable of playing well. He's done it for about a third of his career.

Maybe Parcells can get through to him ... and that means Drew needs a superb O-line AND a HOF coach to succeed (we'll find out by December if even that is enough). And that also means the Bills still made the right decision to dump him, because we have neither.

I've never known such a needy quarterback.

:10:

And let's not forget J. Jones' 96 carries...3rd highest in the league.

[Stewie]

A lot of morons around here were talking about how Dallas would bench Drew by week 9, and that Dallas wouldn't win three games all year. Talk about petty. Bledsoe is the man, and Buffalo made a HUGE mistake in not building on what he and the team accomplished last year. I couldn't be happier to see how JP and Drew have performed this year respectively.

If you couldn't be happier to see a Bills qb struggle, why are you here?

[Mr. Cynical]

If you couldn't be happier to see a Bills qb struggle, why are you here?

:bf1:

[mchurchfie]

Somehow, I just can't seem to shake that image of Drew throwing the ball away, out of bounds, on forth down in that night game against KC or Miami (can't remember which) a couple of years ago. We were trying to make a lastditch drive with very little time remaining to win the game. Drew started to run for the first down, of which he could done, but opted to throw the ball away:loser:........GAME OVER.

[Philagape]

Buffalo made a HUGE mistake in not building on what he and the team accomplished last year

Well, talk to the NFL and see if they will let us play the Browns, 49ers, Cardinals, Seahawks and Rams again.

[Ebenezer]

In the last two weeks with some of the stuff here at work, I've talked to people from all over the country...they seem puzzled why we gave up Bledsoe. In fact the only people I hear *****ing about DB are Bills fans - and then only people on this board. I was even talking to some folks in Massachusetts; they don't have much bad to say about Bledsoe.

Say what you want but that OL in Dallas is far from what it was in their glory days (70s or 90s). He has a retread and a wannabe at WR. Jones is carrying a boatload but that is by design. Frankly, it looks very similar to the Bills offense of last year after McGahee replaced Henry and what the Bills offense was supposed to look like this year. Folks here expected him to win on his own. Parcells isn't making him do that. That's the difference. If you all want to call that the "Perfect Situation" or that he is "needy" so be it. Is he benefitting from Parcells? Yup. Maybe TD should have thought about that when he interviewed Charlie Weis.

Right now though, the decision to can him looks hasty, to say the least...we'll have to let it play out. All I know is that if Dallas makes the playoffs and we are sitting home that Buffalo is going to look like a horse's ass...and I'll be more pissed than I am now. I'll say it again, DB gave the 2005 Buffalo Bills a better chance at making the playoffs. Period.

[colin]

bledsoe is a statue and needs protection to take advantage of his biggest strength: picking apart the secondary with long passes.

he isn't very strong in the shorter passing game, but he kills people with the big plays.

plenty of immobile QBs need protection: Green, Collins, Manning, the other Manning, Bruenel (even tho he used to run), etc.

the bills just can't protect the passer, so i am willing to accept that bledsoe isn't a fit for our team. it doesn't mean he stinks, he is obviously good enough to be a big upgrade in dallas.

anyhow, holcomb has a quick release and a very good touch on the short passing game, so i think he might be a better overall fit for our O than bledsoe. JP simply doesn't have any of the skills to be a starter in the NFL right now, and shouldn't start until he is at least close to earning the starting job.

[Mr. Cynical]

Is he benefitting from Parcells? Yup. Maybe TD should have thought about that when he interviewed Charlie Weis.

No argument there. TD should be fired.


Right now though, the decision to can him looks hasty, to say the least...we'll have to let it play out. All I know is that if Dallas makes the playoffs and we are sitting home that Buffalo is going to look like a horse's ass...and I'll be more pissed than I am now. I'll say it again, DB gave the 2005 Buffalo Bills a better chance at making the playoffs. Period.

Wrong. See below.


the bills just can't protect the passer, so i am willing to accept that bledsoe isn't a fit for our team.

Exactly. :up:

And to beat this dead horse for the trillionth time, the Cowboys are 3-2. Wait until he blows it like he has so many times before. I can't believe how you and others are so quick to praise him after how many times he has failed before. Wait, you'll see.

[ddaryl]

the Bills and Bills fans have to admit how big of a mistake it was to not keep DB around. if we would have fixed the OL, DB would have been our best option at QB this year.

BUT since the Bill shad no intention of upgrading the OL it was better that we did get rid of him

[Philagape]

plenty of immobile QBs need protection: Green, Collins, Manning, the other Manning, Bruenel (even tho he used to run), etc.

Not as much as Drew needs it. The great QBs have a sixth sense and can elude a pass rush without running around and can find a receiver in an instant under pressure. Drew usually doesn't. Drew is nothing but a strong arm mounted on a mannequin. He has none of the intangibles that make a QB great.

[Philagape]

If our O-line could protect the passer, Holcomb could QB us to the playoffs, and he's a lot cheaper.

[Ebenezer]

No argument there. TD should be fired.



Wrong. See below.



Exactly. :up:

And to beat this dead horse for the trillionth time, the Cowboys are 3-2. Wait until he blows it like he has so many times before. I can't believe how you and others are so quick to praise him after how many times he has failed before. Wait, you'll see.
You are either saying there was another QB that gave the Bills a better chance to make the playoffs or that the Bills had no chance to make the playoffs. Which?

[colin]

Not as much as Drew needs it. The great QBs have a sixth sense and can elude a pass rush without running around and can find a receiver in an instant under pressure. Drew usually doesn't. Drew is nothing but a strong arm mounted on a mannequin. He has none of the intangibles that make a QB great.

if brett farve (the fan favorite for "intangibles") plays with a bad line (which has only done about 2 or 3 times in his career) he falls apart.

Drew is a good passer, he is a very smart QB, and has the yards and passing records to prove it. he just can't move well.

Kelly and Marino where great QBs, but couldn't get it done, even with great lines, because the QB doesn't determine the game by himself (unless he gives it away, JP losman style).

if we had 2 or 3 more O linemen who can play i'd take bledsoe in a second, and no matter what the line is like he is much better than JP, and i'd say with about 90% certainty better than JP could ever be.

we are lucky to have holcomb, who might get hurt or rattled yet.

[Philagape]

if brett farve (the fan favorite for "intangibles") plays with a bad line (which has only done about 2 or 3 times in his career) he falls apart.

Yeah, Favre really sucked last Monday night when he almost pulled off a miracle comeback. He has 15 TD passes, most in the NFL, with his best WR out for the year and a bad O-line. Good call.


Drew is a good passer, he is a very smart QB, and has the yards and passing records to prove it. he just can't move well..

The Drew lovers always point to the yardage, but 40,000 yards is no feat when you have SIX THOUSAND attempts. Mere quantity is not greatness. His career rating of 77 is much more telling, because that measures quality over quantity.

[colin]

Yeah, Favre really sucked last Monday night when he almost pulled off a miracle comeback. He has 15 TD passes, most in the NFL, with his best WR out for the year and a bad O-line. Good call.



The Drew lovers always point to the yardage, but 40,000 yards is no feat when you have SIX THOUSAND attempts. Mere quantity is not greatness. His career rating of 77 is much more telling, because that measures quality over quantity.

wow, are you for real?

what about the playoff games he tanks with terrible ints? or the horrible games he put up against bad teams in the first 3 weeks of this year, or all over the place last year?

bottom line is QBs without protection (and in the case of favre last year, sometimes with protection) make bad plays and have bad games.

drew isn't as good as favre (maybe now he is, but not over his career), but he get's those attempts because he converts third downs.

the PER doesn't measure production, but production is important.

[Philagape]

what about the playoff games he tanks with terrible ints? or the horrible games he put up against bad teams in the first 3 weeks of this year, or all over the place last year?

Good description of Drew's career.

As for Favre, the facts are for real. Like I said and you ignored, he leads the NFL in TD passes, and had a 64.5 % going into this week, and was 7th in yards going into this week. (Yards! Your favorite stat!) Now I won't say he played great, because of the outcomes, but he hasn't been "horrible."

And at least Favre has led his team to a ring, so don't go comparing playoff performances.

Bottom line is, Favre doesn't need protection as much as Drew does, and neither do most QBs. I really don't think you want to compare the two.

[Mr. Cynical]

Yeah, Favre really sucked last Monday night when he almost pulled off a miracle comeback. He has 15 TD passes, most in the NFL, with his best WR out for the year and a bad O-line. Good call.

colin :spank: philagape


The Drew lovers always point to the yardage, but 40,000 yards is no feat when you have SIX THOUSAND attempts. Mere quantity is not greatness.

:up:


drew isn't as good as favre (maybe now he is, but not over his career), but he get's those attempts because he converts third downs.

:huh: What Drew are we talking about? Brees? I think you need to do some research on his completion % on third downs...heck, just check out his comp % period. It sucks. And so does his INT/TD ratio. 4.3INTs for every 5TDs. That's nothing to be proud of.


Bottom line is, Favre doesn't need protection as much as Drew does, and neither do most QBs. I really don't think you want to compare the two.

Actually I hope he does, since it will only sink the Drew Love Boat.

[Mr. Cynical]

You are either saying there was another QB that gave the Bills a better chance to make the playoffs or that the Bills had no chance to make the playoffs. Which?

I don't have a crystal ball, but IMHO it is the latter. This team is not a serious playoff contender, regardless of the QB.

[chernobylwraiths]

The Drew lovers always point to the yardage, but 40,000 yards is no feat when you have SIX THOUSAND attempts. Mere quantity is not greatness. His career rating of 77 is much more telling, because that measures quality over quantity.

Johnny Unitas's alltime passer rating is around 78. And many consider him to be the best ever.

[chernobylwraiths]

Good description of Drew's career.

As for Favre, the facts are for real. Like I said and you ignored, he leads the NFL in TD passes, and had a 64.5 % going into this week, and was 7th in yards going into this week. (Yards! Your favorite stat!) Now I won't say he played great, because of the outcomes, but he hasn't been "horrible."

And at least Favre has led his team to a ring, so don't go comparing playoff performances.

Bottom line is, Favre doesn't need protection as much as Drew does, and neither do most QBs. I really don't think you want to compare the two.


Actually, most good QBs DO need good protection.

But IMO Bledsoe isn't even close to as good as Favre.

[Mr. Cynical]

Johnny Unitas's alltime passer rating is around 78. And many consider him to be the best ever.

Well the man played for 18 years from '56-'73, and the ratings, rules, players and game has changed exponentially since then. Not sure you can make that comparison.

[The_Philster]

Actually, most good QBs DO need good protection..What are you doing bringing facts into the debate? :cynic:

[BillsFever21]

Drew was never gonna succeed here. You could tell by his body language he wasn't happy here.

He was like a robot going through the motions the last two years. He was uninspired and didn't leave everything he had on the field.

Being released gave him inspiration and something to prove(Like when he first came here from NE) Lets see how he does towards the end of the season and next year.

[Philagape]

Johnny Unitas's alltime passer rating is around 78. And many consider him to be the best ever.

My God, first Favre, now Unitas.

Unitas' credentials are just a tad better than Drew's. ... Led Colts to 1958, 1959 NFL crowns. . .All-NFL six seasons, Player of Year three times . . .MVP three times in 10 Pro Bowls. Threw at least one TD pass in 47 straight games.

Unitas is considered the greatest because he's a winner. He had the intangibles I mentioned before.

[Philagape]

Actually, most good QBs DO need good protection.


Did I say otherwise? Read the whole sentence and don't leave out the "as much as Drew" part before you refute a point I didn't make.

[olivia]

Letting Bledsoe go was a huge mistake and if you do not believe it ask Lee Evans. The coaching staff in Buffalo is getting away with murder, it is there job to put in a scheme to take advantage of the players you have and they never did that with Drew. The coaching staff is awful and as long as Mularkey is there they will never contend

[chernobylwraiths]

Well the man played for 18 years from '56-'73, and the ratings, rules, players and game has changed exponentially since then. Not sure you can make that comparison.

People like bringing up stats and this is one. Stats don't tell the whole story.

As I've said before, IMO in Drew's prime he was a good QB. He is now a mediocre QB that can look real good when given good protection. Not all QBs can look good even when given good protection. I just refute the claims that he sucks.

[colin]

Good description of Drew's career.

As for Favre, the facts are for real. Like I said and you ignored, he leads the NFL in TD passes, and had a 64.5 % going into this week, and was 7th in yards going into this week. (Yards! Your favorite stat!) Now I won't say he played great, because of the outcomes, but he hasn't been "horrible."

And at least Favre has led his team to a ring, so don't go comparing playoff performances.

Bottom line is, Favre doesn't need protection as much as Drew does, and neither do most QBs. I really don't think you want to compare the two.

non sequitor

he has racked up some numbers this year sure, but so has bledsoe.

favre has been better over his career (i just said so above, nice job not reading that), but without protection even he breaks down.

the bottom line is while drew requires more protection than favre, he doesn't require much more than many other QBs in the NFL who are immobile themselves, yet have success.

you just knee jerk and dig up stuff to support your idea that bledsoe stinks. he doesn't stink, he has been to many probowls and had big time passing success on 3 teams after this year (if he breaks dallas passing records you have got to recognize that he at least doesn't suck).

the thing you can't let yourself admit is that drew doesn't suck, and can be very effective. favre will go down as one of the best ever, and he chucks insane picks all over the place, while not pressured. this has always been the knock on favre, he gunslings and makes great things happen and terrible things happen too. it doesn't follow that with favre being better drew is terrible, that kind of thinking got bledsoe run out of town and cost us 2 or 3 games this year with a not ready yet JP playing.

the only ring a qb ever wins is when he is on a great team, that green bay team that won the super bowl was stacked, and it took massive special teams play to get them there and to win the game.

it's pretty laughable that you and the other posts here insisted on having Warner, Garcia, and other retread QBs here instead of drew, then thought that any QB will be better on our team, and now excuse JP and pretend bledsoe isn't playing well in Dallas.

you (and the other tenis fans) are just too obsessed with the QB, you bring up PER stats when the suit you, and ignore them when the don't. you bring up accolades like Unitis when they suit you, and ignore them when they don't. you bring up team records when it suits your argument for a QB (which is insane, it assumes that the QB is the only player that can change the outcome of the game), but are happy to have a terrible young QB like JP even when he is all but wearing a sign on his face saying he can't play.

[chernobylwraiths]

Did I say otherwise? Read the whole sentence and don't leave out the "as much as Drew" part before you refute a point I didn't make.

I didn't 'leave anything out', I quoted your whole piece. I am saying that most QBs need as much protection as Drew, maybe not Favre, but for most of the good ones, they usually are pretty well protected.

I don't know how you can compair like that either.

[Mr. Cynical]

Bledsoe doesn't play for Buffalo anymore.

[The_Philster]

But the point of this whole thread is that he should be playing for Buffalo, and fans should be so upset at management for their mishandling of him that they should stop supporting Buffalo and defect to Dallas.While I'm not thrilled that he left (if they're not gonna develop JP like they said all offseason, they should've found a way to keep Drew, IMO), he's not bigger than the team. Anyone who switches teams because of a player move was never a fan of the team he was with to begin with.

[colin]

While I'm not thrilled that he left (if they're not gonna develop JP like they said all offseason, they should've found a way to keep Drew, IMO), he's not bigger than the team. Anyone who switches teams because of a player move was never a fan of the team he was with to begin with.
true dat yo

[Turf]

Phil, I think your next pic in your sig line should just be a vagina.

[Ebenezer]

I don't have a crystal ball, but IMHO it is the latter. This team is not a serious playoff contender, regardless of the QB.
I don't have one either; but after the season ended last year I thought this defense could make the Bills a contender for the playoffs. That's why I said go with DB. Now that we have two injured starters on defense, the defense has slipped and the offense looks way too conservative and putrid I agree that the Bills aren't going to make the playoffs.

[Mr. Cynical]

I don't have one either; but after the season ended last year I thought this defense could make the Bills a contender for the playoffs. That's why I said go with DB. Now that we have two injured starters on defense, the defense has slipped and the offense looks way too conservative and putrid I agree that the Bills aren't going to make the playoffs.

I know we'll just have to agree to disagree on this...but

Last year, of our 9 wins, 2 were against winning teams. This year we have beaten Houston (worst team in the league) and Miami (who commited 18 penalties and 5 turnovers). They have proved nothing yet IMO.
The oline was not good and still isn't.
The D was/is overrated. They played very well against crap teams but folded at many critical times against good ones. And IIRC you put the blame on missing the playoffs on Nate not knocking that ball down against Jax. (may have been clump, not sure). I do agree it is now worse with the injuries, but even before TKO they were not playing playoff caliber ball.So, I never felt this team was ready regardless of the 9-7, because of all of the above. My only hope this year was for JP to get experience so that we had the triplets to build a team around (JP/WM/LE). Looks like we'll have to wait yet another year for that to happen while we limp along at maybe .500 once again.

[The_Philster]

Eb putting the blame on Nate for the Jax game was a little stab at the Amigos' putting the blame (seemingly completely) on Drew's shoulders for losing the other 6 games ;)

[Ebenezer]

I know we'll just have to agree to disagree on this...but

Last year, of our 9 wins, 2 were against winning teams. This year we have beaten Houston (worst team in the league) and Miami (who commited 18 penalties and 5 turnovers). They have proved nothing yet IMO.
The oline was not good and still isn't.
The D was/is overrated. They played very well against crap teams but folded at many critical times against good ones. And IIRC you put the blame on missing the playoffs on Nate not knocking that ball down against Jax. (may have been clump, not sure). I do agree it is now worse with the injuries, but even before TKO they were not playing playoff caliber ball.So, I never felt this team was ready regardless of the 9-7, because of all of the above. My only hope this year was for JP to get experience so that we had the triplets to build a team around (JP/WM/LE). Looks like we'll have to wait yet another year for that to happen while we limp along at maybe .500 once again.
we will have to disagree...we were not sliding by weak opponents last year; we were blowing them away. Had we barely beaten Cleveland, SF, etc. I would have agreed with you. Had they not played Pittsburgh tough for 3 quarters maybe I would have felt different. I didn't drink the cool-aid and think this team could go 13-3 or be a SB contender but I did feel they had a chance for the playoffs...as we see this division may be up for grabs. Would we be in this same position with DB and the defense the way it is? Probably close...3-2 at best (I still hold that we would have beaten Atlanta). Over the course of the season, though? No, right now this is not a playoff team...all the more reason to have JP in there.

You wanted JP because you never believed them to be a playoff team. I want JP because I am now convinced the defense is a paper tiger.

[Philagape]

I guarantee you, we'd still be 2-3 with Drew, as surely as the sun rises and sets. Just because he's played well so far with Dallas (except for the two times he choked during attempted comebacks), does it follow that he'd be playing the same way here, now? Behind our O-line? He played the same way in 2002 the last time a team dropped him, when he had something to prove.
Holcomb is no worse; he has the same career efficiency numbers. He doesn't have Drew's arm but is more accurate and has shown that he can light it up. Same result, far less cost.

[Ebenezer]

Eb putting the blame on Nate for the Jax game was a little stab at the Amigos' putting the blame (seemingly completely) on Drew's shoulders for losing the other 6 games ;)
Phil, it was no jab. If he knocks the ball down the Bills start 1-0. Who knows, maybe that carries into Oakland and they win...etc...if the defense holds against the Jets...if Henry reaches over the goal line...if the defense doesn't give up a 59 yard run at Willie Parker...

I am not going over 35,000 posts but somewhere after the Jax game I posted that the Bills might regret Clements not knocking down that ball.

[Ebenezer]

I guarantee you, we'd still be 2-3 with Drew, as surely as the sun rises and sets. Just because he's played well so far with Dallas (except for the two times he choked during attempted comebacks), does it follow that he'd be playing the same way here, now? Behind our O-line? He played the same way in 2002 the last time a team dropped him, when he had something to prove.
Holcomb is no worse; he has the same career efficiency numbers. He doesn't have Drew's arm but is more accurate and has shown that he can light it up. Same result, far less cost.
is Holcomb worth a $1.1 mil savings this year??

[Mr. Cynical]

is Holcomb worth a $1.1 mil savings this year??

Let's ask that question at the end of the season. :;

[Philagape]

The question is, would Drew have been worth $1.1 mil more? After three years of showing us what he had, it would take a lot of convincing for me to believe he was worth $1.10 more.

[chernobylwraiths]

I have a question for those who continually bring up Bledsoe's salary, although it will but some blame on everyone's current favorite whipping boy.

The question is, why should Bledsoe have taken a huge cut in salary to save the team money when: a) many here would still blame him for the losses anyway and b) no matter how much money he could have given back to the team (hell, he could have gone to veteran minimum) does anyone think Donahoe would have signed or traded for a top offensive lineman?

The answer of couse is no.

[Mr. Cynical]

Let me ask you this question...do you think Drew was worth a #1 pick and $21+M for his performance while he was here?

[camelcowboy]

Before you guys go crying about not having bledsoe keep this in mind. When he gets pissed he has great games, but after a while he loses his motivation. Hell he made the probowl because of his first eight games with us, he was trying to prove everyone wrong, that they should have kept him instead of brady. The honey moon is only about five weeks, If he can do it the whole season then ill be impressed, I wouldn't wager any money on it. Teams will figure him out.

[The King]

I am just curious as to how many people have watched Dallas' this year. There is a lot of this and that as to what you are all saying but has anyone actually seen him play this year. The guy is running an offense that I have never seen him run. He is taking off and scrambling through the holes when he has them, thats right... scrambling. His line is better yes but his mobility this year is unlike anything I have seen from Bledsoe. He is also avoiding mistakes. He isnt perfect but he is throwing the ball away this year, instead of forcing it. He is playing like a veteran.

I think the moral of the story here is Drew wouldnt be having the season he is having if he were in Buffalo. Say what you want about his ability or his career. He is having a good year lets acknowledge that, and move on. If we are to start a thread after every Bledsoe win we will all be dealing with a long season. We are all Bills fans but none of us are time travelers we cant go back and change anything. I think we need to focus some of this energy at TD's throat after all this is his mess, not JP's or Drews.

[BSXIII]

I've seen all the Dallas games this year and all that is true. He doesn't look like the statue he supposedly is in Dallas. He's moved around the pocket pretty well and at times has scrambled for the first down. The main difference is he has a pocket to move around in. With this team, the O-line would break down and defenders would come free. And when guys come unblocked not even Michael Vick can elude them most of the time. When the linemen at least do something to slow the rushers progress though, Bledsoe has show the abilty to move away from the rush and make plays. Also Dallas has been punishing teams for blitzing. The O-line and WR's adjust, and the ball has been out of his hand within three seconds for a big gain.

The moral of this story is that teams need good O-lines to win. Everyone seems to get this besides the blind Bledsoe haters and our egotistical moronic GM.

[camelcowboy]

I am just curious as to how many people have watched Dallas' this year. There is a lot of this and that as to what you are all saying but has anyone actually seen him play this year. The guy is running an offense that I have never seen him run. He is taking off and scrambling through the holes when he has them, thats right... scrambling. His line is better yes but his mobility this year is unlike anything I have seen from Bledsoe. He is also avoiding mistakes. He isnt perfect but he is throwing the ball away this year, instead of forcing it. He is playing like a veteran.

I think the moral of the story here is Drew wouldnt be having the season he is having if he were in Buffalo. Say what you want about his ability or his career. He is having a good year lets acknowledge that, and move on. If we are to start a thread after every Bledsoe win we will all be dealing with a long season. We are all Bills fans but none of us are time travelers we cant go back and change anything. I think we need to focus some of this energy at TD's throat after all this is his mess, not JP's or Drews.

I agree, i have watched lots of dallas games this year, well 3 have been on at times i can view them, and i am impressed, The biggest difference in my mind is the inner offensive line of the cowboys. They are big, and decent and guard and center, something the bills can't say. Its tough for teams to bust the middle of the pocket with the blitz. Philly tried doing it all game and they were burnt. With time bledsoe can be a great qb, Losman is a mobile qb, but the passrush is getting to him just as fast, i saw the same thing with Holcomb, Its time TD, actually put invest some effort into the lines on this team.

[The King]

Its time TD, actually put invest some effort into the lines on this team.

I dont know if he can avoid it any longer. I can't see any possible explanation.

[Meathead]

Phil, I think your next pic in your sig line should just be a vagina.

http://www.greenpeace.org/raw/image_full/international/photosvideos/photos/george-bush-leads-the-us-towar.jpg

[camelcowboy]

I dont know if he can avoid it any longer. I can't see any possible explanation.

This franchise hasn't had a o-line since the kelly era, they have made little effort in the draft. I would love to see all our first day draft picks go right to the o-line, or d-line center being the number one priority. D-tackle being the next.

I think Gandy is turning out to be a good player, I like Preston too, keep Williams, but Teague, Vanerial, and Anderson, need to go. We need a D-tackle because Sam is showing his age, and Ron Edwards doesn't have the durability to be a starter.

[Philagape]

Every time I've seen him play this year, I keep saying, "Wow, look at all the time he has."

Also, in his career, most of Drew's best days have been under Parcells. If Parcells can fix him, that makes him a HOF coach as much as any Super Bowl.

[BillsFever21]

Nobody can say that Drew had the fire in him the last two years that he has right now with the Cowboys.

He has that same fire he did in 2002 after the Patriots dumped him and we picked him up. He will soon have that same lack of fire that we saw the last two years in Buffalo and towards the end of his Patriot days where it seemed like he had no desire to play.

If you get rid of this guy every year he will give you a good season but once he gets comfortable he loses his motivation. Maybe Parcells will keep him motivated but I doubt it.

If Bledsoe was still here he would not be having this type of season. Me and other doubters even predicted this start of the season for him but he will tank by the end of the year.

[Jan Reimers]

I think that Bill Parcels - as well as every coach, personnel man, usher, ticket taker and football fan in the country - knows that Drew Bledsoe needs a big, strong O line to be effective. TD is the only person in America not to have figured it out.

[Mr. Cynical]

Nobody can say that Drew had the fire in him the last two years that he has right now with the Cowboys.

He has that same fire he did in 2002 after the Patriots dumped him and we picked him up. He will soon have that same lack of fire that we saw the last two years in Buffalo and towards the end of his Patriot days where it seemed like he had no desire to play.

If you get rid of this guy every year he will give you a good season but once he gets comfortable he loses his motivation. Maybe Parcells will keep him motivated but I doubt it.

If Bledsoe was still here he would not be having this type of season. Me and other doubters even predicted this start of the season for him but he will tank by the end of the year.

Well said.

[chernobylwraiths]

Let me ask you this question...do you think Drew was worth a #1 pick and $21+M for his performance while he was here?

The number one pick I can only say that at the time of the trade, yes. I didn't know Buffalo wouldn't successfully address its offensive line issues well enough. I knew he needed a very good line when he came here and we drafted Williams right away, it wasn't enough.

As for the money, that is not my call. He was making that kind of money when we traded for him so they knew how much he was going to have to get paid. Plus, he did take a bit of a pay cut. I'm not hung up on how much he made.