Jauron already screwed up.

[ICE74129]

There is no such thing as competition at the QB position. There was none with Elway, Kelly, Montana, Marino, Aikman etc.

You pick a guy and give him 100% support and groom him. Jauron has pretty much said all positions will have competition. He was dumb enough to say 'If there is a guy that could take a Jim kelly's or Bruce smith's position, then god bless us'. Sorry Dick, GOOD coaches pick a guy and he gets the reps.

It is that simple. Aikman didn't compete with anyone. Guess he turned out ok. This guy is going to take needed reps from whomever is the starter and hurt both QB's.

And let me add this, When you do that it is very easy to make it where a certain player wins the competition. When we see JP gets next to no time with the first team in preseason you will see this.

[The_Philster]

If JP gets no real chance to win the job, that'll be a serious mark against Jauron...but given a fair shot, JP can win it

[THATHURMANATOR]

There is no such thing as competition at the QB position. There was none with Elway, Kelly, Montana, Marino, Aikman etc.

You pick a guy and give him 100% support and groom him. Jauron has pretty much said all positions will have competition. He was dumb enough to say 'If there is a guy that could take a Jim kelly's or Bruce smith's position, then god bless us'. Sorry Dick, GOOD coaches pick a guy and he gets the reps.

It is that simple. Aikman didn't compete with anyone. Guess he turned out ok. This guy is going to take needed reps from whomever is the starter and hurt both QB's.

And let me add this, When you do that it is very easy to make it where a certain player wins the competition. When we see JP gets next to no time with the first team in preseason you will see this.
He was honest he didn't know enough about Losman yet.

[tat2dmike77]

Your right. I think i dunno.

I've always heard that no job is guarnetied in the NFL. Maybe i'm hearing it wrong i dunno.

But my question is this. How can a guy that hasn't seen Losman play just give him the job? I'm sure in the end this is what will happen anyway.

This happened with WM and TH when TH sucked WM came and ran with it. This is what Losman has to do. He has to run with it (not literally) if he is the starter then he needs to play like one.

I know what people will say. We need a O-line first. DUH i think everyone that has even watched bills highlights (oxymoron?) this season knows that. What do you people want from DJ answers today about everything?

[feelthepain]

Wasn't JP given the reins last year?? He lost the job because he didn't hold the Job, not becaise MM just felt like having a QB controversy!! You Bill fans want to win and you want JP to be the starter, you can't have both!! The HC's jobs on the line not yours, it's a result oriented business. JP didn't get results, JP was replaced with a veteran, and the Bills played much better.

[MikeInRoch]

It is that simple. Aikman didn't compete with anyone. Guess he turned out ok.

Yeah, he was OK. He's also probably the most overrated QB of all time.

[Mudflap1]

Aikman competed with Steve Walsh. They were both taken in the first round in the same draft. Dallas let them compete head to head, then traded Walsh the next year because they realized Aikman was their guy.

Aikman won three Super Bowls. He's not overrated.

Jon

[tat2dmike77]

Yeah, he was OK. He's also probably the most overrated QB of all time.

:bf1:
:posrep:

[ParanoidAndroid]

If Holcomb outperforms JP, then perhaps he should start. However, up to now, Holcomb really hasn't done anything to convince me he is better, nor has JP done anything to convince me of the opposite. When in doubt, start the 1st rounder. This past season, there was doubt, thus my membership in the JPD.
I have a feeling JP will win the starting job.

[Forward_Lateral]

There is no such thing as competition at the QB position. There was none with Elway, Kelly, Montana, Marino, Aikman etc.

You pick a guy and give him 100% support and groom him. Jauron has pretty much said all positions will have competition. He was dumb enough to say 'If there is a guy that could take a Jim kelly's or Bruce smith's position, then god bless us'. Sorry Dick, GOOD coaches pick a guy and he gets the reps.

It is that simple. Aikman didn't compete with anyone. Guess he turned out ok. This guy is going to take needed reps from whomever is the starter and hurt both QB's.

And let me add this, When you do that it is very easy to make it where a certain player wins the competition. When we see JP gets next to no time with the first team in preseason you will see this.

First, every single guy, besides Ralph, that wanted to draft Losman is no longer in the Bills' organization. Second, Jauron admitted that he doesn't know ANYTHING about Losman. Do you expect him to just name Losman the starter? No. Any coach with half a brain will evaluate every position when hired. Quit griping about Jauron, he's the new coach, deal with it or go become a fan of another team. This *****ing is getting old, fast.

[mush69]

I think it should be a competition for QB. IMO Loseman needs something to push him, he showed flashes of talent this last year but he was very inconsistant. He has a strong arm but his accuracy just plain sucks. Time to hit the old tire swing for a few days.

Juron is not going to come in on day 1 and say this is going to be the guy, without atleast hitting the books for a bit. I say send Matthews back to changing diapers, find another veteran QB and invite him to camp. Let Holcomb, JP, and the vet battle it out!

[dolphinssuck]

Yeah I agree griping is not going to change anything and maybe JP and KH should try for the starting position and then we'd see how much better and deserving JP is. As far as Jauron Im willing to give him a chance and maybe what hasnt worked for him in the past might work in Buffalo. I know alot of folks will disagree with me but it does no good to get mad about the hiring of Jauron so we can only accept it and hope for the best next season. Or there are alot of other teams to pull for in the NFL.

[Mr. Cynical]

Dick didn't screw up. It was standard procedure for a coach of his caliber and W-L record.

[Bill Cody]

There is no such thing as competition at the QB position. There was none with Elway, Kelly, Montana, Marino, Aikman etc.



:roflmao: But the question more on point would be was there competition for Ryan Leaf, Akili Smith, Heath Schuler, Tim Couch, Rick Mirer and Joey Harrington? That's what I want to know.:bullseye:

[Iehoshua]

I agree with ftp about the league being result-oriented but then again there is a learning curve for entering the NFL. Most players don't enter the league and put up Pro-Bowl caliber numbers in their first 16 starts. There are exceptions, but they are not the rule. If the team is going give JP a fair shot at developing, then this talk about competition is ridiculous. If, however, the team simply isn't concerned with developing players and just wants to try hurling players at the wall until one sticks, then we are basically going to be spinning our tires for the next however-many years. This is why you don't see too many Kurt Warner stories. Most teams know there is going to be some bumps when the leader of your team is inexperienced.

[Iehoshua]

:roflmao: But the question more on point would be was there competition for Ryan Leaf, Akili Smith, Heath Schuler, Tim Couch, Rick Mirer and Joey Harrington? That's what I want to know.:bullseye: All of the above had well more than a full season's chance to start. They failed. It's a totally different situation.

[lynobx]

If Holcomb outperforms JP, then perhaps he should start. However, up to now, Holcomb really hasn't done anything to convince me he is better, nor has JP done anything to convince me of the opposite. When in doubt, start the 1st rounder. This past season, there was doubt, thus my membership in the JPD.
I have a feeling JP will win the starting job.

I agree. Basically, JP has a huge upside, where Holcomb will never get any better. That's why JP needs to be given the chance to play and grow into his potential.

[ICE74129]

I think it should be a competition for QB. IMO Loseman needs something to push him, he showed flashes of talent this last year but he was very inconsistant. He has a strong arm but his accuracy just plain sucks. Time to hit the old tire swing for a few days.

Juron is not going to come in on day 1 and say this is going to be the guy, without atleast hitting the books for a bit. I say send Matthews back to changing diapers, find another veteran QB and invite him to camp. Let Holcomb, JP, and the vet battle it out!

JP doesn't need anything to push him. In fact he needs to BACK OFF! He needs to relax.

[ICE74129]

My issue is this, he says he is going to form his system around the talent. Here is the problem....they are two totally different QB's. If Jauron wants to dink, dunk and try to run a very slow paced offense then go with holcomb but you need to draft a guy to groom in that mold.

JP isn't that guy. He is a Kelly, Favre, Marino, Elway type. Not a Rothlesburger, Brady type. That is just his makeup. It isn't wrong, it is just the way he is.

To me you need to GREATLY upgrade the OL, add a couple WR's and a REAL TE and run a 3 wide 1 back base offense with JP. Use the pass to set up the run like Kelly did.

[Nighthawk]

Wasn't JP given the reins last year?? He lost the job because he didn't hold the Job, not becaise MM just felt like having a QB controversy!! You Bill fans want to win and you want JP to be the starter, you can't have both!! The HC's jobs on the line not yours, it's a result oriented business. JP didn't get results, JP was replaced with a veteran, and the Bills played much better.


Got to agree with you on this one. However, that being said, I don't want Holcomb as our starter...we need something better at that position and he isn't good enough. I don't know if JP is either...that has to be addressed no matter what. This team goes nowhere without a good QB.

[SquishDaFish]

Listen ICE he hasnt seen enough of anyone yet. Hes saying what any new coach would say plain and simple. Give it a break already JEEZ!

[ICE74129]

I agree with ftp about the league being result-oriented but then again there is a learning curve for entering the NFL. Most players don't enter the league and put up Pro-Bowl caliber numbers in their first 16 starts. There are exceptions, but they are not the rule. If the team is going give JP a fair shot at developing, then this talk about competition is ridiculous. If, however, the team simply isn't concerned with developing players and just wants to try hurling players at the wall until one sticks, then we are basically going to be spinning our tires for the next however-many years. This is why you don't see too many Kurt Warner stories. Most teams know there is going to be some bumps when the leader of your team is inexperienced.

It's good to see someone else get it. ALL of the QB's listed, good, bad whatever got no less than a FULL SEASON with FULL SUPPORT from their HC. Hell how long did cowher stick with kordell? You are not going to know what any QB can do until you get this period out of the way.

JP was yanked his second game for a series or two for a 'Spark'. That is pure crap coaching. He NEVER had the full support of MM, nor the locker room. Hell the vets in Chicago didnt like Orton starting either, but they backed him. The result? 10-3 as a starter as a rookie!

If they are not going to give JP this chance here,then do the kid a favor and trade him. All he does is bust his ass for this org and gets screwed in the process. Now Jauron needs to either give him that shot OR Get someone else in here to play musical QB's with holcomb this offseason/ Camp.

[Patti120]

Everyone just needs to sit back and relax, because there is nothing we can do but sit and wait, just like we always do. We are all sick of it but hey it's out of our hands, I don't like it either but I'm not going to jump to conclusions until I see how things shake out down the line and through the next couple of seasons. Yeah it suck, but since I have no control over the outcome I'm going to sit back and hope that if there is a god above, he takes mercy on all of us and maybe the pieces to the puzzle will land in the right places for us.

[ICE74129]

And let me add, does any successful QB in the league have to earn his job each year? No. not favre, manning I or II, not Palmer etc.

The QB should not have to look over his shoulder. Confidence is the #1 thing that makes a great QB. Not arm, not mobility, confidence. If you have a QB that is affraid to make a mistake because he will get benched or the guy behind him will take his job, you are ruining a QB period.

That is just how it is. This 'Well then he just isnt' tough enough' Crap is just that...Crap. None of the full time starting QB's in this league look over their shoulders. Are the panthers going to bring in another QB to challenge Delhome due to his meltdown yesterday? No. because Fox is a GOOD coach and knows better.

See a good coach like cowher, Holmgren, Bellichick, Caughlin all have this knowledge. They name a guy, and do all they can to help him. They don't have stupid little competitions that take away from one or the other and force the QB to look over his shoulder. They realise an NFL QB has MANY more things to worry about.

The only teams that have a QB competition are teams that don't have a clear cut starter, period. And we have one, we just haven't let him develop yet. This is the main reason I wanted Sherman and I feel is also the main reason he wasnt' hired. He was going to name losman the starter and that was it. That would have been not only a good move but the RIGHT Move.

I honestly don't think Marv and even moreso Ralph wants to wait on JP to develop. They aren't holding it against him he is inexperienced, they just don't have time to wait. They know it isnt' his fault and he needs time. I feel they want another Veteran brought in, with much more upside than Holcomb to challenge and win the job. They also know that will get the current locker room on board and help attract FA's. If that is the case, trade JP. Don't make the kid sit and screw him over in return for his hard work.

[ScottLawrence]

I think I follow you Ice.


Jauron didn't come out and say Losman is our starting quarterback next year, and mentioned competition, all the Losmanities are crying now, because their hero is probably out as the starter.


So, had he come out and said we will be loooking for a quarterback in the market, or said Holcomb is our starter, he would've screwed up with that as well right?

[ICE74129]

I think I follow you Ice.


Jauron didn't come out and say Losman is our starting quarterback next year, and mentioned competition, all the Losmanities are crying now, because their hero is probably out as the starter.


So, had he come out and said we will be loooking for a quarterback in the market, or said Holcomb is our starter, he would've screwed up with that as well right?

Again assclown, go hump your holcomb doll and leave us alone.

[The_Philster]

I think I follow you Ice.


Jauron didn't come out and say Losman is our starting quarterback next year, and mentioned competition, all the Losmanities are crying now, because their hero is probably out as the starter.


So, had he come out and said we will be loooking for a quarterback in the market, or said Holcomb is our starter, he would've screwed up with that as well right?
not all the Losman fans...most of us have faith that JP can win the job outright

[Ickybaluky]

I disagree wholeheartedly.

I think the #1 problem the Bills made this past offseason was naming Losman the unquestioned starter so early and without competition. It separated him from the team, and naturally led to the vets grumbling and calling for Holcomb the first time he struggled.

Losman should compete and win the job, just like everyone else. It sends the right message to the rest of the team. If he is as good as you think he will be, then he should win the job. Then the rest of the team will see that he has earned it and not had it handed to him. Then it is easier to stick with the young guy once he struggles, because the vets have seen he is better.

The only time the younger guy should play over a better player is when your team isn't playing for anything. Preseason, when the team is out of the postseason or late in the year if the team has clinched a playoff spot. Otherwise, you have to play the guy who gives you the best chance to win, the guy who has proved the better player.

Granted, if you have a guy who has proven himself to be a top player at his position, he really isn't facing competition for his job. However, that isn't the case with a young guy who hasn't proven anything.

It is interesting you choose Aikman as an example, because he had to win his job. People forget the Cowboys drafted Steve Walsh with a #1 pick in the Supplemental draft the same year they took Aikman with the top pick. They had to compete with each other for the job until Aikman established himself as the superior player. In fact, Walsh QB'ed Dallas to their only win in Aikman's rookie seaeson.

The best player plays, regardless of position.

[ICE74129]

I disagree wholeheartedly.

I think the #1 problem the Bills made this past offseason was naming Losman the unquestioned starter so early and without competition. It separated him from the team, and naturally led to the vets grumbling and calling for Holcomb the first time he struggled.

Losman should compete and win the job, just like everyone else. It sends the right message to the rest of the team. If he is as good as you think he will be, then he should win the job. Then the rest of the team will see that he has earned it and not had it handed to him. Then it is easier to stick with the young guy once he struggles, because the vets have seen he is better.

The only time the younger guy should play over a better player is when your team isn't playing for anything. Preseason, when the team is out of the postseason or late in the year if the team has clinched a playoff spot. Otherwise, you have to play the guy who gives you the best chance to win, the guy who has proved the better player.

Granted, if you have a guy who has proven himself to be a top player at his position, he really isn't facing competition for his job. However, that isn't the case with a young guy who hasn't proven anything.

It is interesting you choose Aikman as an example, because he had to win his job. People forget the Cowboys drafted Steve Walsh with a #1 pick in the Supplemental draft the same year they took Aikman with the top pick. They had to compete with each other for the job until Aikman established himself as the superior player. In fact, Walsh QB'ed Dallas to their only win in Aikman's rookie seaeson.

The best player plays, regardless of position.



Really? what did the giants players say when Warner was benched for Eli? Nothing because they knew better. That is the way it should be. STFU And support who is in there.

There was no real competition with Aikman and Walsh. I am in Oklahoma and Dallas is pushed down our throats. Walsh was a joke and out of the league in no time.

There is NO COMPETITION AT THE QB POSITION! There is none, unless you have two BACKUPS trying to beat each other out.

Why wasn't Maddox given the chance to get his job back from Rothlesburger? Isnt' there an unwritten rule about not losing your job to injury? Instead Cowher flat out left roth in there and told maddox tough! You pick ONE guy and you go with him period.

On the part where you say "The only time the younger guy should play over a better player is when your team isn't playing for anything. Preseason, when the team is out of the postseason or late in the year if the team has clinched a playoff spot. Otherwise, you have to play the guy who gives you the best chance to win, the guy who has proved the better player." That is completely wrong as well.

holcomb might be better this last year. he should have been! he is a 9 year guy. JP is a first year guy! But you MUST take this into consideration....are you going to make it into the playoffs and win with holcomb for the next 3-4 years? NO you will NOT! How much better is holcomb than JP? Not much. Will Holcomb improve? No, infact he is declining. Will JP improve? YES with playing time and experience. That all said you MUST PLAY JP And let the kid DEVELOP! Hell Cinci, NYG, Pittsburgh, etc all realised this. Why can't the Bills?

And let me add, screw the veterans. That is our #1 problem on this team. TD filled it with a bunch of ME players that just dont' get it. They are the players, they don't make decisions and have very little imput. Go out, do your job and STFU.

[The_Philster]

uhh..Steve Walsh was in the league for 11 years http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/WalsSt00.htm

[ICE74129]

The best player plays, regardless of position.

then according to you the NFL will fold in about 5 years because no rookie should play period. ALL players need EXPERIENCE to get better, not sit the bench. PLAYING is the only way.

We committed a 1st, 2nd and 5th round picks to JP. We then make him the starter then pull him. That is pure football stupidity no matter how you spin it. JP should have had all 16 games from start to finish this year. Had we done that, who knows how good he would have become. At the least we would have a somewhat honest basis in which to judge him.

[The_Philster]

As much as it pains me to agree with ICE, JP should've never been benched in 2005..and he needs to win that starting role..either by a declaration in the offseason...or a competition. Personally, it'd be nice to get it out of the way and just name him the starter..but if he wins it in camp, it may solidify the team unity around him.

[Forward_Lateral]

As much as it pains me to agree with ICE, JP should've never been benched in 2005..and he needs to win that starting role..either by a declaration in the offseason...or a competition. Personally, it'd be nice to get it out of the way and just name him the starter..but if he wins it in camp, it may solidify the team unity around him.

Hindsight is 20/20. It's funny how almost everyone is now saying that JP should've never been benched. Easy to say after the team finished 5-11. Not so easy after Holcomb came in and promptly beat the Fins and Jets. It's great how everyone pretends that they never wanted Holcomb to be the starter, and that they everyone was 100 % behind Losman from day 1, and never EVER wanted him to be benched.

[gr8slayer]

JP should have never been benched. Period

[The_Philster]

Hindsight is 20/20. It's funny how almost everyone is now saying that JP should've never been benched. Easy to say after the team finished 5-11. Not so easy after Holcomb came in and promptly beat the Fins and Jets. It's great how everyone pretends that they never wanted Holcomb to be the starter, and that they everyone was 100 % behind Losman from day 1, and never EVER wanted him to be benched.
actually, I was *****ing about JP being benched when it happened..there were plenty of us against it

[Forward_Lateral]

actually, I was *****ing about JP being benched when it happened..there were plenty of us against it

Well, Mularkey is gone, TD is gone, so quit freaking whining about it. What do you want Jauron to do about it? HE CAN'T FIX WHAT MULARKEY DID. Sorry, *****ing about something that someone who's already gone did is not going to solve anything. Quit piling on Jauron already. He hasn't done anything wrong yet, he was just hired FFS.

[EricStratton]

Really? what did the giants players say when Warner was benched for Eli? Nothing because they knew better. That is the way it should be. STFU And support who is in there.



I live 10 miles from Giants stadium and I could hear the crying from there when Warner was benched last year. The vets *****ed like crazy.

Besides that and the fact Holmgren benched Matt Hassleback for two plus games last year in favor of Trent Dilfer and Troy got benched in favor or Steve Walsh in his rookie season you're on a roll.


Keep up the good work

[The_Philster]

you're talking to people in general, right? I'm not piling on Jauron...I'm taking a wait-and-see attitude

[tonyc37]

First of all you can't put the blame solely on JP.MM said we were gonns rub the ball to control the game and have a play action passing game.If he had followed through on this JP would have been fine.The coached staff hung him out to dry.If you have never coached the game you would no idea as to what I'm talking about.I have coached and your job as a head coach is to put your players in the best situation to have success.

[Ickybaluky]

With the Warner situation he was a mercenary, and he wasn't pulled until he started struggling. He got off to a hot start in his first couple games, and then he was pulled when he started having some of the same issues that plagued him at St. Louis. The Giants took a gamble, and time will tell if it pays off. Right now, Eli isn't exactly the greatest QB in the world. Warner actually played better last year.

Walsh was Jimmy Johnson's QB at Miami, he loved him. That is why he gave up a first round pick to draft him, AFTER he picked Aikman.

In their rookie seasons, Aikman had 293 attempts, Walsh 219. It wasn't until his second season that Aikman beat him out for good.

I don't disagree the Bills pulled Losman too early, but they also did him no favors by naming him the starter in February. Doing so separated him from the group, and created natural tension among the veterans who don't see him earning his way. It sends a bad message to the team.

If a guy is clearly the best player, he will show it in practice more than games. That is where J.P. should have won the job, and it would have set him up much better as a leader. I think it is most important for a young QB to prove to the veterans in practice that he deserves to play, because he is in a leadership position. If the vets see it, they can understand why he is playing through growing pains. Naming him the starter in the offseason is just dumb, IMO.

I'll take it a step further, I think Jauron did the wise thing by not committing on a QB now. He should let them know it will be a competition, and that they will have to work for playing time. If J.P. is worth the draft picks, he will step up to the challenge. Your QB should be a competitor, so the competition will be good for him.

He has to establish himself first, he has not done that yet.

[Mr. Cynical]

Again assclown, go hump your holcomb doll and leave us alone.

:lmao:

[EricStratton]

I'll take it a step further, I think Jauron did the wise thing by not committing on a QB now. He should let them know it will be a competition, and that they will have to work for playing time. If J.P. is worth the draft picks, he will step up to the challenge. Your QB should be a competitor, so the competition will be good for him.

He has to establish himself first, he has not done that yet.


Bingo

[BuffaloBillsStampede]

You said it perfectly, I think JP is going to be a very solid starter for us in the near future so long as we get the line together and players start supporting him more. That said I also think he needs to take a step back and look at himself and realize he has no reason to be as cocky as he is because he is yet to do anything of importance at this level.

[Spiderweb]

There is no such thing as competition at the QB position. There was none with Elway, Kelly, Montana, Marino, Aikman etc.

You pick a guy and give him 100% support and groom him. Jauron has pretty much said all positions will have competition. He was dumb enough to say 'If there is a guy that could take a Jim kelly's or Bruce smith's position, then god bless us'. Sorry Dick, GOOD coaches pick a guy and he gets the reps.

It is that simple. Aikman didn't compete with anyone. Guess he turned out ok. This guy is going to take needed reps from whomever is the starter and hurt both QB's.

And let me add this, When you do that it is very easy to make it where a certain player wins the competition. When we see JP gets next to no time with the first team in preseason you will see this.

While it's hard to find a flaw in your logic when given the examples you chose, ones still has to consider for each of those you cited, there are more of the Klingler, Ware, Shuler, Akili Smith, Nagle, Couch, Maranovich, Blacklege, etc., types and at what point does one give up?

Even though Steve Young started initially, when he was traded to San Fran, he rode the pine until it was apparent that he was ready and Joe Montana had fallen behind him. Staubach didn't start immediately either, but when he did.... What this means is that there does still exist multiple ways to skin a cat, so to speak.

Personally, I like open competition. Even though that's what Jauron said, I believe there will always be intangibles as well as talent that comes into deciding who one's QVB will be. Physical talent alone states JP is the starter. Old noodle arm Holcomb isn't as mobile, and trails drastically in arm strength, yet he did make faster decisions and seemed better at reading defenses, but that should be the case since he's a vet. The position is there for JP to grab it, it's totally up to him at this point and I feel he'll be given a far shot, especially since is competition is a career backup with a noodle arm.

After the 4th and 7 throw for 2 yards to Moulds who was double teamed in tight coverage, and that season finale disaster against the Jests, I have no respect for Holcomb or belief in him as our starter. So I'm hoping for JP to put it together and win the position as you might image.

[TacklingDummy]

JP should have never been benched. Period

Yeah cause he was playing so well before the benching. What was his average 75 yards 1 INT a game?

Even I can admitt JP played better AFTER he got benched. But he still sucks and will end up a bust. Just like RJ.

[EricStratton]

So from what I can figure out ICE you’re not mad about Jauron vs. Sherman, you’re mad because you figured Sherman would have given JP his best chance as starter and that’s your bottom line.

Is that about accurate?

[ICE74129]

I live 10 miles from Giants stadium and I could hear the crying from there when Warner was benched last year. The vets *****ed like crazy.

Besides that and the fact Holmgren benched Matt Hassleback for two plus games last year in favor of Trent Dilfer and Troy got benched in favor or Steve Walsh in his rookie season you're on a roll.


Keep up the good work

You are flat lying. The vets STFU or got fined or worse. They went out and did their jobs.

[ICE74129]

So from what I can figure out ICE you’re not mad about Jauron vs. Sherman, you’re mad because you figured Sherman would have given JP his best chance as starter and that’s your bottom line.

Is that about accurate?

As usual you are wrong. I will say we committed to JP and he deserves the same oportunities given to pretty much all QB's that were drafted then made starters....a FULL SEASON. 16 games, no pulling him, no benching him etc. 16 with full support of the staff. Only then can we even start to make a decision on him.

And again there is no such thing as QB competition. It is ALWAYS biased toward who the Coach wants. It's a joke. And it hurts both QB's by taking away the very limited amount of snaps with the first team in preseason.

[ICE74129]

there are more of the Klingler, Ware, Shuler, Akili Smith, Nagle, Couch, Maranovich, Blacklege, etc., types and at what point does one give up?


Every bad QB you site got no less than ONE FULL SEASON as a starter. Most of them TWO full seasons.

JP was yanked his SECOND GAME! Hell the kid comes off of a win, has some issues in a VERY tough stadium against a very tough team, and he gets pulled for a series or two. You NEVER do that! You make him work through the issues.

Lets go back and look at FACT. We started off 1-3 Under JP. We kept hearing 'it's JP's fault the Defense can't get off of the field' so he was benched. Then come to find out it was the DEFENSE that couldn't get the DEFENSE off of the field. So they wrongly started throwing blame at the essentially rookie QB! And this is the coaching staff! Not to mention the press and fans!

The kid never did get a real shot. Not from the start of the Tampa game on. There is no way in hell you can judge a QB that way, No way in hell. Then he plays hurt against New england. Fights to the very end, not giving up and gets a TD to Reed. Then benched again under a Bull SH@! injury that we all know was flat crap. They say 'look he sucks' while ignoring that is the first time JP Faced Bellicheck. Gee, Bill hasn't made fools of oh..say ...the best damn QB's in the league. It isn't that JP Was essentially a rookie or nothing against BB who makes payton maning look like Ryan Leaf. No...it was just that JP sucks. Give me a friggin break!

How can anyone here say with a straight face at all that JP had any prayer to succeed under those conditions? Moulds changes his route in mid flight of a deep ball in the New Orleans game. I have the game recorded, if you do, go look! It wasn't originally a post. he changed it AFTER it was thrown. So in addition to the coaching, being a rookie etc, now you have the top vet on the team throw you under the bus too?

Give the kid a full season, with full support and see what we have at the end of the year. I think even his biggest detractor will be suprised.

[EricStratton]

Every bad QB you site got no less than ONE FULL SEASON as a starter. Most of them TWO full seasons.




Of that list only Blacklege and Couch ever started an entire season.

And the Giants vets *****ed like crazy about the benching of Warner. In retrospect they were wrong but they made their voices heard when he was benched.

[ICE74129]

Of that list only Blacklege and Couch ever started an entire season.

And the Giants vets *****ed like crazy about the benching of Warner. In retrospect they were wrong but they made their voices heard when he was benched.

Every successful QB must have no less than one full season starting from the outset. There have been a few step in and do ok, but they had great teams around them. We don't have a great team by any stretch.

I don't feel it will be in Buffalo, but JP needs and deserves a full season with full support to see if he shows enough improvement to keep going, or cut bait. THIS Should have been that season, but TD, MM and Ralph wanted to WIN NOW. They thought they had a good enough team...THEY Thought wrong. That isn't JP's fault.

[Saratoga Slim]

Quit griping about Jauron, he's the new coach, deal with it or go become a fan of another team. This *****ing is getting old, fast.

Amen brother. What's the point? He's here, and hasn't done a damn thing yet to complain about. Lets give the brother a shot. With some decent coordinators he might put a good team on the field.