Moulds to Denver?

[vicmantak]

By Nick Bakay
SuperBowl.com Couch Correspondent

How long until he throws Jake Plummer into a wood chipper?

Don't get me wrong, Owens is tempting -- hey, I drafted him in fantasy football because he puts up monster numbers -- as long as he isn't on double secret probation like some naughty kid at boarding school … but there's a big difference: As a fantasy football owner, I don't have to talk to him.

I don't have to change his diapers. I don't have to fork over a seven-figure bonus only to watch his narcissism turn my clubhouse into a bad episode of Jerry Springer, with my make-or-break free agent playing the role of the psychotic pre-op transsexual stripper off his/her meds.

In the mercurial world of T.O., all it takes is one game for things to go south. I'm talking a rough Sunday, or even worse, a primetime game when the guy tossing him the rock plays like "The old Jake Plummer." How long until this diva wide receiver will accuse Plummer of frolicking with barnyard animals?
Maybe the Broncos can harness T.O. with enough incentive-based clauses to milk one, sane year out him and separate from the AFC elite. But Year 2 is shakier than K-Fed's "musical" career.

In the meantime, I don't sign Owens unless he agrees to a Paxil clause and three specials with Dr. Phil …

P.S.: If the Bills can't fit Eric Moulds under the cap, I think I just made Mike Shanahan's job a lot easier. I know he's not T.O. anymore, but he's a pro, he can catch the ball when it's snowing, and Moulds, Rod Smith and Ashley Lelie? Close enough for rock and roll, sans the tabloid stuff.

http://www.superbowl.com/features/bakay

[RedEyE]

That's just Bakay regurgitating thought.

[vicmantak]

Well, Broncos are seriously interested to trade up on the next draft and it makes sense that both teams would be benefited if Moulds is involved in this business deal.

Bills would be able to add depth with two first round players and it also by itself would really help to purge part of Bills depleted salary cap controversies...

[ICE74129]

I say franchise Clements and trade him to the Giants for their #1. Trade moulds to Philly for thier 2nd rounder. That is two picks in each round and tons of cap room made.

I can hear it now 'Sure ICE trade away our two best playmakers blah blah blah' I say 'Funny we didn't WIN with them here, and other teams won without them. Maybe it is time to try a different approach'.

[DBrown77]

why dont we get rid of our whole team for draft picks? how does that sound?

[mybills]

I'm all for waiting to see if Moulds restructures.

[gr8slayer]

I hate all the trade talk. Everyone is going everywhere right now.

Ricky Williams is going to the Broncos.

T.O. is going to the Broncos, Chiefs, Jets, Cowboys, and 49ers.

This is the worst time of the season.

[Forward_Lateral]

I say franchise Clements and trade him to the Giants for their #1. Trade moulds to Philly for thier 2nd rounder. That is two picks in each round and tons of cap room made.

I can hear it now 'Sure ICE trade away our two best playmakers blah blah blah' I say 'Funny we didn't WIN with them here, and other teams won without them. Maybe it is time to try a different approach'.

If you think anyone will give the Bills a first round pick for Clements, you are high.

[ddaryl]

It's not worth restrucutring Moulds again. All we are doing now is creating bigger dead cap space. Unless EM all of a sudden decides he can play for less in the last years of his contract, he'll just be more dead weight later when he loses another step and gets another year older.

Moulds has value left for a team who needs another rock solid WR and who has a playoff caliber team, but the Bills immediate future is to make changes and fix another mess created by yet another Bills GM. (Butler was the worst followed by TD)

and lets face facts. I don't think Moulds even wants to waste the rest of his career in Buffalo. He is not on the JP bandwagon, and he won't be happy here for a few years until we can right our ship. By that time it will be too late for EM.

IMO EM needs to move on, he deserves a real shot with an experienced All-Pro QB. He doesn't deserve another rebuilding period.

We'll miss him, but he saves us good money, and gives us a good opportunity to get something in return we can rebuild with. Cause we definitely need to replace 1/4 of our roster ASAP.

[HHURRICANE]

I say franchise Clements and trade him to the Giants for their #1. Trade moulds to Philly for thier 2nd rounder. That is two picks in each round and tons of cap room made.

I can hear it now 'Sure ICE trade away our two best playmakers blah blah blah' I say 'Funny we didn't WIN with them here, and other teams won without them. Maybe it is time to try a different approach'.

People hate logic!! This makes total sense. I have said all along that our team chemistry sucks. Getting rid of Moulds and Clements makes sense if we can get some talent. Personally I'd keep Clements at the right price but Moulds best days are behind him. Let him leave!!

[HHURRICANE]

One other point. If you are a fan that thinks we need to win now than this post isn't for you. This attitude is why we still suck. If we played JP entirely last year we would know alot more about our future. In addition Moulds would have seen little playing time and most fans would be saying get rid of him. Instead we half-assed the season with Holcomb and now we have a QB contoversy and a slpit decision on whether Moulds stays or leaves.

It's time to make a legitimate shot at rebuilding which starts with the OL. Losing Moulds to pick up a starting offensive lineman makes total sense. If our QB doesn't have time to throw it doesn't matter if we have Moss, Owens, and Simth as receivers. PERIOD.

[mybills]

I understand the cap part of it, but.....

To say that he's not on the JP bandwagon is wrong. He made one comment back when JP wasn't ready, and people are sticking that to him even today? :shakeno: It won't matter who the QB is if he decides to stay & restructure. He has also said he'd like to retire a Bill. How easily people forget that!

If he does take the paycut, he is STILL valuable. If JP does win the QB competition, Lee won't always be wide open to throw to. It's not like Moulds will never see any play time.

[mybills]

If you think anyone will give the Bills a first round pick for Clements, you are high.
:10:

[Saratoga Slim]

I hate to part with Moulds unless we have some fairly legitimate veteran on the hook. Getting rid of Moulds means, what, Josh Reed is our most experienced receiver? yikes! I'm hoping for a Lee Evans breakout this year, but no rookie is going to play at Moulds' current level for at least 2 yrs, probably three. we see over and over that it takes most rookie wideouts three years to get comfortable. I hate to put all our eggs in Lee's basket till we see that he can really produce.

That said, if we can't get Eric's numbers down somehow, I think we've got to let him go. As it stands, its simply too much money to pay for one position when we don't have all that much cap room and do have a lot of needs.

So lets hope we can work something out with Moulds.

[ICE74129]

If you think anyone will give the Bills a first round pick for Clements, you are high.

Care to bet?

[ICE74129]

I understand the cap part of it, but.....

To say that he's not on the JP bandwagon is wrong. He made one comment back when JP wasn't ready, and people are sticking that to him even today? :shakeno: It won't matter who the QB is if he decides to stay & restructure. He has also said he'd like to retire a Bill. How easily people forget that!

If he does take the paycut, he is STILL valuable. If JP does win the QB competition, Lee won't always be wide open to throw to. It's not like Moulds will never see any play time.

He won't play at 100% for JP we saw it all year minus the carolina game. He spits on players and threw JP under the bus in the locker room and moved to get him benched.

He is a locker room cancer.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

To me, it all comes down to the money.

The Bills don't have a big WR who can take Moulds' place--sorry Sam Aiken!--and there really isn't anyone in this draft who can step in and start right away who can come close to being the threat Moulds is. That being said, the money he is supposed to get is too much for the Bills to afford.

If Moulds is willing to restructure his contract down to a level that the Bills can afford, I would be in favor of keeping him. But, I doubt that he will do that or that it can be accomplished in a way that won't cause bad salary cap problems down the road.

In that case or if Moulds refuses to restructure his contract, I would try to get Philly and Denver (and perhaps Carolina) into a bidding war for his services--a trade would give the team getting him exclusive negotiating rights, while they would have to take a chance on him picking them if we let him go as a free agent--and trade him for a draft pick. (I doubt that we could trade Moulds and the # 8 pick for Denver's two # 1s--even getting a # 2 for Moulds might be hard, due to his age--but Philly probably would be willing to give up it's 3rd Rounder for Moulds and that might get the other two teams to consider giving up a 2nd Rounder for him.)

If the Bills get Moulds off of their books by trading him or if they have to cut him because he won't restructure, they should be able to get a FA WR to replace him (maybe not a star, but a vet with some size) and still have some money left over to put towards an O-lineman or D-lineman. If they get a first day pick out of trading him, so much the better--they can use it to address one of the many holes they have in their roster (O-line, D-line, safety, CB, etc.) or as a bargaining chip to move up higher in the draft.

Moulds and the Bills know that there are teams out there that would love to have him for the couple of productive years he has left. The Bills really don't have anyone to replace Moulds, but they can't afford to keep him at his current contract price and, knowing that he may be able to get more than the Bills can afford from one of those teams, Moulds may not be willing to restructure his contract down to where the Bills can afford to keep him. If that is the case, the Bills should do their best to trade him for as much as they can get for him before they are obliged to pay his roster bonus or cut him. That only makes sense. If Denver is interested in TO, they may be interested in Moulds--and, God knows that Philly could really use him! Carolina, too, if they could convince Delhomme to throw the ball to more than one WR....

[ICE74129]

To me, it all comes down to the money.

The Bills don't have a big WR who can take Moulds' place--sorry Sam Aiken!--and there really isn't anyone in this draft who can step in and start right away who can come close to being the threat Moulds is. That being said, the money he is supposed to get is too much for the Bills to afford.

If Moulds is willing to restructure his contract down to a level that the Bills can afford, I would be in favor of keeping him. But, I doubt that he will do that or that it can be accomplished in a way that won't cause bad salary cap problems down the road.

In that case or if Moulds refuses to restructure his contract, I would try to get Philly and Denver (and perhaps Carolina) into a bidding war for his services--a trade would give the team getting him exclusive negotiating rights, while they would have to take a chance on him picking them if we let him go as a free agent--and trade him for a draft pick. (I doubt that we could trade Moulds and the # 8 pick for Denver's two # 1s--even getting a # 2 for Moulds might be hard, due to his age--but Philly probably would be willing to give up it's 3rd Rounder for Moulds and that might get the other two teams to consider giving up a 2nd Rounder for him.)

If the Bills get Moulds off of their books by trading him or if they have to cut him because he won't restructure, they should be able to get a FA WR to replace him (maybe not a star, but a vet with some size) and still have some money left over to put towards an O-lineman or D-lineman. If they get a first day pick out of trading him, so much the better--they can use it to address one of the many holes they have in their roster (O-line, D-line, safety, CB, etc.) or as a bargaining chip to move up higher in the draft.

Moulds and the Bills know that there are teams out there that would love to have him for the couple of productive years he has left. The Bills really don't have anyone to replace Moulds, but they can't afford to keep him at his current contract price and, knowing that he may be able to get more than the Bills can afford from one of those teams, Moulds may not be willing to restructure his contract down to where the Bills can afford to keep him. If that is the case, the Bills should do their best to trade him for as much as they can get for him before they are obliged to pay his roster bonus or cut him. That only makes sense. If Denver is interested in TO, they may be interested in Moulds--and, God knows that Philly could really use him! Carolina, too, if they could convince Delhomme to throw the ball to more than one WR....

Since Carolina is my #2 team I will say Moulds with a real RB that can be an impact and stay healthy and Carolina wins next years superbowl. Delhome looked for other WR's only to find none open. they have Smith then a ton of #3 WR's and it killed them in Seattle.

Moulds killed himself with his antics this last year. Yeah I know 'frustrated' so what? Do your job, act like a professional then deal with your personal frustrations in the offseason. Ralph wilson would have given him a one on one no problem. Instead he resorted to spitting on a saints player, throwing JP under the bus, leading the locker room to get JP Benched then acted like an ass and got suspended. That is not a leader, nor a veteran example in my book. Had he kept his mouth shut, supported JP in the locker room and in the press, had he given 100% every game JP was in there, I wouldn't have an issue extending his contract. As is, he needs to go.

that said, I think Carolina and Philly would both pony up thier 2nd round picks for Moulds. I think marv needs to let Moulds agent start talking to other teams so we can get this done the first morning of FA which is less than 30 days away.

[Night Train]

Retructuring a 34 year old WR with a 10.8 Mil cap figure is just dumb business. Hasn't the demise of the 49ers, who used that failing practice, taught us anything ? Carrying dead cap hit for players who have been gone for 2-3 years. Sharp thinking.

Cut him and make him an offer, if you want him. Vet WR's are the easiest position to find in Free Agency.

[NorthCarBills]

If you think anyone will give the Bills a first round pick for Clements, you are high.

I would think there are teams out there who would give up a first-round pick for Clements. I'm not saying he's worth it, but I feel confident that teams would bite. The way he talks smack and promotes himself, I'm sure he's got a highlight reel out to possible teams already. I won't miss his inconsistent play and crap attitude, but I think his self-acclaimed "playmaker" ability will draw someone's interest and provide us with a healthy draft pick.

[ICE74129]

Retructuring a 34 year old WR with a 10.8 Mil cap figure is just dumb business. Hasn't the demise of the 49ers, who used that failing practice, taught us anything ? Carrying dead cap hit for players who have been gone for 2-3 years. Sharp thinking.

Cut him and make him an offer, if you want him. Vet WR's are the easiest position to find in Free Agency.

:bf1:

[Kerr]

There's a good chance we can garner a 2nd round pick for Moulds so why cut him? I know many people in bills nation love Moulds, but you have realize that he is not really at the stance of talking crap about qb's since his play has been tunneling every year. Please, i'm tired of hearing Moulds doesn't have a real qb to throw the ball to him, which is why his numbers are down. Anyone notice the situation over in St.Louis? Old man Issac Bruce averaged about 14.7 yards a catch this season without Marc Bulger. He did it with a rookie qb, yet Moulds excuse is that he had no real good qb, hence his 10.1 yds a catch average this season. I'm tired of the excuses for Moulds. He needs to analyze his own play before he runs his mouth about the 2nd year qb. Therefore, I don't see Moulds staying here is in his best interest or ours. Jp is going to keep looking Evans as his first target, while Moulds is going to cry that he's not getting enough balls thrown his way. Do him the favor and trade him to a playoff calibar team so he can be happy, and we can be done with his drama. With the eagles 43rd pick(just after us) we can select Chad Jackson if he's still there or another need(DT, S, OL).

[HHURRICANE]

One other point. If you are a fan that thinks we need to win now than this post isn't for you. This attitude is why we still suck. If we played JP entirely last year we would know alot more about our future. In addition Moulds would have seen little playing time and most fans would be saying get rid of him. Instead we half-assed the season with Holcomb and now we have a QB contoversy and a slpit decision on whether Moulds stays or leaves.

It's time to make a legitimate shot at rebuilding which starts with the OL. Losing Moulds to pick up a starting offensive lineman makes total sense. If our QB doesn't have time to throw it doesn't matter if we have Moss, Owens, and Simth as receivers. PERIOD.

Read it again please!!

[DaBills]

T.O. will be a problem for a team year two. Teams get fooled into thinking "I can straighten him out. He won’t try that **** on my team." So he goes somewhere new and behaves the first year. Then...

it all goes to **** the second year.

[Novacane]

A second round pick for Moulds? :lmao:

[ICE74129]

LMAO I still have some assclown hitting me with Negs when I tell the truth about Moulds. I have it straight from the locker room, He is a cancer. CANCER. PUNK. SELF CENTERED POS!

[dolphinssuck]

LMAO I still have some assclown hitting me with Negs when I tell the truth about Moulds. I have it straight from the locker room, He is a cancer. CANCER. PUNK. SELF CENTERED POS!I agree I wished hed go and we bring in a young talent who has more time remaining in his career. I know hes a really good player but we need a young and talented person to caome in long term and not be a problem in the locker room.

[The_Philster]

comparing Moulds to TO is purely ridiculous..basing everything on 2 small incidents...one where he complained about JP not throwing into double coverage and one where he got into a shouting match with the coaches on the sidelines because of the play-calling...nowhere close to TO...a real locker room cancer

[ICE74129]

comparing Moulds to TO is purely ridiculous..basing everything on 2 small incidents...one where he complained about JP not throwing into double coverage and one where he got into a shouting match with the coaches on the sidelines because of the play-calling...nowhere close to TO...a real locker room cancer

He went to the staff and *****ed until JP was benched. Didn't back him in the press, in the locker room and On the field. It was more than obvious the jerk didn't play 100% when JP Was in, only when holcomb was. Add to that he is back to spitting like a friggin child, he needs to go.

[ddaryl]

Moulds is too expensive to keep, and too old to restructure. moulds however does provide a vet team making a Superbowl push a weapon they definitely need. Moulds could get the Bills a 2nd or 3rd rd pick. We need these picks to shore up a few positions on our team.

The Bills definitely need a WR of Moulds' caliber, and hopefully we can find one that can help take the burden off of Evans. However everyone here has to believe that EM is tired of not playing in the playoffs, and is tired of being a WR for a QB trying to learn the ropes, or trying to survive behind an OL that needs another whole year of work and then some.

Moulds IMO wants new scenery, and his actions dictated this last season. If EM stays he would have ot take a paycut that pays him less over the enxt 3 years as he gets older and the Bills start needing to place thier finances towards younger players.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

He went to the staff and *****ed until JP was benched. Didn't back him in the press, in the locker room and On the field. It was more than obvious the jerk didn't play 100% when JP Was in, only when holcomb was. Add to that he is back to spitting like a friggin child, he needs to go.

I totally agree with you, Ice, about Moulds' behavior last season. IMO the worst thing that he did was to immediately take his complaints about Losman to the press. Regardless of whether his complaints were legitimate or not or whether he had the support of other players in the lockerroom, I feel he was absolutely and completely in the wrong when he went to the press--I was taught and it is still the unspoken rule in most sports that what goes on within the team stays in the lockerroom!!! Going to the press, in my day (albeit that was in the olden, olden days), was considered an unforgiveable, "mortal" sin for a player to do. The fact that Moulds was explicit in saying to the media that Losman should not be the starting QB (again, whether he was right on not) after only the second game was unforgiveable in my book.

However, because I was so adamant in criticizing Moulds for this throughout the season and apparently the owner of the team as being as big an offense as I did, I tried to keep that entirely out of my earlier analysis of what the Bills should do with Moulds. I would have prefered that MM would have done what coaches like Lombardi or George Allen would have done as soon as Moulds' criticisms appeared in the press, but that is "water under the bridge" now. TD and MM are gone, there's a new GM and HC and Moulds is still on the roster and due to receive a huge roster bonus and the new management of the team has to decide what to do with Moulds--and they may feel that Moulds will not challenge them the way that he challenged the previous regime or that he will be on his best behavior this season and won't be a problem for them to deal with. As a result, they may try to decide what to do with him without taking his behavior last year into consideration--as I tried to do in order to anticipate the factors that they would certainly have to take into consideration.

If I were making the decision, like you, Moulds' behavior last season would be a major factor in my thinking. But, I'm not and I'm not so sure that it will be as much of a factor as you or I think it should be in Levy and Jauron's decision-making process.

[ICE74129]

I totally agree with you, Ice, about Moulds' behavior last season. IMO the worst thing that he did was to immediately take his complaints about Losman to the press. Regardless of whether his complaints were legitimate or not or whether he had the support of other players in the lockerroom, I feel he was absolutely and completely in the wrong when he went to the press--I was taught and it is still the unspoken rule in most sports that what goes on within the team stays in the lockerroom!!! Going to the press, in my day (albeit that was in the olden, olden days), was considered an unforgiveable, "mortal" sin for a player to do. The fact that Moulds was explicit in saying to the media that Losman should not be the starting QB (again, whether he was right on not) after only the second game was unforgiveable in my book.

However, because I was so adamant in criticizing Moulds for this throughout the season and apparently the owner of the team as being as big an offense as I did, I tried to keep that entirely out of my earlier analysis of what the Bills should do with Moulds. I would have prefered that MM would have done what coaches like Lombardi or George Allen would have done as soon as Moulds' criticisms appeared in the press, but that is "water under the bridge" now. TD and MM are gone, there's a new GM and HC and Moulds is still on the roster and due to receive a huge roster bonus and the new management of the team has to decide what to do with Moulds--and they may feel that Moulds will not challenge them the way that he challenged the previous regime or that he will be on his best behavior this season and won't be a problem for them to deal with. As a result, they may try to decide what to do with him without taking his behavior last year into consideration--as I tried to do in order to anticipate the factors that they would certainly have to take into consideration.

If I were making the decision, like you, Moulds' behavior last season would be a major factor in my thinking. But, I'm not and I'm not so sure that it will be as much of a factor as you or I think it should be in Levy and Jauron's decision-making process.


But what about Character? Isn't that what marv said he wanted? Moulds actions are completely opposite what marv said he wants.

First off he is what, 33 or going to be? His skills are declining and his cap number is so high that even if we restructure it is a cap burden later on. He showed the young vets the wrong way to handle things. Personally after I trade him I have a team meeting at our first camp (we get an extra manditory camp due to a new HC) and explain to everyone, that attitude won't cut it here.

[mybills]

34 is not too old. Look at all of the Raiders a few years ago. Weren't they in the S.B.? :shakeno: