Nightmare SB is over: some brief thoughts

[Ingtar33]

1) yes i was rooting hard for Pittsburg

2) Seattle was killed by the refs tonight.
details
-PI call was ticky tack, and while it was right (within the definition of the penalty) i don't think it needed to be called
-Big Ben's TD could have gone either way, if i was calling it on the field i'd probably call it a TD, if i was under the hood, i'd have ruled that Ben FUMBLED the football, and did not have control when the ball crossed the goal-line (yes the football crossed the goal-line), he regained control and was down by contact when the ball was behind the goal-line, no touchdown. But then I'm not an NFL ref, and i have the luxury of making such a call with no repercussions. The safe play for the ref was to say there was no incontrovertible evidence either way.
-The MH 15 yard personal foul on the INT return was a terrible call
-the holding on the big Warrick punt return was weak

3) Pit brought it's 'C-' game and still won, a result of luck, good coaching, bad officiating, and an extremely mediocre opponent.

4) what can we learn from this game? The 6th best team in the AFC is marginally better then the best team in the NFC. Seahawks were the product of the leagues easiest schedule (statistical fact, Seahawk opponents combined record = .430 winning percentage), weak conference, one of the strongest O-lines in the league and an above average defense.

5) be prepped for at least two more AFC wins in the super bowl before the NFC has a team ready to challenge for a championship... and yes, the Steelers have to be the weakest SB champ since the 2000 Patriots, who, truth be told, were even luckier to win their bowl then the Steelers tonight (due in large part to the fact they were playing a VERY good football team, where as the Steelers were not).

6) this was a terrible game to watch, as both teams played bad enough to lose

[Novacane]

What about the "hold" that wiped out a Seattle first and goal at the 2

[Ingtar33]

it was a hold from the one shot i saw of it... the right side of the seattle line was holding all game... if seattle needs a goat that's where they should look as their right guard and tackle cost them plenty.

[Novacane]

And Stephens. His drops killed them

[Ingtar33]

yep... though it was not just Stephens... the seattle droppsies came back today in force.

[BSXIII]

Seattle won in the trenches tonight, but don't blame the refs. Yes maybe the Steelers did get the benefit of the doubt, but they won fair and square. Calling Hasslebeck even a mediocre QB is a major stretch. From what he did at BC and at a professional level, he couldn’t even hold Flutie’s jock. Had Seattle ditched Hasslesuck and signed their hometown hero last off season, they easily win tonights game.

[Mr. Cynical]

Seattle's D actually impressed me tonight. In fact, I think you could argue that overal the Hawks played better than the Steelers, except for the big plays which the Steelers made when they had to.

However, that said, the Hawks got jobbed by the refs. The backlash should be interesting to watch unfold over the next day or so.

[Crisis]

What about the horse collar Porter had on Alexander??

The refs blew.

[YardRat]

I'd take Hasselback over anybody the Bills have on their roster at the moment.

[AndreReed83]

Right on Crisis. I noted that too when it happened. Even though I have yet to see that penalty called this season (I don't even know why they made it a rule, since they WON'T enforce it) that was a perfect time to call it. The collar was the only reason Porter brought Alexander down.

I think the offensive PI was actually a good, gutsy call at the time. Looking back on it now, it's way bad because I thought they would even the calls out throughout the game. The reason Jackson extended his arm is because Ike Taylor went to grab his arm, but missed. Common wideout move to push off a little when you are grabbed like that, but since Taylor did miss grabbing his arm, it just looked like an offensive PI. Bad call considering the way the rest of the game went reffing wise.

[Ingtar33]

i've not seen the horse collar call in a game yet this year, so i don't know what needs to be 'seen' by the ref's to make it a penalty.

Unless i forget how the rule is written, I think the reason why it wasn't called was due to the fact Porter had two hands on Alexander, one on his neck, the other on his side. And in theory he wasn't dragging him down by the collar alone (though he was in reality, clearly dragging him down by the collar).

I figure if you're never going to call the penalty (which im reasonably sure it's never been called this year), then why start in the superbowl?

Weak i know, but then as i clearly stated, i thought Seattle got the shaft for most of the game from the refs...

[AndreReed83]

What I find funny is that in being Super Bowl 40, in what was supposed to be the NFL's crowning achievement to date, and a culmination of it's history coupled with 'super' storylines like the Bus, Big Ben's promise to the Bus, Cowher and Holmgren, the Steelers possibly tying for the title of most Super Bowl wins, Seattle's first Super Bowl appearance, Alexander being the MVP, the QB play, Stevens/Porter, I could keep going on, instead this will probably go down amongst fans and others as the NFL's most embarrassing moment. The NFL pissed off 75% of it's fans tonight, if not more. *thumbs up* Paul Tagliabue. Pete Rozelle is spinning in his grave.

[Ingtar33]

It was a terrible game to watch (not the ref's fault)
With terrible officiating
two not so great football teams
and boring commercials

heh... as i said, “Nightmare Super bowl is over.”

[The Spaz]

Yeah I mean who doesn't know that tackling the ball carrier really is a block below the waist!?:confused:

[Bill Brasky]

seattle won everything but the final score. i feel bad for their fans. if this had happened to us, we'd be ready for a mass suicide.

the nfl needs to overhaul a lot of things... mainly the officiating.

i think in the SUPER BOWL, their so called "game of the year", questionable calls should be able to be reviewed. it's their biggest game, their biggest moment, the one day where the entire league is on showcase, and they put out one of the worst products (games) of the season. the officiating was a joke, the game was boring, and the "entertainment" sucked. this game defines what the league is about, and to us hardcore fans who watch week in and week out this was a major dissapointment. i would have rather watched the Bills-Chargers game over this.

secondly, i think a big part of the problem is this 2 week layoff between the championships and the game. it's ridiculous. we had to hear about jerome bettis for 2 weeks, meanwhile the guy doesn't even get 30 yards rushing. who cares? joey porter and jeramy stevens, big deal! why hear this crap for 2 weeks when they can just keep the schedule, have a week off, and have a more competitive game.

i don't understand the NFL's marketing plan... "hey, let's bombard our hardcore fans with 2 weeks of BS and entertainment so we can get that 34 year old soccer mom who doesn't know a first down from a field goal to tune in!". great idea. those soccer moms aren't buying season tickets and merchandise. you can't tell me there wasn't a big difference between the Steelers of 2 weeks ago verses the team we saw tonight. they flat out sucked and had no business being in, let alone winning, this game. if the nfl continues this fiasco of trying to entertain instead of putting on a football game, nobody will go to games and put $$ in those owners' pockets. but the soccer moms might still watch.

dear paul, stop turning the game into a corporate festival and keep it what it is for 20 weeks throughout the year, otherwise it will turn into the NBA.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

it was a hold from the one shot i saw of it... the right side of the seattle line was holding all game... if seattle needs a goat that's where they should look as their right guard and tackle cost them plenty.

If that was a hold, then the tackle that Hines Ward made on the DB on Roethlisberger's first down run late in the fourth quarter was a hold as well.

And, as for Big Ben's TD, I will say the same thing: if he made it to the end zone on that carry--and I'm not saying he did or didn't--then Mack Strong got a first down for Seattle on 3rd down on the previous series when they moved the ball back almost a full yard and he came up 3 inches short on the measurement.

If I were a Seahawks fan I would be livid--as it was, I was utterly disgusted--at the refereeing in this game. Virtually every key call or non-call went against Seattle. While Seattle did make its share of mistakes--no, they did not play a perfect game--and Pittsburgh is a good team, IMHO there is no way that that game plays out the way it did if the refereeing was halfway decent and Seattle got its fair share of the calls. As I see it, the refs dictated the outcome of the game: it would have been tough enough for the Seahawks to beat the Steelers straight up in front of a hostile crowd--and they were playing well enough to do that--but there was no way for them to beat the Steelers in that situation and the referees with all of the calls that went one-sidedly against them.

If they had been wearing Bills uniforms instead of Seattle's unis, everyone on this board would be screaming that we got screwed by the refs again in this game.

[AndreReed83]

Seattle had 7 penalties accepted against them for 70 yards. They lost a total of 160 yards on the penalties, two 1st down and goals/tens in the redzone, and one touchdown.

The Steelers had 3 penalties accepted against them.

Those are the facts of the game.

Now, my thoughts on Seattle's penalties:

I believe of the many holding penalties I saw, 2 were legit. They ALL came on huge plays.

The Hasslebeck chop block penalty was a loophole in the rule. Obviously, it was called to add even more momentum to the turnover.

Pittsburgh was at least offsides twice. Neither were called. The first was a 3rd down play, in which Clark Haggans quick jump discombobulated the Seahawks scheme and allowed for a sack. The second was on the phantom holding call, in which two Steelers jumped early, including the player who was "held."

Three times that I saw, holding by the Steelers was not called. The first was on Willie Parker's 75 yard touchdown run, in which Alan Faneca tackled the player who would have made the tackle. The next two were by the Center on 3rd downs, one of which Big Ben scrambled for the 1st down, the hold being the key to springing him.

Good eye on the Mack Strong play Lifetime. I'm not so sure that Mack got the 1st, but originally the official spotted the ball on the yellow line, then moved it back to the real spot (about half an inch short), then insanely moved the ball back even further.

This is a moot point, but on Jerramy Stevens second drop of the game, he was lying flat on his stomach, due to a Polamalu hit. Polamalu walked over Stevans, and proceeded to sit down on him, he sat on him for a good 8 seconds, if not more. Does anyone remember that play? I think it was a disgusting display of poor sportsmanship.

[madness]

This is a moot point, but on Jerramy Stevens second drop of the game, he was lying flat on his stomach, due to a Polamalu hit. Polamalu walked over Stevans, and proceeded to sit down on him, he sat on him for a good 8 seconds, if not more. Does anyone remember that play? I think it was a disgusting display of poor sportsmanship.

I did, just another case of the refs blowing this game. Stevens also got taunted at the end of the game by three Steelers standing over him while he was on the ground. Just another fine example of how the refs had no control over this game. I know nothing happened and it was the end of the game but if a Seattle player came blazing in to Stevens rescue it could have gotten ugly.

Also just another reason why I hate Pittsburgh so much. Everybody calls them a hardworking blue-collar team but everytime I watch a game, I see somebody doing something dirty. It's a disgrace to the real hardworking blue-collar people in this world. :down:

[That Guy]

What about the horse collar Porter had on Alexander??

The refs blew.
Didn't you hear? Horse collar only gets called when somebody breaks their damn leg.

[Gunzlingr]

What about the horse collar Porter had on Alexander??

The refs blew.

Is that a penalty?

I saw that, and my buddy and I didn't know if it was or not. Porter had his hands in Alexander's pads right in the neckhole and drug him back.

[AndreReed83]

Yes, the horse collar is a penalty. Last season TO being exhibit A, that Ravens RB (Terry Allen?) being exhibit B. Both tackled by Roy Williams. I didn't see it get called ONCE this season though.

If the NFL isn't going to enforce it, they need to develop some equipment that keeps players from getting a handle in there.

[tat2dmike77]

and boring commercials



I thought the best commercial was the "Magic fridge" from budlight.

Overall this superbowl gets a grade of a D-

[HAMMER]

1) yes i was rooting hard for Pittsburg

2) Seattle was killed by the refs tonight.
details
-PI call was ticky tack, and while it was right (within the definition of the penalty) i don't think it needed to be called
-Big Ben's TD could have gone either way, if i was calling it on the field i'd probably call it a TD, if i was under the hood, i'd have ruled that Ben FUMBLED the football, and did not have control when the ball crossed the goal-line (yes the football crossed the goal-line), he regained control and was down by contact when the ball was behind the goal-line, no touchdown. But then I'm not an NFL ref, and i have the luxury of making such a call with no repercussions. The safe play for the ref was to say there was no incontrovertible evidence either way.
-The MH 15 yard personal foul on the INT return was a terrible call
-the holding on the big Warrick punt return was weak

3) Pit brought it's 'C-' game and still won, a result of luck, good coaching, bad officiating, and an extremely mediocre opponent.

4) what can we learn from this game? The 6th best team in the AFC is marginally better then the best team in the NFC. Seahawks were the product of the leagues easiest schedule (statistical fact, Seahawk opponents combined record = .430 winning percentage), weak conference, one of the strongest O-lines in the league and an above average defense.

5) be prepped for at least two more AFC wins in the super bowl before the NFC has a team ready to challenge for a championship... and yes, the Steelers have to be the weakest SB champ since the 2000 Patriots, who, truth be told, were even luckier to win their bowl then the Steelers tonight (due in large part to the fact they were playing a VERY good football team, where as the Steelers were not).

6) this was a terrible game to watch, as both teams played bad enough to lose


If beating the 1,2,and 3 seeds on the road to get to the SB makes you a weak team than what does a strong team look like? Sorry Ingtar, you are off the mark. They didn't play their best football today but they got it done.

[Ickybaluky]

it was a hold from the one shot i saw of it... the right side of the seattle line was holding all game... if seattle needs a goat that's where they should look as their right guard and tackle cost them plenty. Robbie Tobeck, their C, seemed to get tooled as well. Granted, Hamption is a load, but he had his way with Tobeck.

[Ickybaluky]

What about the horse collar Porter had on Alexander??

The refs blew. That wasn't a horse collar. A horse collar is only if you pull the guy back towards you. It isn't illegal to bring someone down by the collar, only to pull them back underneath you.

[Ickybaluky]

Seattle killed themselves in this game. The refs weren't good, but Seattle made mistakes that cost them the game.

[Ingtar33]

If beating the 1,2,and 3 seeds on the road to get to the SB makes you a weak team than what does a strong team look like? Sorry Ingtar, you are off the mark. They didn't play their best football today but they got it done.

I didn't say Pittsburg wasn't a good team, i said compared to past super bowl champs they didn't match up favorably at all.

That doesn't take away form what they accomplished at all, and it does highlight just how strong the AFC is, considering, I think every team in the AFC playoffs with the exception of Jax probably could have beat Seattle yesterday, and quite easily.

BTW: great teams don’t play like Pittsburg did last night in the biggest game of the year. They laid an egg, and won despite themselves. I didn’t think Seattle played particularly bad… what we saw from them was what I saw from them all year long, just the overall level of opposition was stronger yesterday then the NFC had to offer this season.

[AndreReed83]

NE39, I'm going to have to respectfully disagree about the horse collar. They talked to Brock Huard on ESPNnews today, and showed the horse collar play from a close camera view 3 times (the view that ABC would have used, if they had shown a replay), and you see Porter's hand grab the back of the collar, the collar moves back and down, and Shaun Alexander falls backwards TOWARDS Porter. Text book horse collar.

[mybills]

Shaun Alexander falls backwards TOWARDS Porter. Text book horse collar.
That's what I saw.

[Ickybaluky]

NE39, I'm going to have to respectfully disagree about the horse collar. They talked to Brock Huard on ESPNnews today, and showed the horse collar play from a close camera view 3 times (the view that ABC would have used, if they had shown a replay), and you see Porter's hand grab the back of the collar, the collar moves back and down, and Shaun Alexander falls backwards TOWARDS Porter. Text book horse collar. Well, I only saw it once but I didn't think it a horse collar. It isn't illegal to ride a guy down by his collar, the rule reads "immediately pull down the runner". The interpretation is more jerking the guy back. IMO, it is typical of the rules the NFL has changed, which almost always favor offense. At any rate, I didn't think it the most blatant poor call in the game, which admittedly wasn't well-officiated. However, IMO, Seattle has nothing to complain about. They played like crap and would have beat Pittsburgh if they played better, refs or no refs. If I were a Seattle fan I'd be more upset by the dumb turnovers, defensive lapses, poor clock management and dropped passes. Were the refs responsible for Jeremy Stevens drops? Were they responsible for Hasselbeck throwing the ball up for grabs a couple times? Where they responsible for letting the clock run at the end of both halves? Were they responsible for letting up big plays to a Pittsburgh team they otherwise shut down? Seattle and Holmgren didn't wrap himself in glory with this game. Besides the clock management, I question his decision to punt with over 6 minutes left on 4th-and-13 while down 11 points, near mid-field. That was paramount to conceding, IMO. Parker's long run was because Seattle was caught in their base defense against Pittsburgh's 3 WR set, and when Boulware missed the tackle there was nobody else there. Wrong defense. The S were out of position on the pass to Ward on the scramble play that set up Pittsburgh's first score as well. And they got beat clean by a trick play on the Ward TD. Granted, the game wasn't played well by either side or officiated particularly well, but Seattle should look at themselves first before complaining.

[tampabay25690]

Seattle won in the trenches tonight, but don't blame the refs. Yes maybe the Steelers did get the benefit of the doubt, but they won fair and square. Calling Hasslebeck even a mediocre QB is a major stretch. From what he did at BC and at a professional level, he couldn’t even hold Flutie’s jock. Had Seattle ditched Hasslesuck and signed their hometown hero last off season, they easily win tonights game.

What game did YOU watch......Hasselbeck played a good game...If anything Roethlisberger was the one that played bad. This was one of the worst SB's I have ever seen. The better team did not win...Seattle was able to move the ball whenever they wanted then a penalty or a mistatke killed them. The REFS were plain out putrid but i guess they had PITT -4.......
I guess we watched 2 different games.....

[TigerJ]

I thought the main goat for Seattle was the tight end, Stevens. Maybe he let Joey Porter get in his head after all, but he had two major drops costing Seattle anywhere form 6 to 14 points. If he catches those two well thrown balls, we have a very different game.