Bills To Franchise Clements

[The_Philster]

<!--StartFragment -->According to the Sunday edition of the NY Post, the Buffalo Bills are definately going to place the franchise tag on cornerback Nate Clements. By doing so the former first round pick will not be able to test the free-agent market. more (http://www.rnews.com/Sports/Story_2004.cfm?ID=35101&rnews_story_type=39)

<!--StartFragment --> The team is also likely to let receiver Josh Reed and center Trey Teague loose.

[Tatonka]

i want them to keep josh reed.. :mad:

i know he is not what we thought he would be.. but i just have this awful gut feeling that he will go some where else and do well.. losman seemed to like reed and evans the most.

[rschepise]

Good Post. I actually hope that the Bills retain Josh Reed. He seemed to develop a good rapport with JP Losman. Josh Reed seemed to progress last season as a slot receiver (Minus a couple drops at San Diego). However, I think it is time to part ways with Trey Teague. The Bills need to upgrade at the interior of their offensive line.

[rschepise]

Good Post. I actually hope that the Bills retain Josh Reed. He seemed to develop a good rapport with JP Losman. Josh Reed seemed to progress last season as a slot receiver (Minus a couple drops at San Diego). However, I think it is time to part ways with Trey Teague. The Bills need to upgrade at the interior of their offensive line.

[The_Philster]

Ditto...with JP, he's actually done pretty well...and besides..his old college coach is now with the Fish

[YardRat]

I thought Clements was a no-brainer once his tag $$ was reduced.

I'd like to see them keep Reed also. He drops a few, but he is a decent blocker and a viable slot receiver, IMO.

[sba]

Goodbye Josh Reed !!!!!

[Tatonka]

i could totally see reed with the fish.. kind of irritating.

[vicmantak]

i could totally see reed with the fish.. kind of irritating.
Agree. I can see the same scenario.
The only thing I know is that a confident Reed will kill us...

On the other hand, it's a little late but it's great to know that Bills will franchise Clements. Right now, commited teams will be trying to find many ways to get him.

[Tatonka]

yeah.. i wouldnt expect it, but if another team offered us two first rounders for nate.. i would take it in a new york minute.

[G. Host]

yeah.. i wouldnt expect it, but if another team offered us two first rounders for nate.. i would take it in a new york minute.
Actually Bills would not have a choice with franchise tag - that is how much it costs.

And yeah Reed appeared to be getting his mojo back and for a while was only one consistantly catching balls from both QBs AND he was blocking better than our star RB. I'd hope the Bills could sign him on a 2 or 3 deal but they will probably lose him since they NEED to rebuild the OL.

[Tatonka]

well, they could match the contract or accept the 2 firsts.. but i have never seen it happen, and dont expect that it would.

i am wondering how much josh reed would really want.. i mean, it is not like he could command much more than league minimum based on his stats.. maybe we can sign him to a 3 year 2.5 million dollar deal or something. he doesnt seem like the kind of guy that is running for the money.. he almost seems like the kind of guy that would want to prove he isnt a bust and stick around to see the ship righted.

[ICE74129]

Actually Bills would not have a choice with franchise tag - that is how much it costs.

And yeah Reed appeared to be getting his mojo back and for a while was only one consistantly catching balls from both QBs AND he was blocking better than our star RB. I'd hope the Bills could sign him on a 2 or 3 deal but they will probably lose him since they NEED to rebuild the OL.

The Bills can agree to lesser compensation.

[vicmantak]

yeah.. i wouldnt expect it, but if another team offered us two first rounders for nate.. i would take it in a new york minute.
Maybe I'm wrong but if Bills FO are only willing to get something for Nate, they can make some franchise contract changes and get only one 1st round pick as they did some years ago. Last year, if I'm not wrong Colts, Jaguars and Eagles were looking to trade their franchised players for only a 2nd round pick.

[ICE74129]

I think the Bills will do this to see if they can get a reasonable deal done with nate. If not, look for him to be traded on draft day. No way they let him play out one year then let him walk or tag him again.

Interesting in the article is they are going to let Teague walk. THANK GOD! That means Center and LG will now both definately be addressed.

[G. Host]

The Bills CAN agree to lower compensation (many times teams do this) but it a team chooses it can hand over 2 first round picks (they can not trade up to get them splitting a low 1st round pick into 2 higher 1st round picks) to the Bills and the Bills can only say "thank you" and have no right to match. I am not sure what happens if a team has a pick from the previous year and how valuable it has to be other than being a 1st.

This does mean the costs are different for different teams (i.e. Pittsburgh would pay less than Texans).

Players' agents are starting to understand the game now and advising their clients to sign the contract now for teams can pull the contracts once mad money is gone and players are left with dealing with teams with salary cap space only.

[Meathead]

yeah i hope they do franchise clements. five and a half mil or whatever isnt bad at all if he plays like he used to. hes a force when hes on his game and other than last year he usually has been

[Drive 4 Five]

Agree. I can see the same scenario.
The only thing I know is that a confident Reed will kill us...

On the other hand, it's a little late but it's great to know that Bills will franchise Clements. Right now, commited teams will be trying to find many ways to get him.

Ha! Let's not get carried away. Reed is not going to "kill" anybody. Regardless of how confident he is. Still. At the right price he is a decent third or fourth option. If not. Hit the road jack.

[OpIv37]

yeah i hope they do franchise clements. five and a half mil or whatever isnt bad at all if he plays like he used to. hes a force when hes on his game and other than last year he usually has been

I'm sorry but this just isn't logical. "If you ignore his recent streak of horrible play, he's worth $6 million". You're doing the reverse of what Wys used to do to manipulate stats in order to fit his preconceived notion of certain players.

Giving Clements this much money is a mistake. And we're going to regret it when we can't bring in any OT or DT help.

[Meathead]

i dont think he was horrible. granted he had a couple real sinker games but all things considered he was above average, very subpar for him but still a major contributor

considering his outstanding play the prior three years its a stronger likelihood that he'll be better compared to last season than get worse or stay the same. that would be worth 5+ mil. if he doesnt then you would be right, it would be a mistake

id roll them bones myself

[Tinboy]

Clemets was a no brainer really. The Jags are in need of a good cb, perhaps a 2nd round and a 3rd from them. Otherwise I would love to trade him to 49'ers who also are in need of a cb but I don't think that's going to happen.

Reed fate was sealed the last draft with the pick of Parrish.

[The_Philster]

I'm sorry but this just isn't logical. "If you ignore his recent streak of horrible play, he's worth $6 million". You're doing the reverse of what Wys used to do to manipulate stats in order to fit his preconceived notion of certain players.

Giving Clements this much money is a mistake. And we're going to regret it when we can't bring in any OT or DT help.
so because his play suffered because his defensive coordinator threw him under the bus, he sucks?

[Jan Reimers]

If Moulds walks and Reed is let go, we're going to be awfully thin at WR. We will then have to spend FA $ or draft picks to rebuild the position, which we can ill afford to do, given our other needs.

I hope that we can find a way to bring them both back.

[Night Train]

UFA WR's are a dime a dozen every spring.

Cutting Moulds, Mike Williams, Wire, Burns and maybe a couple others will free up some decent $$ to fill holes on the OL & DL.

Franchising Nate for 1 year isn't any real backbreaker on the cap,especially if the above cuts are made. Good move.

[Jan Reimers]

UFA WR's are a dime a dozen every spring.

Cutting Moulds, Mike Williams, Wire, Burns and maybe a couple others will free up some decent $$ to fill holes on the OL & DL.

Franchising Nate for 1 year isn't any real backbreaker on the cap,especially if the above cuts are made. Good move.
I don't totally disagree, but I'm not convinced that there's a bumper crop of FA WR's this year, either. Obviously, we can't take Moulds' cap hit, but I would still love him and Reed back at the right price.

You can probably add Teague to your cut list, as Preston appears to be the C of the future.

[tampabay25690]

Goodbye Josh Reed !!!!!

I agree 100%..........BYE BYE

[BAM]

Good move! But we need to have Nate back or our d will be even worse.

[OpIv37]

so because his play suffered because his defensive coordinator threw him under the bus, he sucks?

why are you so willing to blame Gray? Isn't it equally as likely that Clements benefitted from strong D's in 03 and 04 as it is that 2005 was Jerry Gray's fault? It doesn't seem logical to consider his bad play as a result of the overall D without considering that his prior good play was also a result of the overall D.

[justasportsfan]

i want them to keep josh reed.. :mad:

i know he is not what we thought he would be.. but i just have this awful gut feeling that he will go some where else and do well.. losman seemed to like reed and evans the most.Same here.

[ShadowHawk7]

well, they could match the contract or accept the 2 firsts.. but i have never seen it happen, and dont expect that it would.

i am wondering how much josh reed would really want.. i mean, it is not like he could command much more than league minimum based on his stats.. maybe we can sign him to a 3 year 2.5 million dollar deal or something. he doesnt seem like the kind of guy that is running for the money.. he almost seems like the kind of guy that would want to prove he isnt a bust and stick around to see the ship righted.
Agreed, I hope it works out like that.

[madness]

why are you so willing to blame Gray? Isn't it equally as likely that Clements benefitted from strong D's in 03 and 04 as it is that 2005 was Jerry Gray's fault? It doesn't seem logical to consider his bad play as a result of the overall D without considering that his prior good play was also a result of the overall D.

Boohoo, we're going to franchise a player that many people in the league consider a top free agent. Who knows, we might even get a 1st rounder on draft day. Either way, I'm not going to lose sleep over it.

This has also said time and time again but it doesn't seem to sink through. We had to stack the box this year because our run support was terrible! Put any top 5 corner out there against the elite receivers in this league without safety support and more times then not, the receiver is the one that's going to be looking good.

[gr8slayer]

This is the best news in a LONG TIME.

[ublinkwescore]

well, they could match the contract or accept the 2 firsts.. but i have never seen it happen, and dont expect that it would.

i am wondering how much josh reed would really want.. i mean, it is not like he could command much more than league minimum based on his stats.. maybe we can sign him to a 3 year 2.5 million dollar deal or something. he doesnt seem like the kind of guy that is running for the money.. he almost seems like the kind of guy that would want to prove he isnt a bust and stick around to see the ship righted.

I thought Washington (by decision of an arbitrator) bettered the Jets' Franchise tag tender to Santana Moss, and that's how they ended up with him for a year???

[ublinkwescore]

why are you so willing to blame Gray? Isn't it equally as likely that Clements benefitted from strong D's in 03 and 04 as it is that 2005 was Jerry Gray's fault? It doesn't seem logical to consider his bad play as a result of the overall D without considering that his prior good play was also a result of the overall D.

I think Nate looked pretty damn solid before our D ranked #2 for 2 years in a row.

Maybe it was just the fact that he was playing how he was told to play and was just being a good soldier (unfortunately, I kinda wish he would have played how he plays best last year, he might have actually made a difference in a couple of games - like the season finale against the Jets).

[The_Philster]

why are you so willing to blame Gray? Isn't it equally as likely that Clements benefitted from strong D's in 03 and 04 as it is that 2005 was Jerry Gray's fault? It doesn't seem logical to consider his bad play as a result of the overall D without considering that his prior good play was also a result of the overall D.
Because, unlike Gray (and you apparantly) I remember the past..I remember how playing so far off the LOS has hurt us...it's basically playing in Prevent...which is a scheme that only prevents you from winning.

[ICE74129]

Because, unlike Gray (and you apparantly) I remember the past..I remember how playing so far off the LOS has hurt us...it's basically playing in Prevent...which is a scheme that only prevents you from winning.

Until he faces Steve smith again. If Clements hadn't been so far off the ball and had two more guys helping him, Clements would have been schooled worse.

[The_Philster]

If he had jammed Smith at the line, the timing of the route would've been thrown off.

[Mr. Cynical]

This is what opposing WRs see on the field when they go up against Nate.

[ICE74129]

If he had jammed Smith at the line, the timing of the route would've been thrown off.

It didn't work against any team stupid enough to try it this year. Face the fact, Nate isn't that great. Good, yes, Great not even close. he isn't on the same level as a Steve Smith in this league.

[OpIv37]

Boohoo, we're going to franchise a player that many people in the league consider a top free agent. Who knows, we might even get a 1st rounder on draft day. Either way, I'm not going to lose sleep over it.

This has also said time and time again but it doesn't seem to sink through. We had to stack the box this year because our run support was terrible! Put any top 5 corner out there against the elite receivers in this league without safety support and more times then not, the receiver is the one that's going to be looking good.

haven't you been a Bills fan long enough to know that most of the league and national people don't watch the Bills enough to know what's really going on with the team? The people who call Nate Clements a "top" free agent remember some highlight reel clips of him in 04 and weren't paying attention to the Bills in 05 cuz they were doing so poorly.

And this has been said time and time again but it doesn't seem to sink through: this team has too many needs to pay $6 million for a corner that got eaten alive most of last year.

[ScottLawrence]

It didn't work against any team stupid enough to try it this year. Face the fact, Nate isn't that great. Good, yes, Great not even close. he isn't on the same level as a Steve Smith in this league.


How many cornerbacks are "great"?


I can't think of any, Nate is as good as any corner in the league.

[Dozerdog]

The rules have eliminated true "shut down corners"

Thus, the value of a shut down corner has dropped- nearly 3 million a season.

Nate also gives your team a threat to score- on ST, on INT returns. We need the guy. Sign him

[HHURRICANE]

Keeping Nate is a slam dunk.

Teague sucked so goodbye.

I don't get the lovefest with Josh Reed. We had one of the worst passing offenses in the League, maybe 31 out of 32 teams. Reed looked mediocre on a very bad offense. I think we will take our chances without him.

This is why this team has sucked. We keep waiting for mediocre players to get better. It's like Posey, Milloy, Teague, Anderson (either one). They are bad on any good team!!!!

[HHURRICANE]

why are you so willing to blame Gray? Isn't it equally as likely that Clements benefitted from strong D's in 03 and 04 as it is that 2005 was Jerry Gray's fault? It doesn't seem logical to consider his bad play as a result of the overall D without considering that his prior good play was also a result of the overall D.

We usually agree but on this one I have to say that it is hard to blame the corner when you have absolutely no pass rush. I played corner and the more time you give a receiver to break back to the ball, etc. the tougher it is on the guy covering him. I don't know how many times i watched the coverage break down because the opposing QB had all time to sit back in the pocket. Nate is a solid player and franchising him is a very smart move. Grey does get blamed because once people picked up our 8 man rush we were wide open in the secondary!

[OpIv37]

We usually agree but on this one I have to say that it is hard to blame the corner when you have absolutely no pass rush. I played corner and the more time you give a receiver to break back to the ball, etc. the tougher it is on the guy covering him. I don't know how many times i watched the coverage break down because the opposing QB had all time to sit back in the pocket. Nate is a solid player and franchising him is a very smart move. Grey does get blamed because once people picked up our 8 man rush we were wide open in the secondary!

But I still have to ask this: how do we know that ANY corner wouldn't have been just as good as Nate with the intense pass rush we had in 03 and 04?

And is the level of play between him and, say, a $2 million corner really worth $4 million?

[THATHURMANATOR]

I wouldn't say our Pash rush has been intense in the last 5 years. Yes in 04 and 03 our D was very good but I don't remember getting a lot of sacks. Clements is a good player. I feel very confident saying that no King or Thomas would not have been as good as Nate in the last 5 years.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Who else would you like the Bills to get OP?

[ublinkwescore]

I wouldn't say our Pash rush has been intense in the last 5 years. Yes in 04 and 03 our D was very good but I don't remember getting a lot of sacks. Clements is a good player. I feel very confident saying that no King or Thomas would not have been as good as Nate in the last 5 years.

I think we finished 3rd in sacks in 04 - Fat Williams' last year.

[ublinkwescore]

Who else would you like the Bills to get OP?

personally, I hope we shore up our OL as much as possible in the FA - the DL we can go after too obviously in the FA, but I'd rather we didn't wait another year for our OL to develop - let's get the FA studs for our OL, and draft the best possible guys that we can on the DL - we've still got Schobel who would still be a starter on a lot of teams, and Adams is a good pass rushing DT - let's just take our chances on getting better through the draft, and hope Spikes is back to at least half as good as he was before the injury, and hope Crowell can make us forget about Posey.

[HHURRICANE]

But I still have to ask this: how do we know that ANY corner wouldn't have been just as good as Nate with the intense pass rush we had in 03 and 04?

And is the level of play between him and, say, a $2 million corner really worth $4 million?

I think Nate is pretty well respected in the league. Clements is young and an excellent athlete. I actually think Nate at 5.8 million is a pretty good deal for the Bills. The Bills have so many other players that have been overpaid for their performance. In addition Nate is going to rebound and probably have a career year. If he doesn't than he's gone and we only wasted a one year deal on him. I think the Bills have so many other holes to address that this is/was a no brainer.

[madness]

haven't you been a Bills fan long enough to know that most of the league and national people don't watch the Bills enough to know what's really going on with the team? The people who call Nate Clements a "top" free agent remember some highlight reel clips of him in 04 and weren't paying attention to the Bills in 05 cuz they were doing so poorly.

And this has been said time and time again but it doesn't seem to sink through: this team has too many needs to pay $6 million for a corner that got eaten alive most of last year.

Whatever Nate did to you. Let it go, Op, let it go.

[patmoran2006]

Three points
1- I think Nate is worth the money, ONLY if you are totally committed to upgrading your pass rush. Nate is nowhere as bad as he was in '05, He just flat-out had a down year, as did Most the defense. Nate needs to be in a position to make plays and he will. Last year he was schooled thoroughly in at least 3-4 games. But with the market cheaper for CB's this year, keeping him was a no brainer.

2- You MUST get a DE or DT in who can get after the QB along with Schobel. Kelsay is not the answer. A better pass rush equates to a better secondary.

3- With Josh Reed, unless you see him starting next year (which I dont), then he's not going to be back. Like him or not, Buffalo isn't giving up on Parrish as #3 WR after only one year. And you're going to pay $1 million or more for a fourth receiever? I'm not.

I keep hearing how Reed had a good rapport with JP, but unfortunately, the problem is that JP starting is VERY far from a lock.. ESPECIALLY with Jauron as coach.

[Bill Brasky]

i wouldn't be oppossed to them franchising him, and then trying to work a deal with another team to maybe get a lesser corner and a decent DT or DE.

his value and his perception among other teams is very high... the bills could really get some value out of the guy if not this year, then next year (dependent on how he plays this year if he stays)

i wouldn't be surprised to seem the franchise him this year, go after a guy like Ngata in round one and maybe a CB to develop in the 2nd or 3rd, then maybe next year try to work a deal with another team for a high profile DE or OL/DL in exchange for Nate as part of the rebuilding program here

though he truely might not be worth a 2 player or 1 player/ 1 draft pick deal, i wouldn't be surprised to see a team pony up something like that just because he is regarded as one of the best in the league, some team will be dumb enough to offer something like that.

[John Doe]

I don't get the lovefest with Josh Reed. We had one of the worst passing offenses in the League, maybe 31 out of 32 teams. Reed looked mediocre on a very bad offense. I think we will take our chances without him.


Exactly. Where are all the fans that were complaining that Drew Haddad should have made the team last year instead of Reed?

We carried over 5 wide-outs last year. Reed is certainly expendable.