Adams does not fit Bills system says Marv

[Mahdi]

I was just listening to Marv's interview with Pat Kirwan on sirius NFL radio (interview is on BB.com) and when asked about Adams and Vincent he said that Adams doesnt quite fit the system because they want players who "fly to the ball" where as Adams is more of a 3-4 Nose type DT. This probably also means that Ngata is not an option at our #8 draft pick. On Vincent he said that he has done some good things. So im thinking the Bills may be looking to either move up and get Brick, or draft Huff or Jimmy Williams who would be great in a cover 2 scheme. And then in the second we can take a player like Bunckley who fits what Marv is describing at DT. This is assuming OL is addressed in FA. If not, maybe we take Triplett from Indy. and go OL in the second.

[ICE74129]

I was just listening to Marv's interview with Pat Kirwan on sirius NFL radio (interview is on BB.com) and when asked about Adams and Vincent he said that Adams doesnt quite fit the system because they want players who "fly to the ball" where as Adams is more of a 3-4 Nose type DT. This probably also means that Ngata is not an option at our #8 draft pick. On Vincent he said that he has done some good things. So im thinking the Bills may be looking to either move up and get Brick, or draft Huff or Jimmy Williams who would be great in a cover 2 scheme. And then in the second we can take a player like Bunckley who fits what Marv is describing at DT. This is assuming OL is addressed in FA. If not, maybe we take Triplett from Indy. and go OL in the second.

I am starting to think we move up somehow and get D'brick. Marv remembers how it is to have a probowl LT. I also am starting to think that they will address DT in Free agency. Milloy will be gone and SS addressed as well.

If they can't move up to get D'brick, I am not sure how they go. I agree Ngata may not be what Marv and DJ have in mind for a DT. Who in the draft is more like Tommie Harris from OU? That is the type of DT they want

[ICE74129]

Speaking of, Both DT's for Chicago are barely over 300lbs but Very stong, very good technique and quickness. Both DE's are slightly over 260.

They want speed, Quickness and technique. Not a bad combo to have.

[Mahdi]

Speaking of, Both DT's for Chicago are barely over 300lbs but Very stong, very good technique and quickness. Both DE's are slightly over 260.

They want speed, Quickness and technique. Not a bad combo to have.
Thats why I was thinking of maybe Bunckley, who is a Tommie Harris type player. Slightly undersized but gets to the QB and penetrates well. Or maybe Orien Harris as well.

[Carlton Bailey]

As long as we don't get Ngata I'm happy. I watched him in the Holiday Bowl and he was non-existent.

[gr8slayer]

As long as we don't get Ngata I'm happy. I watched him in the Holiday Bowl and he was non-existent.
I agree.

[Night Train]

That's rather surprising.

Adams has shown he can just blow into the backfield with a quick initial move many times over, in his 3 years here. How could that not fit the Cover 2 ?

Lets review. We let Pat Williams walk and now people wish to cut Adams. That leaves us with what in the middle of the DL, other than short on talent ? :coocoo:

Cheap contracts will not impress the opposing teams OL, who will just run over us until we can prove we can stop them.

[TacklingDummy]

I miss the days when the Bills had Ted Washington/Pat Williams or Pat Williams/Sam Adams in the middle and teams couldn't run on us.

Besides bums at QB last year, the Bills biggest problem was stopping the run. Pat Williams was clearly missed.

[Jan Reimers]

Marv's philosophy worries me. Our fast, athletic defense of the Super Bowl years was fun to watch and obviously pretty good. But it was a smallish, not extremely "smash mouth"-type unit which was in large part responsible for our not being able to stop our more physical NFC opponents.

I would like to see Adams and Ngata anchoring a monster line.

[RedEyE]

That's rather surprising.

Adams has shown he can just blow into the backfield with a quick initial move many times over, in his 3 years here. How could that not fit the Cover 2 ?

Lets review. We let Pat Williams walk and now people wish to cut Adams. That leaves us with what in the middle of the DL, other than short on talent ? :coocoo:

Cheap contracts will not impress the opposing teams OL, who will just run over us until we can prove we can stop them.

I agree with what you've said. Getting rid of Adams this year is ascinine.

[Mahdi]

Marv's philosophy worries me. Our fast, athletic defense of the Super Bowl years was fun to watch and obviously pretty good. But it was a smallish, not extremely "smash mouth"-type unit which was in large part responsible for our not being able to stop our more physical NFC opponents.

I would like to see Adams and Ngata anchoring a monster line.
Chicago doesnt seem to have trouble stopping their opponents and their heaviest starting DL is Ian Scott at 302 pounds. So I think what Marv is saying is correct, you need to get the players who fit the system.

[madness]

Players with "character". This is not Adams. Brick is though... :up:

[ICE74129]

As long as we don't get Ngata I'm happy. I watched him in the Holiday Bowl and he was non-existent.

I guess OU being one of the top programs in the nation didn't have anything to do with it? Nor the fact he had to face Davin Joseph one of the top OLinemen in this draft either. I am sure this link had nothing to do with it either...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=maisel_ivan&id=2341786

By your thought process, everyone should pass on Reggie Bush in the top 10 as well right? I mean Adrian Peterson put up 200+ on texASS as a freshman so Reggie must suck.

Guys have bad games ALL of them have bad games. You can't judge an essential rookie NFL QB on just 8 games just like you can't judge a college player on one bowl game.

[ICE74129]

Players with "character". This is not Adams. Brick is though... :up:

Agreed!

[ICE74129]

Marv's philosophy worries me. Our fast, athletic defense of the Super Bowl years was fun to watch and obviously pretty good. But it was a smallish, not extremely "smash mouth"-type unit which was in large part responsible for our not being able to stop our more physical NFC opponents.

I would like to see Adams and Ngata anchoring a monster line.

What defenses are winning games now though? the Cover 2. Those teams don't have monsters in the middle. They have technique, smarts combined with Strength and quickness.

Adams is a self serving player as well. That won't fly under marvs command. And as for as the Superbowl years, We had one major problem. We ran a 3/4 with a weak assed/ Small NT. had we went 4-3 or had a ted washington at NT, we would have been fine. But when the center can man handle the NT alone....you are screwed.

[Jan Reimers]

Chicago doesnt seem to have trouble stopping their opponents and their heaviest starting DL is Ian Scott at 302 pounds. So I think what Marv is saying is correct, you need to get the players who fit the system.
But I don't understand creating another hole when we already have so many to fill. Adams is our best DT by far. With him gone, we will need to bring in 2 quality DTs, instead of 1, through the draft or free agency.

That's one fewer O lineman, safety, DE, LB or WR that we will be able to pursue.

[ICE74129]

But I don't understand creating another hole when we already have so many to fill. Adams is our best DT by far. With him gone, we will need to bring in 2 quality DTs, instead of 1, through the draft or free agency.

That's one fewer O lineman, safety, DE, LB or WR that we will be able to pursue.

Jan, Adams is not that good. He just isn't. he is a fat, old slob. Someone will hire the bum that is for certain. I have said all along we need two DT's and I stand by that. Seems marv understands that too.

[Jan Reimers]

Jan, Adams is not that good. He just isn't. he is a fat, old slob. Someone will hire the bum that is for certain. I have said all along we need two DT's and I stand by that. Seems marv understands that too.
You're probably right, ICE. Not only is he getting older and slowing down, but he's not the kind of character guy that Marv likes. I guess we just bite the bullet and find 2 new DTs who can play more effectively in Jauron's system.

And Adams' substantial cap savings should help with adding the new guys.

[ICE74129]

You're probably right, ICE. Not only is he getting older and slowing down, but he's not the kind of character guy that Marv likes. I guess we just bite the bullet and find 2 new DTs who can play more effectively in Jauron's system.

And Adams' substantial cap savings should help with adding the new guys.

Agreed. he saves about 3.5 mill by cutting him. And there are those saying it is stupid to cut adams. 1) he isn't a high character guy. He has been released by every team in his NFL career and NONE have sighted an issue with his play. So why is it they didn't want him back? 2) even with Sam and fat pat, how many playoff apperances? Superbowls? it's time for a change of philosophy at OBD

[Saratoga Slim]

How bout that Seahawk DT, Rocky Bernard for starters. He had 8.5 sacks this year. I think he fits the Cover 2 mold a little better and he'll be available for probably less than we're going to pay Sam Adams.

[Bmax]

Bunkley will be a 1st round pick ..late or early 2nd .. Chances are we won't have a shot.. I say they will sign Ryan Pickett from St Louis.. Bill Kollar already has a relationship with the guy. Who knows what they are going to do ...It seems Marv and dick jaroun didn't mind big old ted washington in the middle of thier defenses.


Bmax

[Dont drink the water]

Jan, Adams is not that good. He just isn't. he is a fat, old slob. Someone will hire the bum that is for certain. I have said all along we need two DT's and I stand by that. Seems marv understands that too.

Adams is not a team player and Marv is looking for team players. Marv will likely cut Sam AFTER Free Agency IF they can find someone better who is more interested in supporting the defense plan rather than trying to jump the snap count to get more stats,

[Bill Cody]

Adams is not a team player and Marv is looking for team players. Marv will likely cut Sam AFTER Free Agency IF they can find someone better who is more interested in supporting the defense plan rather than trying to jump the snap count to get more stats,

Marv has this backwards. Sam fits the scheme fine. He was a monster when he had Big Pat next to him instead of a scrub. And how is he not a team player? Because he wasn't into long trips to the hot tub with communications expert Mularkey? He jumps the snap count to pad his stats? That's just stupid.

As for Sam being a cancer, check the record. He goes to Baltimore after a long and successful stint in Seattle and the next year the Ravens win the SB with one of the greatest defenses ever. He moves on to Oakland and they go to the SB the same year. He comes here and the year after we have the #2 defense in the league. Coincidence? I don't think so. Sam is the man.

[patmoran2006]

I dont care what "scheme" you have.. If you front four can't contain the run and get after the QB you're not going anywhere.

Buffalo is CRAZY to get rid of Adams.. with the money they would "save" by cutting him, are they gonna UPGRADE there?!?

Not only do they NEED Adams back, they NEED another starting DT either through FA or draft.

[onceproudbillsfan]

Agree 100% drewbluefan. Big Sam makes TKO and Fletch better by plugging up the holes. Keep Sam and bring in someone like Pat to play along side him so we can stop the run next year. With our linebackers that we have it makes them better when we can stop the run up the middle.

[patmoran2006]

Cutting Adams saves 2.1 mill (according to Clump)

You're gonna get better at his spot for 2.1 million?

[Tatonka]

I agree with what you've said. Getting rid of Adams this year is ascinine.


no ****.. seriously, if they cut adams.. i will have a meltdown..

Adams IS the best player on our defensive line.. and that is total **** about him not being able to get to the qb.. i dont know how many times i have seen him get sacks before the qb has even gotten through his three step drop. and he can stop the run.

unless they plan on making a big splash in FA, i just dont see how this is going to work.. i mean marv has basically already screwed the ****ing pooch by saying what he said.. he basically just came right out and said "YOUR CUT ADAMS!"...

who in the hell do they think is going to stop the run? tim anderson? bannan? edwards? sape? you have to be kidding me.

i mean why wouldnt you want at least ONE big man on your dl?

i guess mario williams is out of the question too, because he is 295 lbs.. i guess they will just love schobel and kelsay then.. they are small.

warren sapp was adams size.. booger mcfarland is adams size.. somehow they seemed do ok in the cover 2 defense.

this is just lame.. and adams doesnt even cost that much.. they will not be able to get near the quality at DT for that price tag.

so gay.. wtf does marv know about defense.. he never built one good enough to help win a superbowl.

[Devin]

As long as we don't get Ngata I'm happy. I watched him in the Holiday Bowl and he was non-existent.

Yeah I know, I hate dominant DT's. THey suck. Who do they think they are taking on two guards and a center. THEY SUCK.

I want another WR.

[Crisis]

Adams is one of the best in the league when he's motivated.

If he plays with a fire under his ass he's one of our best players. I think he could fit the scheme fine...I mean hell, who else do we have? Atleast hold onto him for another year so we can atleast get a replacement.

[Crisis]

Ngata is going to be a HUGE bust IMO.

I think if we pass on Huff it'll be like draft we took Big Mike over Roy Williams.

[finsrclowns]

People can take their shots at Sam Adams but IMO this guy plays hard and plays well when he's on the field. He actually amazes me how well he can move for a man his size. Ok, so there isn't anyone his size. He still moves well.

I went down to the front row at RWS to watch the guys warm up at a game the year before last and it doesn't even make sense how big Sam is. EASILY the biggest human I've ever gotten within 30 yards of. You would think we'd have learned something from letting Big Pat go how valuable the big DT can be. Now we have basically nothing OTHER than Sam, we've got him under contract for a reasonable salary and we're talking about letting him go? Say it ain't so Marv.

[The_Philster]

How much film has Marv seen of Adams? Maybe in body size he's a NT...but in terms of his style of play, he doesn't fit that mold.

[rschepise]

Agreed........Sam Adams is more of a penetrator/Get to the QB type player. Pat Williams is more of a nose tackle, which, in my opinion, is why they played so well together. Williams was able to hold his own against double teams and clog the middle, while Adams got to the QB. Adams would be perfect for a cover 2 sceme and long as he had some decent players around him. Maybe the fact that Tim Anderson and Chris Kelsay were playing next was the problem.

I just can't understand this move. We have a multitude of holes to fill, so, hey, lets create another one and cut our best D-lineman. I swear, the Bills organization gets dumber every year. I think Marv needs to start taking his Ginko.

:bullseye:

[vicmantak]

If this interview is true, I hate to say this but it seems that Levy is only focused on money.
Troy Vincent has far been a bust and from this point of view, it's really unfair his comments about Sam Adams.
I'll be extremely dissapointed if he start gambling on draft. 8th pick is one of the best positions to get immediate impact players and if he wants to sacrifice valuable draft picks just to trade up, it make me think that he is not considering the extra pressure this player will face on media and specially on Buffalo.

In the other hand, if Levy stay cool and draft by immediate impact, he's right. Huff is close to be an insurance policy and this movement will allow him to address punishment ("Ronnie Lott" type of player). It also allow to balance the defense by cost-perfomance if Lawyer Milloy is released.

[YardRat]

Adams is still a monster at times, albeit not as consistently dominant as he used to be, and IMO fits any scheme they wish to play him in.

Apparently he just needs to be convinced to play within the system and quit free-lancing.

[ParanoidAndroid]

If you really watch Sam play every down, which I made a point of doing after the drama with Mularkey, he is good for about 3 seconds. He cannot pursue and he does not slide down the line well. He is all downhill and if the play moves laterally, he is out. He does not cut off the cutback lanes on running plays because he is too slow. He's good at what he does (anticipating the snap count and engulfing his man), but if the coaches want a pursuit and swarm type of defense, Sam is not that guy. Someone mentioned Rocky Bernard. He has been on my wish list from day one and is the best pass rushing DT I can ever remember seeing. The average guard is too slow to stop him.

[Mahdi]

If you really watch Sam play every down, which I made a point of doing after the drama with Mularkey, he is good for about 3 seconds. He cannot pursue and he does not slide down the line well. He is all downhill and if the play moves laterally, he is out. He does not cut off the cutback lanes on running plays because he is too slow. He's good at what he does (anticipating the snap count and engulfing his man), but if the coaches want a pursuit and swarm type of defense, Sam is not that guy. Someone mentioned Rocky Bernard. He has been on my wish list from day one and is the best pass rushing DT I can ever remember seeing. The average guard is too slow to stop him.
You make some really good points there Andy, cant disagree.

[Meathead]

while i would agree that its a bit disconcerning to thing about what the bills might be without their best defensive lineman, jauron is a pretty good defensive coach and if he's not comfortable with sam in his system then that is good enough for me

hes not going to let marv dictate some old style bills defense if he doesnt believe in is either

[mysticsoto]

I also disagree with Sam not fitting into the system - in fact, that's what he likes to do - to go after the QB instead of staying put and blocking the lanes, which Mularkey/Gray wanted him to do. I think if we can't get Brick, we should take Ngata mostly b'cse our lines have to be our top choices. I'd like to see Adams and Ngata next to each other, and the Bills should grab Ted Washington when the Raiders release him. No, that hasn't been stated, but given that the Raiders are $31 million over the cap, I think it's almost a foregone conclusion that they will be releasing alot of their older vets. Sam and Ted can spell each other and Ngata can get most of the reps on the other side and occasionally be spelled by Edwards who was much better in spot duty than as a starter.

[PUCKER]

I think this is a bad move. :( He will go to another team now and haunt us. :shakeno:

[LifetimeBillsFan]

I guess OU being one of the top programs in the nation didn't have anything to do with it? Nor the fact he had to face Davin Joseph one of the top OLinemen in this draft either. I am sure this link had nothing to do with it either...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=maisel_ivan&id=2341786

By your thought process, everyone should pass on Reggie Bush in the top 10 as well right? I mean Adrian Peterson put up 200+ on texASS as a freshman so Reggie must suck.

Guys have bad games ALL of them have bad games. You can't judge an essential rookie NFL QB on just 8 games just like you can't judge a college player on one bowl game.

Additionally, Ngata played in the Holiday Bowl about a week after his mother died. He was very close to her and had decided to go pro to help pay for her medical bills and support the family.

I don't know that this necessarily rules out Ngata--because he is supposed to be very quick on his feet (I've read comparisons between him and Richard Seymour), but it sure casts doubt on whether the Bills will take him. Bunkley is looking like a better option right now.

I'm not sure that I agree with Marv on Adams--but he is getting older and slower. But, as I see it, the Bills already need two DTs, with Adams on the roster, and would need to add three if they cut him and it will be hard to find that many good DTs in free agency and the draft this off-season.

I LOVE Rocky Bernard! Nothing would make me happier this off-season than to see the Bills get him, but the question is whether Seattle will let him go. If the Bills put a good offer on the table to Hutchinson and Bernard, Seattle may be forced to sacrifice one in order to keep the other and either way, the Bills would be able to help themselves a lot regardless of which one Seattle decides to re-sign.

[tampabay25690]

As long as we don't get Ngata I'm happy. I watched him in the Holiday Bowl and he was non-existent.

SO did I and he looked awful.....

[Tatonka]

i am still irritatated by the idea that we would actually cut adams when we have so many other things to worry about.

[Marvelous]

Is Marv nuts? I doubt he said that Adams isn't a speed rusher etc. Or however he said what he said.. I agree with Tatonka 100%. Adams explodes into the gap and i recall many sacks where i was in shock at how fast he nailed the QB.. AGREED that he has to be motivated though... No way can we get a better tackle for the money we save by releasing him. + why make 1 problem into two???