Ok, now that we have lost both Wells & Idonije... [Archive] - BillsZone.com

Bill Brasky

03-22-2006, 07:36 PM

ICE74129

03-22-2006, 07:36 PM

Draft. Sorry, I know you don't want to hear it, but marv gave FA his best shot. Oh sure some depth will be addressed, but unless there is some wild trade, DT, LG and LDE will be addressed Via draft.

ICE74129

03-22-2006, 07:41 PM

Free Agency is pretty much a lost cause at this point. Buffalo obviously isn't going to pony up enough cash to entice guys to come here, let alone beat any offers other teams can match.

Honestly, who's even left? They migh luck out and get somebody who might be cut further down the road, but at this point I don't see them even bringing in somebody that can make a difference on this team on either side of the ball.

This has been one of the worst free agnecy periods I can ever remember as a Bills fan. In a year where I thought they'd be quite active because they NEEDED to be in order to get back to a competitive level, they've really dropped the ball. Now they have only the draft to look forward to and there's no way you can rebuild in 3 years simply by drafting.

At least with TD and his bs signings it brought a little bit of hope and excitement to the organization. The moves might not have panned out, but some of them made sense.

Right now this team looks completely lost, I don't even think they had a Plan A, let alone a Plan B

JF, TD's signings were EXACTLY what screwed us. Yeah the fans said 'Yea! We are making name signings yea!' and we went 31-49.

here is our position, we aren't attractive right now. Marv can't do anything but what he can do. It will take two offseasons. We sign good, mid tier FA's that have some time in the league and ready to step up and become damn good productive guys.

Next we draft really well finding about 3-4 immediate starters in the draft and more quality depth. We watch the waiver after June 1st.

We then implement our systems and play well. Now this next offseason, The FA's see we are on the way up. Players tell other players that we are almost there and that with thier help we can get there. Not only that we AGAIN have about 15 mill in available cap room. Now the players are telling potential FA's how cool it is to play for DJ, and the assistants.

NOW we sign 2-3 really good FA's then back to mid tier guys for improvement throughout the roster, draft well again and start making a run in 07.

We can't get around this process. TD SCREWED us by not taking this same approach when he took over. he made what I refer to as 'appeasment' signings. Ie they were names to make the fans renew season tickets. When in fact WINNING would have done more.

Nighthawk

03-22-2006, 07:42 PM

Draft. Sorry, I know you don't want to hear it, but marv gave FA his best shot. Oh sure some depth will be addressed, but unless there is some wild trade, DT, LG and LDE will be addressed Via draft.

Yeah, I know, but you have to admit, he didn't seem to have a Plan B to fall back on. There is no way this team fills all their needs in the draft. If I had to rate Marv's first FA, I'd have to give him a D. Most of our needs have not been filled and he left this team with too many holes to address in the draft. Now, I understand that we still have to play the 2006 season, but I'm just saying that at this moment, right now, it looks like Marv has failed his first Free Agent period. IMO

Nighthawk

03-22-2006, 07:46 PM

JF, TD's signings were EXACTLY what screwed us. Yeah the fans said 'Yea! We are making name signings yea!' and we went 31-49.

here is our position, we aren't attractive right now. Marv can't do anything but what he can do. It will take two offseasons. We sign good, mid tier FA's that have some time in the league and ready to step up and become damn good productive guys.

Next we draft really well finding about 3-4 immediate starters in the draft and more quality depth. We watch the waiver after June 1st.

We then implement our systems and play well. Now this next offseason, The FA's see we are on the way up. Players tell other players that we are almost there and that with thier help we can get there. Not only that we AGAIN have about 15 mill in available cap room. Now the players are telling potential FA's how cool it is to play for DJ, and the assistants.

NOW we sign 2-3 really good FA's then back to mid tier guys for improvement throughout the roster, draft well again and start making a run in 07.

We can't get around this process. TD SCREWED us by not taking this same approach when he took over. he made what I refer to as 'appeasment' signings. Ie they were names to make the fans renew season tickets. When in fact WINNING would have done more.

Yes, some of what you say, I do agree with. However, how much faith should we have in Marv to choose the right players in the draft? I mean, is he going to draft some kid out of a small school, who obviously isn't as talented as somebody still on the board, just because he's his kind of guy? If that is the approach he is going to take, I think we are in trouble. If he takes the approach he has taken in FA, we're in for a bad draft. Now, I hope I'm wrong and he does well with the draft, but I'm not yet convinced that he is the right man for the job. He really needs to prove it to me and so far, I am less than impressed.

ICE74129

03-22-2006, 07:46 PM

Yeah, I know, but you have to admit, he didn't seem to have a Plan B to fall back on. There is no way this team fills all their needs in the draft. If I had to rate Marv's first FA, I'd have to give him a D. Most of our needs have not been filled and he left this team with too many holes to address in the draft. Now, I understand that we still have to play the 2006 season, but I'm just saying that at this moment, right now, it looks like Marv has failed his first Free Agent period. IMO

There was no need for a plan B. Get the mid tier guys that are on the upside you can get, then draft. That was the plan period and Marv is doing that. Davis, Royal, Bowen and Fowler WILL shock some people this year. We still need LG 92nd round) DT (first round) and LDE (3rd round, FA) to address. I think he wants to address Tackle but with who and what tackle spot I don't know. Runyan is a RT and so was Fabini.

ICE74129

03-22-2006, 07:47 PM

Yes, some of what you say, I do agree with. However, how much faith should we have in Marv to choose the right players in the draft? I mean, is he going to draft some kid out of a small school, who obviously isn't as talented as somebody still on the board, just because he's his kind of guy? If that is the approach he is going to take, I think we are in trouble. If he takes the approach he has taken in FA, we're in for a bad draft. Now, I hope I'm wrong and he does well with the draft, but I'm not yet convinced that he is the right man for the job. He really needs to prove it to me and so far, I am less than impressed.

THIS is the one area I LOVE Having marv here. He helped build 4 superbowl teams with the DRAFT! He wasn't around but the first 2-3 years or so of FA. DRAFT is his specialty.

Besides, HE won't be drafting. This will be Modrak's baby you can bet your sweet Arse on that. and Modrack has proven in Philly the man CAN Draft!

Nighthawk

03-22-2006, 07:48 PM

There was no need for a plan B. Get the mid tier guys that are on the upside you can get, then draft. That was the plan period and Marv is doing that. Davis, Royal, Bowen and Fowler WILL shock some people this year. We still need LG 92nd round) DT (first round) and LDE (3rd round, FA) to address. I think he wants to address Tackle but with who and what tackle spot I don't know. Runyan is a RT and so was Fabini.

Man, I wish I could be as optimistic as you, but I just can't get there. I hope you're right and I really hope I'm wrong!

HHURRICANE

03-22-2006, 07:49 PM

As I totally predicted!! Again, what a waste of time. Note to Marv: you need to be reasonably confident that the other team isn't going to match your offer.

I am ready for my '06 prediction, 6-10. We are bringing back most of the losers from last years defense and offense.

I'm sick to my stomach.

Bill Brasky

03-22-2006, 07:50 PM

JF, TD's signings were EXACTLY what screwed us. Yeah the fans said 'Yea! We are making name signings yea!' and we went 31-49.

here is our position, we aren't attractive right now. Marv can't do anything but what he can do. It will take two offseasons. We sign good, mid tier FA's that have some time in the league and ready to step up and become damn good productive guys.

Next we draft really well finding about 3-4 immediate starters in the draft and more quality depth. We watch the waiver after June 1st.

We then implement our systems and play well. Now this next offseason, The FA's see we are on the way up. Players tell other players that we are almost there and that with thier help we can get there. Not only that we AGAIN have about 15 mill in available cap room. Now the players are telling potential FA's how cool it is to play for DJ, and the assistants.

NOW we sign 2-3 really good FA's then back to mid tier guys for improvement throughout the roster, draft well again and start making a run in 07.

We can't get around this process. TD SCREWED us by not taking this same approach when he took over. he made what I refer to as 'appeasment' signings. Ie they were names to make the fans renew season tickets. When in fact WINNING would have done more.

I disagree. I said "some" of TD's signings made sense, but he never gave a lot of those guys the tools to be successful here. IE: ignoring the OLine for his entire tenure and drafting other positions that weren't an immediate need. I am not a Bledsoe homer, but when he had time, he was a potent weapon for this offense. And TD did revamp the defense to the point that it was near the top of the league for a couple years before it fell apart at the seems this past season partly due to age. And let's not forget he got this team out of "cap-hell". Not defending the guy, but a lot of the FA moves he made did make sense, they just didn't pan out because they didn't have a core to work around. It was like a grabbag of talent that had to make due with scraps from the salvation army. There was no balance.

As far as drafting well, that remains to be seen because since Polian left this organization has had terrible drafts, which is a big reason why they are in the position they're in now. Even if they are able to draft high-impact guys, they're going to command a huge salary just to come play for a "bad" team, and that leads to potential hold outs, "eli-manning" syndrome, etc. I'm not saying those situations will neccesarily arise, but they could. No vets want to play here, why would a young up-and-comer want to?

Just a thought.

Nighthawk

03-22-2006, 07:51 PM

THIS is the one area I LOVE Having marv here. He helped build 4 superbowl teams with the DRAFT! He wasn't around but the first 2-3 years or so of FA. DRAFT is his specialty.

Besides, HE won't be drafting. This will be Modrak's baby you can bet your sweet Arse on that. and Modrack has proven in Philly the man CAN Draft!

True enough about Modrak, but I'm not so sure Marv was all that responsible for the Bills drafts when he was here. First, Polian did the building and next Butler did. If you remember, Marv never wanted to play rookies when he was coaching and that is not possible any longer...does he understand this? We need guys who can play now, not in 2-3 years...this is where I'm still having concerns about his ability.

ghz in pittsburgh

03-22-2006, 07:52 PM

Show me a team built on FA signings that wins consistently in NFL.

You must like the Skins.

HHURRICANE

03-22-2006, 07:53 PM

THIS is the one area I LOVE Having marv here. He helped build 4 superbowl teams with the DRAFT! He wasn't around but the first 2-3 years or so of FA. DRAFT is his specialty.

Besides, HE won't be drafting. This will be Modrak's baby you can bet your sweet Arse on that. and Modrack has proven in Philly the man CAN Draft!

The draft is great and all but it takes 2-3 years to reep the benefits of a good draft. I was really hoping for some real impact. The cap went way up and we were way under. We did nothing special. Matter-of-fact I'm worried that we may be worse.

ICE74129

03-22-2006, 07:55 PM

I disagree. I said "some" of TD's signings made sense, but he never gave a lot of those guys the tools to be successful here. IE: ignoring the OLine for his entire tenure and drafting other positions that weren't an immediate need. I am not a Bledsoe homer, but when he had time, he was a potent weapon for this offense. And TD did revamp the defense to the point that it was near the top of the league for a couple years before it fell apart at the seems this past season partly due to age.

As far as drafting well, that remains to be seen because since Polian left this organization has had terrible drafts, which is a big reason why they are in the position they're in now. Even if they are able to draft high-impact guys, they're going to command a huge salary just to come play for a "bad" team, and that leads to potential hold outs, "eli-manning" syndrome, etc. I'm not saying those situations will neccesarily arise, but they could. No vets want to play here, why would a young up-and-comer want to?

Just a thought.

Marv isn't drafting, Modrak is :bf1: I can bet you right now Modrak runs this draft. He will let Marv and Ralph know who and why, but I can bet you Modrak runs the draft and I like it!

No one has really held out on the Bills and they won't now. There is a know rule that the salary is 'slotted' with a +5% or so from the year before, and ralph has NEVER had any issue paying for a draft pick (see Mike Williams).

As for as TD, he was horrible. Linemen don't put butts in the seats. TD Felt if he kept the fans happy with signings and draft picks that would be enough.....WRONG!

TD has put us in a very bad way on the field. Marv has to fix it

Nighthawk

03-22-2006, 07:56 PM

Show me a team built on FA signings that wins consistently in NFL.

You must like the Skins.

Very true, but show me a team that has won that hasn't addressed some of their needs with FA? It just seems that we miss the boat every year on what is the main trouble area with this team...the OL. I didn't say that I want every FA, but I would've liked to see us be more aggressive at fixing our OL problems.

The_Philster

03-22-2006, 07:58 PM

Besides, HE won't be drafting. This will be Modrak's baby you can bet your sweet Arse on that. and Modrack has proven in Philly the man CAN Draft!Not saying he wasn't a big part of Philly's success..but how much of that was Modrak? Considering Philly has remained strong since he left (except this year, obviously), Reid had to have had a heavy hand in it as well.
I'm reminded of Donahoe...Pittsburgh was strong at bringing in players..through the draft primarily with some free agents..and it was thought that TD was a great GM because they remained competitive. Then TD left the Steelers..and Cowher and the Steelers haven't missed a beat. TD comes here and our drafting hasn't been stellar by any means :ill:

ICE74129

03-22-2006, 08:03 PM

Not saying he wasn't a big part of Philly's success..but how much of that was Modrak? Considering Philly has remained strong since he left (except this year, obviously), Reid had to have had a heavy hand in it as well.
I'm reminded of Donahoe...Pittsburgh was strong at bringing in players..through the draft primarily with some free agents..and it was thought that TD was a great GM because they remained competitive. Then TD left the Steelers..and Cowher and the Steelers haven't missed a beat. TD comes here and our drafting hasn't been stellar by any means :ill:

Read down and look at how fast he turned the Eagles around. Reid is good, but most of his team that went to 4 straight NFC Championship games, Modrak put together.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04340/421989.stm

This is why I am VERY excited about this draft. I also feel fine with the mid tier guys being brought in right now. Marv is listening very intently to the opinions and recomendations from Modrak and Guy.

ghz in pittsburgh

03-22-2006, 08:04 PM

Very true, but show me a team that has won that hasn't addressed some of their needs with FA? It just seems that we miss the boat every year on what is the main trouble area with this team...the OL. I didn't say that I want every FA, but I would've liked to see us be more aggressive at fixing our OL problems.

The Steelers won the superbowl this year without any impact FAs, unless you count their only FA - wr Wilson - as having any impact. In fact the only impact FA they had the last 4 years has been the middle LB from the Jets (his name escape me now).

ICE74129

03-22-2006, 08:06 PM

This part stands out the most...

"The Eagles were 3-13 in 1998. His first duty was to resist the howls from fans and some pressure within the organization to draft Heisman Trophy winner Ricky Williams. He passed on Williams and drafted quarterback Donovan McNabb. He cleaned house, worked hard for new practice facilities and rid the Eagles of a losing culture. After going 5-11 in Modrak's first season, Philadelphia finished 11-5 and went two games into the playoffs in 2000. The Eagles won the NFC East in 2001 and lost in the NFC championship game."

Sounds a lot like what we are doing now doesn't it?;)

ICE74129

03-22-2006, 08:07 PM

The Steelers won the superbowl this year without any impact FAs, unless you count their only FA - wr Wilson - as having any impact. In fact the only impact FA they had the last 4 years has been the middle LB from the Jets (his name escape me now).

And Mr ghz please tell the fans playing at home HOW the Steelers mostly built that superbowl team?

EDS

03-22-2006, 09:05 PM

Show me a team built on FA signings that wins consistently in NFL.

You must like the Skins.

Astute comment.

You guys are nuts if you think the Bills have done nothing this off-season. Marv and company have made several key acquisitions - acquisitions which involve young veterans who will help supplement the core of the Bills going forward. You guys act like armchair Dan Snyders who want to sign someone solely based on name value rather then a consideration of whether they fit within the frame work of the team next season and two seasons down the road.

I am at an absolute loss as to who you guys actually think the Bills missed out on. This is not a strong free agent class. Pickett is about the only one since the Bills had no legitimate chance at Hutchinson or Bentley. Pickett is decent, but he is no game breaker. If we were talking about John Henderson or Richard Seymour I could see why you are upset, but Pickett isn't close to being in their league.

The reality is the Bills are building with young veterans and draft picks. Likely only two more starting positions are up for grabs - left guard and defensive tackle. Those two need areas happen to fall right in the wheel house in terms of what is available in the draft. Ngata/Bunkley in round one; Joseph/Spencer/Lutui in round two. After that everything is gravy.

EDS

03-22-2006, 09:07 PM

And Mr ghz please tell the fans playing at home HOW the Steelers mostly built that superbowl team?

Through the draft and with bargain bin free agent signings - exactly how the Pats built their super bowl teams! Last I checked the big spending Redskins haven't won a super bowl in Snyders tenure. I can't believe this is lost on people.

Nighthawk

03-22-2006, 09:14 PM

Through the draft and with bargain bin free agent signings - exactly how the Pats built their super bowl teams! Last I checked the big spending Redskins haven't won a super bowl in Snyders tenure. I can't believe this is lost on people.

Please stop with that comment...nowhere did I say that I wanted to be like the Redskins. I merely would like the OL addressed for the first time in...oh crap, I don't when we last appropriately addressed the OL.

John Doe

03-22-2006, 09:24 PM

I think that signing Wells or Idonije would have been considered a bonus in what has been a very successful free agent phase. They knew that the chances of signing them were slim, but if they did get them, then so much the better.

patmoran2006

03-22-2006, 11:14 PM

Show me a team built on FA signings that wins consistently in NFL.

You must like the Skins.

There aren't many organizations that are as bad as the Bills that are needly BADLY to have impact players through FA than the Buffalo Bills.. That's the truth my friend.

Go through this roster and how many IMPACT players do the Buffalo Bills really have?

Fletcher- Yes, but A) He's getting old for a MLB and B) He's as FA next year and he sure as hell at his age doesnt want to be around a 3-4 year program.

Spikes- Sure, IF he gets healthy.. I dont know of many achiles injuries that took less than 2 years to get back to 100% and in some cases (Jamir MIller of the top of my head) they never come back and play well again.

Vincent- Please.. His best days after 15 years are long gone.

Clements- I would call him a top 5 corner until he showed how dismal he was without a pass rush in front of him last year. He got beat ALL year long, commits stupid penalties and makes BIG mistakes at crucial times. Great ability physically, and probably the closest thing we have to a real impact player.

EVans?- That remains to be seen how he'll do without teams double teaming Moulds and paying a lot more attention to him. Having Josh Reed and Andre Davis play next to him won't do him any favors either.

Willis?- He has to show he can run hard for 16 games, last year was a joke. He did more dancing than Jerry Rice on dancing with the stars.. He's also far from the type of player that belongs on a Marv Levy team. His main goal= to stay healthy and collect a paycheck. Thurman THomas used to throw up when the Bills played bad. Willis barely gave a shrug.

My point being this team doesn't have NOWHERE near enough impact players to be a competitive team. Hell, they don't even have the first clue who their quarterback is going to be.

If you want to build your team around "role" players (and thats all they will ever be) like Royal, Davis, Bowen, etc and become better pretty much 100% through the draft and get on par with the Pitt, Den and NE's of the league (which Im sure you are referring too), then that's fine.

Don't expect to win for at LEAST 3-4 years . But that's fine. THe Bills are starting out from the VERY bottom of the barrel... If they elect to go the cheap route through FA and build through the draft, it's going to be a long time before you can expect to see football at the Ralph in January.

patmoran2006

03-22-2006, 11:16 PM

patmoran2006

03-22-2006, 11:25 PM

Through the draft and with bargain bin free agent signings - exactly how the Pats built their super bowl teams! Last I checked the big spending Redskins haven't won a super bowl in Snyders tenure. I can't believe this is lost on people.

I think that people like you (and no disrespect either) are misunderstanding points that people like myself, freeman and nighthawk (and some others) are trying to make.

I dont think ANY OF US expected Buffalo to go out and get Dan Syner-ish on the league. I dont think any of us expected LeCharles Bentley, Ryan Pickett, Adam Archuleta, Lavar Arrington and David Givens in one year.

Some of us are PO'd because with marv levy being gm and 80 years old, an older experienced head coach being brought in and TOP HALF of the league money in regard to cap space.. We expected to have a decent amount of starters and upgrades over a 5-11 team last year that was total crap.

It hasn't happened and if ALL upgrades are coming through the draft, its going to be a VERY long road back to winning football.

hydro

03-22-2006, 11:46 PM

patmoran2006

03-22-2006, 11:51 PM

Everyone should just be a Redskins fan. All this forum wants is to buy a winning team. Where has it got Synder... no where. Look at the Patriots, most of there team has been put together through the draft (allbeit luck). Patience is a virute.

The Patriots were successful because of a guy named Bill Billicheck and some assistants named Romeo Crennel and Charlie Weiss.. Mangini wasn't too bad either and I"m tired so im SURE im forgetting A LOT more great coaches. oh and they got LUCKY that Bledsoe got hurt too.

Those coaches are now all gone and so are a lot of NE players LOST through FA.. Lets see how their "system" for them works out in 2006.

WHen we have those guys in our organization and not recycled head coaches and 80 year old rookie GM's i'll be more inclined to buy into your system..

For the time being, I'd rather spend some money and have some actual talent in town.

patmoran2006

03-23-2006, 12:00 AM

Read down and look at how fast he turned the Eagles around. Reid is good, but most of his team that went to 4 straight NFC Championship games, Modrak put together.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04340/421989.stm

This is why I am VERY excited about this draft. I also feel fine with the mid tier guys being brought in right now. Marv is listening very intently to the opinions and recomendations from Modrak and Guy.

While the EAgles had a losing record at that time, it needs to pointed out that they had a hell of a lot more talent on that team than their record indicated: Jeramiah Trotter, Runyan, Duce Staley (who was a 1200 yd rusher that year), Brian Dawkins, Hugh Douglas, A younger Troy Vincent, Bobby Taylor and Tra Thomas.

And at the end of the day, Marv makes the final call........ I TO THIS DAY HAVE NO CLUE WHY MODRAK WAS NOT NAMED THE GM.

I do agree with you that Modrak knows how to build a team.. I also have a sneaking suspicion if he was running the show our roster would look more than a tad different right now.

BillsFever21

03-23-2006, 04:17 AM

Historian

03-23-2006, 04:41 AM

You guys are nuts if you think the Bills have done nothing this off-season. Marv and company have made several key acquisitions - acquisitions which involve young veterans who will help supplement the core of the Bills going forward. You guys act like armchair Dan Snyders who want to sign someone solely based on name value rather then a consideration of whether they fit within the frame work of the team next season and two seasons down the road.

I am at an absolute loss as to who you guys actually think the Bills missed out on. This is not a strong free agent class. Pickett is about the only one since the Bills had no legitimate chance at Hutchinson or Bentley. Pickett is decent, but he is no game breaker. If we were talking about John Henderson or Richard Seymour I could see why you are upset, but Pickett isn't close to being in their league.

The reality is the Bills are building with young veterans and draft picks. Likely only two more starting positions are up for grabs - left guard and defensive tackle. Those two need areas happen to fall right in the wheel house in terms of what is available in the draft. Ngata/Bunkley in round one; Joseph/Spencer/Lutui in round two. After that everything is gravy.

:bf1:

The_Philster

03-23-2006, 04:53 AM

Clements- I would call him a top 5 corner until he showed how dismal he was without a pass rush in front of him last year. He got beat ALL year long, commits stupid penalties and makes BIG mistakes at crucial times. Great ability physically, and probably the closest thing we have to a real impact player.In all fairness, can you name some CBs who can succeed without a pass rush?

WHen we have those guys in our organization and not recycled head coaches Belichek was a recycled head coach

For the time being, I'd rather spend some money and have some actual talent in town.even if that talent can't produce as a unit? Levy and Modrak aren't trying to assemble a group of All-Pros...they're trying to build a TEAM.

The specialty of the draft is Bill Polian. Polian was the GM and handled the draft. Marv was just the coach.

Don't try and give Marv the credit for the team that Polian built.Are you trying to say that Marv had NO input into the draft? Give me a break...that's a very naive comment.

EDS

03-23-2006, 08:38 AM

I think that people like you (and no disrespect either) are misunderstanding points that people like myself, freeman and nighthawk (and some others) are trying to make.

I dont think ANY OF US expected Buffalo to go out and get Dan Syner-ish on the league. I dont think any of us expected LeCharles Bentley, Ryan Pickett, Adam Archuleta, Lavar Arrington and David Givens in one year.

Some of us are PO'd because with marv levy being gm and 80 years old, an older experienced head coach being brought in and TOP HALF of the league money in regard to cap space.. We expected to have a decent amount of starters and upgrades over a 5-11 team last year that was total crap.

It hasn't happened and if ALL upgrades are coming through the draft, its going to be a VERY long road back to winning football.

You are the one missing the point. Pickett, Givens, Archuleta, Neal, Runyan - none of those guy are "impact" players. Why mortgage your future on non-impact players?

Bowen, Tripplett, Fowler are all free agents signed to replace veterans on the downside of their careers. All should be upgrades both now and particularly down the road (Milloy, Adams and Teague will be retired by then). Royals may even be an upgrade over Campbell as far as a blocking tight end, so that could make 4 positions. Chances are only two rookies are going to start on this team, if that - defensive tackle and left guard.

Improvement is going to come from young veterans like JP, Willis, Evans, Peters, Gandy, Kelsay, Schobel, McGee, Crowell, Parrish, etc. If those guys don't improve the Bills don't win, but no manner of free agent signings is going to change that.

Perennially good teams (NE, Indy, Pitt, Philly, Denver, etc.) for the most part do not make big splashes in free agency. Occassionally they will make a big signing or two (NE - Colvin; Philly - TO, Kearse; Denver - Plummer; Indy - Simon) but for the most part they blead players every year (NE - Milloy, Woody, Washington, Givens, Andruzzi, T. Jones, Law, etc.; Indy - half the o-line, Peterson, Thornton, Edge, Tripplett, Pollard, etc.; Philly - Simon, Barber, Deuce, Runyan, Vincent, Trotter, etc.; Denver - Teague, O'Neal, Berry, Hayward, Pryce, Drougns, etc.) yet they more often then not fill those positions with rookies, young drafted veterans or street and bargain bin free agents.

Gunzlingr

03-23-2006, 08:50 AM

Free Agency is pretty much a lost cause at this point. Buffalo obviously isn't going to pony up enough cash to entice guys to come here, let alone beat any offers other teams can match.

Who? The big names commanded HUGE money (Hutchinson, Archuleta), the rest are guys that aren't much better than the guys we signed. I don't have a problem not signing guys that are 33+ going on 40 and wanting big contracts. IMO the free agents this year are all mediocre with a couple stars thrown in.

I am not going to pass judgment until I see what we have when the season starts. I am neither optimistic or pessimistic on the team so far, mostly because I don't see the point of getting all pissed off because we arent signing every guy out there. I have no control over what happens, so I just have to hope for the best.

justasportsfan

03-23-2006, 08:51 AM

I thought this was Dick's draft. He tells Marv what he needs after asking his assts. Marv runs to Modrak, these are the positions we need "who do you think are the best players in the draft." Modrak runs to his PS 2 and then we have our draft :D.

justasportsfan

03-23-2006, 08:54 AM

You are the one missing the point. Pickett, Givens, Archuleta, Neal, Runyan - none of those guy are "impact" players. Why mortgage your future on non-impact players?

Bowen, Tripplett, Fowler are all free agents signed to replace veterans on the downside of their careers. All should be upgrades both now and particularly down the road (Milloy, Adams and Teague will be retired by then). Royals may even be an upgrade over Campbell as far as a blocking tight end, so that could make 4 positions. Chances are only two rookies are going to start on this team, if that - defensive tackle and left guard.

Improvement is going to come from young veterans like JP, Willis, Evans, Peters, Gandy, Kelsay, Schobel, McGee, Crowell, Parrish, etc. If those guys don't improve the Bills don't win, but no manner of free agent signings is going to change that.

Perennially good teams (NE, Indy, Pitt, Philly, Denver, etc.) for the most part do not make big splashes in free agency. Occassionally they will make a big signing or two (NE - Colvin; Philly - TO, Kearse; Denver - Plummer; Indy - Simon) but for the most part they blead players every year (NE - Milloy, Woody, Washington, Givens, Andruzzi, T. Jones, Law, etc.; Indy - half the o-line, Peterson, Thornton, Edge, Tripplett, Pollard, etc.; Philly - Simon, Barber, Deuce, Runyan, Vincent, Trotter, etc.; Denver - Teague, O'Neal, Berry, Hayward, Pryce, Drougns, etc.) yet they more often then not fill those positions with rookies, young drafted veterans or street and bargain bin free agents.

I smell smoke, someone must be BURNING! :D

patmoran2006

03-23-2006, 08:55 AM

Gunzlingr

03-23-2006, 09:27 AM

I dont think ANY OF US expected Buffalo to go out and get Dan Syner-ish on the league. I dont think any of us expected LeCharles Bentley, Ryan Pickett, Adam Archuleta, Lavar Arrington and David Givens in one year.

But this is Exactly the case! I can't remember which one of you started a thread about not bringing in the big names, and when I asked who, those names came up! Time and again I hear about the Bills not shelling out the money to the big names, and then the poster gets all defensive when you ask who, because realistically we have no chance competing for them. I think we are doing ok with what we have to work with.