Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

[ICE74129]

No safetys, TE's, WR's, LB's etc.

LINES!

If you will look the guys wanting these skill positions are the some of the most vocal about not being worth a damn over the last 6 years. But they want to continue to do the same things that got us 31-49 over the 5 year TD hellish Reign.

The problem from the day we didn't make the superbowl again has been a failure to address both lines. Lines are where games are won and lost. We have safetys, CB's, LB's, WR's, QB's and etc. We still greatly lack good lines.

Teams like Pittsburgh, NE, Carolina, Seattle etc built thier lines mostly though the draft. Sure you sign a guy here and there, but you do it through the draft. This years draft is THE year to do this. Deep at OL and very solid though round 2 on DL.

I will quote Bill Cowher again 'When you have a clear cut need, and you can draft the top guy or next to top guy at that position of need, you do so' We didn't address DT #2 in FA, time to do so in the draft. We didn't address LG in FA, we need to in the draft. I for one am on record as being perfectly happy spending the first 4 picks on lines. It is well past time for that to happen.

Picking lines is boring. It makes for a boring draft to some people. Those are the Madden Gen / Fast food fans of today. they want flash for the 8th pick. I keep reading posters say 'Well I don't feel so and so is worth #8'. I bet if you had access to all 32 teams draft boards, they DO have so and so worth the 8th pick. But that is why there are GM's and there are fans.

I would personally like to move back 2-3 spots, pick up another 2nd round pick and take Bunkley. If we stay at 8 so be it. But both lines need to be addressed in this draft.

Lastly the thing that gets me is we know lines need to be addressed, but fans want lesser rated talent to fill them. 'Draft BPA (ie a Safety or TE) with #8. Use 2nd and 3rd round picks on the lines'. That makes no sense. You try and get the best talent available at the position of need when you can. if we have a clear cut need at DT, then take the best damn DT possible!

Address the lines, It isn't flashy, but it's a winning formula.

[patmoran2006]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

NO, the majority of fans think that when it comes to our lines, we should have went out and signed 1-2 starters on each side (maybe not franchise players but at least starters from other teams). As opposed to rookie's starting on a OL.


Let me ask you this, are you are JP Losman fan or a Craig Nall fan? You expect JP to have a real chance to succeed when you replace the left side of your line Gandy and Anderson with one or even two rookies (as your clearly suggesting)? He'll get KILLED with a rookie LT who's last name isn't Brick.

And Me, you, bill cowher or my sister can play GM when it comes to the 8th pick.. WHO CANT take a good player at eight? A good GM, the Pittsburgh's and Denver's and NE's you model everyday, how many of their starting OL and DL are first round picks? Go do the research (I have) the answer is NOT many...

If Levy's ability are up to par with other good GM's, he can find a starting DT in the second round, a solid guard and tackle in round three, etc etc ..

If we had the 20th pick or the 28th pick, like Pitt, NE and Den do every year its one thing.. Those teams rarely if ever get the shots at a top ten player like a Vernon Davis or a AJ Hawk or Michael Huff.

Pittsburgh the last TWO times they've had a pick in the first half of the first round, took a QB (Big Ben) and a S (Polamalu) .. That sound a lot fantasy football'ish to me now, doesnt it.

While I agree any type of Bills fan on this board or in WNY for that matter understands both sides of our line are currently ****, that does NOT mean we have to take a tackle or DT with our FIRST PICK.. EVERY team y ou mention on a comparison every day finds good starters on the line at ALL Phases of the draft.

[patmoran2006]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

Mr Cowher's last nine first round draft picks.

2005- Heath Miller, TE (30th)
2004- Ben Rothleisberger, QB (11th)
2003- Troy Polamalu, S (14th)
2002- Kendall Simmons, G (30th)
2001- Casey Hampton, DT (19th)
2000- Plaxico Burress, WR (8th)
1999-Troy Edwards, WR (13th)
1998- Alen Faneca, G (26th)
1997- Chad Scott, CB (27th)

Summary: 2 guards taken in the first round, with 26th pick in '98 and 30th pick in '02.. ONE Dt taken in first round last nine years, the 19th pick in '01.

the ONE time Cowher owned the 8th pick, he took a WR.

THREE Other times Cowher had a pick in the first half of the first round, he took : QB, WR, S.

If Brick was on the board at 8, 100% of us would agree that's the pick.. If Ngata fit the defense we ran (vets got released for not fitting the scheme) then a lot of people would say that's the pick.. Truth is, he doesnt fit .

You gonna take a linemen at 8 just to take a linemen? You take the best player on the board that will help your team.

You have THREE other first day draft picks.. If you want, I'll go show you in the next two rounds how Cowher's draft picks of OL and DL INCREASE dramatically in rounds 2-4...

[oldno711]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

No safetys, TE's, WR's, LB's etc.

LINES!

If you will look the guys wanting these skill positions are the some of the most vocal about not being worth a damn over the last 6 years. But they want to continue to do the same things that got us 31-49 over the 5 year TD hellish Reign.

The problem from the day we didn't make the superbowl again has been a failure to address both lines. Lines are where games are won and lost. We have safetys, CB's, LB's, WR's, QB's and etc. We still greatly lack good lines.

Teams like Pittsburgh, NE, Carolina, Seattle etc built thier lines mostly though the draft. Sure you sign a guy here and there, but you do it through the draft. This years draft is THE year to do this. Deep at OL and very solid though round 2 on DL.

I will quote Bill Cowher again 'When you have a clear cut need, and you can draft the top guy or next to top guy at that position of need, you do so' We didn't address DT #2 in FA, time to do so in the draft. We didn't address LG in FA, we need to in the draft. I for one am on record as being perfectly happy spending the first 4 picks on lines. It is well past time for that to happen.

Picking lines is boring. It makes for a boring draft to some people. Those are the Madden Gen / Fast food fans of today. they want flash for the 8th pick. I keep reading posters say 'Well I don't feel so and so is worth #8'. I bet if you had access to all 32 teams draft boards, they DO have so and so worth the 8th pick. But that is why there are GM's and there are fans.

I would personally like to move back 2-3 spots, pick up another 2nd round pick and take Bunkley. If we stay at 8 so be it. But both lines need to be addressed in this draft.

Lastly the thing that gets me is we know lines need to be addressed, but fans want lesser rated talent to fill them. 'Draft BPA (ie a Safety or TE) with #8. Use 2nd and 3rd round picks on the lines'. That makes no sense. You try and get the best talent available at the position of need when you can. if we have a clear cut need at DT, then take the best damn DT possible!

Address the lines, It isn't flashy, but it's a winning formula.

Definitely not flashy, but necessary

[ICE74129]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

Definitely not flashy, but necessary

Its the way winning teams are built.

[oldno711]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

Its the way winning teams are built.

Agreed. That's why I would love to see them get proactive and make the moves needed to ensure Ferguson is a Buffalo Bill next year. He's that good.

[ICE74129]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

Agreed. That's why I would love to see them get proactive and make the moves needed to ensure Ferguson is a Buffalo Bill next year. He's that good.

You and me both, but I really don't want to lose picks this year. The draft is deep.

[patmoran2006]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

Its the way winning teams are built.

How so? With Top Ten picks on linemen? I already showed you Pittsburgh.. Now lets examine another team you like to compare often; Denver.

Broncos First Picks Last 10 years.
2005- Darrent Wiliams, CB
2004-DJ Williams, CB
2003- George Foster, T
2002- Ashley Lelie, WR
2001- Willie Middlebrooks, CB
2000- Deltha O'Neal, CB
1999- Al Wilson, LB
1998-Marcus Nash, WR
1997- Trevor Pryce, DT
1996-John Mobley, LB

That's exactly ONE offensive linemen and ONE defensive linemen picked first overall in the last 10 years, yet they dont seem to have problems with their interior. KNow why? Most of their starters came in later rounds.. Its called GOOD drafting.

I dont think ANYBODY dude is denying our Lines are the biggest weak spots.. The point is Top Ten players are the BEST players in the draft for a reason, you HAVE to get one of them.. If he happens to fit a position of weakness its graavy.. But you DONT pass up on a franchise player because he's not a DT or OT.

Great GM's, the Polian's of the world.. Find good fat linemen all throughout the draft, the main reason its seven rounds.. not one.

[oldno711]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

You and me both, but I really don't want to lose picks this year. The draft is deep.

We got Moulds??? Clements??? TWO 3rd rounders?????

MAKE IT HAPPEN MARV!

ok, so i'm obviously partial to my boy from Virginia but the guy's a beast.

[BillsNick]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

Yes, maybe we could get another Mike Williams!

[don137]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

I truly believe the Bills will not go OL or DL in the first round unless they trade up for Brick/Williams or down. Ngata does not fit the scheme and Bunkley has character issues. Other than Brick or Williams no one is worth an 8th pick on the OL or DL. Thats why unless Hawk, Williams or Brick fall to 8 I see Huff or Davis as the selection.

[patmoran2006]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

now.. based on a top 10 talent scale. If Buffalo had the third pick and Mario Williams or D'Brickshaw Ferguson were there, I highly doubt ANYBODY sane would be talking Vernon Davis, Huff or even AJ Hawk..

Williams and brick both fit a need, AND they are top 8 players... However, neither will be there.

Trading up to get either would be STUPID.. Here's why.
To move up to get Brick, based on the GM Bible (NFL draft value chart), he will likely be the second pick to the Saints..

Saints has a 2600 value.. Buffalo has 1400 with our pick..
It would take our first, second, both thirds and a fourth for the Saints to have equal points value. NO player is worth that much, not even Brick.

[patmoran2006]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

I truly believe the Bills will not go OL or DL in the first round unless they trade up for Brick/Williams or down. Ngata does not fit the scheme and Binkley has character issues. Other than Brick or Williams no one is worth an 8th pick on the OL or DL. Thats why unless Hawk, Williams or Brick fall to 8 I see Huff or Davis as the selection.

Thank you SO MUCH!

Your 100% right.. Trade up for Brick or Mario (almost impossible see above chart).. Or trade down and get Justice or Bunkley, then absolutely..

Keep the eighth pick.. Not a chance.

[TedMock]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

The draft is deep.

Which is why I see us taking a skilled position in the 2nd round. I 100% completely agree with you that games are won and lost on the lines. They are the primary staple of a great team. No doubt about it. However, the draft is deep with good lineman. A trade down is most beneficial in my opinion. 8 is a tough position because there are indeed going to be skilled players much more worthy of the pick at that time. I think we can land a starting guard in the 3rd or 4th round. If we go DL in 1, S in 2, OL in 3 and 4, I'm very pleased with that. I still think we'll also see a QB in 5 or 6.

[ICE74129]

Re: Just say no to any skill positions until 4th round or later.

Which is why I see us taking a skilled position in the 2nd round. I 100% completely agree with you that games are won and lost on the lines. They are the primary staple of a great team. No doubt about it. However, the draft is deep with good lineman. A trade down is most beneficial in my opinion. 8 is a tough position because there are indeed going to be skilled players much more worthy of the pick at that time. I think we can land a starting guard in the 3rd or 4th round. If we go DL in 1, S in 2, OL in 3 and 4, I'm very pleased with that. I still think we'll also see a QB in 5 or 6.

I would like to see us trade down a couple slots and take Bunkley or Justice with that pick. Use the first pick in the 2nd on the other line. Then decide from there.