Gandy is Underated

[patmoran2006]

I think a lot of people are underestimaing Mike Gandy. I think he was FAR away from being the weakest link on this offensive line last year. He is FAR from a superstar or a Franchise tackle, but maybe I was watching the wrong games because I didnt think he played that bad. IN fact, for the most part I think he held his own.. He'll never be Orlando Pace, but I"ve seen far worse.

The BIG weakness in the Bills offensive line for the past few years, and especially 2005 was the MIDDLE of the offensive line. Trey Teague wasn't strong enough to play center, Bennie Anderson was far too slow and Chris Villarrial has more mental lapses than Eminen's wife. PLus he gets hurt a lot.

Teams DESTROYED us up the middle last year... Defensive tackles owned the interior of our line and teams blitzed up the middle with ease. Those are the three OL slots more in need of improvement. Fowler was a start at center and I'm sure we'll get at least one first-day draft pick at guard. I'd have Preston compete with Villarrial for the other spot.

I'd prefer Gandy to play left tackle in 2006 over ANY rookie that we drafted, except MAYBE Brick (he does have franchise LT written all over him)..

Whether it's JP, Nall or a rookie.. WHOEVER is QB, they have no chance with a raw young rookie playing LEFT TACKLE.. If that's going to be the case, you may as wel run JP outta town now... WE're OBVIOUSLY going to have a rookie LG in place of Anderson this year.. You want a young, unproven QB playing with an entire ROOKIE LEFT side of the line? I sure as hell dont.

Gandy isn't old, I believe he's a five-year vet. I think long-term his future is as depth (Like Marcus Price was valuable to us as a backup at one time) but for the time being I have no problem with him starting, especially since a young raw guy will be starting at LG via draft or Preston.

With the 8th pick, I'd MUCH rather give my young QB a weapon to have besides Lee Evans. Dont fool yourself with Reed, he's had four years to prove his worth here and failed (miserably).. He could be a good #3 WR at times, but he's taking NO pressure and double teams away from Evans.

I'd love to have Vernon DAvis, or I'd even consider trading down and taking Chad Jackson.. Losman needs more than Evans.

DT, G need to addressed in the second/third rounds and then I'd take a tackle for the FUTURE with my second third rounder.. The DT and G are going to have to start (The Andersons-Tim and Bennie totally SUCK) from day one.. I dont want a rookie protecting my QB's blindside if his name aint Brick..

Davis at 8 is a great pick.. Chad Jackson at say 13-15 is a great pick.

WRoten, Watson, McCargo are all good DT's who could start right away in the second.

Boothe, Spencer, Latui.. One of them will make round three.. all are better than Anderson..

Whitworth, Callagahan or Derek Morris are great value tackles in the third who could be future starters.

Gandy isn't as bad as you think.. And regardless of who your QB of choice is, if you want him to have a real chance to be successful: you better get him another weapon besides Evans.

[Gunzlingr]

I think Gandy is serviceable.

[Meathead]

yes and you forgot an r

[ICE74129]

Gandy is serviceable at best. He was also out of football for nearly a year. When you can get a Good to great LT that will anchor your line for years, you take him.

This is a known fact that has been preached for decades in football.

No matter how many posts, No matter how much *****ing and complaining, I am not going to budge off of this stance. Post articles, whatever. I coach so I know this fundamental truth. I have talked with one of the best GM's in the game as well so I am set in my foundation. LINES!

Address the lines in this draft and get it over with. Take the best possible talent on the lines and quit looking to add flash to the team. Good football teams have good lines, and we dont' have a good offensive line. LT IS a need for this team. Gandy is a serviceable backup.

[ICE74129]

and PS we are NOT going to draft a QB in the first round. Its not going to happen. Read what marv has said about the team from day 1, he won't be putting that much focus on one guy.

PSS THIS IS THE YEAR to let a Rookie LT come in and develop. If ever there was a time, it is now.

[patmoran2006]

you give me my choice between Nick Mangold, Davin Joseph or Winston Justice and Im takin them in that EXACT order given the needs of this team.

[patmoran2006]

Ice..
Let me ask you this.. Lets say you are right and we take Winston Justice with the 8th pick and he STARTS at left tackle as a rookie..

Are you going to start a rookie at LG as well?? SURELY you're not suggesting that Bennie ANderson returns at LG?

You start TWO rookies on the LEFT SIDE of the line we better have SEVEN QB's because everyone of them will get KILLED!

[ICE74129]

you give me my choice between Nick Mangold, Davin Joseph or Winston Justice and Im takin them in that EXACT order given the needs of this team.

Fowler is our center. I watched several of his games last year. He was a major reason for the 9-2 run. He is a young guy on the rise, he just needed his chance. Fowler will start at center.

[ICE74129]

Ice..
Let me ask you this.. Lets say you are right and we take Winston Justice with the 8th pick and he STARTS at left tackle as a rookie..

Are you going to start a rookie at LG as well?? SURELY you're not suggesting that Bennie ANderson returns at LG?

You start TWO rookies on the LEFT SIDE of the line we better have SEVEN QB's because everyone of them will get KILLED!

No. You move Villarial to LG if need be and the rookie starts at RG until he gets the feel for the game. Look Guard play is in space. Left, right, it doesn't matter. But even if we went LT and LG as rookies (and we won't) We should still do it. NOW is that time.

Look its like a shot....get it over with. Resist the urge to take flash. Upgrade the lines in this draft and we are done with it. Let them develop together and we are set for years.

[patmoran2006]

He could also play guard if we had Mangold at center and be a much better guard than Bennie Anderson..

I have nothing bad to saw about Fowler other than he's unproven as a starter.. I like Fowler. but we're not getting Mangold, I was making a statement of preference.

But it doesnt solve my dilemna.. No coach in their right frame of mind will start Two RAW guys on the left side of the line with a QB who hasnt proven nothing in the NFL.

[justasportsfan]

Gandy wasn't bad for someone who was out of football and who was new to the team. Who knows if he's getting better.

[patmoran2006]

No. You move Villarial to LG if need be and the rookie starts at RG until he gets the feel for the game. Look Guard play is in space. Left, right, it doesn't matter. But even if we went LT and LG as rookies (and we won't) We should still do it. NOW is that time.

Look its like a shot....get it over with. Resist the urge to take flash. Upgrade the lines in this draft and we are done with it. Let them develop together and we are set for years.

Chris Villarrial is a 11-year BANGED up to death vet, to my knowledge he's never been a LG and after 11 years in the NFL its a tad late to start developing him as one. He's barely any good as a RG, in fact he's one of the biggest weaknesses on the team.

[patmoran2006]

Gandy wasn't bad for someone who was out of football and who was new to the team. Who knows if he's getting better.

I dont thinks he's a future Pro Bowler or a long-term (3-4 year) starter.. but given how deplorable our DT and Guards spots are, OT is not even CLOSE to being the priority given the state of those other positions and who currently mans them.

I got no problem taking a good prospect at tackle at round three who develops over a couple of years while a vet who's played the position like Gandy before starts there while he learns in the NFL.

[Kerr]

Agreed with Pat on Gandy. Gandy did a decent job last year. Didn't he shutout jason taylor in both games last season? That's not easy to do for any tackle. At best you can compare gandy to jonas jennings, not a great tackle, but a decent tackle, except he's not getting overpaid like jennings did. If the Bills draft a LT in the 1st round, they shouldn't put all their eggs in one basket and expect the guy to automatically come in and do a good job.If the rookie LT, say Winston, outperformed gandy in camp and preseason, then they got lucky, but if he struggles, then gandy is a good choice to pick it up, while winston gets rep throughout the season until he improves.

[ICE74129]

He could also play guard if we had Mangold at center and be a much better guard than Bennie Anderson..

I have nothing bad to saw about Fowler other than he's unproven as a starter.. I like Fowler. but we're not getting Mangold, I was making a statement of preference.

But it doesnt solve my dilemna.. No coach in their right frame of mind will start Two RAW guys on the left side of the line with a QB who hasnt proven nothing in the NFL.

He is our Center.

Again, we are going to address guard that is a given considering how much we offered Wells. We also brought in a Tackle and given the fact the Bills have said Peters is a RT period, that leaves LT to address in the draft.

Now the question is...what guard are they going to address? I say move the veteran to LG and put the rookie at RG. Then let Villarial go next year and bring in a vet LG.

[ICE74129]

Agreed with Pat on Gandy. Gandy did a decent job last year. Didn't he shutout jason taylor in both games last season? That's not easy to do for any tackle. At best you can compare gandy to jonas jennings, not a great tackle, but a decent tackle, except he's not getting overpaid like jennings did. If the Bills draft a LT in the 1st round, they shouldn't put all their eggs in one basket and expect the guy to automatically come in and do a good job.If the rookie LT, say Winston, outperformed gandy in camp and preseason, then they got lucky, but if he struggles, then gandy is a good choice to pick it up, while winston gets rep throughout the season until he improves.

Gandy is a servicable backup. I wish fans would understand this. We ***** about the team sucking, but then think its ok to start average players and pass them off as good starters.

[patmoran2006]

Gandy is MORE than just servicable when you compare him to Bennie Anderson or even Villarrial at this point of his 11-year career..

And more importantly, no head coach is going to SACRIFICE his starting QB by startin a pair of rookies on the offensive line..

Peters has started less than a year, Fowler has started 8 games.. You want to add two ROOKIES to this starting mix along with an oft-broken down old guard?

[ICE74129]

Gandy is MORE than just servicable when you compare him to Bennie Anderson or even Villarrial at this point of his 11-year career..

And more importantly, no head coach is going to SACRIFICE his starting QB by startin a pair of rookies on the offensive line..

Peters has started less than a year, Fowler has started 8 games.. You want to add two ROOKIES to this starting mix along with an oft-broken down old guard?

Yes. There comes a time when you just have to do it. We do it now and come this time in 07 and we will be glad we did.

[patmoran2006]

Yes. There comes a time when you just have to do it. We do it now and come this time in 07 and we will be glad we did.

yOu tell that to the thousands of fans right now debating on whether to spend their hard-earned money on season tickets to watch a team that's playing for 2007.. Because if you start TWO rookies on the OL, thats exactly what your doing..

And you better forget about whoever starts at QB to last.. Wont happen when he's on his back (or in the hospital) every week.

[MDFINFAN]

Gandy is a servicable backup. I wish fans would understand this. We ***** about the team sucking, but then think its ok to start average players and pass them off as good starters.

I know my voice won't have much weight here, being a fin fan, but Ice is right, all good football teams start in the trenches, and if D. Brick is there when you guy draft, and you don't pick him up, that would be crazy. We've gone several seasons since we lost Webb, and you see what it's done to the phin's O. I argued with you guys last year that you didn't improve the OL, and it would be your downfall...I argue at finheaven that Rick Spelman's redoing our OL 2 years ago would be the best thing that happened to the phins, and it started to pay off last year. It's a young OL we have but they're starting to play together, and now that we've added a decent LT, should be even a better OL, and we still sign our old LT for depth...he's another Grady, serviceable LT, but depth.

[ICE74129]

yOu tell that to the thousands of fans right now debating on whether to spend their hard-earned money on season tickets to watch a team that's playing for 2007.. Because if you start TWO rookies on the OL, thats exactly what your doing..

And you better forget about whoever starts at QB to last.. Wont happen when he's on his back (or in the hospital) every week.

First off the fans will buy the tickets. 2nd Fans know its all about the lines. You want to see a riot at RWS? Draft a QB. Fans aren't stupid pat, they know football and they know the lines haven't been addressed worth a damn in the last decade.

Fans will come to that stadium regardless. Now is the time to do the right thing and address the lines.

[mysticsoto]

I think a lot of people are underestimaing Mike Gandy. I think he was FAR away from being the weakest link on this offensive line last year. He is FAR from a superstar or a Franchise tackle, but maybe I was watching the wrong games because I didnt think he played that bad. IN fact, for the most part I think he held his own.. He'll never be Orlando Pace, but I"ve seen far worse.

The BIG weakness in the Bills offensive line for the past few years, and especially 2005 was the MIDDLE of the offensive line. Trey Teague wasn't strong enough to play center, Bennie Anderson was far too slow and Chris Villarrial has more mental lapses than Eminen's wife. PLus he gets hurt a lot.

Teams DESTROYED us up the middle last year... Defensive tackles owned the interior of our line and teams blitzed up the middle with ease. Those are the three OL slots more in need of improvement. Fowler was a start at center and I'm sure we'll get at least one first-day draft pick at guard. I'd have Preston compete with Villarrial for the other spot.

I'd prefer Gandy to play left tackle in 2006 over ANY rookie that we drafted, except MAYBE Brick (he does have franchise LT written all over him)..

Whether it's JP, Nall or a rookie.. WHOEVER is QB, they have no chance with a raw young rookie playing LEFT TACKLE.. If that's going to be the case, you may as wel run JP outta town now... WE're OBVIOUSLY going to have a rookie LG in place of Anderson this year.. You want a young, unproven QB playing with an entire ROOKIE LEFT side of the line? I sure as hell dont.

Gandy isn't old, I believe he's a five-year vet. I think long-term his future is as depth (Like Marcus Price was valuable to us as a backup at one time) but for the time being I have no problem with him starting, especially since a young raw guy will be starting at LG via draft or Preston.

With the 8th pick, I'd MUCH rather give my young QB a weapon to have besides Lee Evans. Dont fool yourself with Reed, he's had four years to prove his worth here and failed (miserably).. He could be a good #3 WR at times, but he's taking NO pressure and double teams away from Evans.

I'd love to have Vernon DAvis, or I'd even consider trading down and taking Chad Jackson.. Losman needs more than Evans.

DT, G need to addressed in the second/third rounds and then I'd take a tackle for the FUTURE with my second third rounder.. The DT and G are going to have to start (The Andersons-Tim and Bennie totally SUCK) from day one.. I dont want a rookie protecting my QB's blindside if his name aint Brick..

Davis at 8 is a great pick.. Chad Jackson at say 13-15 is a great pick.

WRoten, Watson, McCargo are all good DT's who could start right away in the second.

Boothe, Spencer, Latui.. One of them will make round three.. all are better than Anderson..

Whitworth, Callagahan or Derek Morris are great value tackles in the third who could be future starters.

Gandy isn't as bad as you think.. And regardless of who your QB of choice is, if you want him to have a real chance to be successful: you better get him another weapon besides Evans.


:posrep:

It's about time somebody stated this. All the negativity toward Gandy...I can't believe people think he needs to be replaced so badly when in fact, it was the interior line that was killing us constantly last year!!!

Grabbing a top guard is a priority and therefore needs to be done with our 2nd rd pick!!!

My only concern with grabbing Davis with our 1st is that our Dline is not going to be great. Let's put things in perspective...Tripplett was a very decent pickup, but he's not going to singlehandedly change the outcome of a game by himself. We need another top DT and if we try to settle for a 3rd rounder (remember, Tim Anderson was a 3rd rounder) we just might get the same level of play. In my opinion, we can't afford that. Bunkley is a good candidate, and unless Marv has interviewed with Ngata and saw something in him that we may not be privy to...I'd say Bunkley has to be our pick. And if we don't pick him by the 12th pick, Baltimore will surely take him...he's not going to last much more past that...

[EDS]

I think guard is a more pressing need then tackle for the Bills. That said, if they do draft Justice they could follow the Vernon Davis/Johnathan Ogden plan and start Justice at guard as a rookie to get his feet wet.

[patmoran2006]

Ice.. I am all for addressing the OL as well..

If we had the 17th pick in the draft, I'd stay take a linemen first.. But we have the 8th, tackle is NOT a major weak spot on this team.. GUARD is.

Its crazy to draft a tackle at eigth, to me its the same as drafting a CB or RB with the 8th pick.. Justice is no more a need over Gandy than Huff is over Bowens..

NOW at 8.. Bunkley could be a good pick.. YOu dont stop the run, you do nothing..

[ICE74129]

Ice.. I am all for addressing the OL as well..

If we had the 17th pick in the draft, I'd stay take a linemen first.. But we have the 8th, tackle is NOT a major weak spot on this team.. GUARD is.

Its crazy to draft a tackle at eigth, to me its the same as drafting a CB or RB with the 8th pick.. Justice is no more a need over Gandy than Huff is over Bowens..

NOW at 8.. Bunkley could be a good pick.. YOu dont stop the run, you do nothing..

It's not crazy at all. But I digress. We have a common enemy now....that old fart spitting and sputtering on the PC right now.

Past time for him to sell. I hope to God that is what might be happening soon.

[TedMock]

Our area of need is the interior line, not the tackles. Gandy was a very pleasant surprise last season. He played much, much better than we could have expected. He was not part of the problem. The pressure came right up the gut last season, all season. You build a team from the lines - out. Our immediate need on the lines is inside. I'd love if we could drop down, and get a DT lower in the first, then start addressing guards immediately after.

Gandy was out of football because of an injury, not because of lack of talent. I believe it was Carolina that brought him on board before 2004, but he subsequently failed the physical which only proves that his injuries in Chicago were indeed very real. He sat out a year, came back healthy, and gave Buffalo a very solid season. Of course D'Brick is the type of talent that's tough to pass on, but he will not be there at 8 anyway.

[Saratoga Slim]

Ice.. I am all for addressing the OL as well..

If we had the 17th pick in the draft, I'd stay take a linemen first.. But we have the 8th, tackle is NOT a major weak spot on this team.. GUARD is.

Its crazy to draft a tackle at eigth, to me its the same as drafting a CB or RB with the 8th pick.. Justice is no more a need over Gandy than Huff is over Bowens..

NOW at 8.. Bunkley could be a good pick.. YOu dont stop the run, you do nothing..

I agree with this unless Brick is there at 8. There is NO excuse for not taking that guy if he's there at 8, even if interior line is a bigger need. Other than that, I've said over and over that I don't want any of the other Tackles at #8.

However, if we drop down a few picks, I'd be OK grabbing W. Justice/E. Winston in the 1st Rd., Claude Wroten/John McCargo in the 2nd, and Spencer/Latui etc in the 3rd.

[DBrown77]

Should this site be called IceMoranzone.com? Dont you guys have jobs?