The Velvet Bird

[Meathead]

In his own inimitable way Marv has kindly and gently given the finger to the amateur draftnicks panning the teams day 1 picks:


"We don't really go by what the experts say," Levy said. "It was a calculated thing. We felt, in terms of our need, this merited making that move. If it's interpreted as a reach, that's fine."
Consider yourself ***** slapped.

Even Tom Modrak got his own silky smooth backhand smack in:


Tom Modrak anticipated questions about the Bills selections, saying: "It's different strokes and different people want different things. ... But we'd like to think we have our lists in proper order, too."


I love the added "too". Implying the amateurs feel their lists are better than what the Bills have. Priceless.

It all just goes to show you there may be snow on the roof but grumpy old men can still dish out the spankings - even if you haven't started feeling the sting just yet.

[G. Host]

There are a lot of *****es (and bastards) to be slapped. Keep slapping.

[ICE74129]

And there are those that are the Bills *****es and take it regularly even when the Bills are wrong.

[The last buffalo fan]

As my team GM, I like the combination............. old, wise and nice. :up:

[OpIv37]

yeah, taking the advice of experts is horrible idea. The next time you're sick, ask your old college drinking buddies what's wrong instead of going to a doctor.

[G. Host]

If a ***** (or bastard) does not like he master they ought to go to a new team where they can be happier. I understand the North Dallas team has room on its bandwagon and is very popular for those looking for rich sugar daddies.

[LABillsFan]

yeah, taking the advice of experts is horrible idea. The next time you're sick, ask your old college drinking buddies what's wrong instead of going to a doctor.

What if you and your buddies are in med school?

[Cntrygal]

In his own inimitable way Marv has kindly and gently given the finger to the amateur draftnicks panning the teams day 1 picks:


"We don't really go by what the experts say," Levy said. "It was a calculated thing. We felt, in terms of our need, this merited making that move. If it's interpreted as a reach, that's fine."
Consider yourself ***** slapped.

Even Tom Modrak got his own silky smooth backhand smack in:


Tom Modrak anticipated questions about the Bills selections, saying: "It's different strokes and different people want different things. ... But we'd like to think we have our lists in proper order, too."


I love the added "too". Implying the amateurs feel their lists are better than what the Bills have. Priceless.

It all just goes to show you there may be snow on the roof but grumpy old men can still dish out the spankings - even if you haven't started feeling the sting just yet.

I love it! :roflmao:

[Iehoshua]

If any of these guys in the media were real experts, they'd be working for an NFL team and not writing a bunch of garbage bashing people. Notice how most of them are cast-offs who failed in NFL positions...

:bf1:
Marv & Moddy

[ublinkwescore]

In his own inimitable way Marv has kindly and gently given the finger to the amateur draftnicks panning the teams day 1 picks:


Consider yourself ***** slapped.

Even Tom Modrak got his own silky smooth backhand smack in:



I love the added "too". Implying the amateurs feel their lists are better than what the Bills have. Priceless.

It all just goes to show you there may be snow on the roof but grumpy old men can still dish out the spankings - even if you haven't started feeling the sting just yet.

inimitable?

Were you trying to spell inevitable?

[Meathead]

hey paco if youre gonna live in this country you should learn engrish - and use it to sing any song that has the word america in it

in·im·i·ta·ble
adj.
Defying imitation; matchless.

[G. Host]

hey paco if youre gonna live in this country you should learn engrish - and use it to sing any song that has the word america in it

in·im·i·ta·ble
adj.
Defying imitation; matchless.
Is "engrish" a regional dialect or have you learned English from a bad movie listening to an Asian villian? :D

[Meathead]

you got a probrem?

[jamze132]

I was kind of hoping for Marv to say something like this:

"If we thought Kiper was such a draft guru, we would have offered him a job."

[jamze132]

Kiper can eat a _____! (insert word)

[Michael82]

:lolpoint: Mel Kiper

We all know that they were talking about Mel. They even bashed him on the players he has that were supposed to be in the top of round 1, and fell out of that round. :snicker:

[G. Host]

They were not just bashing Kiper. They were bashing almost the entire ESPN draft broadcasting team. I wonder if team on NFL Network were any better.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

In the old days--which I can still remember--before most teams developed scouting departments and so much emphasis was put on the draft, there was a magazine called "Street & Smith's" that covered college football extensively and, at the end of each year, put out an issue that ranked all of the college players that were eligible to go pro that year. While they didn't have the NFL Combine in those days or all of the video tape that we have today or access to all of the "measureables" that have become so important today, they sent scouts to watch games, they talked with coaches and even got input from the early scouting services (after they began) to use in coming up with their rankings. They were the "draft experts", the Mel Kiper, of their day.

And, believe it or not, there were NFL and AFL teams that actually did use the "Street & Smith's" rankings when they conducted their drafts. And, you will occasionally now hear some of the "Old Timers" around the NFL laugh about how some teams drafted using "Street & Smith's".

Well, there's a reason that that is such a big joke to them today. And, there's a reason that every team in the NFL stopped using "Street & Smith's" magazine as their draft guide and decided to pay millions of dollars over the years, first for the services of BLESTO-V, and, then, to have the NFL Combine. If you ever get a chance to do so, look up which teams used "Street & Smith's" (I believe Denver was one in the early 1960s, but there were others) and take a look at what their records were.

To take nothing away from Mel Kiper or any of the rest or from those of us who follow the draft closely, but how many of us can really tell how fast a CB can turn his hips or if a DT with shorter arms knows how to use his hands well enough to keep blockers off of him at the NFL level? I watch a TON of college games on TV and, having played a couple of different positions in high school and college, I know a little bit about techniques at those positions, and, yes, I can tell when a player is making a lot of plays consistently in the games that I see him play in. But, there's no way that I see a player often enough, close up enough, on tape enough, nor do I know enough about the details of what coaches are looking for and the different techniques needed in every scheme employed in the NFL to know as much as the guys whose jobs are to know this stuff or to make decisions about which player projects to be the best player to fit into a specific team's lockerroom and system. Now, I know enough and there are enough similarities to get an idea, but I don't have 5-10 guys who do this all day, every day, telling me who they think will translate into the best player on the NFL level.

Now, Mel Kiper (and some of the other "draft gurus") has access to more information than I do or than most of us do. But, Mel doesn't have access to as much information as every NFL team has access to--he doesn't. NFL teams spend a lot of money to make sure that they know as much as they possibly can about the players who are available in any year's draft. And, Mel and the others are not in every team's draft room listening to everything that is going into each team's decisions on draft day--that's simply not possible. So, while they may know some things and be able to infer a lot of things about the draft, they don't know everything that goes into the decisions that each team's draft. That's why you so often hear the GMs that are paid to make these decisions deriding Kiper and others when they do not agree with a particular team's selection in a certain round of the draft. Now, those GMs have been wrong at times, but so too has Mel (and the other "draft gurus").

For example: Mel said that he had McCargo going in the third round or later. But, on ESPN Draft Wrap-Up show, Schlereth said that he had McCargo rated as the # 2 DT. In a draft where there were at least 3 teams: Philly, the Bills and the Giants; that needed DTs in this draft, isn't it possible that some of those teams agreed with Schlereth and might be concerned that, if they waited until the third round to take McCargo, he would be long gone? If the NY Giants had a chance to take him at # 32 to replace K.Clancy instead of taking Kiwi to sit behind two Pro Bowl DEs, don't you think that they would have done so and left the Bills out in the cold? So, then, how much of a reach was McCargo for the Bills? And, how wrong was Mel about where he should go in the draft? And, Mel has made other mistakes over the years as well--although I can't be bothered trying to chronicle them all and bore you with them.

Now, Mel's good--that's why he's so popular--but he isn't always right. Neither are the GMs around the NFL. But, when they are wrong, they lose their jobs. When Mel is wrong, he keeps his and ESPN doesn't remind people of all of the times he has messed up.

We'll see who is right or wrong about the Bills' draft. But, I think I understand what the Bills did in the draft and why they did it--and it makes sense. Now it's up to the Bills' coaches and the players the Bills selected to prove that it didn't just make sense, but that they were the right players to pick.

[Bulldog]

yeah, taking the advice of experts is horrible idea. The next time you're sick, ask your old college drinking buddies what's wrong instead of going to a doctor.

So if these so called experts are so smart, why is it again that they aren't working in one of the NFL front offices? Just a guess on my part, but I'm pretty sure that Levy and Modrack have a little better handle on the needs of the team as opposed to the goons on ESPN. Just curious, but what is it that makes Kiper or any of the people on ESPN qualified experts in your book?

[OpIv37]

So if these so called experts are so smart, why is it again that they aren't working in one of the NFL front offices? Just a guess on my part, but I'm pretty sure that Levy and Modrack have a little better handle on the needs of the team as opposed to the goons on ESPN. Just curious, but what is it that makes Kiper or any of the people on ESPN qualified experts in your book?

there are only 32 NFL teams, so what you're basically saying is there are only 32 people in the country qualified to evaluate NFL talent and they're already hired by NFL teams.

I don't buy it.

And btw I never said anything about Kiper- I don't know why people keep bringing him up. There are plenty of people other than Kiper who disagreed with the Bills' decisions.

[eyedog]

Good post Lifetime.
With all the money, time, and effort put into the draft by NFL teams it's amazing a guy like Donahoe can draft worse than many on this board.

[G. Host]

So if these so called experts are so smart, why is it again that they aren't working in one of the NFL front offices?
Those on top in media make more money and work less hours than those not at the top of NFL offices. Millen of Detroit probably got a pay raise but he wasn't at the very top and he took the top job and very few teams will give such a media person a GM job. Jaws would be the only one I think a team would consider.

[Bulldog]

Those on top in media make more money and work less hours than those not at the top of NFL offices. Millen of Detroit probably got a pay raise but he wasn't at the very top and he took the top job and very few teams will give such a media person a GM job. Jaws would be the only one I think a team would consider.

OK. I see the light now. The talking heads in the media know more about Buffalo and who they should have taken than Levy and Modrak do. The so called "draft experts" are wrong more often than not but don't get criticized to the degree that GM's do because its all just talk. When a GM screws up, everyone knows it. Suddenly the media that praised the GM for that very same pick three years prior, turns their back and begins to wonder how a team could have been so wrong about a particular player. If I had a dollar for every time the "draft experts" missed on a supposed can't miss prospect, I would retire today.

[justasportsfan]

yeah, taking the advice of experts is horrible idea. The next time you're sick, ask your old college drinking buddies what's wrong instead of going to a doctor. In this case , who's the doctor? Kiper ? Mort ?


Sorry, I'll take Marv and Modraks opinion over those quacks doctors. At least Modrak built the eagles, Marv is a HOF coach. What has Kiper and Mort done? Thought so.

Bad analogy Op.

[Captain gameboy]

OK. I see the light now. The so called "draft experts" are wrong more often than not but don't get criticized to the degree that GM's do because its all just talk.

This same media phenomena extends well beyond sports by the way, well into economics, finance, public policy and on and on.

It might be valuable to recognize the lack of accountability, profit/ratings focus and motivation of the media, coincident with its lack of responsibility.

[G. Host]

OK. I see the light now. The talking heads in the media know more about Buffalo and who they should have taken than Levy and Modrak do.

I was not saying the ESPN talking heads know better, just they work less and most would not want a front office job and probably could not handle workload or stress.

[TigerJ]

As much research as media drafniks do on candidates for the draft, most of them are working individually. An individual can't possibly watch as much film, visit as many colleges, attend as many college games as a team of scouts for an NFL team. That doesn't guarantee a GM is going to make the right decision of a draft choice, but it certainly gives him the right to feel like he knows enough that he doesn't have to listen to Mel Kiper, Mark Schereth, Mike Mayock etc. If the Bills continue to be mired in mediocrity, Levy will eventually have to pay the piper for the decisions he makes, but Wilson hired him to make those decisions.

For Levy to make decisions based on what he thinks popular opinion will be or what he reads in the Sporting News Draft Guide is exactly the wrong way to do his job. The GM's job is to build a winner. If he does that, any unpopular decisions he makes along the way will be quickly forgotten. If he doesn't, no amount of popular decisions made along the way will save his job. That seems to be the way TD ran things. At the time, Bledsoe was a hugely popular signing. Following initial shock, McGahee was a bold and popular draft choice. Some of his decisions may have been the right ones, but he let things go in the trenches (except for the unfortunate drafting of Mike Williams) and in the end the big splashes he made on draft day didn't help him.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Good post Lifetime.
With all the money, time, and effort put into the draft by NFL teams it's amazing a guy like Donahoe can draft worse than many on this board.

The interesting thing about Donahoe's drafts is that the moves that he made that the ESPN guys and others liked the most: the draft headed by Mike Williams (which included M.Sullivan), the Bledsoe trade, etc. worked out worse than the ones that they didn't like or thought were dicey: taking McGahee instead of Kelsay, the pick of Crowell, taking Evans so high in the first round, etc.

Given that history, maybe I should be really delight by how much they have panned the Bills draft this year....