Why Vince Young and Matt Leinart Give Me Hope For The Future Bills Quarterback

Most NFL Draft, "experts," do not have good track records.

Seems like the, "consensus," of experts are wrong more than they're right, especially when it comes to QB.

In 2006, Vince Young and Matt Leinart were ranked as the 2 best quarterbacks available in that year's draft.

Young was selected with the 3rd overall pick by the Titans.

Leinart was taken with the 10th overall pick by the Cardinals.

The Denver Broncos then traded up with St. Louis to draft Jay Cutler.

Cutler was predicted to be the third quarterback taken, at least they got that right.

Vince Young and Matt Leinart were two huge NFL first round busts.

Tarvaris Jackson proved to have more talent than both players. He was drafted in the 2nd round with the 64th overall pick in 2006 and he's still in the league as a backup QB with the Seahawks.

Charlie, "Clipboard Jesus," Whitehurst was drafted by the Chargers with the 81st overall pick in the 3rd round and he's still in the league as a backup QB for the Titans.

Jameis Winston and Marcus Mariota are projected to be the first two quarterbacks drafted in 2015.

There's no consensus among the, "experts," as to who will be the third quarterback selected.

I would not be surprised if the third quarterback drafted in 2015 has a better NFL career than the media darlings.

The 2006 NFL Draft was not an anomaly either.

The, "experts," in the media and team scouts get it wrong again, again, again, again, and again.

In 2007, Jamarcus Russell and Brady Quinn were the first two quarterbacks off the board in the 1st round.

Kevin Kolb and Trent Edwards had better careers.

In 2008, Matt Ryan was drafted ahead of Joe Flacco with the 3rd overall pick.

Flacco has a ring, Matt Ryan doesn't.

In 2011, Cam Newton, Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert, and Christian Ponder were all off the board before Andy Dalton, and Colin Kaepernick.

Dalton and Kaepernick have had more success.

In 2012, RGIII, Ryan Tannehill, Brandon Weeden, and Brock Osweiler were drafted before Russell Wilson.

12 picks after Wilson, the Eagles chose Nick Foles.

In 2014, Blake Bortles and Johnny Manziel were drafted ahead of Teddy Bridgewater, Derek Carr, and Zach Mettenberger.

I feel at least a little bit better now.

QBs are and have always been a HUGE gamble no matter who it is.

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Originally Posted by Luisito23

QBs are and have always been a HUGE gamble no matter who it is.

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Are they? or are teams just putting more value in the QB stock then any other position on the field? I've always stated that the first word in the phrase "franchise QB" is franchise. In other words build the rest of the team around him and honestly any QB has a chance to be a franchise guy. Right now as it sits I think the Bills lack a legitimate starting QB, TE, co-starting RB and improved offensive line to be thought as a playoff team assuming our defense can maintain the level we saw it play last year. To me I go heavy on all the other positions outside of QB why? As the better the team the less burden you put on a QB which means you can guy with having just a guy there. I mean the last time we made the playoffs was 1999 and our QB stat line for that season was 290/513 3293 yards 21 TDs 16 INTs. Hardly earth shattering numbers. As outside of QB play what killed the Bills last season was red zone offense and the inability to sustain a consistent running game. BillsImpossible brings up some valid points but the point is so much that the QBs drafted earlier failed but to me that the team around the team failed. I mean right now if you want to compare the Panthers roster versus the Bengals roster, without looking at the QBs which is the better team on paper? To me it's easily the Bengals and that's why they've been a consistent playoff contender the last few years not that Dalton's playing that much better as a QB than Newton.

I really like the, "Surround EJ With The Most Talent," theory but I think Rex Ryan's days with the Jets proved that idea to be wrong.

Sanchez had a stellar offensive line, a great running back, good wide receivers and tight ends to work with in 2009 and 2010.

The Jets got burnt because Sanchez wasn't good enough no matter how much talent surrounded him.

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Originally Posted by BillsImpossible

Most NFL Draft, "experts," do not have good track records.

Seems like the, "consensus," of experts are wrong more than they're right, especially when it comes to QB.

In 2006, Vince Young and Matt Leinart were ranked as the 2 best quarterbacks available in that year's draft.

Young was selected with the 3rd overall pick by the Titans.

Leinart was taken with the 10th overall pick by the Cardinals.

The Denver Broncos then traded up with St. Louis to draft Jay Cutler.

Cutler was predicted to be the third quarterback taken, at least they got that right.

Vince Young and Matt Leinart were two huge NFL first round busts.

Tarvaris Jackson proved to have more talent than both players. He was drafted in the 2nd round with the 64th overall pick in 2006 and he's still in the league as a backup QB with the Seahawks.

Charlie, "Clipboard Jesus," Whitehurst was drafted by the Chargers with the 81st overall pick in the 3rd round and he's still in the league as a backup QB for the Titans.

Jameis Winston and Marcus Mariota are projected to be the first two quarterbacks drafted in 2015.

There's no consensus among the, "experts," as to who will be the third quarterback selected.

I would not be surprised if the third quarterback drafted in 2015 has a better NFL career than the media darlings.

The 2006 NFL Draft was not an anomaly either.

The, "experts," in the media and team scouts get it wrong again, again, again, again, and again.

In 2007, Jamarcus Russell and Brady Quinn were the first two quarterbacks off the board in the 1st round.

Kevin Kolb and Trent Edwards had better careers.

In 2008, Matt Ryan was drafted ahead of Joe Flacco with the 3rd overall pick.

Flacco has a ring, Matt Ryan doesn't.

In 2011, Cam Newton, Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert, and Christian Ponder were all off the board before Andy Dalton, and Colin Kaepernick.

Dalton and Kaepernick have had more success.

In 2012, RGIII, Ryan Tannehill, Brandon Weeden, and Brock Osweiler were drafted before Russell Wilson.

12 picks after Wilson, the Eagles chose Nick Foles.

In 2014, Blake Bortles and Johnny Manziel were drafted ahead of Teddy Bridgewater, Derek Carr, and Zach Mettenberger.

I feel at least a little bit better now.

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I read your posts; they are generally a worthwhile read. I agree with your posits, I disagree - whatever.

But please...we would all feel at least a bit better now if you would stop the double spacing when you post. Causing a reader to scroll through what may or may not be the start of a paragraph only to find a one-liner isn't conducive to reading continuity.

Style matters. If one desires to communicate. Which you do.

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Originally Posted by stuckincincy

I read your posts; they are generally a worthwhile read.I agree, I disagree - whatever.

But please...we would all feel at least a bit better now if you would stop the double spacing when you post. Causing a reader to scroll through what may or may not be the start of a paragraph only to find a one-liner isn't conducive to reading continuity.

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Lumping the whole post in to one single paragraph isn't fun to read.

Each sentence is an individual line of thought.

Thanks for the constructive criticism though.

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Originally Posted by BillsImpossible

Lumping the whole post in to one single paragraph isn't fun to read.

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Learning how to compose a statement, learning how to separate thoughts, in coherent fashion, how to draw it all together, is the essence of good communication. Lumping everything into one single paragraph was not mentioned or advocated.

As an aside, that lumping as you say was used chronically in the 17th and 18 century - if you read literature of that period, be prepared for a slog. A head-in-the-hands slog.

As I said, I read your topics. What I want you to do is improve your style. Condense 6 or more lines into one paragraph - the comma, ellipses, dash, semi-colon are useful punctuations. Punctuations are powerful things - they add a dash of the spoken word to the written. They pre-dated emoticons by millenia.

Do not be angry with me...I offer you insight into better ways to communicate.

I agree QBs are over-rated, but you need one that is at least a couple steps above flat-out suck.

This is some of the stupidest **** I've ever read. I'm sure the Bills FO would eat it right up

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Originally Posted by The Jokeman

Are they? or are teams just putting more value in the QB stock then any other position on the field? I've always stated that the first word in the phrase "franchise QB" is franchise. In other words build the rest of the team around him and honestly any QB has a chance to be a franchise guy. Right now as it sits I think the Bills lack a legitimate starting QB, TE, co-starting RB and improved offensive line to be thought as a playoff team assuming our defense can maintain the level we saw it play last year. To me I go heavy on all the other positions outside of QB why? As the better the team the less burden you put on a QB which means you can guy with having just a guy there. I mean the last time we made the playoffs was 1999 and our QB stat line for that season was 290/513 3293 yards 21 TDs 16 INTs. Hardly earth shattering numbers. As outside of QB play what killed the Bills last season was red zone offense and the inability to sustain a consistent running game. BillsImpossible brings up some valid points but the point is so much that the QBs drafted earlier failed but to me that the team around the team failed. I mean right now if you want to compare the Panthers roster versus the Bengals roster, without looking at the QBs which is the better team on paper? To me it's easily the Bengals and that's why they've been a consistent playoff contender the last few years not that Dalton's playing that much better as a QB than Newton.

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yeah... well...I'm still waiting for this idea that a great defense gets the Bills anywhere.

Sorry, but that hasn't come close to working for the Bills. Even when they've had a very good D, they don't even make the playoffs, much less a SB.

2003 2nd ranked D
2004 2nd ranked D
2009 2nd ranked passing D
2013 10th ranked D
2014 4th ranked D

Playoff appearances...0

And all of these teams had pretty good RB's on their teams.

Henry
McGahee
Lynch/Jackson
Jackson/Spiller

0 for the playoffs.

But its not like they've put much effort into the position.

a whopping 3 draft picks in the past 10 years. They've drafted 19, count 'em 19 DB's in the same time frame.

If the Bills are hoping for a middle to late round gem to pop up...they might want to start actually using draft picks for the position.

All the OP shows is the obvious, finding your QB isn't easy, most aren't going to make it.

That is all the more reason to intensify efforts on your search.

You just can't draft one guy every 3-4 years.

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Originally Posted by cookie G

yeah... well...I'm still waiting for this idea that a great defense gets the Bills anywhere.

Sorry, but that hasn't come close to working for the Bills. Even when they've had a very good D, they don't even make the playoffs, much less a SB.

2003 2nd ranked D
2004 2nd ranked D
2009 2nd ranked passing D
2013 10th ranked D
2014 4th ranked D

Playoff appearances...0

And all of these teams had pretty good RB's on their teams.

Henry
McGahee
Lynch/Jackson
Jackson/Spiller

0 for the playoffs.

But its not like they've put much effort into the position.

a whopping 3 draft picks in the past 10 years. They've drafted 19, count 'em 19 DB's in the same time frame.

If the Bills are hoping for a middle to late round gem to pop up...they might want to start actually using draft picks for the position.

All the OP shows is the obvious, finding your QB isn't easy, most aren't going to make it.

That is all the more reason to intensify efforts on your search.

You just can't draft one guy every 3-4 years.

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Oh I agree we've dropped the book by not drafting QBs more. As I'm all for taking a QB prospect every draft as it worked for the Packers in the early 90s when ended up with Favre, Brunell, Hasselbeck, Aaron Brooks and even ended up with Kurt Warner in camp at one time. Yet one thing you may want to remember is that at least 4 DBs will likely be on the field in anyone given play in comparison only 1 QB can be. Hence the need for DB could be debated is higher based on the law of numbers. Also for what it's worth throughout the history of this organization it could be stated that Joe Ferguson was the only QB we've ever developed into a starter.

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Originally Posted by The Jokeman

Oh I agree we've dropped the book by not drafting QBs more. As I'm all for taking a QB prospect every draft as it worked for the Packers in the early 90s when ended up with Favre, Brunell, Hasselbeck, Aaron Brooks and even ended up with Kurt Warner in camp at one time. Yet one thing you may want to remember is that at least 4 DBs will likely be on the field in anyone given play in comparison only 1 QB can be. Hence the need for DB could be debated is higher based on the law of numbers. Also for what it's worth throughout the history of this organization it could be stated that Joe Ferguson was the only QB we've ever developed into a starter.

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I dare anyone to come up with a better camp group of QBs than the year they had Brett Favre, Kurt Warner, Mark Brunell & Ty Detmer-2 HOFers (Warner will make it in a year or 2 & should be in already) a Pro Bowler & a Heisman winner who was a decent backup.

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Originally Posted by BillsImpossible

I really like the, "Surround EJ With The Most Talent," theory but I think Rex Ryan's days with the Jets proved that idea to be wrong.

Sanchez had a stellar offensive line, a great running back, good wide receivers and tight ends to work with in 2009 and 2010.

The Jets got burnt because Sanchez wasn't good enough no matter how much talent surrounded him.

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The first two years Sanchez was in the NFL, he was surrounded by talent & the Jets made it all the way to the AFC Championship game.

Year three for Sanchez, the Jets started losing the talent on that team & every year after that the talent diminished further on the Jets.

This Bills defense has so much talent that unless catastrophic injuries happen I think the Bills make the playoffs no matter who is the QB.

vince young in debtors prison yet?

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Originally Posted by BillsImpossible

Lumping the whole post in to one single paragraph isn't fun to read.

Each sentence is an individual line of thought.

Thanks for the constructive criticism though.

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I like the double spacing

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mouldsie

This is some of the stupidest **** I've ever read. I'm sure the Bills FO would eat it right up

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How can you disagree with the facts?

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Originally Posted by The Jokeman

Oh I agree we've dropped the book by not drafting QBs more. As I'm all for taking a QB prospect every draft as it worked for the Packers in the early 90s when ended up with Favre, Brunell, Hasselbeck, Aaron Brooks and even ended up with Kurt Warner in camp at one time.

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I wasn't even thinking of Green Bay, but they are an example of a team that a) understands the importance of the position and b) has an eye for QB talent.

They had a HOF QB but still drafted Rodgers;
They had Rodgers but still used a 2nd on Brian Brohm; (and it proves that even they aren't always right.)

I was really thinking more of a team like Seattle. They spent a 2nd in a trade for Charlie Whitehurst, they spent money on bringing in Tavaris Jackson, they spent money on bringing in Matt Flynn, and they still used a 3rd on Russell Wilson.

They kept going until they found the right guy.

We've had a history of saying, "we need to give the guy 3 years to see what he can do".

I don't have a problem with giving a guy development time, but there better be a plan B in place.

Donahoe might have made some bad decisions, but I at least give him credit for trying.

Jauron thought it was good for a QB to throw 8 TDs in a season.
Buddy...did nothing. God he was worthless when it came to the offense.

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Originally Posted by The Jokeman

Yet one thing you may want to remember is that at least 4 DBs will likely be on the field in anyone given play in comparison only 1 QB can be. Hence the need for DB could be debated is higher based on the law of numbers. Also for what it's worth throughout the history of this organization it could be stated that Joe Ferguson was the only QB we've ever developed into a starter.

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As a friend of mine is fond of saying, "when you don't have a QB, it automatically becomes the No. 1 need".

We haven't had one. And there isnt' a DB in the game that matches the importance of a good QB.

We just had 2 regimes whose priorities were out of whack.

Just a sense, but Whaley seems a little different.

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Originally Posted by Albany,n.y.

I dare anyone to come up with a better camp group of QBs than the year they had Brett Favre, Kurt Warner, Mark Brunell & Ty Detmer-2 HOFers (Warner will make it in a year or 2 & should be in already) a Pro Bowler & a Heisman winner who was a decent backup.

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San Fran at one point had Montana, Young and Bono I believe, which is not too shabby.

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Originally Posted by BillsImpossible

In 2011, Cam Newton, Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert, and Christian Ponder were all off the board before Andy Dalton, and Colin Kaepernick.

Dalton and Kaepernick have had more success.

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To be fair, Cam Newton has had some pretty solid stats as a starter and made the playoffs twice (albeit in a ****ty division). He's an incredible athlete.

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Originally Posted by Buckets

How can you disagree with the facts?

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Because they are cherry picked "facts". I think the lead post here is nonsense.