The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

[Mike]

What will happen is what has been happening for the past 10years. In the beginning for the 2000's we went with a Great Defense mind, and he really was great at defense. Our defense improved to #2 overall and we almost made the playoffs, but what was missing? Offence, so we fired our coach (who btw just won a SB ring for helping improve Saints Defense) and hired an offensive coach who was run oriented (Mularkey). That did not work, so we fired him and hired a Defensive Cover 2 Coach who focused more on Passing in Jouron. And after a few more years, we fired him and hired a an Offense Run first coach. Its like a see saw, it keeps going back and forth, without solving any of the original issues, like Talent evaluation, scouting, and getting the right people drafted and signed as FA.

The Bottom line is that the Bills do not have the personal to have a good offence or a good defense this year. Simply that is what is missing, and above all else we needed a great talent evaluator who could put the pieces together. A guy like Parcels, or Shanny, or Cowart, etc.... and we simply did not get that type of guy in here!

So, Gaily and his offense and his skill are irrelevant because at the end of the day your can't make a chicken sandwich without chicken, but you can always make a turd sandwich with whatever is lying around.

[trapezeus]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

the thing is we got people who were so afraid of losing their jobs, they pulled in lesser coaches, which in jauron's case was actually kind of impressive that he could find NFL coaches worse than himself.

If gailey has a good relationship with nix and feels like he's not going to lose his job because the DC is doing a great job, he might actually try and fill that spot with a qualified person.

The only way to break the habit is to have capable people. that's what has been missing. i get what you are saying. we address an immediate concern and another problem takes shape.

[Mike]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

We are Not Solving the Root Problem
Instead we are hacking away at the Symptoms

The Root Problems are Obvious as is their solution: Get a Top GM Talent Evaluator and Top Coaches who can teach!

The Symptoms: The offensive line is poor, QB sucks, we need a new one, Coaches Run the Ball to much, Coaches Pass the Ball too much, our defense sucks, our pass rush is no good, etc....

Instead of solving the real issue, we are trying to put a band aid on the problem, so our offense or defence may get a little better because of a coach change, but then another symptom arrises. In the very early 2000s our CB were getting Torched, our secondary sucked, Now our Secondary is one of the Best in the league but the 2ooo team and this team equally suck.

[justasportsfan]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

So, Gaily and his offense and his skill are irrelevant because at the end of the day your can't make a chicken sandwich without chicken, but you can always make a turd sandwich with whatever is lying around.

Kordell, Tomzack, Fiedler , Thigpen disagrees with you.

[Mr. Pink]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

Mularkey wasn't fired. He quit.

[trapezeus]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

i think they have at least tried to address that this time. they changed the GM to a guy who's been around football and buildin gdecent teams for a long time. Nix is the solution they've picked. he isn't glamorous like cowher, but he isn't as awful as GM by committee.

Gailey may be the teacher they are looking for. he seems to get stuff out of his players. however, you are right. This year is a bandage year. Some pieces have to get installed to be built on. RB, and defensive line.

next year is going to be a QB, WR, OL, LB.

while its been a painful 10 years, you can't just poo poo the change without seeing what the change is. i know we've been conditioned to expect the worse, but this is the first time in 10 years that they gave the football guys the reigns and got out of their way.

[Jan Reimers]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

The Root Problems are Obvious as is their solution: Get a Top GM Talent Evaluator and Top Coaches who can teach!

Nix is universally regarded as a fine talent evaluator, and Gailey as a very good teacher.

Why not give them a chance before saying nothing ever changes.

[Mr. Pink]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

Nix is universally regarded as a fine talent evaluator, and Gailey as a very good teacher.

Why not give them a chance before saying nothing ever changes.

Because some people are snake bitten when we've received guys who allegedly knew how to get it done in the past.

We had Donahoe. Still have Modrak. Two guys who were allegedly great talent evaluators.

We had coaches who were good teachers and "knew" how to get it done. Mularkey, Gilbride, Greggie. Who did nothing here but have been successful in other stops in the NFL.

It's OK for people to be a little apprehensive about the hire.

[better days]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

Because some people are snake bitten when we've received guys who allegedly knew how to get it done in the past.

We had Donahoe. Still have Modrak. Two guys who were allegedly great talent evaluators.

We had coaches who were good teachers and "knew" how to get it done. Mularkey, Gilbride, Greggie. Who did nothing here but have been successful in other stops in the NFL.

It's OK for people to be a little apprehensive about the hire.

Donahoe was not bad at getting players for the team. I would take any QB under him over what is on the roster today. His problem was he could not hire a decent HC.

[madness]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

Donahoe's and Modrak's track record speak for themselves as talent evaluators and were successful everywhere but here for obvious reasons. Donahoe's problem was that he couldn't make a sound management decision if he tried which the Bills should have known when the giant red flag went up after him and Cowher couldn't co-exist.

Modrak was successful in Pittsburgh and Philly but really had no say in the FO until recently and it's been documented a few times he wanted guys that the Bills passed on.

Add to the picture Nix who's been largely credited for the Chargers drafts and a young Whaley who's name has been a hot name for the for the past few years, you can say nothing has changed all you want but the FO has been put in a position to succeed for the first time in a decade. They still have to prove they can turn the franchise around and obviously won't get the benefit of the doubt but they at least deserve the chance.

Little known fact: Whaley is known for his great scouting ability of 3-4 defenders... when he's not fwd'ing porn emails.

[mayotm]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

Because some people are snake bitten when we've received guys who allegedly knew how to get it done in the past.

We had Donahoe. Still have Modrak. Two guys who were allegedly great talent evaluators.

We had coaches who were good teachers and "knew" how to get it done. Mularkey, Gilbride, Greggie. Who did nothing here but have been successful in other stops in the NFL.

It's OK for people to be a little apprehensive about the hire.

It's also OK for people to support the hires.

[psubills62]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

So I have to ask...what about this thread qualifies it for the "light bulb" symbol on the main page?

I am also wondering quite a bit about classifying Jauron as a "coach who focused more on passing." Maybe we should look at the stats:

2006: 431 passing attempts (31st in the league), 420 rushing attempts (27th in the league)
2007: 445 passing attempts (30th in the league), 448 rushing attempts (15th in the league)
2008: 479 passing attempts (22nd in the league), 439 rushing attempts (14th in the league)
2009: 441 passing attempts (30th in the league), 424 rushing attempts (16th in the league)

So granted, we did technically pass more than we ran in 3 out of 4 years. But compared to the rest of the league, we were more of a running team than passing every single year. And when you take into consideration that we've been a losing team every year, those passing stats are probably somewhat inflated by being behind in a higher number of games late. Thus, I definitely wouldn't call Jauron a coach focused on passing. I wouldn't say he focused on offense at any point, actually.

I personally don't see more of the same, and that's just in one draft. I see the FO getting playmakers - guys that we haven't had in how many years? When was the last time we really had a guy who could go the distance at any time? And I don't mean Parrish on punt returns. They also clearly focused on getting defensive players who are already good against the run, but have upside against the pass. Troup, Batten, Carrington, Moats, they are all known for being very good against the run.

I see a team moving to a defensive scheme that is inherently vulnerable against the run. However, the FO appears to be counteracting that by getting players who are good fits for the defense and are good against the run.

On Sunday, April 25th, I saw more of a direction for this franchise than I've seen in the last 4 years under Jauron. Will they be good this year? Probably not. But I don't see how you can say these guys are poor talent evaluators when their main draftees haven't even played a game.

It seems to me that this "light bulb" thread has been born out of a need for a big name in the front office or on the sidelines. That's all you seem to want.

[trapezeus]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

donahoe's teams lacked a good coach to harness a top 5 defense. the coaches were his fault because he felt he lost his job due to cowher. so he wanted an easy coach to push around. Williams wasn't that bad of a pick (if hte team was younger and didn't know better). but he put him on a fairly old team that tuned him out immediately.

Mularkey was a bad pick and was another move by donahoe to get a puppet who didnt' disrupt the master.

jauron was straight up nepotism of old guy recommending an old guy to the oldest guy. and there was no one in the organization with a half a brain that could stop it.

of the last 10 years, i only truly find the last 4 to be incredibly maddening. in 2001-2005, it was just a streak of bad choices and bad luck that did us in.

the last 4 years, we had no talent, no coach, and no gm.

[JCBills]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

What will happen is what has been happening for the past 10years. In the beginning for the 2000's we went with a Great Defense mind, and he really was great at defense. Our defense improved to #2 overall and we almost made the playoffs, but what was missing? Offence, so we fired our coach (who btw just won a SB ring for helping improve Saints Defense) and hired an offensive coach who was run oriented (Mularkey). That did not work, so we fired him and hired a Defensive Cover 2 Coach who focused more on Passing in Jouron. And after a few more years, we fired him and hired a an Offense Run first coach. Its like a see saw, it keeps going back and forth, without solving any of the original issues, like Talent evaluation, scouting, and getting the right people drafted and signed as FA.

The Bottom line is that the Bills do not have the personal to have a good offence or a good defense this year. Simply that is what is missing, and above all else we needed a great talent evaluator who could put the pieces together. A guy like Parcels, or Shanny, or Cowart, etc.... and we simply did not get that type of guy in here!

So, Gaily and his offense and his skill are irrelevant because at the end of the day your can't make a chicken sandwich without chicken, but you can always make a turd sandwich with whatever is lying around.

Isn't half of that why we signed Nix as our national scout last year, and all of that why he's running the show now?

[Oldbillsfan]

Re: The Bills Pattern...and solving their Core Issue

I like everything the good ole boys have done said and done so far. I'm optimistic.