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Thread: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

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    Retired (mostly) MidnightVoice's Avatar
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    Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Salman Rushdie and John le Carré have been fighting for years, and have just "made up". The fight had its roots in Le Carré's criticism of The Satanic Verses: "My position was that there is no law in life or nature that says great religions may be insulted with impunity," said Le Carré.

    But is there any natural law that says they cannot be insulted? Why has the UN condemned "defamation of religion." ?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamat...United_Nations

    What is so special about religion that we cannot condemn it for its idiocies?
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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightVoice View Post
    Why has the UN condemned "defamation of religion." ?
    There is a subtle shift in the UN resolution now that it protects believers, not beliefs. To be clear, the resolution is toothless.
    Carpenter's history. He just doesn't know it yet.

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    Registered User Gibby's Avatar
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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Can we make fun of athiests?

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    Registered User jimmifli's Avatar
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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gibby View Post
    Can we make fun of athiests?
    Ahhh, the persecuted majority.

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightVoice View Post
    Salman Rushdie and John le Carré have been fighting for years, and have just "made up". The fight had its roots in Le Carré's criticism of The Satanic Verses: "My position was that there is no law in life or nature that says great religions may be insulted with impunity," said Le Carré.

    But is there any natural law that says they cannot be insulted? Why has the UN condemned "defamation of religion." ?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamat...United_Nations

    What is so special about religion that we cannot condemn it for its idiocies?
    I wasn't aware of this spat so I can't say for sure, but it reads to me like Le Carre was talking about the incident in realpolitick terms. In other words, if you kick someone with the ability and will to kick back, no matter how much they deserve it, you can't be surprised if they hit back.

    Notice how he used the word "insulted" which isn't the same thing as condemn.
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    One Bills Drive, Georgia - 871 miles south of Orchard Park gebobs's Avatar
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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gibby View Post
    Can we make fun of athiests?
    If you promise to try and spell it right, I have no problem. But it better be original. Theists have been taking potshots at us for years. They are typically unimaginative or downright stupid: "no atheists in foxholes", the Pascal wager, "atheism is a faith", "Hitler was an atheist", etc. etc.

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by gebobs View Post
    If you promise to try and spell it right, I have no problem. But it better be original. Theists have been taking potshots at us for years. They are typically unimaginative or downright stupid: "no atheists in foxholes", the Pascal wager, "atheism is a faith", "Hitler was an atheist", etc. etc.
    "So Hitler and Pascal walk into a foxhole..."

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
    I wasn't aware of this spat so I can't say for sure, but it reads to me like Le Carre was talking about the incident in realpolitick terms. In other words, if you kick someone with the ability and will to kick back, no matter how much they deserve it, you can't be surprised if they hit back.

    Notice how he used the word "insulted" which isn't the same thing as condemn.
    Insulting Islam was what Rushdie was condemned to death for by the Mullahs. My question is, why is religion so special that it cannot be insulted? Why do blasphemy laws exist? And should they? Why should someone be condemned for insulting something as transient as a religion?

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightVoice View Post
    Insulting Islam was what Rushdie was condemned to death for by the Mullahs. My question is, why is religion so special that it cannot be insulted? Why do blasphemy laws exist? And should they? Why should someone be condemned for insulting something as transient as a religion?
    No ideas should be above criticism.

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gibby View Post
    Can we make fun of athiests?
    Only while we're alight.

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by gebobs View Post
    No ideas should be above criticism.
    Agreed. But people make laws about insulting religions

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightVoice View Post
    Insulting Islam was what Rushdie was condemned to death for by the Mullahs. My question is, why is religion so special that it cannot be insulted? Why do blasphemy laws exist? And should they? Why should someone be condemned for insulting something as transient as a religion?
    Religion CAN be insulted.

    And mullahs CAN issue fatwas.

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightVoice View Post
    Agreed. But people make laws about insulting religions
    No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    If it's any consolation MV, apparently churches aren't eligible for any FEMA assistance.
    There's battle lines being drawn...Nobody's right if everybody's wrong
    We better stop...Hey, what's that sound? Everybody look - what's going down?

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightVoice View Post
    Agreed. But people make laws about insulting religions
    Not in democracies.

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
    Religion CAN be insulted.

    And mullahs CAN issue fatwas.
    But not so good when the fatwas call for violence.

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    I think that religious jokes are on par with race of gay jokes. They are tasteless but there shouldn't be a law against them...

    ...

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    I think that religious jokes are on par with race of gay jokes. They are tasteless but there shouldn't be a law against them...
    How are they on par? You CHOOSE to be whatever religion you are. If that religion says you get your own planet when you die then you'd better believe I'm giving you **** for that.

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightVoice View Post
    Insulting Islam was what Rushdie was condemned to death for by the Mullahs. My question is, why is religion so special that it cannot be insulted? Why do blasphemy laws exist? And should they? Why should someone be condemned for insulting something as transient as a religion?
    here's the problem: believers in their religion truly believe that their religion is the word of God. It is holy, sacred, and infallible, so if you insult it, you are insulting God himself. That's why blasphemy laws exist.

    The reality, though, is that religion is an instrument of control. Believers are obedient, and the people who control the religion (or the governments in the case of Muslim theocracy) benefit greatly from obedience. So, anything that casts even an iota of doubt on their religion or makes the devout even stop to think about their beliefs for a minute becomes a threat to those in power. The attempt to limit insults or even legitimate debate/criticism simply shows the weakness of their position and the way they are attempting to use religion as a control mechanism.

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    Re: Should Religions be insulted with impunity?

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
    Religion CAN be insulted.

    And mullahs CAN issue fatwas.
    You mean it's not a conspiracy?

    Some Muslims are in fact lunatics like every other major religion???

    This is a major breakthrough for you!

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