Vanek right back to his old self

[OpIv37]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

I think this endless Vanek bashing is weakest this season, he's the only real performer out there making things happen at his position. He's near the top for total points thus far as well, so he's playing up to his contract. Thinking any different is personal hate or jealousy, which is becoming more obvious everyday. When Vanek helped us beat Tampa, first posts mentioned about how he failed to perform during his previous games. He either helps us win or he doesn't & looking at the scoresheets, if he doesn't play we don't win.

I'd turn the spotlight away from league leading performing players to people like Stafford / Ville who are sucking up our resources with very little in return, those arguments I can see being justified.

Personal hate? Jealousy? Please.

On one hand you complain about the team doing bad, and on the other hand, you defend one of the reasons why the team is doing bad. Comparing Vanek to the other heaps of **** on this team is useless. He needs to be compared to the other top players in the league, and long term he never cuts it.

[OpIv37]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

It comes down to this: Vanek has some talent but he's not good enough to build a team around.

Unfortunately, this is the ****ty situation that our FO has created for us. Either Vanek plays like a top 3 player in the league every night, or the Sabres lose. So, I'm going to hold him to that standard. He has shown he can do it in bursts. He has not shown that he can do it consistently, and until he does, the criticism will come.

You can argue all day about whether that's fair or realistic, but it's irrelevant because its the reality under which we are forced to live.

[gebobs]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

So on one hand you say prior performance is no guarantee of future results, but then you go on to justify spending millions of dollars on something with no guarantee of results.

Is there an alternative?

I stand by my statement. Paying market price can still be a mistake.

That's the gamble anyone takes any time they pay for anything. The greater the cost, the more the risk.

[gebobs]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

No, he doesn't carry the team on his shoulders night after night. 4 points in 8 games and no points in 6 of the last 8.

Now you're just playing semantics. If you read the entire context of my post, you would see that I mention just what you said above. The fact that he falters under the onus of carrying the team's fortunes on his back every night does not mean that burden goes away.

In the Sabres 7 wins this year, he only failed to point in one game and had 2+ in five of them. If Vanek doesn't get on the scoresheet, the team loses almost invariably: 1-7.

[gebobs]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

It comes down to this: Vanek has some talent but he's not good enough to build a team around.

Sure he is. But how are you going to know until you try? :-)

It can't be up to Vanek to get wins every night. Some of these other schmucks need to step up.

[OpIv37]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

Now you're just playing semantics. If you read the entire context of my post, you would see that I mention just what you said above. The fact that he falters under the onus of carrying the team's fortunes on his back every night does not mean that burden goes away.

In the Sabres 7 wins this year, he only failed to point in one game and had 2+ in five of them. If Vanek doesn't get on the scoresheet, the team loses almost invariably: 1-7.

Now we are getting somewhere.

This is exactly why I'm so hard on him. If he's not a top 3 player in the league every night, we lose. That expectation may be unfair, but in reality it's the only way the team wins.

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Sure he is. But how are you going to know until you try? :-)

It can't be up to Vanek to get wins every night. Some of these other schmucks need to step up.

But we both know they won't.

[gebobs]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

This is exactly why I'm so hard on him. If he's not a top 3 player in the league every night, we lose. That expectation may be unfair, but in reality it's the only way the team wins.

So let me get this straight. You go to a restaurant and order a hamburger and a nice Sonoma cabernet. Afterward, you complain to the maitre d' that the wine was not Chateau Margaux?

[OpIv37]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

So let me get this straight. You go to a restaurant and order a hamburger and a nice Sonoma cabernet. Afterward, you complain to the maitre d' that the wine was not Chateau Margaux?

Not following you here.

There is nothing else to tell you. The FO ****ed up and built a team where Vanek has to be damn near perfect to win. Sometimes he is, often he's very average.

And there is no excuse for some of the stupid mistakes. I don't care if he scores 10 goals in a single game- there is no reason to EVER take an offensive zone penalty. You can't win with your best player doing dumbass ****.

[gebobs]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

Not following you here.

The point is that you are pointing at the best player on the team and blaming him for the team sucking when he has done more than any other player on the team this year. It boggles the mind.

The FO ****ed up and built a team where Vanek has to be damn near perfect to win.

Bad job by the Front Office and I have to agree. What I don't agree with is blaming Vanek and hoisting him on a petard when he isn't perfect. I understand that it's frustrating that we can't depend on anyone other than Vanek to make plays. He can't do it by himself. No player can.

there is no reason to EVER take an offensive zone penalty

Yes, he makes a few mistakes. Even the great Gretzky made them.

[Skooby]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

Sure he is. But how are you going to know until you try? :-)

It can't be up to Vanek to get wins every night. Some of these other schmucks need to step up.

The standards set up for one player is too high, there's 4 other guys out there with him on his side. To me, an assist is as good as a goal because it got a goal.

[Skooby]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

The point is that you are pointing at the best player on the team and blaming him for the team sucking when he has done more than any other player on the team this year. It boggles the mind.

OP has set Vanek's bar at legend status. It's Vanek's fault if the team doesn't perform, not the managements for building a better / deeper team. Do you get it??

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The point is that you are pointing at the best player on the team and blaming him for the team sucking when he has done more than any other player on the team this year. It boggles the mind.

OP has set Vanek's bar at legend status. It's Vanek's fault if the team doesn't perform, not the managements for building a better / deeper team. Do you get it??

[SkateZilla]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

Just Tied Ales Kotalik for Shootout Goals.

[OpIv37]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

OP has set Vanek's bar at legend status. It's Vanek's fault if the team doesn't perform, not the managements for building a better / deeper team. Do you get it??

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OP has set Vanek's bar at legend status. It's Vanek's fault if the team doesn't perform, not the managements for building a better / deeper team. Do you get it??

Yeah, because everyone knows I've been so kind and forgiving of management

I've said multiple times in this thread that management ****ed us to create this situation. But what's done is done. If Vanek's not a legend, we lose. It's management's fault but it's the reality that we are living under.

And for the record, I've always liked Vanek on the shootout. He doesn't do anything fancy- it's just one move and then blast a wrist shot past the goalie. But it works more often than not.

[Crisis]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

Why are we crucifying Vanek?

Stafford is a complete waste, how the hell does this loser wear a letter?

[OpIv37]

Re: Vanek right back to his old self

Why are we crucifying Vanek?

Stafford is a complete waste, how the hell does this loser wear a letter?

Once again, Stafford sucks.

But Stafford's, um, "lack of proficiency" doesn't excuse Vanek's mistakes.

He took another offensive zone penalty tonight.