umm. one person made that thread and he's probably younger than 25, which means he never experienced the 90's Bills defenses.Originally Posted by better days
umm. one person made that thread and he's probably younger than 25, which means he never experienced the 90's Bills defenses.
My faith doesn’t make me perfect, it makes me forgiven.
It all depends if an outside consultant with no bias is brought in to examine everything from top to bottom. If they don't do that, then it's business as usual.
A new owner with no salary cap on the front office could correct things at any time.
I'm still skeptical with Whaley and Brandon trying to defend the Manuel pick and the expensive move on Watkins. It could delay any improvement with the O for another year and beyond but it is what it is.
A great D and this fanbase isn't getting their deserved payoff. I would see things differently if I saw a QB with upside and a O scheme with promise. I see neither and enormous pressure to change cannot be ignored this off-season. The window will close on this exceptional D and ST's play before the O can improve enough to be taken seriously. It isn't without talent but poor QB, OG and play calling contributes to too many bad outcomes.
Tired of embracing organizational mediocrity.
Mace (12-16-2014)
Marrone was on board for the Hughes trade, he personally scouted Robey when he was a coach at Syracuse. Graham, Brown, Spikes, Bryant, Charles were all players brought in under his tenure.
Guys like Gray, Thigpen, Hogan, Rambo & Schmidt were all brought in and have contributed to wins. No one knew who these guys were.
Aaron Williams went from an awful corner to a to-notch safety, all these things happened under Marrone.
He's got a say in personnel decisions and he certainly gets some credit for these guys contributing.
As I mentioned on Offense it needs to be improved no question, but I believe he's got a tight leash on these guys because it's in the best interest of winning games. And I am confident that it will get better with some additions in the offseason.
We could very easily be tampa bay and just throw to Sammy no matter what. He'd have Mike Evans type numbers and we'd likely be 2-12 like them. We don't have a QB so we play to not have our QB lose games for us. It's that simple.
We have one focus in the offseason get better on offense.
I remember that one fateful day when Coach took me aside. I knew what was coming. "You don't have to tell me," I said. "I'm off the team, aren't I?"
"Well," said Coach, "you never were really ON the team. You made that uniform you're wearing out of rags and towels, and your helmet is a toy space helmet.
You show up at practice and then either steal the ball and make us chase you to get it back, or you try to tackle people at inappropriate times."
It was all true what he was saying. And yet, I thought something is brewing inside the head of this Coach.
He sees something in me, some kind of raw talent that he can mold. But that's when I felt the handcuffs go on.
The players bust their ass for him, according to FJax. That's a plus.
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#56 DARRYL TALLEY #29 DERRICK BURROUGHS#22 FRED JACKSON #95 KYLE WILLIAMS
jlgarsh (12-17-2014)
Is it possible Marrone is the next http://www.pro-football-reference.co...es/ParcBi0.htm ?
I find the whole thing problematic. He has to get another year at this point.
I like Marrone, really I do :
-He's a Buffalo kind of guy.
-His team is 8-6.
-He picks good DC's and lets them do their DC thing.
I wonder about Marrone, really I do :
-Bulk of the season he made questionable in game decisions on down/distance.
-For a guy with an OL background, his OL coach stinks, and they bumbled way too much exiling Urbik.
-How could he not notice Jerry Hughes wasn't playing a couple weeks ago ?
-Longer back he made in game decisions based on what he thought the opposing kicker's range was that were way off, I already forget which.
-They never even tried using Mike Williams, who made his bones in the red zone, while having red zone issues.
-His team generally has played with no home field fire (first and last obviously the exceptions).
-His team is not a disciplined team. I think that comes from HC not unit coaching.
-For an offensive minded coach, the game plans have no methodology, every play is like a new game.
I don't like Marrone, really I don't :
-He projects sweaty, queasy impending doom on the sidelines.
-He entered his first year with a brittle vet and a project rookie, and lacked the foresight to hire a QB coach.
-He has made no offensive impact, though an offensive coach, with a presumable control over the young OC he brought with him from college. They tried up tempo west coast fast read/react offense with a project rookie who was used to a spread, worked terrible. So they got rid of up tempo, and hired a bad QB coach, worked terrible. So then given a more capable vet, they stuck with a generic offense meant for the project QB, worked terrible.
Summary :
- He gets another year, they improved enough where he (they) earned a continuity.
- I think Marrone is an average to below average HC, might be a good unit coach or average college coach depending on where. This is a talented team except for obviously at QB, but a really good coach, say...Arizona's Arians, manages to win with QB of the week, by adjusting the offensive expectations, game plan and game management. Marrone is greatly enhanced by having Schwartz and leaving him alone, and greatly debunked by Hackett, O-line performance, and offensive lack of identity, dubious personnel decisions that might be other coaches problems (but why are they, he's HC ?). I don't really think I see anything in Marrone to make me optimistic he'll be a good coach, if nothing so terrible as to be a bad one, so I think we're stuck in middlin' by necessity because you don't want to bumble it into bad and can't be positive it won't somehow work out better.
Last edited by Mace; 12-16-2014 at 06:48 PM.
better days (12-17-2014),Historian (12-17-2014),Night Train (12-17-2014)
People that chime in he was a good OC in Saints must learn it was a title and nothing more much like the one Curtis Modkins had under Chain Gailey. To me Marrone is best suited as a HC and/or offensive line coach in the NFL. As to me a HC is about delegating responsibility which think he's done well with his DCs as stated. At times I question his choices to punt or go for it on 4th down and clock management but wonder if that's being handled by Hackett.
The one knock I have on Marrone is, he played o-line and was a o-line coach but our o-line sucks and has gone backwards since hes been here. One would think he would have a lot of experience in this area.
No
I never said he was a good OC with the Saints, he wasn't an OC with the Saints, so toss that one.
Huge diff between delegating and being oblivious, and two weeks ago he had no clue Hughes wasn't playing.
So assuming he leaves his DC's to do what they want, and knowing he's an offensive coach, what responsibility has he delegated proficiently in the offense ? Choice of QB ? That would be iffy. You can then argue, he's delegated responsibility woefully on the offensive side unless he had nothing to add which is worse. So Doug the delegator, being from the offensive side of the equation, either did nothing or did it badly, since by any account this offense is terrible.
Unless by delegate people mean "let other people do stuff and hope it works, with a better chance of it working the less he touches it, like if it is defense."
It's kind of time to stop pretending he does real well by not doing anything. My Lebanese green grocer could do that too. If anyone is thinking to bring out Marrones strong points, it's probably time to start finding them. Surely he has to do more than "not doing anything" well ?
Non disruptive if not inspiring leadership might be one. Letting his DC's alone is two. What positive stuff is Marrone bringing to the table ?
Like I said in my post, he's not done bad enough for the boot, but what real good signs are there besides that he's not done bad enough for the boot ? There have to be some of them.
In my book he's done well enough to not get fired, and gained some progress in the w/l column. Big diff there from going all in on the Marrone Express. I sure wish he'd do well, like I said, he seems a Buffalo kind of guy. But I'm not real deluded he's an adept manager/delegator. He hasn't done anything besides leave his DC's alone ?
He also is responsible for the horrible Jordan Gay move. And was on board with the horrible Chris Williams acquisition. And is running a horrible o-line on many fronts. The self-proclaimed o-line specialist cannot get two draft picks able to play guard. Glenn has regressed. He has allowed the mis-use of Spiller - which you are about to see again.
Continuity.
The Bills are already guaranteed to have their best record in ten years with two games left to be played.
I think that the people that want Marrone gone for whatever reason had better get used to the idea of him being the coach next year.
Historian (12-17-2014)
I feel bad for anybody that can't see that Doug Marrone is a ****ing awful head coach. The defense has won thus team 6 games. The offense barely does anything to help.
Last edited by BertSquirtgum; 12-17-2014 at 06:56 AM.
Were you being sarcastic about Jordan Gay? To me it's been an under rated move this offseason as he's been exactly what we needed. As he's helping the D being making almost every kickoff drive start from the 20.
Did you miss when he kicked the ball out of bounds a few times against the NFL's better offenses these past couple of weeks? That should NEVER happen, and especially when your only job is to kick the ball off. Gave them field position.
better days (12-17-2014),WagonCircler (12-20-2014)
He was being massively ridiculed here and everywhere last Sunday by lots of folks other than me. Ask them. I'd read through the GDT if I were you.
To be quite honest I forgot about that kick. That said most of the season he's been exactly what we've needed.
i like him because he is uber conservative, a lousy game manager which means 2 wins every season for the pats. i only wish Nix stuck around longer. you guys can do way better
Last edited by chris66; 12-17-2014 at 05:47 PM.
Has any coach landed and been fired from more big jobs than Lane Kiffen? I don't get the obsession with the guy.
I give Whaley credit for player acquisitions, not Marrone.
Whaley gets the players on the team as GM & Marrone decides who plays.
I think Whaley has done a better job of acquiring players than Marrone has of determining who plays.
And don't bring up Thigpen or Rambo. Marrone was forced to play them because of injury.
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