Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

From NE area news:

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/borges-im-told-belichick-never-believed-brady

The Deflategate controversy took an interesting turn on Tuesday when Robert Kraft threw in the towel instead of challenging the NFL like many thought he would.
On Sports Tonight, Michael Felger suggested Kraft did an about-face with his argument because he and coach Bill Belichick were starting to believe that Brady wasn't being completely transparent with what he told them.
That's when Ron Borges threw out an interesting piece of information.
"Belichick never believed his story, from what I was told," said Borges. "Because they all know. Why do you think all those retired quarterbacks, the Troy Aikmans of the world -- Troy Aikman is about as nice a guy as I've ever met in football -- nobody's backed [Brady]. Nobody, not a single guy. Why do you think that is? Because they hate Brady? No. Because they're not stupid. They know nothing's done with those balls that the quarterback doesn't want done."

[Skooby]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

From NE area news:

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/borges-im-told-belichick-never-believed-brady

The Deflategate controversy took an interesting turn on Tuesday when Robert Kraft threw in the towel instead of challenging the NFL like many thought he would.
On Sports Tonight, Michael Felger suggested Kraft did an about-face with his argument because he and coach Bill Belichick were starting to believe that Brady wasn't being completely transparent with what he told them.
That's when Ron Borges threw out an interesting piece of information.
"Belichick never believed his story, from what I was told," said Borges. "Because they all know. Why do you think all those retired quarterbacks, the Troy Aikmans of the world -- Troy Aikman is about as nice a guy as I've ever met in football -- nobody's backed [Brady]. Nobody, not a single guy. Why do you think that is? Because they hate Brady? No. Because they're not stupid. They know nothing's done with those balls that the quarterback doesn't want done."

The football is the QB's finely tuned instrument, who'd go into a game without the ability to control the main object they touch the most out of all the players ??

Brady suggesting he just shows up and throws whatever ball that's out there without concern of the details is a complete joke. Did he really think all the other QB's from the past would just say that we take what we get and don't have a fit ? Give me a break man.

[CommissarSpartacus]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

From NE area news:

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/borges-im-told-belichick-never-believed-brady

The Deflategate controversy took an interesting turn on Tuesday when Robert Kraft threw in the towel instead of challenging the NFL like many thought he would.
On Sports Tonight, Michael Felger suggested Kraft did an about-face with his argument because he and coach Bill Belichick were starting to believe that Brady wasn't being completely transparent with what he told them.
That's when Ron Borges threw out an interesting piece of information.
"Belichick never believed his story, from what I was told," said Borges. "Because they all know. Why do you think all those retired quarterbacks, the Troy Aikmans of the world -- Troy Aikman is about as nice a guy as I've ever met in football -- nobody's backed [Brady]. Nobody, not a single guy. Why do you think that is? Because they hate Brady? No. Because they're not stupid. They know nothing's done with those balls that the quarterback doesn't want done."

"suggested"..."what I was told"...

From what I was told suggests that Felger and Borges are pulling things out of their asses...

[senseofdoom]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

Just because someone is able does not mean they are forced to demonstrate it on demand. Especially if they feel the demonstration they're watching doesn't merit it.



"One of the traits..."



Which rules are you insinuating Belichick broke or stretched, whatever that's supposed to mean? Because as far as I can see, Bill Belichick's integrity is only challenged by the ignorant and partisan.



Very familiar with the action of filling bicycle tires, motorcycle tires, car tires, truck tires, tractor tires and yes, footballs. My comment still stands. Read the article about Eli's footballs and their preparation from 2013. A huge amount of work is done in getting them right, but nada about the pressure of the ball.

Now, we don't know exactly why it wasn't mentioned, but a reasonable supposition was the air inside wasn't crucial to him because he couldn't tell a difference, whereas he could feel a HUGE difference in the texture and elasticity of the COVER.

Sorry, but after watching football for 55 years, this thing about the psi of the ball as a reason for success or failure as a qb is the LAMEST excuse for failure that I've ever seen and anyone going to war over it is a gigantic ****ing pussy.

but that's just me. I'm sure the haters have a different opinion of their reasons for smearing the game they're supposed to care about.

Fair enough but if you choose not to demonstrate you can't expect to be taken seriously.

The others are left to my imagination? I'm to trust that you have some good ones and you're just holding out? Sounds entirely reasonable.

Broke - SpyGate
Stretched - Vague injury reports, Ineligible receiver substitution shenanigans
I'm sure I'm missing more. His reputation proceeds him. Denied only by fanboys and homers.

Another reasonable supposition might be that air pressure variance within the allowable range wasn't enough to tell the difference and therefore wasn't crucial to him. Perhaps he's a man of integrity and never thought to try to test the limits allowed by league mandate.

Regardless, I'm not sure who you're intending to insult with this but I never positioned the deflation as having anything to do with the level of Brady's play. I don't think I've mentioned him at all and frankly, it's immaterial. Cheating is cheating whether it's successful or not.

But since you brought it up I'll throw in my 2 cents.

As with Eli, I'm sure whatever was done to those game balls, cover, inflation or otherwise, was done at Brady's direction. I don't think you'll find anyone, anywhere, on any team that would posit that anyone other than the starting QB has any say in how those game balls are prepared. Over the years he's determined what is most comfortable to him, what he believes will allow him to perform at his highest level and that's how they're being prepared. To that end, the prep links to Brady's performance.

Do I think that accounts for his career and that he wouldn't be a top 5 QB all time without it? No.

I liken it to Barry Bonds. He was an all time great before the steroids. He didn't need them. It casts a dark cloud over some of his accomplishments and it makes me think less of him as a man but it doesn't define his career. At least not to me.

[mightysimi]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

As much as I hate Tom Brady, the ball had little to no impact on the game in question. Look at the second half vs the Colts and the Superbowl probably had the most scrutinized balls in the history of football and he played outstanding.

I don't know how anyone can defend what happened but at the end of the day, it didn't affect the outcome of the games. He was at least generally aware of the balls being tampered with after the refs had seen them and to me that merits the suspension. I think that is where it should stay though.

Believing a diliberate attempt to smear the name of the NFL golden boy and flagship franchise is something that I cannot accept.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

...at the end of the day, it didn't affect the outcome of the games.

So why did he do it then?

[mightysimi]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

So why did he do it then?

I'm sure to get a better grip on the ball. Or maybe it was because of the junior varsity WR's he has been playing with couldn't catch the fastball. I'm just guessing but look at the games his performance didn't waiver in the least.

[gebobs]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

So why did he do it then?

Why did CREEP break into the DNC? If Nixon was the Patriots and McGovern was the Colts, the score would have been 520-17.

[CommissarSpartacus]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

Broke - SpyGate
Stretched - Vague injury reports, Ineligible receiver substitution shenanigans

I think we can ignore the stretched category, so Spygate is all you have, huh?

Now, how much do you know about Spygate? Do you think the Pats and Belichick "broke the rule" to gain a competitive advantage? Do you think he thought the Jets wouldn't notice the guy on the sideline with a camera during the first game played after the rule was instituted? Especially when the rule was put in place after new Jets HC Eric Mangini, a guy who owed his success to BB, told tales out of school to the commissioner?

[better days]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

So why did he do it then?

Nobody can say deflated footballs did not affect the outcome of games.

With a fully inflated football, a fumble may have happened at a critical time which would have affected the outcome of the game.

As you inferred, the balls were deflated for a reason.

Just as the Pats* continued to film after they were told not to.

They CHEATED because it gave them an unfair ADVANTAGE in games.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

I'm sure to get a better grip on the ball. Or maybe it was because of the junior varsity WR's he has been playing with couldn't catch the fastball.

This would directly affect the outcome of a football game.

I'm just guessing but look at the games his performance didn't waiver in the least.

In that single instance, against the Colts, yes he played well during the 2 quarters where the balls were within spec. That doesn't really mean much when you've being accused of deflating footballs since 2007.

[mightysimi]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

This would directly affect the outcome of a football game.



In that single instance, against the Colts, yes he played well during the 2 quarters where the balls were within spec. That doesn't really mean much when you've being accused of deflating footballs since 2007.

Where has he been accused of that? That's what we think. As far as I know, he was charged for the game against the Colts when the alleged tampering happened and that's it.

You are also disregarding the Superbowl which probably had a team of secret service agents covering the balls. We saw how that turned out. He was the MVP.

I will say this again. I hate Tom Brady. I would be happy if he never played again. In this instance, I think it is a little overblown. He should be suspended for the tampering. And he was.

Do we here about anybody screaming for baseball players never to play again if they got caught doctering a ball?

[Joe Fo Sho]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

Where has he been accused of that? That's what we think. As far as I know, he was charged for the game against the Colts when the alleged tampering happened and that's it.

You are also disregarding the Superbowl which probably had a team of secret service agents covering the balls. We saw how that turned out. He was the MVP.

I will say this again. I hate Tom Brady. I would be happy if he never played again. In this instance, I think it is a little overblown. He should be suspended for the tampering. And he was.

Do we here about anybody screaming for baseball players never to play again if they got caught doctering a ball?

Who wants Brady kicked out of football? I'm happy with his 4 game suspension.

The truth is, no one knows how long he's been doing it. I thought the Wells report mentioned the potential of him doctoring footballs since 2007.

[mightysimi]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

Who wants Brady kicked out of football? I'm happy with his 4 game suspension.

The truth is, no one knows how long he's been doing it. I thought the Wells report mentioned the potential of him doctoring footballs since 2007.

I didn't read all of it but I did read most of it. I think the 2007 thing came from the fumble numbers being historically low from the point they were allowed to supply their own footballs. Didn't see/glanced over where it mentioned this in the report if it's in there.

[senseofdoom]

Re: Merged all things Brady, cheating, bellicheat, etc.

I think we can ignore the stretched category, so Spygate is all you have, huh?

Now, how much do you know about Spygate? Do you think the Pats and Belichick "broke the rule" to gain a competitive advantage? Do you think he thought the Jets wouldn't notice the guy on the sideline with a camera during the first game played after the rule was instituted? Especially when the rule was put in place after new Jets HC Eric Mangini, a guy who owed his success to BB, told tales out of school to the commissioner?

I'm sure you do. Ignoring details that don't support your narrative is status quo. Much like you cherry picked this and ignored the rest of my post.

All I have is the biggest cheating scandal in the history of the NFL. And of course he was trying to gain a competitive advantage. What else would he be doing out there?