When does Whaley get accountability....

[Mace]

So.... what's to say that none of these guys that everyone is pissing and moaning over couldn't be a "maybe"?

And I'm not at all insinuating that we shouldn't have bothered drafting the later round players. Because as you stated, you never know. However I am also of the realization that these late round players that people are pissing and moaning over are also real long shots to make teh team anyway. So why be pissed over the selection? If they hit on one, great. If not, it's to be expected and you just move on....

I'm big on the "maybe"'s. We could have had more of them. We don't. Work this years "maybe"'s sure, and see what comes of them. The results are expected, yeah, but you said you don't know why people are worked up over a 6th for Williams. Those were two maybes, the 6th and the Williams they never used. Those two "maybe"'s are both on Whaley.

I looked up Ozzie Newsome's drafts, he's considered a premium GM and evaluator of talent in general. In his 13 years as Ravens GM, he always had a 6th. If you look through those drafts, Baltimore always loaded up on "maybe"'s. They never look short on late round picks. The more "maybe"'s you have the more talent to sift, means we're sifting less talent, and we are certainly not the Ravens.

Add in Bryce Brown for a 4th, two more "maybe"'s unexplored. That's up to 4. If Brown was a good pickup you don't get Karlos Williams (though debatable by running style), but to me that counts for another and that's a 5 player talent sifting swing total. Catastophic ? Not yet. But if it doesn't make you wonder, you're not being realistic. It's not about crying or whining, it's about looking at cost vs. return. That speaks directly to Whaley's accountability, doesn't it ? The more players you bring in the more chance to find gems if your scouts are worth their salary.

We are not a perennial division contender to be able to afford dorking around sifting talent and wasting "maybe"'s in any round. In my opinion anyway. And it doesn't make me a complainer, it makes me a realist.

[Zoneblitser]

You bring up a good point Mace. I think we have a week scouting department. If you thought Ralph was cheep on HC choices you can bet your ass he was not going to invest much in scouting. I think there might be a bit of the hangover effect when it comes to that area of the organization. Seems they like to do one stop shopping at FSU.
They need to model the small market Packers. They heavily rely on drafting and resigning their own player's.

[mightysimi]

The thing I like about Whaley is that he tries to fill holes going into the draft as opposed to having to draft a certain position becaue we have absolutely no one at that spot. Just going back a few years of our 4-7 round picks:
2014:
Cockerell: Marginal impact
Richardson: no impact
R. Johnson: no impact
Henderson: Starter. Probably only a 7th due to off field
2013:
Duke: Looks to be a starter
Meeks: IR commando
Hopkins: no impact
Gragg: possibly 2nd TE
2012:
Bradham: Starter good production
Brooks: no impact / decent ST but replaceable
Sanders: no impact
Carder: no impact
Asper: no impact
Potter: no impact
2011
Searcy: Starter good production
Hairston: IR commando
White: no impact
Rogers: no impact
Jasper: no impact

So out of the last 4 drafts other than Searcy, Bradham and Henderson no one else has seen the field regularily other than injuries or in short stints. The jury is still out on Duke and maybe it is a little early to judge last years class.

The draft is a crap shoot. In Bryce Brown/Mike Williams you actually knew what you were getting. There was tape at the NFL level that shows that they were able to at least compete at this level. So to me getting a guy that you know what you are getting is better than a maybe because as we see above, there are many, many more no impact guys than impact.

My favorite quote about the draft is from Brian Burke the former GM of the Canucks. I'm paraphrasing here. He said "There are no guarantees in the draft. I was standing right there when Atlanta picked Patrik Stefan over Daniel and Henrik Sedin." Stefan went on to score 64 goals in 488 games. The Sedins are still going strong.

The odds are stacked against the pick being the next Tom Brady.

[better days]

The thing I like about Whaley is that he tries to fill holes going into the draft as opposed to having to draft a certain position becaue we have absolutely no one at that spot. Just going back a few years of our 4-7 round picks:
2014:
Cockerell: Marginal impact
Richardson: no impact
R. Johnson: no impact
Henderson: Starter. Probably only a 7th due to off field
2013:
Duke: Looks to be a starter
Meeks: IR commando
Hopkins: no impact
Gragg: possibly 2nd TE
2012:
Bradham: Starter good production
Brooks: no impact / decent ST but replaceable
Sanders: no impact
Carder: no impact
Asper: no impact
Potter: no impact
2011
Searcy: Starter good production
Hairston: IR commando
White: no impact
Rogers: no impact
Jasper: no impact

So out of the last 4 drafts other than Searcy, Bradham and Henderson no one else has seen the field regularily other than injuries or in short stints. The jury is still out on Duke and maybe it is a little early to judge last years class.

The draft is a crap shoot. In Bryce Brown/Mike Williams you actually knew what you were getting. There was tape at the NFL level that shows that they were able to at least compete at this level. So to me getting a guy that you know what you are getting is better than a maybe because as we see above, there are many, many more no impact guys than impact.

My favorite quote about the draft is from Brian Burke the former GM of the Canucks. I'm paraphrasing here. He said "There are no guarantees in the draft. I was standing right there when Atlanta picked Patrik Stefan over Daniel and Henrik Sedin." Stefan went on to score 64 goals in 488 games. The Sedins are still going strong.

The odds are stacked against the pick being the next Tom Brady.

The Bills had 6 picks in this draft. None higher than the middle of the 2nd rnd.

If 3 of those 6 picks end up contributing to the team, I will be happy with this draft.

[Zoneblitser]

The Bills had 6 picks in this draft. None higher than the middle of the 2nd rnd.

If 3 of those 6 picks end up contributing to the team, I will be happy with this draft.

That's why I could not understand why the bills wouldn't trade up into the fourth with those two sixth and the one seventh rd picks. Although it is always a gamble you have a better chance of landing a starter from the forth than from the sixth and seventh.

[better days]

That's why I could not understand why the bills wouldn't trade up into the fourth with those two sixth and the one seventh rd picks. Although it is always a gamble you have a better chance of landing a starter from the forth than from the sixth and seventh.

I agree, but maybe they could not find a trade partner.

[Zoneblitser]

I agree, but maybe they could not find a trade partner.

Seems every other team can bounce around and find a trading partner. The bills need a lot of damage control from the past regime.

[better days]

Seems every other team can bounce around and find a trading partner. The bills need a lot of damage control from the past regime.

Every other team?

What teams were able to trade into the 4th rnd for sixth & seventh rnd picks?

[trapezeus]

Nice post. But if they both are failures they got the Bills to 9-7. And when Ryan doesn't do that in 2015 people are going to start wondering. Ryan = most overrated head coach out there. Marrone I still don't like, but he did what he did despite Whaley. Whaley's ceiling is director of player personnel. No higher.

you are probably right. if ryan underperforms, i think there will be questions. but on the other hand, there won't be "we should have had marrone back". i think 9-7 is the best he could do as a HC in the NFL.

ryan's downfall will be tweaking the d that largely worked under schwarz. i would also look at the injuries. last year's d had almost none. if they get actual injuries at key spots, that can't be on ryan. i really hope that the OC can help offensively and round out Ryan.