When you discuss deflatgate with non football fans

[Joe Fo Sho]

No, it actually states the exact opposite.

From Page 111: "Specifically, all but three of the Patriots footballs, as measured by both gauges, registered pressure levels lower than the range predicted by the Ideal Gas Law, when applied to the conditions most likely to have been present on the day of the AFC Championship game."

Haha, funny how the facts dispute a Patriot fan on this subject.

However, I don't think the Ideal Gas Law should be brought into this debate to prove anyone's point in one direction or the other. There are way too many variables involved to use that law to show anything.

[Joe Fo Sho]

What is it about being a Bills fan that entitles you to hate people and organi2ations?

I'm not entitled to do anything.

I've been a football fan for 55 years and it wasn't until I joined the range, and then here, that I learned there was a subset of fans that were PROUD of hating other teams and other players.

Stay away from the internet if you're trying to form an opinion of people, that's not how the internet works. Unless of course, you're trying to formulate an opinion of the way people act on the internet.

Try going outside and talking to real people.

Football is entertainment, you either like it or you don't, but hating individuals on those teams, or the teams themselves, never arose.

You need to listen to your own advice here. Yes, football is entertainment. For me, it is only entertainment and nothing else.

You're the one personalizing this whole thing saying people are out to get poor Tom Brady. I don't care who is on the other end of the punishment, if the QB of the NE Patriots cheated, he should deal with the consequences. If it were the Geno Smith who cheated, my feelings are that he should be punished. If Kyle Orton got caught cheating with the amount of information that's available in this case, I'd suck it up as a fan and admit that we cheated. I'd still gloat to the teams that we beat about how we beat them, but I wouldn't become completely blind as to what's going on.

When did YOU learn it was okay to hate as long as you were a football fan?

You keep using the word 'hate.' Just because you're a rival of a team and you root for them to lose, doesn't mean you hate them. I'm rooting against the Patriots right now in the only 'game' that is taking place...deflate-gate. Rooting for a Tom Brady suspension is equivalent to me rooting for the Colts when they play the Pats. It has nothing to do with Tom Brady, it has to do with things that are happening that can potentially help out the Bills. Tom Brady getting suspended helps the Bills...so that's what I'm rooting for.

I don't hate Tom Brady because he plays for a team that has consistently beat us for as long as I can remember. If that were the case then how come one of my favorite non-Bills of all-time is Vince Wilfork? How come I enjoy watching Gronkowski play so much? The 2 of them are pretty big reasons the Pats were able to stomp on us so bad. Ya know what though? If Gronk was being investigated like Hernandez was, I'd be rooting for a conclusion that kept him off of the football field. I don't care about them personally, because all they are to me is entertainment for 3 hours once a week.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Because he's been doing this since 2007 and had no expectation of being caught.

Patti

Yeah, nicknames tend to stick when you've been called them for 7 years.

[ICRockets]

Because he's been doing this since 2007 and had no expectation of being caught.

Patti

Apparently the implications are obvious even to idiots! Thanks, Patti.

[CommissarSpartacus]

Stay away from the internet if you're trying to form an opinion of people, that's not how the internet works. Unless of course, you're trying to formulate an opinion of the way people act on the internet.

Actually, one of the reasons the internet is interesting is because it allows people to behave in ways and say things they would never do or say in public. People drop their facades and reveal themselves BECAUSE they feel hidden behind a keyboard. It's a bi2arre form of democracy where teenagers can mouth off to their elders and the deluded can argue with the logical and the stupid can insist they're smart.

It's an advanced class in human behavior if you have the wit to reali2e it.

This whole deflategate thing is a perfect example of how the internet allows the id to escape the everyday constrictions of the super-ego so it can express it's deepest, darkest desires.

A case study in rush to judgment.

[CommissarSpartacus]

The implications are pretty obvious if you're not an idiot.

I just read a terrific book by Ken Follett called the Pillars of the Earth. It's about the building of the Kingsbridge Cathedral in the late 1100s and the plot is all about various conspiracies by the rich and powerful to ruin and besmirch the reputations of good hearted people for their own benefit.

Have you read it?

[jimmifli]

I just read a terrific book by Ken Follett called the Pillars of the Earth. It's about the building of the Kingsbridge Cathedral in the late 1100s and the plot is all about various conspiracies by the rich and powerful to ruin and besmirch the reputations of good hearted people for their own benefit.

Have you read it?

I'm really glad you enjoyed it.

[Joe Fo Sho]

and the stupid can insist they're smart.

Ahhh, now I understand what you're trying to do.

[better days]

Actually, one of the reasons the internet is interesting is because it allows people to behave in ways and say things they would never do or say in public. People drop their facades and reveal themselves BECAUSE they feel hidden behind a keyboard. It's a bi2arre form of democracy where teenagers can mouth off to their elders and the deluded can argue with the logical and the stupid can insist they're smart.

It's an advanced class in human behavior if you have the wit to reali2e it.

This whole deflategate thing is a perfect example of how the internet allows the id to escape the everyday constrictions of the super-ego so it can express it's deepest, darkest desires.

A case study in rush to judgment.

This post just reeks of irony.

Here is a clue for you, deflategate is not a TV sitcom.

[ICRockets]

I just read a terrific book by Ken Follett called the Pillars of the Earth. It's about the building of the Kingsbridge Cathedral in the late 1100s and the plot is all about various conspiracies by the rich and powerful to ruin and besmirch the reputations of good hearted people for their own benefit.

Have you read it?

I haven't, but I'll add it to the list.

[ICRockets]

Actually, one of the reasons the internet is interesting is because it allows people to behave in ways and say things they would never do or say in public. People drop their facades and reveal themselves BECAUSE they feel hidden behind a keyboard. It's a bi2arre form of democracy where teenagers can mouth off to their elders and the deluded can argue with the logical and the stupid can insist they're smart.

It's an advanced class in human behavior if you have the wit to reali2e it.

This whole deflategate thing is a perfect example of how the internet allows the id to escape the everyday constrictions of the super-ego so it can express it's deepest, darkest desires.

A case study in rush to judgment.

We get it. You've said on at least a dozen occasions that your favorite thread you've ever started is, "Would you rather be a dumb Bills fan or a smart Patriots fan?" You're getting involved here not because you genuinely believe the Patriots to be innocent, but because you live to push buttons, and you know that this topic is a smorgasbord of irrationality. My issue is that I find disingenuousness to be really boring, and not at all enlightening. You're arguing for the sake of your own entertainment, not for the sake of finding any sort of common ground with anybody else here.

[CommissarSpartacus]

We get it. You've said on at least a dozen occasions that your favorite thread you've ever started is, "Would you rather be a dumb Bills fan or a smart Patriots fan?" You're getting involved here not because you genuinely believe the Patriots to be innocent, but because you live to push buttons, and you know that this topic is a smorgasbord of irrationality. My issue is that I find disingenuousness to be really boring, and not at all enlightening. You're arguing for the sake of your own entertainment, not for the sake of finding any sort of common ground with anybody else here.

Actually, you don't get it. If I do push buttons, I do it to prove a point with people that are immune to logic and reason.

If I find myself entertained by the result, so much the better. It's not against the rules.

As for the Patriots ultimate guilt or innocence, logic and reason says there is nothing that points to the Pat's guilt other than some correlation/causation arguments, ala the media has labelled this Deflategate and Mcnally called himself the Deflator in an email, therefore there must have been a Tom Brady led conspiracy to give Tom Brady an illegal advantage that cheated everyone else out of their share of success.

At the same time, logic and reason point to shenanigans involving Ryan Grigson, his equipment manager, Troy Vincent, Ted Wells and Roger Goodell.

But the haters don't want to acknowledge any of this, they just want to keep screaming CHEATER, even though Brady and the Pats won THREE Superbowls before the rule was changed and won the last one by wasting Indy in the second half and beating Seattle Iin the big game WITH LEAGUE APPROVED BALLS.

So, sorry, but the "you just do this for your own entertainment" accusation doesn't wash.

I don't HAVE TO find common ground with *******s and morons and I'm always willing to discuss things reasonably with those that are willing to be reasonable.

You're just mad because of the dawning reali2ation you might have made a silly mistake.

The fact that patti had your back must have given you a hint, did it not?

[ICRockets]

Actually, you don't get it. If I do push buttons, I do it to prove a point with people that are immune to logic and reason.

So you're trying to prove a point to the very people you know are incapable of hearing it? And you think this makes sense?

[ICRockets]

At the same time, logic and reason point to shenanigans involving Ryan Grigson, his equipment manager, Troy Vincent, Ted Wells and Roger Goodell.

They really don't. You've been trying to make that point for 5 months, and it hasn't made a lick of sense to me in that entire time. It makes even less sense now that the report has made it abundantly clear that this has been going on long enough for the guy who's been handling the balls to have been calling himself "the deflator" even before the 2014 season. The Colts and the Patriots have played eachother how often in the last 3-8 years? Why is it unreasonable to think that there was an equipment guy for the Colts who has systematically noticed underinflated balls when he's against the Patriots, and finally decided to mention it to somebody with the clout to ask the league to look into it?

[ICRockets]

As for the Patriots ultimate guilt or innocence, logic and reason says there is nothing that points to the Pat's guilt other than some correlation/causation arguments, ala the media has labelled this Deflategate and Mcnally called himself the Deflator in an email, therefore there must have been a Tom Brady led conspiracy to give Tom Brady an illegal advantage that cheated everyone else out of their share of success.

This is gibberish. You're trying too hard to convince me of your righteous indignation.

[feldspar]

Spartacus, buddy...have you read the report yet?

Answer.

If not, then perhaps you should.

[CommissarSpartacus]

So you're trying to prove a point to the very people you know are incapable of hearing it? And you think this makes sense?

Absolutely. Otherwise one is just preaching to the converted.

[CommissarSpartacus]

They really don't. You've been trying to make that point for 5 months, and it hasn't made a lick of sense to me in that entire time.

So, by your own standard, it makes no sense to talk to you about this, correct?

Or should I make an attempt to remind you that the equipment manager's email said it was common knowledge around the league, not that he'd "systematically noticed" (whatever that is) under-inflated balls in the games with the Patriots?

We'll see from your reply whether you wish to discuss it, or argue with me, thus rendering the attempt nonsensical...

[CommissarSpartacus]

This is gibberish. You're trying too hard to convince me of your righteous indignation.

Only gibberish to those who refuse to think about it.

[CommissarSpartacus]

Spartacus, buddy...have you read the report yet?

Answer.

If not, then perhaps you should.

Why? Is it required? Have you read it?