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Thread: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

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    The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...on-head-injury

    .....The mass outrage stemming from Thursday night is rooted in the fact that Tagovailoa had his head twice violently slammed down four days apart. It’s a struggle to process how we can enjoy this sport without guilt, how a medical staff allowed this young man to take the field, how the league provides such little transparency on brain trauma to its players and fans. But the tough reality is had Tagovailoa not left the game on a stretcher, most of the NFL zeitgeist wouldn’t have given another thought to Tagovailoa’s brain and the possible impact of playing so soon after his “back” injury.....

    Dolphins head coach Mike McDaniel addressed the media following Miami’s loss to the Bengals and in one line demonstrated all the league’s ills when it comes to brain trauma messaging. McDaniel reported the “good news” that his quarterback “doesn’t have anything more serious than a concussion”. It is inconceivable that after a $765m settlement and cases of CTE in former players and general unknowns about brain trauma, that an NFL head coach would have the audacity to minimize any concussion, especially under Tagovailoa’s circumstances."


    A view from afar, where there sre similar problems in rugby. And similar lawsuits.
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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    I guess Mike McDonald is the new deity in the NFL home office.

    Everyone back off and let him diagnose all his players with minor scrapes.
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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Another reason why I'm pi**ed off at the 3rd and 22 call. Maybe McDermott and Frazier is too nice. I'm sure old fashioned coaches will go more aggressive when they let Tua came back out there in the 2nd half. You want to get him to the ground as much as you can.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    It's absolutely insane that he was allowed to play.

    This is already a black eye for the Fish and the league. It will be worse if there aren't consequences.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Tua could have life-lasting effects from two concussions within 4 days. He needs to stay out the rest of the season and see where his head’s at. It seems like he’s super fragile.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    The NFL needs to take any decision to let there player return away unless it is to keep him out even if the doctor says he can go. i.e. Tomlin did a few years back. There are symptoms that don’t allow players to return even if he passes the tests. Shaking your head and looking like the scarecrow in the Wizard of Oz are two of those symptoms. If a team violates/circumnavigates the rules they should loose their draft choices and heavily fined!

    What Tia was put through Sunday and Thursday was horrific and the Dolphins need to pay!
    Last edited by kgun12; 09-30-2022 at 10:00 AM.
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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    **** the NFL they are the ones whose asses need to be wrenched up into a bind for allowing Miami to be the party making the decision in the first place. It's just like the ****ing idiot who made the police police the police because they were the police. Talk about a dumb ass spinning top.

    The protocol should have kept Tua out of the game not Miami and any failure should come back to the NFL not Miami.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Didn't Tua have a say in all this?
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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobylal View Post
    Didn't Tua have a say in all this?
    When someone has bounced their brain around, they're not supposed to make "important decisions".
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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    They need to follow their protocol, and I don't care if we were playing them. Reminded me of Shanahan playing Griffin on a wobbly knee that looked terrible, but this is a brain and his body responding to further injury was horrible this last game. I find it real hard to believe he's just mildly concussed and dandy for the next round.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Protocol or not at this point Tua needs to take it upon himself to be tested as thoroughly as possible, he may have a neck or back condition that makes him more susceptible to head injuries.
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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Quote Originally Posted by YardRat View Post
    Protocol or not at this point Tua needs to take it upon himself to be tested as thoroughly as possible, he may have a neck or back condition that makes him more susceptible to head injuries.
    NFLPA needs to step in, since the NFL is basically staying silent on the subject.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    This whole thing is a mess and somebody needs to step up between the league and the PA and actually give a **** about the player’s health as opposed to just using it as a labor bargaining point.

    It’s clear the team doesn’t give a ****, so it’s up to the PA or the league.
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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    The NFLPA is looking into it.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    The decision for a player to enter the protocol has loopholes as it allows the team doctor to override the independent neurologist making determinations that preclude entering the protocol on the first place.

    Albert Breer explains is quite well....


    One thing the public may not understand is there’s no test that definitively tells the doctors examining players on game day whether a player has a concussion. They’re testing for symptoms and using what’s called the SCAT5, short for Sport Concussion Assessment Tool, 5th edition. There are four steps to the test: red flags, observable signs, memory assessment using Maddocks questions and examination using the Glasgow Coma Scale.

    Under Step 2, observable signs, there are two check boxes: one for “witnessed” and the other for “observed on video,” meaning either applies. And one of the yes/no categories is balance/gait difficulties/motor incoordination: stumbling, slow/labored movements.

    It doesn’t take a neurologist to have watched what happened after Tagovailoa had his head slammed to the turf on Sunday by Bills linebacker Matt Milano and check off the yes boxes.

    Additionally, the NFLPA website’s overview of the protocol has a graphic that states: “If a player demonstrates gross motor instability that is determined by the team physician, in consultation with the UNC [the independent neurologist], to be neurologically caused, then the player is designated a No-Go.”

    Again, in this case, it’s a slam dunk to say Tagovailoa demonstrated “gross motor instability” on Sunday at Hard Rock Stadium. The larger question, then, is whether that event was “neurologically caused.” In Tagovailoa’s case, the team doctors could make that determination—which, by a strict reading of the policy, they’d be able to do—and which could potentially undermine having an independent neurologist. There would also be the question of whether there was any follow-up testing after the game or during the week to confirm it.

    Which is where another problem lies. Once Tagovailoa was cleared and went back into the game on Sunday, there wasn’t a requirement for him to enter the concussion protocol during the week. In fact, on Monday the Dolphins actually said Tagovailoa wasn’t in the protocol, so unless he complained of symptoms, it’d likely be a nonissue for the team at that point.

    So that’s the loophole here. In the heat of the moment, the team doctor (or the independent neurologist) could, on paper, determine that Tagovailoa’s stumbling was caused by his back, and not his head, and send him back into what was a very big game for the Dolphins. And then, because of that result, there’d be no requirement for further testing, with motivation, at that point, for everyone involved (doctors, team, player, league) to confirm the original finding—because if they were wrong on Sunday, what would that say about them?
    The whole protocol must be carefully reexamined and changes must be made. Young men’s quality of life depend on it. It is easy to imagine that Tua could have been permanently crippled on Thursday light, that could have been prevented after (what looks like) a faulty decision during the Bills game.

    BUT, and this is a HUGE “but”, both the team doctor and the independent neurologist could have been acting with all due diligence and to the best of their ability to do the right thing.

    As far as I know, we only have one medical doctor on this site....swiper. As far as I can tell, he has not commented on this situation. I, for one, would be very interested in his observations and opinions.

    As non-medical professionals it is difficult to comprehend the fragile and sometime fraught minefield of diagnosis. Doctors, acting in good faith and to the very best of their abilities, sometimes make mistakes. It’s not like there is a definitive test that provides undeniable proof of a condition.

    But, certainly, this situation looks really bad. And the investigation results will be closely watched.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?


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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    They need to follow their protocol, and I don't care if we were playing them. Reminded me of Shanahan playing Griffin on a wobbly knee that looked terrible, but this is a brain and his body responding to further injury was horrible this last game. I find it real hard to believe he's just mildly concussed and dandy for the next round.
    That Griffin thing really pissed me off, I would have fired Shanahan immediately.

    Tua must be kept out no matter what he declares.

    That organization must pay period.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cntrygal View Post

    Are there neurologists on individual teams or is it just the Unaffiliated neurologist?
    Because a general practitioner is probably going to listen to what the Neurologist tells him.

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike13 View Post
    Are there neurologists on individual teams or is it just the Unaffiliated neurologist?
    Because a general practitioner is probably going to listen to what the Neurologist tells him.
    Dude got fired

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    Re: The Dolphins failed Tua Tagovailoa. Will any change come of it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike13 View Post
    Are there neurologists on individual teams or is it just the Unaffiliated neurologist?
    Because a general practitioner is probably going to listen to what the Neurologist tells him.
    There are three in the stadium for every game. One for each team on their sideline, and one in the booth.

    Miami very simply ignored the protocol from the beginning, intentionally, and fubared the system the rest of the way.

    More than just the one UNC should end up losing their job over this, a few in the Dolphins organization should be unemployed within the next couple of weeks, and the team should be heavily fined and penalized even more draft choices.

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