Josh allens footwork gets progressively bad every year

[kgun12]

I do read your posts but what’s the point and what do you want us to say, seriously what’s the point of telling us the same thing over and over?

[Cali512]

I do read your posts but what’s the point and what do you want us to say, seriously what’s the point of telling us the same thing over and over?

Whats the point of saying anything on here?

Everyone says "well the issue is this and this and this"

We have 20 threads about his injury/playcalling/mind. Yet one post about his fundamentals and your acting like its overkill?

Its something that rarely gets mentioned unless i do it, so theres a place for it on this board. Would you rather me make another thread about playcalling, fire our coaches, new running game, better weapons? Or would you rather an in depth showcasing of an issue with our QBs fundamentals which could explain inconsistency?

[kgun12]

Whats the point of saying anything on here?

Everyone says "well the issue is this and this and this"

We have 20 threads about his injury/playcalling/mind. Yet one post about his fundamentals and your acting like its overkill?

Its something that rarely gets mentioned unless i do it, so theres a place for it on this board. Would you rather me make another thread about playcalling, fire our coaches, new running game, better weapons? Or would you rather an in depth showcasing of an issue with our QBs fundamentals which could explain inconsistency?

You’re right unless you keep mentioning it. You’ve made your point every time you mention it. Answer my question, what’s the point and what are you looking for us to say? Yes you watch type and told us again about the quarterback’s fundamentals.
Here’s another question, you say it’s been happening for three years but we were 13 seconds from a SB last year, wasn’t a problem then was it?

Here’s another thing, Mahomes, might have the worst fundamentals in the league, jump passes, throwing off the wrong foot all the time, side arm, underarm and he’s probably going to probably win the MVP this year. A lot of today’s QB’s are unorthodox. It’s more about lack of talent, scheme and coaching.

[Cali512]

You’re right unless you keep mentioning it. You’ve made your point every time you mention it. Answer my question, what’s the point and what are you looking for us to say? Yes you watch type and told us again about the quarterback’s fundamentals.
Here’s another question, you say it’s been happening for three years but we were 13 seconds from a SB last year, wasn’t a problem then was it?

Here’s another thing, Mahomes, might have the worst fundamentals in the league, jump passes, throwing off the wrong foot all the time, side arm, underarm and he’s probably going to probably win the MVP this year. A lot of today’s QB’s are unorthodox. It’s more about lack of talent, scheme and coaching.

Honestly i expect people to give their points of view on what they see from the videos and if theyve noticed this too. Yes we were 13 seconds away from the championship game. Doesnt chance the massive inconsistency he has throughout the game

I even said, last year in the playoffs his fundamentals were some of the worst ive seen from him. But he still took the game over with pure talent. The problem is when he is like that, and its continuously changing through the course of the season, thats an issue. His accuracy is plainly at his best with his base fundamentals, and he plays better when hes continuously using them


We all agree hes up and down during the course of the season. Im pretty sure this is why. Yes he has amazing games when its off, but it definitely effects his accuracy during a lot of games. Most of the times when hes on, hes using those fundamentals

This is the main thing. Yes mahomes has bad fundamentals. But he also has a base throwing motion that is pretty consistent when he has a clean pocket or is stationary. Allen does not. Allen could be in a clean pocket in one game and throw with his taught fundamentals, then another game his feet/arm/hips are everywhere which is usually the games where his accuracy is everywhere

Allens biggest issue is his consistency week in and week out. Every year his fundamentals are great at the beginning and completely fall off in the middle/end of the season.

Yes he can have great games when his fundamentals are off. We saw that in 2020 before he adjusted. But his bad missed to wide open receivers usually are when he gets out of his specific throwing motion

Im trying to answer the question as to why hes so up and down during the season. Yes he plays great sometimed despite it, but even allen said that last year he got into a certain zone in the postseason where hes never gotten before. Most games hes not going to be in that zone so youd want to have a consistent base to fall back on.


Im only further explaining because most of this thread is blaming his injury, and im trying to explain this is an issue hes had for his whole career. Its something interesting to keep an eye on because its a drastic difference every year

[kgun12]

Honestly i expect people to give their points of view on what they see from the videos and if theyve noticed this too. Yes we were 13 seconds away from the championship game. Doesnt chance the massive inconsistency he has throughout the game

I even said, last year in the playoffs his fundamentals were some of the worst ive seen from him. But he still took the game over with pure talent. The problem is when he is like that, and its continuously changing through the course of the season, thats an issue. His accuracy is plainly at his best with his base fundamentals, and he plays better when hes continuously using them


We all agree hes up and down during the course of the season. Im pretty sure this is why. Yes he has amazing games when its off, but it definitely effects his accuracy during a lot of games. Most of the times when hes on, hes using those fundamentals

This is the main thing. Yes mahomes has bad fundamentals. But he also has a base throwing motion that is pretty consistent when he has a clean pocket or is stationary. Allen does not. Allen could be in a clean pocket in one game and throw with his taught fundamentals, then another game his feet/arm/hips are everywhere which is usually the games where his accuracy is everywhere

Allens biggest issue is his consistency week in and week out. Every year his fundamentals are great at the beginning and completely fall off in the middle/end of the season.

Yes he can have great games when his fundamentals are off. We saw that in 2020 before he adjusted. But his bad missed to wide open receivers usually are when he gets out of his specific throwing motion

Im trying to answer the question as to why hes so up and down during the season. Yes he plays great sometimed despite it, but even allen said that last year he got into a certain zone in the postseason where hes never gotten before. Most games hes not going to be in that zone so youd want to have a consistent base to fall back on.


Im only further explaining because most of this thread is blaming his injury, and im trying to explain this is an issue hes had for his whole career. Its something interesting to keep an eye on because its a drastic difference every year

Again you’ve made your point, we all see it and hopefully they (he and the coaches) do something to fix it, but like Mahomes, they are what they are and yet you said this earlier this month even with all their flaws.

“ Mahomes- 46 total tds 5,600 total yds, 12 ints

Allen- 42 total tds, 5000 total yds, 14 ints


Allen also didnt play a whole game


Definitely mahomes award, but allens number 2 no question”

[Cali512]

Again you�ve made your point, we all see it and hopefully they (he and the coaches) do something to fix it, but like Mahomes, they are what they are and yet you said this earlier this month even with all their flaws.

� Mahomes- 46 total tds 5,600 total yds, 12 ints

Allen- 42 total tds, 5000 total yds, 14 ints


Allen also didnt play a whole game


Definitely mahomes award, but allens number 2 no question�

Then next time say "i see it too" and move on

Ive honestly lost completely what you are arguing about.

You responded saying "we understand he has issues but we all recognize that it was also due to coaching and an injury

Im trying to explain that this isnt a "this year" problem. Its been going on for 3 years, and i believe its his complete change in throwing motion.

This is a topic about the pattern of him throwing without his base fundamentals every year midway through the season and how the injury isnt the whole issue, its been an issue for 3 years

If your unable to discuss it or dont have anything to contribute, thats fine, but i dont get your need to basically say "dont talk about this, we know, but its also this". When im clearly showing that this is an issue hes had without an injury, and with daboll calling plays.

There are 10-20 threads the last few months about weapons, injury, playcalling, coaching. This is the one thread discussing his change of throwing motion which literally no one mentioned all year. The one thread that actually went back through the last 3 seasons and showed the progression of the seasons where his motion drastically changes midway-end of season.

His change in throwing motion only gets discussed when i bring it up, i have for 2 years. Me bringing up his throwing motion changing is no different than people saying "oh he reads the field bad all of a sudden", "he has poor decision making"

I dont get why it bothers you so much that i even brought it up. I guess its because for some reason people have in their mind that they always need a basic excuse for him when he plays bad. Oh its the weapons, oh its the playcalling, oh we depend on him to much, oh its the injury, oh its the running game. You seem to rather beat your head against the wall trying to figure out how its not allens fault rather than actually thinking about this and see that there is a very specific thing that changes

This is a discussion about specifically Allen, and explaining why he goes from extreme highs to lows in a single season. Whats the "old josh" that people mention. THIS IS IT. Its his back and forth from one throwing motion to the other.

He had 6 really bad games this season, and 4 average games. Was it his injury? Maybe, but that doesnt explain why this happens every single year. What im explaining does.


Im responding to people who are blaming the injury because i dont believe thats it. Its a discussion about a specific thing. I dont get why your so against having a discussion about our QBs complete reverting back to his old fundamentals when everyone is always asking "why is he so inconsistent some games"

If your so against the discussion about the nuance of how a QB throws the actual football, then leave, dont get so offended that someone brought up a topic illustrating the issue FOR THE FIRST TIME ALL SEASON

[YardRat]

You are in Camp Dorsey? Play calling was awesome?

There doesn't have to be 'camps'. This was Dorsey's first year as a coordinator, of course there is a learning curve. This was Josh's fifth season on the field, and he regressed to more Bad Josh instead of taking the next step up to three dimensional chess. He reverted back to checkers.

[YardRat]

Yeah, in arm angle, because HE COULDNT THROW normally.

You are comparing apples to oranges, as usual

A mid-season change is a mid-season change, regardless of the motive. If he can consciously change his throwing motion to alleviate pain, then he can consciously make a change to his feet mechanics.

[YardRat]

I sure hope you're wrong. Can't say you are.

Next year is a big season for Josh. We'll see if he can grow into a legit championship quarterback, or if his ceiling is going to be Dan Marino and Phillip Rivers.

I see this but it’s because of the other issues. (I hope) This team did go through a lot this season, let’s hope they and especially Josh can rest.

I think it's time to stop giving Josh a free pass and treating him with kid gloves. He's a five year vet with plenty of playoff experience and a big contract, there are always going to be distractions, injuries, and extenuating circumstances. He's expected to overcome them and lead the team to a Super Bowl.

[YardRat]

I only watched the KC playoffs Davis highlights but it looked to me like his feet were pointing toward the target, his hips were turning and he was getting some push from his legs.

His mechanics aren't going to be exact on every throw, and they are going to vary here and there as he adapts to the moment, so picking out individual plays here and there isn't necessarily evidence of a definite conclusion.

One would think an alleged trend like this would be seen during the week when Josh is reviewing film and he would work on any corrections he needs to make in between games.

[Cali512]

I only watched the KC playoffs Davis highlights but it looked to me like his feet were pointing toward the target, his hips were turning and he was getting some push from his legs.

His mechanics aren't going to be exact on every throw, and they are going to vary here and there as he adapts to the moment, so picking out individual plays here and there isn't necessarily evidence of a definite conclusion.

One would think an alleged trend like this would be seen during the week when Josh is reviewing film and he would work on any corrections he needs to make in between games.

You just said i picked and chose when you watched one video out of 10 lol. Watch the other ones. I only used that specific video because i know half of yall dont want to watch an hr of videos so i found a few quicker videos


Regardless ill admit one thing. I went back and watched the vikings game and yes, that is where his motion went to **** this season. It got better towards the end of the year, and was good vs the dolphins in the first half but it steadily went back during the end of the game. Then it totally went to **** vs the bengals

So it may of started from the injury like yall suggested. The thing is this did happen last season too so i do think he still has an issue with muscle memory. But yes the difference between the jets and vikings game is pretty apparent. I still think he made it worse on himself because he abandoned his legs and started throwing with all arm

[YardRat]

You just said i picked and chose when you watched one video out of 10 lol. Watch the other ones. I only used that specific video because i know half of yall dont want to watch an hr of videos so i found a few quicker videos


Regardless ill admit one thing. I went back and watched the vikings game and yes, that is where his motion went to **** this season. It got better towards the end of the year, and was good vs the dolphins in the first half but it steadily went back during the end of the game. Then it totally went to **** vs the bengals

So it may of started from the injury like yall suggested. The thing is this did happen last season too so i do think he still has an issue with muscle memory. But yes the difference between the jets and vikings game is pretty apparent. I still think he made it worse on himself because he abandoned his legs and started throwing with all arm

I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying there isn't sufficient evidence to conclude you are right. However, if you want to claim his mechanics consistently go to hell every season you really shouldn't use video evidence where his mechanics appear to be fine as evidence.

It's certainly a possibility that he let his footwork slip this season, but then he needs to identify that trend and correct it in real time.

[Cali512]

I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying there isn't sufficient evidence to conclude you are right. However, if you want to claim his mechanics consistently go to hell every season you really shouldn't use video evidence where his mechanics appear to be fine as evidence.

It's certainly a possibility that he let his footwork slip this season, but then he needs to identify that trend and correct it in real time.

I used that specific video because of the 2 td passes to davis where he whips his whole body to make the pass and the throw off his back foot where he flicks his leg then spins after releasing the ball. If you watch the whole game, it was a mix of good but a lot of wonky mechanics. That video was probably the most irrelevant video i showed honestly, but those 3 plays are some of the worst mechanics ive seen from him. I just threw it in there to show that sometimes he does get loose and still plays amazing. But those games are more of the exception to the rule. If i was trying to be bias i wouldve left that one alone because i know people will think it contradicts the point, but i posted it to explain that hes so talented that he can make weird mechanics work at times. Its when it becomes a trend for a stretch that it gets very wonky. I mean 2 of those passes were in a clean pocket to a wide open davis, its not like he got away with something, theyre hard passes to miss lol

If i thought someone would literally just watch that video and that video alone, i wouldnt of used it. I assumed people would watch a few of the other videos and then see that video.


Idk what you mean by not enough evidence to show that im right. Every video i posted shows games where his mechanics are amazing and games where they are awful. Almost every game where his mechanics are amazing, are at the beginning of the season, while the worst ones are towards the end.

Yes if you watched one video that was honestly the least important one, than i guess you can say thats not enough evidence. But once again, it was the least important video out of all of them

[Forward_Lateral]

A mid-season change is a mid-season change, regardless of the motive. If he can consciously change his throwing motion to alleviate pain, then he can consciously make a change to his feet mechanics.

Lol you are obtuse

[kgun12]

Next year is a big season for Josh. We'll see if he can grow into a legit championship quarterback, or if his ceiling is going to be Dan Marino and Phillip Rivers.



I think it's time to stop giving Josh a free pass and treating him with kid gloves. He's a five year vet with plenty of playoff experience and a big contract, there are always going to be distractions, injuries, and extenuating circumstances. His contract numbers expected to overcome them and lead the team to a Super Bowl.

I’m not giving him a pass, my question is what is the solution? I know endless threads and videos of the issue which we ALL acknowledge to varying degrees is there, it’s mind numbing! His contract number aren’t going away, but to say there are always distractions is funny. Having a teammate almost die on the field is more than a distraction, have to move a home game with two day’s notice is more than a distraction. Injuries are but when it’s on the throwing arm of the QB it’s more than a distraction.

Again, what’s the solution? I know what mine is, bring in a QB coach and OC that are going to work on his issues and develop an offense that is more balanced run to pass and doesn’t always rely on Josh’s legs or the long ball. But the very first thing that has to be done it’s to upgrade the line.
I’m not saying Josh doesn’t own his issues but the lack of coaching isn’t helping.
Let me explain, nature says if you allow a bad behavior happen and don’t correct it, it will continue to happen. The coaches need to let Josh’s elbow heal then work all off season to correct his mechanics. This will not be an easy task because for every hour a bad habit is performed, it takes 3 hours to correct!

[DraftBoy]

Nobody's whining about his footwork when he's throwing 60 yard dimes off of his back foot, on the run.

I wouldn’t say nobody is. It’s not like the critiques of his technique have been silent his entire career.

[YardRat]

I’m not giving him a pass, my question is what is the solution? I know endless threads and videos of the issue which we ALL acknowledge to varying degrees is there, it’s mind numbing! His contract number aren’t going away, but to say there are always distractions is funny. Having a teammate almost die on the field is more than a distraction, have to move a home game with two day’s notice is more than a distraction. Injuries are but when it’s on the throwing arm of the QB it’s more than a distraction.

Again, what’s the solution? I know what mine is, bring in a QB coach and OC that are going to work on his issues and develop an offense that is more balanced run to pass and doesn’t always rely on Josh’s legs or the long ball. But the very first thing that has to be done it’s to upgrade the line.
I’m not saying Josh doesn’t own his issues but the lack of coaching isn’t helping.
Let me explain, nature says if you allow a bad behavior happen and don’t correct it, it will continue to happen. The coaches need to let Josh’s elbow heal then work all off season to correct his mechanics. This will not be an easy task because for every hour a bad habit is performed, it takes 3 hours to correct!

He needs to continue his growth. That's on him, not any coach or anybody else.

[kgun12]

He needs to continue his growth. That's on him, not any coach or anybody else.

I don’t agree, whether he calls Brady like Mahomes or watches videos or get a personal trainer, you don’t know what you don’t know. The work will be his, but unless someone helps him he can’t fix it.

It’s like crewing with your mouth open, unless someone tells you that it is as gross as thing as you can do at a dinner table you will continue to do it. Once someone tells you how vile it is then it’s up to you to correct, but when you slip up there needs to be someone to say mouth closed!

If he’s not told what he doing wrong and it’s not reenforced he can’t correct it!

I’ve coached at all level and you have to keep correcting because humans will fall back to old habits. That’s what coaches are for and that’s what parents are for.

Here another example: When a puppy pisses on the floor you don’t say one time no no and they go outside after that.

[Mace]

Next year is a big season for Josh. We'll see if he can grow into a legit championship quarterback, or if his ceiling is going to be Dan Marino and Phillip Rivers.



I think it's time to stop giving Josh a free pass and treating him with kid gloves. He's a five year vet with plenty of playoff experience and a big contract, there are always going to be distractions, injuries, and extenuating circumstances. He's expected to overcome them and lead the team to a Super Bowl.

He was extremely legit and on a pace to pass Manning for yards per season record up until the bye. I don't know what happened at the bye, but Allen was legit. That wasn't Marino or Rivers. Then he just fell apart, but there isn't any doubt to me that he was legit. I just can't imagine how he crumpled. But then again, I still can't grasp how the whole team did. That was just not an impressive demonstration of anything, though they eked out a lot from it.

[YardRat]

I don’t agree, whether he calls Brady like Mahomes or watches videos or get a personal trainer, you don’t know what you don’t know. The work will be his, but unless someone helps him he can’t fix it.

It’s like crewing with your mouth open, unless someone tells you that it is as gross as thing as you can do at a dinner table you will continue to do it. Once someone tells you how vile it is then it’s up to you to correct, but when you slip up there needs to be someone to say mouth closed!

If he’s not told what he doing wrong and it’s not reenforced he can’t correct it!

I’ve coached at all level and you have to keep correcting because humans will fall back to old habits. That’s what coaches are for and that’s what parents are for.

Here another example: When a puppy pisses on the floor you don’t say one time no no and they go outside after that.

He's not a puppy, he's full grown. He was potty trained his first couple of seasons, when he pisses on the floor now it's his fault.

I'm not saying he shouldn't get help and training from others, but it's up to him to do it. He's been in the league five seasons and has gone through the working on the mechanics from scratch, if they are slipping he should be the first to recognize and the first to try correcting. If he's not playing efficient football and hurting the team in the process, he should be the first to recognize it and the first to correct it.

This is his team. He is the man. It's on him.