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OC aside most of his glaring mistakes haven’t been due to scheme or receivers running bad routes or etc, they’ve been due to stupid decisions that he made. He alone needs to recognize that, take accountability and work diligently to greatly reduce them (he’s human so he’ll make mistakes, he just can’t continue to make them in the volume that he has been if the team is to progress).
That's completely wrong. His supporting cast makes plenty of mistakes. That's not to say Josh is perfect. No one is.
There's also a major difference that scheme makes. It's why a guy like Belicheat can take castoffs from other teams and still craft a great defense, and then when they go to another team they after JAGs. I'd take OCs like Reid, McVay and Zac Taylor well before Daboll and Brady (for now, since he's largely unproved). I also want to see what adding a speed WR does and whether if make the offense back to the 2020-2021 versions.
I don't think anybody would expect Diggs to score on that play. Get the first, extend the drive, kill clock. It was the right throw at the time, not the wrong one, and that's the point. Also why I stated leave with the lead, not necessarily the win.
Josh underperforms and it's Daboll's fault. Then Dorsey. Now Brady. There's a common denominator here and it isn't the OC.
Uh yeah, it is the OCs. Daboll was a failed NFL OC before Josh. Dorsey had never been an OC before. Brady isn't some wunderkind like a McVay or Taylor. We're all hoping he is but in all likelihood he's not.
What the Bills need more than anything is for the defense to show up in the playoffs. Or at least be somewhat healthy.
If it's irrelevant that Josh is trying to accomplish something that only two quarterbacks have done in the entire history of the Super Bowl, then it's even more irrelevant what QB's have won championships at 28 years old or later.
But I agree, Josh isn't past his prime. Although at this point it appears we have seen his ceiling in 2020.
The facts I presented are undeniable as well.
My set of facts are what matters to refuting the idea lame idea that the Bills "have wasted Josh's prime".
It is immensely relevant that two thirds of QB's that have won a SB did so when Josh's age or older.
Uh yeah, it is the OCs. Daboll was a failed NFL OC before Josh. Dorsey had never been an OC before. Brady isn't some wunderkind like a McVay or Taylor. We're all hoping he is but in all likelihood he's not.
What the Bills need more than anything is for the defense to show up in the playoffs. Or at least be somewhat healthy.
In over 20 years of NFL head coaching Andy Reid never won a Super Bowl....UNTIL he had Patrick Mahomes.
Not only is Mahomes a better QB than Josh (so far), he became one almost the instant he became their starter with the aid of sitting behind (and learning from) an extremely competent above average starter (some believed a well above average) QB in Alex Smith helping him.
Josh came into the league a much more raw talent that Mahomes...had no opportunity to sit and learn and NO competent (Jesus....not even a bad QB to learn from....he was saddled with NATE PETERMAN....one of the crappiest QB's in history) ahead of him.
On top of that, as Bills scout (when Josh came into the league) Gerald "Smoke" Dixon attested to, Allen was not a student of the game, and shunned film study. He has observed that Josh still makes boneheaded mistakes and leans on his astounding physical ability too much at time.
If and when Josh masters the mental part of the game, and takes it more seriously that he apparently has so far, he could (and I believe will) be a multiple SB winner.
In over 20 years of NFL head coaching Andy Reid never won a Super Bowl....UNTIL he had Patrick Mahomes.
Not only is Mahomes a better QB than Josh (so far), he became one almost the instant he became their starter with the aid of sitting behind (and learning from) an extremely competent above average starter (some believed a well above average) QB in Alex Smith helping him.
Josh came into the league a much more raw talent that Mahomes...had no opportunity to sit and learn and NO competent (Jesus....not even a bad QB to learn from....he was saddled with NATE PETERMAN....one of the crappiest QB's in history) ahead of him.
On top of that, as Bills scout (when Josh came into the league) Gerald "Smoke" Dixon attested to, Allen was not a student of the game, and shunned film study. He has observed that Josh still makes boneheaded mistakes and leans on his astounding physical ability too much at time.
If and when Josh masters the mental part of the game, and takes it more seriously that he apparently has so far, he could (and I believe will) be a multiple SB winner.
Again, Reid took McNabb, a tier 2 at best QB, to a SB. Just like there are different levels of QBs, there are different levels of coaches. I dare you to find anyone who would take Daboll/Dorsey/Brady over Reid (or McVay or Taylor) as an OC or McD over Reid as HC. I doubt you'd also find anyone to take McD over Spags as DC.
Coaching matters. A lot. You wouldn't think this would need to be said. Now if you're saying that Josh isn't good enough to overcome the coaching disparity, then I can't really disagree.
That's completely wrong. His supporting cast makes plenty of mistakes. That's not to say Josh is perfect. No one is.
There's also a major difference that scheme makes. It's why a guy like Belicheat can take castoffs from other teams and still craft a great defense, and then when they go to another team they after JAGs. I'd take OCs like Reid, McVay and Zac Taylor well before Daboll and Brady (for now, since he's largely unproved). I also want to see what adding a speed WR does and whether if make the offense back to the 2020-2021 versions.
Ya we’ll have to agree to disagree. Are the other factors to blame on occasion? Sure, which is why I said “most”. But you’re seemingly blaming all of Josh’ dumb decisions on everyone but Josh. That is “completely wrong” imo.
Again, Reid took McNabb, a tier 2 at best QB, to a SB. Just like there are different levels of QBs, there are different levels of coaches. I dare you to find anyone who would take Daboll/Dorsey/Brady over Reid (or McVay or Taylor) as an OC or McD over Reid as HC. I doubt you'd also find anyone to take McD over Spags as DC.
Coaching matters. A lot. You wouldn't think this would need to be said. Now if you're saying that Josh isn't good enough to overcome the coaching disparity, then I can't really disagree.
I did not say that coaching does not matter. Who is QB is MORE important in today's game. It's undeniable. It's no surprise that FIVE of the last SIX SB's were won by either Tom Brady or Mahomes. The GOAT and the soon to be equal GOAT.
Plus EIGHT of the last TEN SB winners were either Brady, Mahomes or Peyton Manning....who was considered one of the masters of the game and the position of QB.
Kurt Warner (with input from Peter King) was spot on when he said this after the Bills loss to KC because Josh is NOT YET a mater of the game or the mental part of QB...
Allen, on this drive (last Bills drive of the game), had flipped and thrown and side-armed completions of 7, 4, 8, 10, 6 and 7 yards. And needing a first down here, he went gunslinger. I just don’t know why. Kurt Warner, one who would know, tried to explain it a few days after the game.
“Sometimes,” Warner said, “you talk yourself into a play and say, ‘I’m gonna make this play, and this is the throw that’ll send us to the championship game,’ instead of saying, ‘I’m gonna let the defense dictate where I throw the ball.’ As a quarterback, you have to have the ability to balance those things.”
I thought Warner put it best on Allen in this game, and Allen as a player. He said, “It’s impossible to play perfect games, and Josh played an incredible game—until the end. In the end, he took some chances that wouldn’t have been what I would have done. But he chose to make those throws, and if you choose those throws, you’ve got to make ‘em. That’s part of being great. Brady, Montana, Mahomes—they have careers of making the plays in the absolute crucial times of the game. Now they’re on the Mount Rushmore of NFL quarterbacks.”
Allen is just six years into his career. He’s got much of his NFL life in front of him. He’s a smart guy. He’s one of the most talented quarterbacks ever to play in the NFL. He’s going to have plenty of chances to go deep into the playoffs, and to win a Super Bowl. But this is a crucial lesson he must learn, or he may never hold the Lombardi Trophy
Mahomes on the Bills (with no other changes to any players of coaches) and the BILLS would probably have won two or three Super Bowls. Josh Allen on KC (with no other changes to players or coaches) and they probably win NONE.
Ya we’ll have to agree to disagree. Are the other factors to blame on occasion? Sure, which is why I said “most”. But you’re seemingly blaming all of Josh’ dumb decisions on everyone but Josh. That is “completely wrong” imo.
So your contention is Josh messes up the most on the offense? Yeah, we'll have to agree to disagree.
I did not say that coaching does not matter. Who is QB is MORE important in today's game. It's undeniable. It's no surprise that FIVE of the last SIX SB's were won by either Tom Brady or Mahomes. The GOAT and the soon to be equal GOAT.
Plus EIGHT of the last TEN SB winners were either Brady, Mahomes or Peyton Manning....who was considered one of the masters of the game and the position of QB.
Kurt Warner (with input from Peter King) was spot on when he said this after the Bills loss to KC because Josh is NOT YET a mater of the game or the mental part of QB...
Mahomes on the Bills (with no other changes to any players of coaches) and the BILLS would probably have won two or three Super Bowls. Josh Allen on KC (with no other changes to players or coaches) and they probably win NONE.
The facts are hard to ignore.
I looked-up McNabb's stats and tier 2 may have been generous. He had a 59% career completion percentage. His TD:TO ratio was 1.4.
In any case, there is a thread on another popular Bills site. It's titled "What if Allen and Mahomes swapped exact situations?" Check it out and be enlightened.
There's a good thread on another popular website about this topic. It would be wise to check it out. Basically, reverse Josh and Mahomes and the same team is winning SBs.
I looked-up McNabb's stats and tier 2 may have been generous. He had a 59% career completion percentage. His TD:TO ratio was 1.4.
In any case, there is a thread on another popular Bills site. It's titled "What if Allen and Mahomes swapped exact situations?" Check it out and be enlightened.
There's a good thread on another popular website about this topic. It would be wise to check it out. Basically, reverse Josh and Mahomes and the same team is winning SBs.
So your contention is Josh messes up the most on the offense? Yeah, we'll have to agree to disagree.
SNIP.
Correct. Daboll, Dorsey and Brady all have one thing in common outside of the obvious…none of them threw even one of the dozens of picks thrown during their tenure. League leading picks. That’s not even counting the fumbles they never lost.
Josh is terrific and he’s our guy. He also makes far too many stupid avoidable mistakes.
Correct. Daboll, Dorsey and Brady all have one thing in common outside of the obvious…none of them threw even one of the dozens of picks thrown during their tenure. League leading picks. That’s not even counting the fumbles they never lost.
Josh is terrific and he’s our guy. He also makes far too many stupid avoidable mistakes.
Yes and everyone around him is perfect. Those 4 passes dropped (none for Mahomes) were all his fault. So too was Bass' missed 44-yard FG to tie the game. And that fake punt was a really great coaching decision.
Yes and everyone around him is perfect. Those 4 passes dropped (none for Mahomes) were all his fault. So too was Bass' missed 44-yard FG to tie the game. And that fake punt was a really great coaching decision.
None of that explains Josh’s league-worst turnovers.
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