Interesting take - Is it 2017 all over again for the Bills?

[Gibby 2.0]

He’s Marvin Lewis with a software upgrade.

And again, he’s a defensive HC in a league that has left them in the dust for awhile now

Jack Pardee, these past few teams just feels like the early 90s Oilers. Ungodly talented on both sides of the ball and yet still can't get past the elites in the conference. I do mean Jack Pardee, the 91 Oilers get past Denver they probably beat us and they matched up very well against Washington, hell they went to OT at RFK in the regular season, but in the playoffs? They just could not keep double digit leads.

Anyways, my expectations are that Beane trades up, he always makes a trade, or he trades for an established star (probably overpays, see the Edmunds and Diggs trades) and that yet again this team wins the division and underperforms in the playoffs.

I love the team McD and Beane have built, and in the regular season I love McD, but in the playoffs every year I know that the heartbreak is coming and coming soon. The only fairly painless playoff loss this team had was the Cincy game. Every other one, they either had leads, went the distance and then crushed us all by last second ****ups.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

I doubt it. Look at what Sneed went for and he's won 3 SBs with the Chefs.

You may be right. I probably let Gilmore's post FA signing career clouded judgement. But it is true that if anyone knows the franchised guy you are signing will be an NFL Defensive Player of the Year, a near MVP for a super bowl (I still believe he and Edelman should share that honor), teams will line up to give you a high pick.

Let's see what Mr. Sneed will do in Tennessee. I'm betting against a Gilmore type of impact, probably a general consensus.

[Goobylal]

You may be right. I probably let Gilmore's post FA signing career clouded judgement. But it is true that if anyone knows the franchised guy you are signing will be an NFL Defensive Player of the Year, a near MVP for a super bowl (I still believe he and Edelman should share that honor), teams will line up to give you a high pick.

Let's see what Mr. Sneed will do in Tennessee. I'm betting against a Gilmore type of impact, probably a general consensus.

The only way to have traded Gilmore was to franchise him since his rookie deal was up. But McD assessed the team and knew who he wanted to keep and who he didn't and Gilmore was the latter. I have no doubt that Gilmore/his agent made it known that if he were franchised, he would sit out. And when a team has to give a player a huge new contract, the draft pick compensation goes down.

McD made the right decision. While a draft pick would have been nice, the team was put on the right path by getting rid of him and other malcontents.

[notacon]

Gilmore and Woods were UFAs. Neither wanted to be back (Gilmore never wanted to be there in the first place). And Woods was a good WR but I never imagined he'd put up the numbers he did.

The other guys in their prime were Watkins, and arguably Dareus and Darby.

I know they were UFA. The point is that Bills cut them loose.

The "prime" of "Watkins, and arguably Dareus and Darby." was close to ****. Especially Watkins. The trade and decision to draft him was one of stupidest in Bills history...and there is a lot of competition for that before McBeane turned this franchise around from a laughingstock to a model to be emulated.

A reminder on just how awful the Watkins debacle was.

In 2014 the Bills sent the 9th overall in 2014 along with (inexplicably) 2015 1st and 4th round picks for the right to move up 5 spots to draft the porcelain doll Watkins. On the board when they picked Watkins at #4 were...

Khalil Mack
Mike Evans
Odell Beckham
Aaron Donald

Watkins NEVER started a whole 16 or 17 game season after his underwhelming rookie season. GM Doug Whaley made this ****ty move to try and salvage his other ****ty move the year before by panicking and reaching for EJ Manuel at #16 when he was more suited as a 3rd round project.

Ostensibly...or should I say....obstinately....desperately tried to prop up the crappy Manuel by giving him a supposedly elite WR. Watkins had elite speed and literately little else.

Whaley's record of drafts between 2013 and 2016 were terrible.

Beane traded away Watkins and Darby (the other player you mention as being in his "prime") with those trades defining and transforming what the Bills would become.

Beane sent Watkins and a 2018 6th round pick to LA Rams in exchange for the Rams 2018 2nd round pick and EJ Gaines. He sent Darby to Philly for a 3rd round pick and WR Jordan Matthews.

With extra day 2 picks in his pocket, it set up Beane to do all the maneuvering to move up in 2018 to draft Josh Allen. After trading Gordy Glenn and the Bills 2018 #21 (and a 2018 5th round) to Cincy for 2018 #12 overall (and their 2018 6th).

To get to #7 overall to get Allen, Beane sent the #12 (from the Cincy deal) #53 and #56 they got in the Watkins deal, to make the best draft pick of the Bills in decades.

In addition, Beane used the pick he got for Darby to draft Harrison Philips.

Getting rid of Watkins and Darby (in their "prime") and letting Gilmore and Woods walk were just what the Bills needed.

[Goobylal]

I know they were UFA. The point is that Bills cut them loose.

The "prime" of "Watkins, and arguably Dareus and Darby." was close to ****. Especially Watkins. The trade and decision to draft him was one of stupidest in Bills history...and there is a lot of competition for that before McBeane turned this franchise around from a laughingstock to a model to be emulated.

A reminder on just how awful the Watkins debacle was.

In 2014 the Bills sent the 9th overall in 2014 along with (inexplicably) 2015 1st and 4th round picks for the right to move up 5 spots to draft the porcelain doll Watkins. On the board when they picked Watkins at #4 were...

Khalil Mack
Mike Evans
Odell Beckham
Aaron Donald

Watkins NEVER started a whole 16 or 17 game season after his underwhelming rookie season. GM Doug Whaley made this ****ty move to try and salvage his other ****ty move the year before by panicking and reaching for EJ Manuel at #16 when he was more suited as a 3rd round project.

Ostensibly...or should I say....obstinately....desperately tried to prop up the crappy Manuel by giving him a supposedly elite WR. Watkins had elite speed and literately little else.

Whaley's record of drafts between 2013 and 2016 were terrible.

Beane traded away Watkins and Darby (the other player you mention as being in his "prime") with those trades defining and transforming what the Bills would become.

Beane sent Watkins and a 2018 6th round pick to LA Rams in exchange for the Rams 2018 2nd round pick and EJ Gaines. He sent Darby to Philly for a 3rd round pick and WR Jordan Matthews.

With extra day 2 picks in his pocket, it set up Beane to do all the maneuvering to move up in 2018 to draft Josh Allen. After trading Gordy Glenn and the Bills 2018 #21 (and a 2018 5th round) to Cincy for 2018 #12 overall (and their 2018 6th).

To get to #7 overall to get Allen, Beane sent the #12 (from the Cincy deal) #53 and #56 they got in the Watkins deal, to make the best draft pick of the Bills in decades.

In addition, Beane used the pick he got for Darby to draft Harrison Philips.

Getting rid of Watkins and Darby (in their "prime") and letting Gilmore and Woods walk were just what the Bills needed.

Dareus was just 27 while Watkins was 24. Those are prime ages. Hindsight says they never fulfilled their promise but at the time, people thought they Bills were giving away top talent in their prime and tanking for a QB. And both could have just needed a change of scenery. I sparred with a Bills fan who I liken to the Uncle Rico of GMs who was saying it was a mistake to trade both. And both were under contract with the Bills, unlike Gilmore and Woods, who would need to have been tagged and paid a ton more money.

And yes, the moves made that year set the stage for the Bills' immediate and sustained success.

[sukie]

They may have been in their promise at 27 and 25 but that is merely chronological. There was. Thing showing any sort of upward trend in Watkins game and getting back a second felt kinda dirty and evil in its larceny. Darius could have been a true disruptive beast. It just never happened.

[Goobylal]

They may have been in their promise at 27 and 25 but that is merely chronological. There was. Thing showing any sort of upward trend in Watkins game and getting back a second felt kinda dirty and evil in its larceny. Darius could have been a true disruptive beast. It just never happened.

Yes, prime age-wise. Again the difference being guys like Hyde, Poyer, White and Diggs etc. are past 30 and on the decline.

[notacon]

Dareus was just 27 while Watkins was 24. Those are prime ages. Hindsight says they never fulfilled their promise but at the time, people thought they Bills were giving away top talent in their prime and tanking for a QB. And both could have just needed a change of scenery. I sparred with a Bills fan who I liken to the Uncle Rico of GMs who was saying it was a mistake to trade both. And both were under contract with the Bills, unlike Gilmore and Woods, who would need to have been tagged and paid a ton more money.

And yes, the moves made that year set the stage for the Bills' immediate and sustained success.

Dareus was huge disappointment if not an outright bust. Watkins WAS a bust.

It may be true that (some) "people thought they Bills were giving away top talent in their prime and tanking for a QB."....I sure was not one of them.

In hindsight it shows that McBeane knew exactly what they were doing.

Just like they do now with the much needed "reset", that I suspect, in hindsight (even as soon as the 2024 playoffs), will be seen as JUST what the Bills needed.

It will start next week with the much anticipated draft. This sure looks a lot like what Beane did to prepare to draft Josh Allen. This time it will be to reload in WR and S and some depth, probably at EDGE and DT.

Back to "people thought they Bills were giving away top talent in their prime and tanking for a QB". It's really interesting to go back and see exactly what "people" were saying at that time.

This is three months before the Bills DID trade Watkins...

Should the Bills Trade Sammy Watkins

The thread starter said that "I'd be happy with a 2nd round pick in 2018." Which or course is what they got.

The post right after it said that "no one will trade for him...."

Of course, the broken record was saying the same crap back then...

This may come as a surprise to some of you, but we need players to put on the field. If we had traded Gilmore last year, who would have played CB? And how much would we have gotten for an average CB with just a year left on his contract?

Tyrod, Sammy, Dareus- we can cut/trade them but it's May. The draft is over and most of the best FA's already signed- who are we going to get that's equal or better before camp starts in 2 months?

After the Bills DID trade Watkins, here is that thread that has the reaction being somewhat mixed....most saying the "tank" was on, and other welcoming the trade....

Bills Trade Sammy

This post is hilarious in hindsight...

The tank is on!!!!

Sam Darnold in 2018!

This 'day two' thread is interesting too....

I like the trades a lot!

The talk about the team being "downgraded" from the some of same people that are saying the same thing today.


All of these predictions of doom and gloom were before the season started...before the roster was even close to being set. Just like today.

Fumy, but 2017 was the year the DROUGHT was finally ended. So the "tank" narrative was so silly.

Hat tip to Ingtar for this....

Personally I think Josh Allen is a better prospect, but we'll see how this season plays out.

Looking back sometimes is illuminating, and verifies my trepidation in valuing so many silly posts, especially those that put forward a definitive declaration as in 'this (fill in the blank...like..."the Bills will not make the playoffs this year" ) happen', when in reality, they don't have the first clue on what is going to happen.

I'm confident in taking most of what is said here with a grain of salt.