bye bye sabres?

[Typ0]

I'm sorry but some people don't miss the point at all. People who open businesses do take more risks but they also get more returns. That's the way it work's some people are more risk averse and they don't want to take the risks. But that doesn't mean they have taken on an inferior station in life and it doesn't mean that their purchasing power should be forced into gobbling up inferior services. You sound like you think you are the only real stakeholder here. People who work for others are the ones that earn the money not the owners like you say. You make it sound like the workers have no choice but to go to work for you because they are only workers and you are the owner. There are plenty of workers who have been screwed over by incompetent ownership and management. I guess they deserve it they didn't take any risks...after all they are only workers.

THe self employed don't have a magic tree in back that keeps the money going when the economy is bad. We work, and work.

I'm sure all the working folk chose their paths just because they get their own money tree.

Where some of you miss the point is, there's a lot of self employeed people in the area that are having it tough.

Oh break my heart. Everyone is having it tough my friend you seem to think you are isolated in your frustrations. I'm certain all the unemployed are just over joyed at how well things are going for them.

THink about it this way, how many people sit in the arena versus the stadium? Even on a bad day for the bills the stadium has a lot of people at a game. For the amount that go to hockey, it's like a drop in the bucket compared to football.

RWS: 75,000 tickets times 8 games = 600,000 tickets available throught the box office.

HSBC: 20000 tickets to 42 games = 820,000 tickets available through the box office.



About the aud, a professional hockey team could not survive in the Aud. You need to look into a concept called life-cycles and the economic perils of reviving the old instead of moving on. Rebuilding the Aud for the team would just be a huge waste of money and subject them to certain peril. At least the arena gives them a fighting chance. The Sabres deal is either going to work with the Arena or it isn't going to work at all. Pumping a lot of cash into the Aud is like putting a band-aid on a severed leg. Very sound financial advice.

[TonyBuffalo]

I think you missed my point a little. Your right on some points, I'm talking more about the "White collar" politicians, and the white collar "goverment supervisors".

WHen you have a gauranteed high salary, you are not as motivated to get off your ass to make things better. Just look at the waste disposal group in amherst. THe "Supervisor" just didn't want the new waste processing equipment to work. Apparently he never wanted to learn the proper way to run the equipment and it turned into a $60,000 a month venture. Now that the right person is running the equipment it's producing how it should and costing more like $1500 a month.

It's no all goverment workers, or unions. It's the few that set a bad example. go to www.realamherst.com or www.politicswny.com. THey are both a little flaky but some of the stuff is true.

And as for risk, yes we have a better chance to make more, but we are taking the risk. Anyone can, so don't blow smoke and say that's our reward.

I risk my money and that is what it is, then have our local leaders give tax breaks to bring a competitor in right across the street from me that is wrong. Specially when they get a tax cut and or a grant to do so. DOn't use my money against me.

We are not talking protecting the homeland or the poor. Look how close we got to giving adelphia all that money. Just think, we could of handed over millions and they could of stole that too. I noticed the great backgroud checks the goverment does. :)

[Typ0]

I hear you there is way too much incompetence in government and corporate america. I have no idea how some people get in the positions they get in. I'll tell you one thing people value good looks a lot more than they do abilities. If someone can talk a good line of BS and dresses well they stand a good chance of moving up the ladder and ending up in a position where they are responsible for other peoples fates. Presentation is everything. I'm sure you can cite contrary arguements but there are ten times as many examples. It is these white collar people who control everything and basically make all the significant decisions. In some ways we are really on the same page here. It's just that there are business owners who are tyrrants, horde everything for themselves, use their gains to assert political power and then turn around and start telling people they are the reason our society is successful. As far as I am concerned no one person is more important than another I don't care if they are Bill Gates or the homeless guy on the corner. Don't neccesarily think I am classifying you in any type of group here either because I am not really talking about you. I am talking about social attitudes.

What I am saying is our plight should be against bad management and incompetence not the Sabres. That is the tone I hear from you. You seem to think we should just give up on the sabres because of decades of political ineptness. What I am saying is we should cherish the opportunity to have a professional hockey team in Buffalo and push towards getting the management and leadership it takes to make the project successful. I'm not saying keep the team if there is no way it can be successful...but I have never seen any hard data saying it can't and I believe Hammister is not going to throw his life into a sinking ship. Therefore, he is making some assertions about what it is going to take to make it successful. Now the city has to evaluate if it's viable or not...but just saying no it isn't viable because we would be spending taxpayers money and the political machine has proven they can't do anything right not only could cost the city a valuable asset but also fails to address the correct problem.

Don't get me wrong Tony I'm all for your success. I understand the challenges faced by businesses of all sizes. You work hard and you deserve to be in an economic environment that at least doesn't leave you wondering what is going to happen to you tomorrow. But does this situation with the Sabres really impact it all that negatively as you are saying? Is it really too much for you to spend an extra 10 cents a year for the next three years to improve the quality of life of millions of blue-collar workers in a blue-collar town? If the deal is put together properly in the long run the taxpayers are the ones who will ultimately benefit because the franchise will generate revenues for the city. What if you get a 4 cent return for the rest of your life is that worth your 30 cent contribution? What if your children get to go to better schools with better teachers? That's the bottom line--the net present value of all the projected cash flows from the franchise. Some things are very hard to measure but if this city doesn't fight to keep the sabres I'll tell you right now the Bills will be the next to leave, the UB football program will fold and the theatres will start closing. People have to make a choice if they want to spiral downward into a ghost town or rise up into a resepectable community.

We are talking about trying to keep a bigger star on the map next to western new york. Frankly, if people don't want to persue that I think they should move into the hills in the deep south, make corn mash whiskey and smoke a corn cob pipe.

[TonyBuffalo]

Right,

But it's more than 30 cents. It's the 30 cents here and there that add up.

I would love to have a hockey team, or any team but seeing our local leaders latly are just a cluster duk, it makes it hard to give someone money thats a part of the group.

It was wrong that hamister bided well knowing he needed money. That should of been on the table before the bid. Problem is they want to maximize the amount of profit they will make while in turn probally not give anything to the comunity back. Will we see lower ticket prices? will we see parking in the new ramp at 4 bucks for all event seeing it's owned by the county? I bet not. Will we see skate nights open to all the inner city kids for free or at least sponsered by local businesses at very very reduced at cost pricing? this would instill in these kids why they should work hard and learn. If they always get to look at hte place but never experience, there's no point.

Someone made a point about 600,000 ticket at bills game and then 800,000 tickets from hockey. When ever, even when the sabres were average did they sell out all the games ? i dont know, but what year had the highest accountable paid attendance? Not attendance that had supplement tickets given to all adelphia employees to fill the seats.

ALso, why the hell is the food and items so costly? It has to be where the average person in buffalo can go and not spend thier weeks paycheck for a family of 5 or so. I went to one concert and the beer was like 6 bucks and flat. I would of rather paid 3 bucks for a cheap can of beer versus the stale draft beer they had.


Soda at 3 to 4 bucks a glass. give me a break, a liter bottle is a buck. IF they allowed people to bring thier own snacks, then the normal blue collared people would go and acutally not get ripped on those items. If they were reasonably priced people wouldn't bother to bring anything anyhow.

I would love them to play in the arena, sometimes things just can't be afforded and must go.

Also, all and any books have to be open to the public if public money is at risk. Just because you can make money in one business enviroment, it doesn't mean you can make money on a hockey team.

Now with that in question... do the destroyers make money? I dont have a clue how that works.

T