Where do we go FA or Draft

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  • kgun12
    Registered User
    • Jul 2002
    • 11315

    #16
    Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

    Originally posted by Woodman View Post
    Draft pick impact!

    Do we have the right coaches to take advantage of such an event?

    If not we better make a change sooner rather than later.
    Not sure but even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in awhile!
    Retired Air Traffic Controller
    USAF VETERAN
    DAV

    Comment

    • Woodman
      Legendary Zoner
      • Apr 2014
      • 65878

      #17
      Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

      Originally posted by kgun12 View Post
      Not sure but even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in awhile!
      My question is if we do succeed and find the animal we all hope for.

      Do we have the right coach in place to take advantage of this animal's skill?


      Or did you already answer that

      “It breaks your heart when someone leaves and you don’t know why.”

      "It may be raining but there's a rainbow above you"


      Former President Donald Trump early Thursday touted the results of a new NPR/PBSNewsHour/Marist poll showing him ahead of President Joe Biden by 8 percentage points among independents.

      Comment

      • Mace
        Haha...yeah you think so ?
        • Mar 2013
        • 20314

        #18
        Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

        It's just my opinion, but I think we've patched via FA as far as we can and they need a draft pipeline of young talent. We're using too many people other people drafted and it's not cost effective or sustainable beyond one year "go for broke" which just won't work under the timid and inflexible McDermott and Frazier, and it's going to get Allen hurt. They need to re evaluate how they're building their roster and it doesn't scream "splash signing" entering the 7th year of a program when a team should be polished and hitting on all cylinders. They aren't going to polish it with FA because they've been trying and can't.

        Comment

        • jamze132
          Registered User
          • Jun 2003
          • 29290

          #19
          Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

          Well the good news is, it shouldn’t cost $15m per season to match Edmunds stats. A
          The occasional pick or sack to go along with a hundred or so tackles is not $15m. Hell, he should lose money every time he plugs the wrong hole.

          Comment

          • notacon
            Registered User
            • Aug 2012
            • 32991

            #20
            Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

            Originally posted by jamze132 View Post
            Well the good news is, it shouldn’t cost $15m per season to match Edmunds stats. A
            The occasional pick or sack to go along with a hundred or so tackles is not $15m. Hell, he should lose money every time he plugs the wrong hole.
            “Stats” don’t win games or form a good defense. Extremely good players like Tremaine Edmunds DO. They do not grow on trees and are not cheap.

            The “tackles” stat (the way some confused “fans” try to use it, as compared to other teams) is the most useless and irrelevant stat for defensive players. It is totally irrelvent how many tackles any Bills players have as compared to other teams’s players.

            ALL that matters is how many tackles a Bills player has compared to other Bills players.

            And Edmunds has led the team in tackles (avg per game....he had less tackles one season (2020, Poyer 124 for 16 games, Edmunds 119 in 15 games, because he played one less games) every single year in his career.

            In 2022, he led the team in tackles over the #2 (Milano) despite playing two fewer games.

            THAT is what matters. An no amount of cherry picking irrelevant stats will change that fact....the stat that really matters.

            Comment

            • notacon
              Registered User
              • Aug 2012
              • 32991

              #21
              Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

              Originally posted by Ed View Post
              A simple restructure of Allen's base salary will get them under the cap, and then there are multiple other moves that will create some spending room. I don't expect any big moves, but they'll get some re-signings done and bring in a few mid-tier guys.

              I expect Edmunds to be the priority re-signing and based on how Beane and McD talk about him I think it will get done. Keep in mind that Von Miller's 6 year $120 mil deal last year only had a $5 mil cap hit in year 1. Even if Edmunds gets a high APY contract they can structure it to work for 2023.
              Exactly!!!

              Comment

              • justasportsfan
                Registered User
                • Jul 2002
                • 71579

                #22
                Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

                Originally posted by kgun12 View Post
                I was referring to your comment on our DRAFT picks don’t make a significant impact. That’s why I said this: “ Maybe we’re due to hit on immediate impact player.”
                sacrifice1
                https://theinterviewwithgod.com/video/

                Comment

                • justasportsfan
                  Registered User
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 71579

                  #23
                  Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

                  Originally posted by jamze132 View Post
                  Well the good news is, it shouldn’t cost $15m per season to match Edmunds stats. A
                  The occasional pick or sack to go along with a hundred or so tackles is not $15m. Hell, he should lose money every time he plugs the wrong hole.
                  the thing about Edmunds is that he affects a qb's decision to throw his way because of his size and athleticism. His problem is , the lack of big plays when it comes his way. For 15 million per year, he should be a player OCs pan for. He isnt.
                  sacrifice1
                  https://theinterviewwithgod.com/video/

                  Comment

                  • sukie
                    Seriously?
                    • Sep 2012
                    • 21503

                    #24
                    Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

                    Originally posted by justasportsfan View Post
                    the thing about Edmunds is that he affects a qb's decision to throw his way because of his size and athleticism. His problem is , the lack of big plays when it comes his way. For 15 million per year, he should be a player OCs pan for. He isnt.
                    He’s an expensive scarecrow.

                    Comment

                    • Bill Cody
                      Registered User
                      • Sep 2004
                      • 11885

                      #25
                      Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

                      Originally posted by sukie View Post
                      He’s an expensive scarecrow.
                      download.jpeg

                      That's harsh

                      Comment

                      • ParanoidAndroid
                        My battery is low and it's getting dark.
                        • Apr 2004
                        • 16833

                        #26
                        Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

                        We need a scheme shift to a 4-3-4 base.

                        Can Taron Johnson play safety? He's one of our best defenders and has great range. Ditching the nickel base would leave him off the field.

                        Put Milano in the middle, Bernard weakside and let Klein play Strong side. We would need depth to back that up, especially the outside spots. Spector could possibly back up the middle.

                        It's asking a lot but wouldn't that better fit the strengths of the people we have? All the while freeing up Edmunds cap hit to upgrade elsewhere?

                        Throwing stuff at the wall....
                        Last edited by ParanoidAndroid; 02-01-2023, 01:59 PM.

                        Comment

                        • notacon
                          Registered User
                          • Aug 2012
                          • 32991

                          #27
                          Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

                          Originally posted by justasportsfan View Post
                          the thing about Edmunds is that he affects a qb's decision to throw his way because of his size and athleticism. His problem is , the lack of big plays when it comes his way. For 15 million per year, he should be a player OCs pan for. He isnt.
                          Except he IS a player “OC’s plan for”. And QB’s are affected by his presence.

                          Comment

                          • ParanoidAndroid
                            My battery is low and it's getting dark.
                            • Apr 2004
                            • 16833

                            #28
                            Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

                            Originally posted by notacon View Post
                            Except he IS a player “OC’s plan for”. And QB’s are affected by his presence.
                            If they do, it seems to be working much of the time.

                            Comment

                            • notacon
                              Registered User
                              • Aug 2012
                              • 32991

                              #29
                              Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

                              Originally posted by ParanoidAndroid View Post
                              We need a scheme shift to a 4-3-4 base.

                              Can Taron Johnson play safety? He's one of our best defenders and has great range. Ditching the nickel base would leave him off the field.

                              Put Milano in the middle, Bernard weakside and let Klein play Strong side. We would need depth to back that up, especially the outside spots. Spector could possibly back up the middle.

                              It's asking a lot but wouldn't that better fit the strengths of the people we have? All the while freeing up Edmunds cap hit to upgrade elsewhere?

                              Throwing stuff at the wall....
                              Yeah....throwing stuff at the wall is right.

                              "Milano in the middle, Bernard weakside and let Klein play Strong side” would be a disaster.


                              Putting two players on the field that are sub-average (and Bernard is worse than sub-average....he got buried in the depth chart because he is just not nearly good enough to be on the filed for defense...at least so far)....to replace an extremely effective player that has gotten better every year and it a integral part of the defense?!?!?


                              We have already seen, when Milano is on the filed, but Edmonds isn’t, the defense is noticeably weaker and performs worse. When the opposite is seen, Edmunds on the field and Milano is not, the defense does not perform as well as with him (of course) but not as much of the fall off as when Edmunds is not with him.


                              There was a
                              noticeable falloff in the second half of the Minny game when Edmunds got injured.....


                              The Edmunds departure was even more notable on film

                              One of the primary observations we had after the game was how much the Bills missed starting middle linebacker Tremaine Edmunds in run defending. It was especially apparent in real time after Dalvin Cook’s 81-yard touchdown run. But the degree in which they missed him both as a run defender and in pass coverage stood out a great deal after watching the All-22. The drop-off from Edmunds to his backup Tyrel Dodson in pass coverage was an extreme one. In the first half, Edmunds was routinely reading the keys of Vikings quarterback Kirk Cousins, which sometimes triggered him to turn his back and go find the defender to break up an oncoming pass. His reaction time, speed, and length were all plus attributes of that first half and a big part of how the Bills bottled up the Vikings so successfully through 30 minutes. With Dodson, his reactions just seemed a quarter of a second later than Edmunds, leading to multiple opportunities in the middle of the field on some clutch third-down chances. He also lost his assignment on a man-to-man coverage rep that led to another easy Vikings first down.


                              Edmunds’ overall importance to the defense has proved more significant than ever this year, and much has to do without the Bills’ usual safety duo of Micah Hyde and Jordan Poyer being in the lineup. Defensive coordinator Leslie Frazier called Edmunds one of the team’s “best players,” underscoring how important they view him within their scheme. Edmunds is of course, a free agent at the end of the season, and opinions outside the building on him are split. But especially if the Bills are planning for life without Hyde or Poyer, or both, in the next two seasons, they might not want to start over at the middle linebacker position as well. Edmunds’ strong play this season and how he’s impacted the opponent’s passing attack adds another layer to an already complicated offseason question.


                              And “ditching the nickel base” that facilitates taking the very effective Taron Johnson off the field????


                              The 4-2-5 scheme has worked extremely well for the Bills, despite the chatter from some here.

                              I’m going to make a "bold prediction" (that is really not that bold)....the Bills WILL continue to use the 4-2-5 scheme. There is little doubt that they WILL retain Edmunds....although it is not 100%....I suspect that Beane, McDermott and Frazier want him back BADLY and will do everything within their power to do so.


                              If Edmunds goes, the defense will take a HUGE step backwards.






                              - - - Updated - - -

                              Originally posted by ParanoidAndroid View Post
                              If they do, it seems to be working much of the time.
                              Not true.

                              Comment

                              • notacon
                                Registered User
                                • Aug 2012
                                • 32991

                                #30
                                Re: Where do we go FA or Draft

                                BTW....the two games the past two seasons that saw the Bills allowing the most points were both missing Edmunds.

                                As I posted about above, Edmunds missing the second half of the Minnesota loss was HUGE. More facts about that.....

                                The 33 points allowed was the most for any game in 2022. And almost all of that was AFTER Edmunds left the game.

                                1st half that he is playing, the Bills lead 24-10. Minny only scored 10 points. 2nd half, after Edmunds is not on the filed, they score TWENTY THREEE (vs the dismal Bills six). The MOST points allowed by the Bills in the a half of a game all year.

                                Yes, the offense failed miserly in that game, and had the win in their pocket until Allen fumbles the snap.

                                BUT, it is obvious that it probably would not have depended on that kneel down snap IF Edmunds was on the field.

                                That’s not the worst of it. Add to that (most points allowed in a 2022 game)....look at 2021. THE worst defensive performance of the season, allowing the MOST points in THAT season, FORTY ONE vs Indy in week #11....Edmunds was NOT on the field. Here is the All-22 analysis for THAT debacle...


                                Bills desperately missing Tremaine Edmunds

                                Bills defensive tackles deserve a lot of blame for not holding up in the middle of the defense, but linebacker A.J. Klein was simply dreadful all game. The Colts routinely forced Klein a step too far to the wrong side, and when he tried to battle back against the oncoming offensive lineman to help make a stop, Klein rarely was able to get off the block before it was too late. He was invisible on far too many rushing attempts, and then when he had some tackle attempts, he failed to get a definitive stop. On some plays, he missed the tackle altogether. Klein was the worst-graded player on the field Sunday, and that’s saying something because of how much the Bills struggled. It also showed how important starter Tremaine Edmunds has become for the Bills.

                                The Bills were able to get by without Edmunds against the Jaguars and Jets because those running games aren’t nearly as prolific as that of the Colts. Edmunds has greatly improved his ability to deal with physicality this year and in how he has worked off blocks. He has also fired to the rushing lanes with confidence much more often than previously in his career. On top of those improvements, Edmunds is a far superior athlete to Klein and can challenge oncoming offensive linemen and running backs in a way that Klein simply cannot. Against a high-powered rushing attack, the Bills desperately need Edmunds in the lineup for how he confronts the opposing blocking schemes. While it wasn’t the case earlier in Edmunds’ career, it is now.

                                That’s two seasons in a row, THE games, each season, allowing the most defense points BOTH did not have Edmunds playing the whole game.

                                That is NOT a coincidence. The reality is crystal clear....the Bills defense is better when Edmunds plays and worse when he does not.

                                To those that are hoping that he walks next year, you are inviting a significant drop-off in the team defense.

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