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Leslie Frazier visits with Packers, Commanders, Giants
I have all the facts on my side. I have presented them over and over and over again. You choose to ignore them.
You have no facts on your side. Hell this thread alone destroys everything you've said since Frazier said he left to take a year off...and then goes and interviews with not one but three teams. You think he was interviewing for next year? LOL!
None of that speculation is supported by the facts. In fact, from what we know, the opposite is true.
They hired Al Holcomb as a 'senior defensive assistant'...not filling a position at the time, creating one for him...on February 9th, about two weeks after the embarrassing loss to the Bengals. Leslie Frazier 'stepped down' almost a full three weeks later. This management doesn't do anything without study and forethought, so it's extremely not likely his departure came as a surprise in between those two days, it's a much larger possibility that a decision was made very shortly after the season was ended. It would also be very unlikely that Frazier would voluntarily take himself out of an active network that is his best path to a head job elsewhere, new HC hires are...by a large margin...currently employed by another team.
Those are facts.
Whether Frazier went to McD after the season and said 'I need a break', or McD went to Leslie and said 'We need to change' is not known, but regardless of the conversation the former represents quitting and the latter getting fired.
I still think they worked together to do what they felt was best for the team and Frazier...he doesn't have to suffer the embarrassment of getting demoted or fired, he can explore the market without that stain added to his resume', and if he does get a job Buffalo should get draft pick compensation.
YardRat Wall of Fame #56 DARRYL TALLEY #29 DERRICK BURROUGHS#22 FRED JACKSON #95 KYLE WILLIAMS
You have no facts on your side. Hell this thread alone destroys everything you've said since Frazier said he left to take a year off...and then goes and interviews with not one but three teams. You think he was interviewing for next year? LOL!
I have ALL the facts in my side.
It is a BLATANT LIE that he "goes and interviews with not one but three teams”.
ALL you have is bullcrap, speculation, conjecture and PURE LIES!!!!
They hired Al Holcomb as a 'senior defensive assistant'...not filling a position at the time, creating one for him...on February 9th, about two weeks after the embarrassing loss to the Bengals. Leslie Frazier 'stepped down' almost a full three weeks later. This management doesn't do anything without study and forethought, so it's extremely not likely his departure came as a surprise in between those two days, it's a much larger possibility that a decision was made very shortly after the season was ended. It would also be very unlikely that Frazier would voluntarily take himself out of an active network that is his best path to a head job elsewhere, new HC hires are...by a large margin...currently employed by another team.
Those are facts.
Whether Frazier went to McD after the season and said 'I need a break', or McD went to Leslie and said 'We need to change' is not known, but regardless of the conversation the former represents quitting and the latter getting fired.
I still think they worked together to do what they felt was best for the team and Frazier...he doesn't have to suffer the embarrassment of getting demoted or fired, he can explore the market without that stain added to his resume', and if he does get a job Buffalo should get draft pick compensation.
The only “facts” you present are:
"They hired Al Holcomb as a 'senior defensive assistant'...not filling a position at the time, creating one for him...on February 9th” & " Leslie Frazier 'stepped down' almost a full three weeks later” All the rest is speculation and conjecture based on nothing except what’s in your own head.
Reports are that Frazier is trying to get back into coaching and has visited the packers and commanders while visiting the giants today
So he didnt take a "year off", like the initial narrative was
This mixed with all the reports coming out of buffalo saying "the defense will be geared towards a more attacking and aggressive defense", with mcdermott, when we know fraziers history of being a more conservative defense, shows that this was definitely closer to a "firing", than Frazier wanting a break
So notty, im pretty sure this proves our point that Frazier was fired, so lets embrace McDermotts D and acknowledge Fraziers defense wasnt providing the scheme that McDermott was trying to implement
How does this “prove” that he “didnt [sic] take a year off”?? And how does this prove that Frazier was fired???
The short answer….it doesn’t. Not in the least.
Unfortunately, you seem to be blowing out of proportion both what is happening here andespeciallywhat it means.Yes, Frazier’s intention wasalways“getting back into coaching”. He’s said so several times......preferably for a head coaching position and after he took a year off.
Looks like I have to explain the what is really going once again….using the facts that are knowable instead of making wild assumptions from half-baked logic based on misunderstood snippets of information.
I have to warn you that intelligent concepts take more than a few bumper sticker slogans to explain complex issues thoroughly, so this post necessarily has more words than the “Cliff Notes” crowd can handle. That’s their problem and why “half-baked logic based on misunderstood snippets of information” is their badge of dishonor. Frazier IS “trying to get back into coaching” and has said that many times since he announced his one-year step back. That has ALWAYS been the stated goal and WHY he said he was not retiring but taking a leave from coaching. That is no secret!!!
So that makes your initial revelation “Frazier is trying to get back into coaching” rather nonsensical. With two extremely critical caveats.
#1. that it is much preferable to do so (and he has not specifically said if this is a deal breaker, but it sure sounds like it) as a HEAD COACH. Or, at the least in a “different capacity”
The obvious foundation of his frustration is, like many Black coaches in the NFL, of being passed over for the HC job.
#2. His return would be after taking a year off.What these visits do NOT do (in any way) is “prove your point” that he was “fired” OR prove that he is not taking a year off are the recent visit with three teams.
Why???
Well, that would take one actually paying attention to what has gone on recently, what Frazier has said (in public and on the record) in addition to the NFL’s dedicated (and very public) effort to encourage Black coaches to be hired as head coaches and other high-level position on NFL teams.As was reported quite widely, during the recent NFL Owners meetings, they conducted, for the second year in a row, the “Coach Accelerator” program. It was announced by the NFL on May 17, 2023….
In continuation of the NFL's commitment to promoting greater diversity across the NFL, the league announced plans to host a Coach Accelerator on May 21-23 at the Spring League Meeting in Minneapolis. The Spring Accelerator follows the inaugural Coach and Front Office Accelerator and the Front Office Accelerator hosted at previous league meetings in 2022.
The Coach Accelerator aims to increase exposure between owners, executives, and diverse coaching talent, providing ample opportunity to develop and build upon their relationships. In a change to the nomination process this year, clubs were able to nominate those from outside of their organization.
The 40 participants this year are attending based on their high potential to be considered for a head coach position in the future. Sixteen of the participants will be returning from the May 2022 Accelerator cohort.In addition to networking, further development of the participants is a critical component of the accelerator, with curated content sessions scheduled that will further engage each participant on the advancement of their executive leadership skills and business acumen.
The 40 Black coach participants included 37 NFL coaches that are currently employed by a NFL team, including Kelly Skipper, the current RB coach for the Bills.
The other three were not presently employed by a NFL team, but have extensive NFL coaching experience.
Obviously, every one of the 40 Black coaches that attended want to progress up the ranks in the NFL and the three that are not presently on a team are “trying to get back into coaching”.
The idea that since Frazier is visiting three teams in June that he is NOT going to take that year off is rather silly.
Why???
NFL teams do not hire coaches in June….their staff is set, and they are conducing OTA’s and getting ready for training camp and the upcoming season. The cake is almost fully baked in June for every NFL team.
For Frazier, who has stated his desire to be a HC, he is not pining for another DC job. In any event, every single team in the NFL already has a DC in place….except one. The Bills.
In fact, the dedicated effort by the NFL to have more Black HC’s is based on “increased exposure between owners, executives, and diverse coaching talent, providing ample opportunity to develop and build upon their relationships.”.
That is what the “Rooney Rule" is all about. The hope that qualified Black coaches interacting via interviews with (almost) all white owners would foster relationships for future openings, or when owners get together and they talk about the interaction they had with this or that Black coach.
That furthering of “increased exposure” to owners to qualified Black coaches is what the recent team visits by Frazier is all about. Plus the fact that theINTENTIONfor Frazier to conduct these visits were reported a week after the Coach Accelerator program (and a week before his now reported “visits” 5/30/23) as was Frazier’s hope to “interview for head coaching jobs in 2024”
The report by Albert Breer including an interview with Frazier tells the story (which disproves your half-baked theory)….
Frazier’s in an interesting place right now. He decided to take this year off after serving as Sean McDermott’s defensive coordinator for the past six years in Buffalo and, as you’d think, as he settled into spending more time at his offseason home in California, it wasn’t the most comfortable thing at first.
Frazier has spent his past 35 years, more than half of his life, coaching football.“Man, early on, this is the third month. So for me, that first month or two, it was hard, man, just trying to find my rhythm and getting used to having free time,” Frazier says. “It’s been so long, more than 30 years, since I haven’t been on a schedule this time of the year. So it was a challenge just trying to figure out what to do with myself. But over the last three or four weeks, things have gotten a lot better as far as me being organized in how I want to spend my time. And I’m thankful for it, just very, very thankful that I can do this.
“I’m so grateful that I’m in a position where we can step back and not be sweating about finances. So, just very thankful.”
He’ll start to put the free time to use this week in heading out to visit old coaching friends, with his focus on using that experience, and experiences like the accelerator, to get in the mix for jobs in January.
Maybe it happens for him. Maybe it doesn’t. Either way, he’s at peace with where he’s at.
“I really feel good about where I am,” he says. “I think my reasons for stepping away were the right reasons; I feel good about it. It just gives me a chance to see things from a different perspective, get recharged again and reenergized. I’m gonna go watch some teams in their OTAs, will probably do the same thing again in training camp, go visit some clubs as well. And then in the fall, I will really begin to take a look at what’s happening around the league, make sure I stay up on any new trends, anything that’s changing.
“And, hopefully, an owner will give me a chance to talk to him about an opportunity. If that doesn’t happen, I’m good. I’ve had a good career. I’m good. My goal is to be a head coach. I know I don’t have much time left, I’m at an age [64] where it seems like owners are going younger and younger, but I think I have some things I can bring to the table. We’ll see what happens"
Yeah…Frazier is doing exactly what he said he was going to do….”go watch some teams in their OTAs, will probably do the same thing again in training camp, go visit some clubs as well” all in a dedicated effort to achieve “my goal is to be a head coach” and positioning himself for a HC job in 2024.
So, no, what has been happening with Frazier does NOT, in any way, shape or form “prove” that he was “fired” or ESPECIALLY that he “didnt [sic] take a "year off".
He could be offered a HC job during the season when the inevitable firing of a HC during the seasons takes place….four in 2022, two in 2021, three in 2020…etc…etc… and that would obviously make his vow to sit out one year moot.
"They hired Al Holcomb as a 'senior defensive assistant'...not filling a position at the time, creating one for him...on February 9th” & " Leslie Frazier 'stepped down' almost a full three weeks later” All the rest is speculation and conjecture based on nothing except what’s in your own head.
- - - Updated - - -
"He interviewed with other teams shortly after leaving” is a BLATANT LIE. Shows how weak your false narrative is.
I quoted from that interview in my post above. The Buffalo News story was based on the SI article that I linked to.
What EXACTLY is in that article that is "Straight from his mouth” and shows that..."so please STFU.”?!?!?
I can answer that question.
NOTHING!!!
Jesus. I even bolded and increased the size of the font so what Frazier SAID would be easily understood.....that, again, refute the crap being heaped on him.
What exactly is your point and what in the Buffalo News artilce (again, based on the SI artilce that I posted) proves your point and refutes mine????
Re: Leslie Frazier visits with Packers, Commanders, Giants
I generally take things at face value, as I took the announcement of Frazier taking a year off. Obviously, that announcement was just a way for both team and Frazier to appear to be amicable about parting ways. I don't know if Frazier wanted out because he didn't appreciate McDermott meddling in the defense or the Bills pressured him to leave because McDermott didn't like his work as DC. I don't really care which it was.
I've made up my mind. Don't confuse me with the facts.
I'm the most reasonable poster here. If you don't agree, I'll be forced to have a hissy fit.
I generally take things at face value, as I took the announcement of Frazier taking a year off. Obviously, that announcement was just a way for both team and Frazier to appear to be amicable about parting ways. I don't know if Frazier wanted out because he didn't appreciate McDermott meddling in the defense or the Bills pressured him to leave because McDermott didn't like his work as DC. I don't really care which it was.
Your post contradicts itself in ways that are unreconcilable.
If you "generally take things at face value, as I took the announcement of Frazier taking a year off.”, then it can't be “obvious” (which it is NOT) that the "announcement was just a way for both team and Frazier to appear to be amicable about parting ways.”.
Taking things at face value and what Frazier (and Beane and sports media insiders close to the team) means taking things at face value.
Frazier’s overriding goal is to get a HC position. It is no secret. He interviewed for several HC jobs in the past (REAL formal interviews, which have a specific meaning in the NFL, not just visits), and like many very qualified Black candidates, got passed over by White owners hiring White coaches.
The hiring process for HC is warped in the NFL (besides the absurd dearth of Black HC’s) in that the interview and hiring frenzy starts the day after the regular season ends (when almost all of the HC opening take place), while all the better teams are getting ready for the playoffs.
Despite playoff coaches interviewing for HC jobs DURING the playoffs (which is insane) the further a team stays in the playoffs the bigger the disadvantage for getting hired as a HC.
Most of the HC jobs are filled while the playoffs are still being played out.
As I mentioned above….in fact, the dedicated effort by the NFL to have more Black HC’s is based on “increased exposure between owners, executives, and diverse coaching talent, providing ample opportunity to develop and build upon their relationships.”.
That is what the “Rooney Rule" is all about. The hope that qualified Black coaches interacting via interviews with (almost) all white owners would foster relationships for future openings, or when owners get together and they talk about the interaction they had with this or that Black coach.
Frazier taking a year off was obviously to further that goal to be considered for a HC job for 2024 by “increased exposure” to owners and teams…which he could only do if he was not occupied with the 14 to 16-hour day, seven days a week job of DC on a contending team.
That time off gave him a better opportunity to attend the NFL coach accelerator program, and to visit clubs during their OTA’s…and, as Frazier also said he is planning on doing….visiting teams during training camp.
An impossibility while doing the job of DC.
“Taking things at face value” means taking things at face value which is pretty easy to do concerning the Frazier situation since he told us what he was going to do, and then did it…..and the narrative was verified by Beane and sports media insiders close to the club.
NOT taking things at face value means assuming that many people with integrity are lying through their teeth over and over again.
Re: Leslie Frazier visits with Packers, Commanders, Giants
I took the announcement at face value when the announcement was made. If Frazier is out job hunting now as reports seem to indicate, it appears that "face value" wasn't the way to take the announcement. If Frazier is out job hunting in the NFL, it looks to me as if the announcement in January was a coverup for one of two things. Either Frazier wanted to leave or the Bills wanted to get rid of him. It looks now as if the announcement was just a way to keep the Bills and Frazier from looking bad. For several months, though, I just assumed Frazier wanted some time off whether or not he returned to the bills.
I've made up my mind. Don't confuse me with the facts.
I'm the most reasonable poster here. If you don't agree, I'll be forced to have a hissy fit.
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I have all the facts on my side. I have presented them over and over and over again. You choose to ignore them.
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