If we draft Leon Hall, the Youboty pick last year is a complete waste

[Coach Sal]

Several mocks now have us drafting Leon Hall (CB; MICH), including Rick Gosselin's latest mock.

With the rumors that Willis may be gone by 12, this may be a possibility.

And if it happens, I'll be totally pissed because that would mean we completely and totally wasted our 3rd round pick last year by drafting Ashton Youboty.

The whole point of drafting Youboty when we did was because we knew Clements was probably gone after 2006 and wanted to get a head-start on at least developing his replacement. Get Youboty in the system for a year and he can be a little more seasoned when it comes time to replace Nate (NOW!).

If we draft Hall, it would be for the same reason....to offset the loss of Clements. That would mean a 3rd round pick - plus an entire year of developing him both physically and mentally - would be a completely wasted.

[L.A. Playa]

Several mocks now have us drafting Leon Hall (CB; MICH), including Rick Gosselin's latest mock.

With the rumors that Willis may be gone by 12, this may be a possibility.

And if it happens, I'll be totally pissed because that would mean we completely and totally wasted our 3rd round pick last year by drafting Ashton Youboty.

The whole point of drafting Youboty when we did was because we knew Clements was probably gone after 2006 and wanted to get a head-start on at least developing his replacement. Get Youboty in the system for a year and he can be a little more seasoned when it comes time to replace Nate (NOW!).

If we draft Hall, it would be for the same reason....to offset the loss of Clements. That would mean a 3rd round pick - plus an entire year of developing him both physically and mentally - would be a completely wasted.

why would it be ??? Mc Gee looked like crap last year and probably is really no better than a nickle or dime back in the NFL, the Bills starting CB's could be Hall and Youboty if Hall is drafted

[Carlton Bailey]

Hall is terrible, in my opinion. I like Revis, because he can be an ideal replacement for Clements with his size and physicality.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Several mocks now have us drafting Leon Hall (CB; MICH), including Rick Gosselin's latest mock.

With the rumors that Willis may be gone by 12, this may be a possibility.

And if it happens, I'll be totally pissed because that would mean we completely and totally wasted our 3rd round pick last year by drafting Ashton Youboty.

The whole point of drafting Youboty when we did was because we knew Clements was probably gone after 2006 and wanted to get a head-start on at least developing his replacement. Get Youboty in the system for a year and he can be a little more seasoned when it comes time to replace Nate (NOW!).

If we draft Hall, it would be for the same reason....to offset the loss of Clements. That would mean a 3rd round pick - plus an entire year of developing him both physically and mentally - would be a completely wasted.
Would it be a complete waste if Youboty becomes a solid Nickel back? 3rd round corners are never a guarantee to be a good starter.

[Dont drink the water]

This just means they are attacking the offense with speed rotating CBs to keep them fresh not necessarily a bad pick if both players can play well.

[Pinkerton Security]

i dont want to draft leon hall. period. but it would not be a waste of the youboty pick. if that if your reasoning, then picking okoye or branch would be 10 times worse since we are more deep at that position AND we drafted a DT in the first AND 5th rounds last year.

[Don't Panic]

I will bet 500 ZBs we don't draft a CB anywhere in the 1st round.

[Coach Sal]

why would it be ??? Mc Gee looked like crap last year and probably is really no better than a nickle or dime back in the NFL, the Bills starting CB's could be Hall and Youboty if Hall is drafted

McGee didn't have as good of an 06 as he did an 05, I agree, but rookie corners don't come in and make huge impacts as starters, either.

If you take the position that Hall is right now better than McGee, then the move would make more sense if it happened.

But I don't believe that. And I certainly don't feel comfortable having a rookie and a 2nd year player (who barely played last year in game situations) starting at both CB spots.

In fact, I'd rather have Kiwaukee Thomas start over Hall if it wasn't mcGee there.

[madness]

why would it be ??? Mc Gee looked like crap last year and probably is really no better than a nickle or dime back in the NFL, the Bills starting CB's could be Hall and Youboty if Hall is drafted

I agree, plus our secondary is pretty thin as it is. We have to remember no position is taken for granted with this coaching staff.

Coach, I doubt we draft Hall but which would you feel more comfortable with?

McGee w/ Youboty and Thomas fighting for the other spot?

or...

McGee, Youboty, Thomas and Hall/rookie all fighting for both spots?

[OpIv37]

Several mocks now have us drafting Leon Hall (CB; MICH), including Rick Gosselin's latest mock.

With the rumors that Willis may be gone by 12, this may be a possibility.

And if it happens, I'll be totally pissed because that would mean we completely and totally wasted our 3rd round pick last year by drafting Ashton Youboty.

The whole point of drafting Youboty when we did was because we knew Clements was probably gone after 2006 and wanted to get a head-start on at least developing his replacement. Get Youboty in the system for a year and he can be a little more seasoned when it comes time to replace Nate (NOW!).

If we draft Hall, it would be for the same reason....to offset the loss of Clements. That would mean a 3rd round pick - plus an entire year of developing him both physically and mentally - would be a completely wasted.

:bf1:

I've been saying the same thing for weeks.

[patmoran2006]

Several mocks now have us drafting Leon Hall (CB; MICH), including Rick Gosselin's latest mock.

With the rumors that Willis may be gone by 12, this may be a possibility.

And if it happens, I'll be totally pissed because that would mean we completely and totally wasted our 3rd round pick last year by drafting Ashton Youboty.

The whole point of drafting Youboty when we did was because we knew Clements was probably gone after 2006 and wanted to get a head-start on at least developing his replacement. Get Youboty in the system for a year and he can be a little more seasoned when it comes time to replace Nate (NOW!).

If we draft Hall, it would be for the same reason....to offset the loss of Clements. That would mean a 3rd round pick - plus an entire year of developing him both physically and mentally - would be a completely wasted.
What he said

[OpIv37]

why would it be ??? Mc Gee looked like crap last year and probably is really no better than a nickle or dime back in the NFL, the Bills starting CB's could be Hall and Youboty if Hall is drafted

at 12, we need a player who will be an improvement for us starting in Week 1 of 2007. CB's are unlikely to do that- it takes them time to adjust to the speed of the NFL. Will Leon Hall be better than McGee? Maybe, but not on Week 1 of 2007.

Combine that with all the other holes we have and the fact that McGee showed a lot of promise in 2005 (although had a setback last year), and drafting a corner doesn't seem like such a bright idea. Plus Hall is overrated.

Don't get me wrong- McGee on one side with Youboty/Thomas on the other makes me nervous, but throwing Hall into that mix doesn't make me any less nervous. We'd be much better off using the 12 on a stud RB or LB (IMO preferably LB).

[MarvLevy]

trade down...bottom line!

[THATHURMANATOR]

at 12, we need a player who will be an improvement for us starting in Week 1 of 2007. CB's are unlikely to do that- it takes them time to adjust to the speed of the NFL. Will Leon Hall be better than McGee? Maybe, but not on Week 1 of 2007.

Combine that with all the other holes we have and the fact that McGee showed a lot of promise in 2005 (although had a setback last year), and drafting a corner doesn't seem like such a bright idea. Plus Hall is overrated.

Don't get me wrong- McGee on one side with Youboty/Thomas on the other makes me nervous, but throwing Hall into that mix doesn't make me any less nervous. We'd be much better off using the 12 on a stud RB or LB (IMO preferably LB).
Winfield and Clements started and played well their rookie years.

NEXT.

[don137]

Marv said all along this off season they will address the run and stoppng the run. As a result doing anything else in the first two rounds would not make sense since they need a RB and a LB badly.

[L.A. Playa]

I didnt say drafting Hall was "The Answer" for the bills just saying it doesnt mean Youboty was a mistake or a waste it may mean they arent comfortable with Mc gee being more than a nickle/dime back and KR based on his performance last year

[THATHURMANATOR]

I am not huge on Hall or Reavis but it would be a need pick and not a reach to choose one at 12. Less of a reach than taking Poz or Beason IMO.

[OpIv37]

Winfield and Clements started and played well their rookie years.

NEXT.

vs how many CB's that haven't? There are two on our current roster- McGee and Youboty- compared to the two you found over the last decade.

you're using the exception as the rule. They're both better than Leon Hall.

CB at 12 makes 2007 training camp for 2008.

[madness]

I am not huge on Hall or Reavis but it would be a need pick and not a reach to choose one at 12. Less of a reach than taking Poz or Beason IMO.

:goodpost:

[OpIv37]

I am not huge on Hall or Reavis but it would be a need pick and not a reach to choose one at 12. Less of a reach than taking Poz or Beason IMO.

I'll agree that hall at 12 is less than a reach than Poz at 12 but I still think we need to address LB and RB before we address CB.

If Peterson, Willis and Lynch are all gone (which is unlikely), I could see the logic in picking Hall but I still don't think it's going to make us better immediately, and we really need to turn the 12 into something that makes us better immediately.

[jimbohastle51]

hall is not even a top 15 pick! did anyone see the USC michagan game? hall was toasted for like over 200 yards! and dwayne jarrett is one of the slower 1st round recievers in college football. if he couldnt shut down mediocore talent how would he shut down the jets coles, new englands stallworth, miamis chambers? and if poz is who levy wants trade back a couple picks and get it done and get another 2nd or 3rd and maybe trade back up into the late 2nd or late 1st if the right player is there.

[THATHURMANATOR]

vs how many CB's that haven't? There are two on our current roster- McGee and Youboty- compared to the two you found over the last decade.

you're using the exception as the rule. They're both better than Leon Hall.

CB at 12 makes 2007 training camp for 2008.
I am just going off our team. Why mention Youboty or Mcgee? There was no need and they were not even given a chance to start their rookie years. PLUS they were 3rd round or later picks not top 12. In our little study here. 2 first round corners started and played well their rookie years.

[THATHURMANATOR]

hall is not even a top 15 pick! did anyone see the USC michagan game? hall was toasted for like over 200 yards! and dwayne jarrett is one of the slower 1st round recievers in college football. if he couldnt shut down mediocore talent how would he shut down the jets coles, new englands stallworth, miamis chambers? and if poz is who levy wants trade back a couple picks and get it done and get another 2nd or 3rd and maybe trade back up into the late 2nd or late 1st if the right player is there.
You base your entire opinion of a guy on one game?

Yeah Nate looked great covering Chambers a couple years back when he went for 200 plus and the game winner. Wonder why San Fran is paying him 10 mil a year.... :shakeno:

[Ickybaluky]

Several mocks now have us drafting Leon Hall (CB; MICH), including Rick Gosselin's latest mock.

Keep in mind, Gosselin does 3 versions of his mock, and they change a great deal.

His first pass he assigns the players based on how he has them ranked. With the second, he takes team needs into consideration and assigns them based on how he rates players by position (still not necessarily taking systems into account).

It is his final mock which receives the most accolades. In his final Mock he actually takes into account information from contacts he has on each team, and takes into account how well a player fits based on the team's criteria.

Gosselin's final Mock isn't due until the morning of the draft.

[TigerJ]

If Willis and Peterson are gone, and the Bills aren't that high on Lynch, then they have to at least attempt a trade down. Unfortunately,that wont be easy because the buzz is that a lot more teams are trying to move down than are trying to move up. If they can't trade down in that situation, any player they draft is going to be a reach.

[patmoran2006]

Gosselin's mock is one of the most respected and usually most accurate.

Even though he's hated on this board, I remember Donahoe in an ESPN peice recently saying that teams pay attention to mocks out there, and Gosselin along with someone else (dont remember who) are the best out there.

[Ickybaluky]

Even though he's hated on this board, I remember Donahoe in an ESPN peice recently saying that teams pay attention to mocks out there, and Gosselin along with someone else (dont remember who) are the best out there.

Again, Gosselin himself says only his final Mock is how he thinks the players will actually come off the board. The first couple use different criteria.

[patmoran2006]

Well I hope Goss doesnt have a CB slotted to us at #12.

If we take a CB in round one, it better be because we traded down and got an extra day one pick.

[camelcowboy]

Any cb at twelve is a reach. This is a weak class and any other year hall is a second round corner. Beason or Poz is less of a reach then Hall. Revis? I could live with him he has far more potential then hall.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Any cb at twelve is a reach. This is a weak class and any other year hall is a second round corner. Beason or Poz is less of a reach then Hall. Revis? I could live with him he has far more potential then hall.

[The Answer]

why would it be ??? Mc Gee looked like crap last year and probably is really no better than a nickle or dime back in the NFL, the Bills starting CB's could be Hall and Youboty if Hall is drafted

The Answer agrees - a lot of fans have been lulled into a false sense of security with Toast McGee because of his stellar Special Teams plays but the reality is that McGee is what he is - a 4th round pick and average CB at best.

If this team plans on starting both Shake Youboty and Toast, than expect a lot of 300+ yard passing games from opposing QB's.

~The Answer

[camelcowboy]

:candle:

[patmoran2006]

NO team is going to have to throw for 300 yards on us, because every team can simply RUN for 300 yards on us.

I'd much rather have a strong front seven and suspect corners, then great corners and NO front seven. Not even Champ Bailey can cover a WR for 9 seconds every pass play.

[camelcowboy]

A good front seven makes the back end look alot better.

[OpIv37]

A good front seven makes the back end look alot better.

good point but our front 7 lost Fletcher and Spikes and only added Darwin Walker to the pile of **** we had at DT last year. So don't count on that for too much help.

[patmoran2006]

If our LB corp isnt much improved after this draft, we could have the worst defense in the ENTIRE NFL this season.

[Elminster]

I wouldn't see Youboty as a waste. I'd see it as Terrance McGee's relegation to returner. That said, IMO, we could do way better at #12 than Leon Hall...