Ennis over Gerbe? [Archive] - BillsZone.com

OpIv37

11-14-2009, 06:08 PM

Seriously, what's the deal with Gerbe? Kennedy and Myers have already made it to the Sabres for significant time. Is this normal development time? Is he just a victim of the number of forwards that Buffalo has? Is this a contracting/CBA issue like the one Myers had? Or is he simply struggling?

With the hype Gerbe had coming out of college, it's frustrating to see him still in the minors.

helmetguy

11-14-2009, 06:20 PM

Gerbe's injured.

OpIv37

11-14-2009, 06:21 PM

Gerbe's injured.

that explains tonight's decision. It doesn't explain why he still hasn't made it up to Buffalo in general though.

Crisis

11-14-2009, 06:25 PM

think gerbe has a concussion, to be more specific.

Nighthawk

11-14-2009, 07:40 PM

OP...Ennis is a VERY good prospect. I think he could possibly be a very good offensive player for this franchise in a year or two.

Demon

11-14-2009, 08:55 PM

Ennis reminds me of a Danny Briere. He has a nose for the goal. He's small but feisty. Great speed and great hands. He could be a good one for years to come and even more reason to trade Gerbe while his value is still somewhat high.

OpIv37

11-14-2009, 09:05 PM

OP...Ennis is a VERY good prospect. I think he could possibly be a very good offensive player for this franchise in a year or two.

I didn't mean this as a knock on Ennis. I honestly don't know enough about him to comment, positive or negative, and I don't have a problem with him getting some NHL ice time. If he's good, he stays, and if he's bad, he goes back to Portland when we're healthy. Nothing bad can come of it.

I'm just frustrated that Gerbe is taking his sweet time to contribute to this franchise.

Demon

11-14-2009, 09:09 PM

I didn't mean this as a knock on Ennis. I honestly don't know enough about him to comment, positive or negative, and I don't have a problem with him getting some NHL ice time. If he's good, he stays, and if he's bad, he goes back to Portland when we're healthy. Nothing bad can come of it.

I'm just frustrated that Gerbe is taking his sweet time to contribute to this franchise.

But Gerbe is hurt. Also, anyone hear Lindy after the game? He assumed he was going to play Nate Paetsch tonight but Darcy Regier came up with the idea of calling Ennis up.... brilliant move by Darcy.

THATHURMANATOR

11-14-2009, 09:26 PM

OP...Ennis is a VERY good prospect. I think he could possibly be a very good offensive player for this franchise in a year or two.
Yeah Op. Ennis is a highly touted offensive prospect. IMO our best prospect outside of Myers. Him over Gerbe was a no brainer especially when looking at production in Portland.

OpIv37

11-14-2009, 09:27 PM

Yeah Op. Ennis is a highly touted offensive prospect. IMO our best prospect outside of Myers. Him over Gerbe was a no brainer especially when looking at production in Portland.

ok now we're getting somewhere. WHY is Gerbe being outplayed by Ennis? That's the whole problem here. I'm not trying to say Ennis is bad. I'm saying Gerbe should be better.

THATHURMANATOR

11-14-2009, 09:29 PM

I didn't mean this as a knock on Ennis. I honestly don't know enough about him to comment, positive or negative, and I don't have a problem with him getting some NHL ice time. If he's good, he stays, and if he's bad, he goes back to Portland when we're healthy. Nothing bad can come of it.

I'm just frustrated that Gerbe is taking his sweet time to contribute to this franchise.
If you ask me I don't see Gerbe being much of a force at the NHL level. At least not in what I saw out of him last season. He was thrown around like a rag doll. Not sure how much bulk he could even add at this point.

OpIv37

11-14-2009, 09:36 PM

ok now we're getting somewhere. WHY is Gerbe being outplayed by Ennis? That's the whole problem here. I'm not trying to say Ennis is bad. I'm saying Gerbe should be better.

Yeah, I tried to say the same thing, but I got a lot of "what about St. Louis and Briere and Gionta?" No one wanted to listen.

THATHURMANATOR

11-14-2009, 09:38 PM

Yeah, I tried to say the same thing, but I got a lot of "what about St. Louis and Briere and Gionta?" No one wanted to listen.
Ennis is the size of St. Louis, Briere and Gionta.. Gerbe is even smaller.

hydro

11-14-2009, 09:40 PM

Yeah, I tried to say the same thing, but I got a lot of "what about St. Louis and Briere and Gionta?" No one wanted to listen.

But unlike you people don't want to write players off before they touch the ice in the NHL. He hasn't impressed and may never. Regardless I won't write off a player until the prove otherwise.

Hell Ennis isn't get big either. Did just fine tonight too. May flop on his face, may turn out to be a super star. We just have to sit back and hope for the best. Not try to convince everyone of something just so it can be thrown back in their face.

THATHURMANATOR

11-14-2009, 09:40 PM

ok now we're getting somewhere. WHY is Gerbe being outplayed by Ennis? That's the whole problem here. I'm not trying to say Ennis is bad. I'm saying Gerbe should be better.
Because Ennis was thought of as the most gifted offensive player in his draft and only lasted until late in the first because he himself is tiny.

Gerbe was a later round pick that flourished at the college level which doesn't always translate to the NHL.

I love Gerbe's effort just don't know if he can overcome the size. I wouldn't totally count him out but I wouldn't count ON him being a star player.

OpIv37

11-14-2009, 09:44 PM

But unlike you people don't want to write players off before they touch the ice in the NHL. He hasn't impressed and may never. Regardless I won't write off a player until the prove otherwise.

Hell Ennis isn't get big either. Did just fine tonight too. May flop on his face, may turn out to be a super star. We just have to sit back and hope for the best. Not try to convince everyone of something just so it can be thrown back in their face.

I never throw anything back in anyone's face, and that has nothing to do with why I expressed concern. Everyone was so excited when we got Gerbe- all I was trying to do was inject a dose of realism, but as usual, everyone was more interested in using the exceptions to prove the rule than actually looking at things objectively.

clumping platelets

11-14-2009, 10:24 PM

Gerbe is trade bait IMO............no desire for him to be here

qcsabresfan84

11-14-2009, 10:49 PM

I think it's too early to tell if Gerbe will be able to succeed in the NHL, but I do see his career only having two possibe paths. Either he never really makes it and bounces around the AHL until he gives up, or he is a 30+ goal scorer and difference maker in the NHL. He won't be able to survive in the NHL if he is only capable of potting 10 goals a year.

While there are plenty of guys in the NHL who do that, they have the ability to contribute more in the physical and defensive aspects of the game than Gerbe will ever be able to do because of his size. If he's going to be able to get up and stay in the big league, he's got to be a big time offensive contributor.

If I had to guess, I feel like he's already maxed out his potential. I really hope I'm wrong though, because I have a lot of respect for him overcoming his size to accomplish as much as he already has. Takes a special kind of character in a guy to do that, which is something you would love to have on your team.

Dr. Lecter

11-14-2009, 11:19 PM

I never throw anything back in anyone's face, and that has nothing to do with why I expressed concern. Everyone was so excited when we got Gerbe- all I was trying to do was inject a dose of realism, but as usual, everyone was more interested in using the exceptions to prove the rule than actually looking at things objectively.

Nobody denied that the size could be an issue.

Nobody. All people tried to tell you was that it did not (and does not) mean he will never make it and that he is a definite bust.

Crisis

11-15-2009, 01:55 AM

gerbe has never been a top prospect other than his amazing run in the frozen four i believe.

even according to HF...

Top Prospects

Tyler Myers, D (http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/tyler_myers)
Jhonas Enroth, G (http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/jhonas_enroth)
Tyler Ennis, C (http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/tyler_ennis)
Chris Butler, D (http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/chris_butler)
Zack Kassian, RW (http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/zack_kassian)
Mike Weber, D (http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/mike_weber)
Nathan Gerbe, LW (http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/nathan__gerbe)

DMBcrew36

11-15-2009, 09:08 AM

I love how many people on this thread have basically 'written-off' Gerbe. How absurd.

11-15-2009, 11:13 AM

Whatever happened to Zagrapan? Russia?

DMBcrew36

11-15-2009, 02:29 PM

Whatever happened to Zagrapan? Russia?

Yep, KHL I believe.

THATHURMANATOR

11-15-2009, 11:54 PM

I love how many people on this thread have basically 'written-off' Gerbe. How absurd.
I was excited for him to be called up last year and he did not impress at all. I can't see how he can excel in the NHL being thrown around like that.

Add in that he currently has a concussion and it doesn't look good.

I would never count anyone with that amount of heart out though.

Dozerdog

11-16-2009, 06:12 AM

Gerbe has Jody Gage written all over him- physically not up to the NHL, but will have the skills to put up lots of points at the AHL level.

He will only be a decent NHLer if the league curtails more physical play. He's just too short. I don't know how he got concussed, but when your forehead is at the same level as shoulders and elbows, you're going to get your bell rung

DMBcrew36

11-16-2009, 09:10 AM

I was excited for him to be called up last year and he did not impress at all. I can't see how he can excel in the NHL being thrown around like that.

Add in that he currently has a concussion and it doesn't look good.

I would never count anyone with that amount of heart out though.

Some guys are NHL ready right 'out of the box.' Other guys need some time in the minors. Gerbe has only played ONE year of AHL hockey. I'm not going to give up on him and I don't think the size issue is that huge of a deal.

THATHURMANATOR

11-16-2009, 10:18 AM

Some guys are NHL ready right 'out of the box.' Other guys need some time in the minors. Gerbe has only played ONE year of AHL hockey. I'm not going to give up on him and I don't think the size issue is that huge of a deal.
I am not giving up on him either. I hope he makes it!

RockStar36

11-16-2009, 11:39 AM

OpIv37

11-16-2009, 07:52 PM

I got about 10 posts into this thread before I became overly frustrated.

Have you seen any Portland games this year? Do you know anything about Gerbe or Ennis? Just because Gerbe isn't up yet doesn't mean he isn't going to contribute to the Sabres. Sometimes certain players take longer to develop. It's only been one full season. Settle down.
I'm not the one who needs to settle down- all I did was pose a question and you flipped out. Gerbe had a lot of hype surrounding him when he came into the league, but so far Kennedy, Ennis and Myers are developing much faster and showing a lot more potential. I'm just trying to understand why.

BlackMetalNinja

11-17-2009, 06:59 AM

I'm not the one who needs to settle down- all I did was pose a question and you flipped out. Gerbe had a lot of hype surrounding him when he came into the league, but so far Kennedy, Ennis and Myers are developing much faster and showing a lot more potential. I'm just trying to understand why.I think the bigger issue is that the Sabres have won 3 games in a row, including some tough opponents, are sporting a 12-4-1 record and are easily in 1st in the division, yet you still find the need to nitpick some sort of negativity out of things. Gerbe is 22 and has all of 10 games experience in the NHL, yet you seem ready to write him off. He's averaged a point a game in the AHL so far in his career and seems to be pretty solid there. Give him some time to adjust to his surroundings before throwing him in the trash heap. Sure, he may never amount to anything, but it's far too premature to say that at this point.

Dr. Lecter

11-17-2009, 07:24 AM

OpIv37

11-17-2009, 08:22 AM

I think the bigger issue is that the Sabres have won 3 games in a row, including some tough opponents, are sporting a 12-4-1 record and are easily in 1st in the division, yet you still find the need to nitpick some sort of negativity out of things. Gerbe is 22 and has all of 10 games experience in the NHL, yet you seem ready to write him off. He's averaged a point a game in the AHL so far in his career and seems to be pretty solid there. Give him some time to adjust to his surroundings before throwing him in the trash heap. Sure, he may never amount to anything, but it's far too premature to say that at this point.
First, Gerbe is in Portland right now, not Buffalo, so the Sabres' win streaknis irrelevant. Just because the team is winning doesn't automatically mean that every player associated with the franchise is doing well.

Second, I was already concerned about Gerbe's size from the beginning. I wad told by people such as yourself that it didn't matter. But now, in addition to Gerbe's size, this organization alone has THREE players developing faster than him.

If you don't see the reason for concern, then you're just being a blind homer.

Dr. Lecter

11-17-2009, 08:29 AM

First, Gerbe is in Portland right now, not Buffalo, so the Sabres' win streaknis irrelevant. Just because the team is winning doesn't automatically mean that every player associated with the franchise is doing well.

Second, I was already concerned about Gerbe's size from the beginning. I wad told by people such as yourself that it didn't matter. But now, in addition to Gerbe's size, this organization alone has THREE players developing faster than him.

If you don't see the reason for concern, then you're just being a blind homer.

Like I said, maybe that is because at least two of those guys (Myers and Ennis) are developing FASTER than a player usually develops. Both of those guys are 19, for God's sake. It is not normal for two guys (especially one like Myers) to come along this quickly. You are the only person who could take the accelerate development of two players and make into a negative for the organization and another one of its players.

If you don't see that as something positive, you are just looking for something to ***** about when, in reality, Gerbe is probably coming along at a more normal pace. Not to mention it is not like he is a complete disappointment. He was the last cut from the team in training camp and might have stuck around had Paille been moved earlier.

RockStar36

11-17-2009, 09:05 AM

This is the classic "the Sabres are doing good, I need something negative to focus on" thread.

hydro

11-17-2009, 09:12 AM

First, Gerbe is in Portland right now, not Buffalo, so the Sabres' win streaknis irrelevant. Just because the team is winning doesn't automatically mean that every player associated with the franchise is doing well.

Second, I was already concerned about Gerbe's size from the beginning. I wad told by people such as yourself that it didn't matter. But now, in addition to Gerbe's size, this organization alone has THREE players developing faster than him.

If you don't see the reason for concern, then you're just being a blind homer.

You were concerned about his size because you are concerned about EVERYTHING. You get so concerned that people try to bring you back to reality but that then results in us being "blind homers" because we are defending the guy. All anyone has said is just give players the benefit of the doubt.

I mean we can't do anything to control the future. So what is the point of being concerned? We have players that are coming along nicely from our farm system and and some that aren't.

OpIv37

11-17-2009, 09:21 AM

You were concerned about his size because you are concerned about EVERYTHING. You get so concerned that people try to bring you back to reality but that then results in us being "blind homers" because we are defending the guy. All anyone has said is just give players the benefit of the doubt.

I mean we can't do anything to control the future. So what is the point of being concerned? We have players that are coming along nicely from our farm system and and some that aren't.
Two years, no playoffs. Translation: most, if not all, of the concerns are legitimate. You can ignore them if you want, but then what's the purpose of having a board to discuss the team? I didn't realize we were only allowed to discuss prospects that are doing well, and all other conversations are off limits.

RockStar36

11-17-2009, 09:25 AM

Two years, no playoffs. Translation: most, if not all, of the concerns are legitimate. You can ignore them if you want, but then what's the purpose of having a board to discuss the team? I didn't realize we were only allowed to discuss prospects that are doing well, and all other conversations are off limits.

I love that line.

Meanwhile, both of your football teams suck an insane amount of ass.

The Sabres are a good team. Enjoy it.

OpIv37

11-17-2009, 09:26 AM

This is the classic "the Sabres are doing good, I need something negative to focus on" thread.
Once again, you are addressing my tone/attitude rather than the issue at hand. As i already said, just because the team is winning doesn't mean everyone associated with it is doing well. If you want a board to discuss the team, just accept the fact that not every post will be a homer/cheerleader post, regardless of how the team is performing.

Now, this is a waste of time. I'm done arguing about tone or attitude. Does anyone have anything to add about Gerbe or not?

RockStar36

11-17-2009, 09:29 AM

Once again, you are addressing my tone/attitude rather than the issue at hand. As i already said, just because the team is winning doesn't mean everyone associated with it is doing well. If you want a board to discuss the team, just accept the fact that not every post will be a homer/cheerleader post, regardless of how the team is performing.

Now, this is a waste of time. I'm done arguing about tone or attitude. Does anyone have anything to add about Gerbe or not?

Not yet. Some players take time to develop. I'm in absolutely no hurry as long as the Sabres themselves are doing well. If the Sabres were struggling and we needed his help, then I would be much more concerned.

hydro

11-17-2009, 09:33 AM

Op is right about one thing though. Nobody on this board knows how to talk about the team when they are playing good. Only action this board gets is when the know-it-all's show up to tell everyone how terrible the team is and what they are doing wrong.

RockStar36

11-17-2009, 10:05 AM

Op is right about one thing though. Nobody on this board knows how to talk about the team we are playing good. Only action this board gets is when the know-it-all's show up to tell everyone how terrible the team is and what they are doing wrong.

It drives people away so quickly.

I'm not captain homer either. I might have one of the most negative attitudes towards the Bills and I rarely hide it.

If the Sabres were deserving of it, they would get it. But they have been very good this season and still the only action in the SZ is *****ing and moaning. It's one thing when it's warranted but it definitely isn't right now.

Dr. Lecter

11-17-2009, 10:12 AM

OpIv37

11-17-2009, 10:34 AM

Not yet. Some players take time to develop. I'm in absolutely no hurry as long as the Sabres themselves are doing well. If the Sabres were struggling and we needed his help, then I would be much more concerned.
That's a fair point. As long as the team is doing well without him, I guess it really doesn't matter.

OpIv37

11-17-2009, 10:40 AM

Op, you seem to want to ignore that part of the reason it looks like Gerbe is coming along slowly is that Myers and Ennis are ahead of the curve for 19 yead old kids.

Their advanced progression makes Gerbe spending (at least part) of a second season in the AHL seem slow, when in fact it is normal.

In other words, being happy about the advanced progression of two kids that farther along than most kids from last years draft is something to behappy about. Not miserable.
I'm not miserable. I've complimented Myers a lot more than I've criticized him, and I haven't said anything one way or the other about Ennis. This thread was never intended to bash him- some people just misinterpreted it.

I don't have enough time in my day to follow all these ahl and junior prospects so I don't know how long it usually takes for them to develop. I just find it frustating that someone as highly touted as Gerbe has yet to contribute.

If gerbe is on the more typical path and Kennedy, myers and ennis are ahead of schedule, so be it. That's part of what I was asking

BlackMetalNinja

11-17-2009, 10:55 AM

Two years, no playoffs. Translation: most, if not all, of the concerns are legitimate. You can ignore them if you want, but then what's the purpose of having a board to discuss the team? I didn't realize we were only allowed to discuss prospects that are doing well, and all other conversations are off limits.Really, because almost all I EVER see in here are negative threads picking out problem after problem. Everytime the team loses 3x as many threads show up as when the team wins.

BlackMetalNinja

11-17-2009, 10:58 AM

I'm not miserable. I've complimented Myers a lot more than I've criticized him, and I haven't said anything one way or the other about Ennis. This thread was never intended to bash him- some people just misinterpreted it.

I don't have enough time in my day to follow all these ahl and junior prospects so I don't know how long it usually takes for them to develop. I just find it frustating that someone as highly touted as Gerbe has yet to contribute.

If gerbe is on the more typical path and Kennedy, myers and ennis are ahead of schedule, so be it. That's part of what I was askingLook around both leagues and tell me how he compares to most 22 year old kids that have almost 0 NHL experience... I think you'll find that his AHL production is still above most of his peers. In fact, points per game, he leads Portland by a small bit over Ennis. Sure, there are a few guys named Tavares, Myers, or Crosby... they aren't at all the norm however. Gerbe has amazing credentials behind him and I still think he can be a valuable player for the Sabres, but there is no need to rush it when the team is playing as well as it is and he can continue to develop in the AHL.

THATHURMANATOR

11-17-2009, 11:02 AM

How could you even criticize Myers at all????

chernobylwraiths

11-17-2009, 11:03 AM

I love how the team is doing very well without Lydman, especially Tallinder. But of course the biggest reason this team is doing well is because of Miller. I'm glad he is finally turning people to believe how good he is and can be. It was pretty much assured how good he is when he got hurt last year and the team tanked. Now the team is considered a contender.

It also hasn't gone unnoticed how much more this team seems to be playing more physical with their new additions. I have said early on that Kennedy wasn't what this team needed because I looked a bit too much at his size and didn't figure he would have as much grit as he seems to. Plus, I have always thought we needed more guys like Gaustad on this team. Grier was a very good addition.

Now they just have to keep playing like they have for most of the beginning and they will be a tough team to play against in the playoffs.

Dr. Lecter

11-17-2009, 11:03 AM

If anybody criticizes Myers, they will have to answer to me and I will not be nice about it!!!!

hydro

11-17-2009, 11:07 AM

If anybody criticizes Myers, they will have to answer to me and I will not be nice about it!!!!

I didn't know how serious you were as a Goo Crew founder until I sat in your seats last Wednesday and the floor was all sticky....

Dr. Lecter

11-17-2009, 11:10 AM

The cleaning service sucks at the Arena!!!!!

DMBcrew36

11-17-2009, 11:32 AM

First, Gerbe is in Portland right now, not Buffalo, so the Sabres' win streaknis irrelevant. Just because the team is winning doesn't automatically mean that every player associated with the franchise is doing well.

Second, I was already concerned about Gerbe's size from the beginning. I wad told by people such as yourself that it didn't matter. But now, in addition to Gerbe's size, this organization alone has THREE players developing faster than him.

If you don't see the reason for concern, then you're just being a blind homer.

I don't see reason for concern.

I'm not willing to compare Gerbe to Myers or say that Myers is developing faster because they're two different style players at two different positions. Myers has also been a much more highly touted prospect due to his size and his play in a tough junior league, while also being a standout for Team Canada.

I'm not willing to compare Gerbe to Kennedy, either. They are two different players. From the time Kennedy was drafted, before even reaching Portland, his game was better suited for the NHL. He is more of a two-way, well-rounded forward than Gerbe. Right out of the box, Kennedy's style of play is better suited for Ruff's system.

Gerbe just needs time to adjust and adapt. Not every player can make the jump immediately, as you know. We also have a glut of forwards. I expect there to be a space for him to make the team next Summer.

RockStar36

11-17-2009, 11:37 AM

Another reason might be the type of game Gerbe plays. Granted I haven't seen him play enough to totally know, but maybe they were looking for more grit and that is why Kennedy has stayed while Gerbe got sent back down. :idunno:

rbochan

11-17-2009, 11:56 AM

Really, because almost all I EVER see in here are negative threads picking out problem after problem. Everytime the team loses 3x as many threads show up as when the team wins.

"There are two hallmarks to every Buffalo sports fan: unbridled, irrational optimism matched only by devastating, irrational pessimism."