A friendly reminder as to why we should temper our enthusiasm....

[OpIv37]

2002- Started 5-3, ended 8-8
2003- Started 2-0 with two huge victories, finished 6-10
2005- Won the first game and everyone was excited about Losman, finished 5-11
2008- Started 4-0, finished 7-9
2011- Won the first 3 and got to 5-2, finished 6-10 (lost 7 straight and 8 of the last 9)
2014- Won the first 2, got to 5-3, finished with a winning record of 9-7 but still missed the playoffs

In each of those seasons, some off-season changes and early success got the national hype machine going, and the team failed to live up to the hype every single time.

[don137]

The toughest part of the schedule are the first three games. It will be a great litmus test for the Bills. Only one team will win it all by end of season but many teams will have good seasons. If the Bills come out of the first three games 2-1 I say enjoy the ride. Its been a long time coming. It doesn't mean the Bills will be Super Bowl Champs. Its just means I am enjoying some competitive football out of the boys in Orchard Park. Nothing wrong with that is there?

[justasportsfan]

forget that. I'm enjoying this win.

[Pinkerton Security]

Thanks for the reminder Op (/sarcasm)...however Im not getting too excited until we beat the Pats. At that point Im going to get extremely excited.

[Joe Fo Sho]

I don't understand why people try to convince other people to temper their enthusiasm. Do they do this because they want to be able to look back at their thread when we end up sucking for an 'I told you so' moment? Are they genuinely concerned over our mental state and are worried that we're not going to be able to emotionally handle the let down of missing the playoffs for a 16th straight year? I don't get it, we're all Bills fans and know full well how to handle the emotional roller coaster that is the NFL season.

Can you explain to me the point of starting a thread like this?

[OpIv37]

Rex and all the off-season moves bringing national attention, all the national guys talking up the D and Taylor, a big victory over a good team, Sportscenter broadcasting from the stadium....

This has all the makings of a typical Buffalo sports let down.

[OpIv37]

I don't understand why people try to convince other people to temper their enthusiasm. Do they do this because they want to be able to look back at their thread when we end up sucking for an 'I told you so' moment? Are they genuinely concerned over our mental state and are worried that we're not going to be able to emotionally handle the let down of missing the playoffs for a 16th straight year? I don't get it, we're all Bills fans and know full well how to handle the emotional roller coaster that is the NFL season.

Can you explain to me the point of starting a thread like this?

I'm just reminding people that history has proven that one exciting victory doesn't mean jack ****. You want to put yourself on an emotional roller coaster and look like a moron for getting so excited before we fail, go right ahead. I can't stop you.

[Captain gameboy]

I'm just reminding people that history has proven that one exciting victory doesn't mean jack ****. You want to put yourself on an emotional roller coaster and look like a moron for getting so excited before we fail, go right ahead. I can't stop you.

Well, as a fan for many, many decades, I'm real excited.

I have never looked "like a moron" on Monday.

This is a professional sports team, in the community I grew up in. I couldn't be more excited.

Super excited. Totally excited.

[Meathead]

good point

as long as shes putting on pregame mascara they are a championship quality team. and cheaters

im not expecting nuthin except seeing if this years early team finally might be the seven pm hot bar chick or the three am hot bar chick

[Joe Fo Sho]

I'm just reminding people that history has proven that one exciting victory doesn't mean jack ****. You want to put yourself on an emotional roller coaster and look like a moron for getting so excited before we fail, go right ahead. I can't stop you.

So it's because you're genuinely concerned for our emotional health?

It kind of sounds like you're looking for an 'I told you so' moment though, it's hard sayin' not knowin'.


...look like a moron for getting so excited before we fail...

Getting excited for Bills football does not make anyone look like a moron..jesus. Claiming we're going to win the Superbowl after a single week does, but excitement and enjoyment absolutely does not.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

One word:

Talent

for as long as I remembered since the last time the Bills made the playoff, this team has more talent than any of teams in those years, and that include coaching talent.

Forget about defense. Let's look at offense, of the starting 11, Watkins, Harvin, Clay, Felton, McCoy can probably start for any team in the league. In those years since 2000, we do not have that many players who can start for other teams defense and offense combined.

[Saratoga Slim]

Thanks for the reminder Op (/sarcasm)...however Im not getting too excited until we beat the Pats. At that point Im going to get extremely excited.

What he said.

Op's right in that we've been here before. And this season might prove that the Colts really aren't that good. But if we beat the Pats too--particularly if Taylor puts on another solid showing--then I think we can start feeling really good about where things are headed. I mean, do we have to wait until we actually make the playoffs to get excited? The point of being a fan is enjoyment.

[Historian]

I'm excited, but tempering it with the fact that it s a real, long, season.

I do believe that we have enough pieces to get into the playoffs, and put my money where my mouth is financially, as did Lecter, Philster, Mike, et al.

We already gave them our credit cards for playoff tix. (If they don;t make it nothing is charged)

I wanna see them beat NE and Miami, then not have a letdown against the Giants, whom I consider an inferior team on the way down.

THEN I will be completely sold.

[Captain gameboy]

My excitation meter is pegged.

Can't wait.

Screw Op, (in a positive way-however that's done).

[TacklingDummy]

On Dec 6, 2015 ~Dummy will be making his first appearance in Rich Stadium since January 21, 1991.

[Novacane]

I'm just reminding people that history has proven that one exciting victory doesn't mean jack ****. You want to put yourself on an emotional roller coaster and look like a moron for getting so excited before we fail, go right ahead. I can't stop you.


1. We don't need any reminders from you. We know the Bills history
2. WTH do you care if others want to put themselves on an emotional roller coaster? You don't even know them.
3. No one looks like a moron for being excited about their team except maybe to you and guess what? We don't care what you think!
4. You want to be a debbie downer after a huge win? You will find the negatives if they beat NE too. Go right ahead. I can't stop you!

[Captain gameboy]

"WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, SIR, I BELIEVE THIS IS GONNA BE OUR FINEST HOUR."

All caps. All bold. All intentional.

[OpIv37]

1. We don't need any reminders from you. We know the Bills history
2. WTH do you care if others want to put themselves on an emotional roller coaster? You don't even know them.
3. No one looks like a moron for being excited about their team except maybe to you and guess what? We don't care what you think!
4. You want to be a debbie downer after a huge win? You will find the negatives if they beat NE too. Go right ahead. I can't stop you!

People comparing us to the 85 Bears look like morons.
People acting like we finally found the answer at QB after one game against a bad DL look like morons.
People saying we are going to beat a team that has dominated us for 15 years because of one good game look like morons.

And I'm not being a "Debbie downer" by pointing out that we've had big wins before that didn't lead to jack ****. Reality is what it is and that's what happened. You claim you remember what happened without my help, but if you actually remembered reality you wouldn't accuse someone of being a "downer" for bringing up something that actually occurred multiple times.

[Strongman]

Respectfully, past performance does not guarantee future results. There's a few reasons to be optimistic this year. Namely, we have an owner who seems to want to bring a championship here instead of an owner with an outdated mindset. The law of averages also suggest at some point in time we will be better, so why not now?

[Buffalogic]

Best team we've had in over a decade. Past failures don't matter.

[OpIv37]

Best team we've had in over a decade. Past failures don't matter.

Are you sure? We've been fed that line before and the results are at the top of this thread....

[Buffalogic]

Nothing to be fed just have to open your eyes. The roster has a ton of talent. A lot more strengths than weaknesses.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Thanks OP

Wouldn't want to actually get excited for this game or anything.!

[Ginger Vitis]

look like a moron

You're looking like a moron for thinking the Colts would beat the Bills by 35 points at the Ralph

[gebobs]

I'm just reminding people that history has proven that one exciting victory doesn't mean jack ****. You want to put yourself on an emotional roller coaster and look like a moron for getting so excited before we fail, go right ahead. I can't stop you.

What's the point of being a Bills fan if you can't get excited in September?

Stay off my emotional roller coaster and don't worry how I look.

Know thyself.

[OpIv37]

You're looking like a moron for thinking the Colts would beat the Bills by 35 points at the Ralph

I've been right a hell of a lot more than I've been wrong. Funny how you never bring up any of the games I called correctly...

[ghz in pittsburgh]

You're looking like a moron for thinking the Colts would beat the Bills by 35 points at the Ralph

NFL is successful because it plays fans emotions - I can easily see why the Romans flocked to Gladiator games thousands years ago. The OP is obviously one of those bi-polar magnified by this game. Before last Sunday, the Colts is deemed invincible and would trash the Bills by 30+ points. After Sunday, the Colts are now morons, among the worst team in the league by all accounts.

[Joe Fo Sho]

God forbid the Bills ever get to the Superbowl one of these years. I can just picture the types of threads OP is going to start.

"A friendly reminder as to why we should temper our enthusiasm. Here's what happened the last 4 times the Bills went to the Superbowl."

[feldspar]

I'm as enthusiastic as can be. It's called being a fan. What the hell is the fun of watching this game with "tempered enthusiasm?"

Do you also have sex with tempered excitement, Opie? They call that a semi...watch the game with a raging semi...just a friendly reminder.

[Pinkerton Security]

I've been right a hell of a lot more than I've been wrong. Funny how you never bring up any of the games I called correctly...

is that what you really want, to be right? weird, id rather have a Bills win.

[Ginger Vitis]

is that what you really want, to be right? weird, id rather have a Bills win.

Once the game starts OPIV will be hoping for a Patriots blowout

[Novacane]

is that what you really want, to be right? weird, id rather have a Bills win.


Yes. That's exactly what he wants. He already has rough drafts of the I told you so threads he's hoping to start!

[Night Train]

2002- Started 5-3, ended 8-8
2003- Started 2-0 with two huge victories, finished 6-10
2005- Won the first game and everyone was excited about Losman, finished 5-11
2008- Started 4-0, finished 7-9
2011- Won the first 3 and got to 5-2, finished 6-10 (lost 7 straight and 8 of the last 9)
2014- Won the first 2, got to 5-3, finished with a winning record of 9-7 but still missed the playoffs

In each of those seasons, some off-season changes and early success got the national hype machine going, and the team failed to live up to the hype every single time.

Ralph is dead and Rex just got here. Means nothing now.

[justasportsfan]

I'm just reminding people that history has proven that one exciting victory doesn't mean jack ****. You want to put yourself on an emotional roller coaster and look like a moron for getting so excited before we fail, go right ahead. I can't stop you.
the only who looks like a moron is the guy who constantly itches his vagina. How I enjoy my team is no concern of yours. Win or lose, I'll enjoy the game.

[justasportsfan]

I don't understand why people try to convince other people to temper their enthusiasm. Do they do this because they want to be able to look back at their thread when we end up sucking for an 'I told you so' moment? Are they genuinely concerned over our mental state and are worried that we're not going to be able to emotionally handle the let down of missing the playoffs for a 16th straight year? I don't get it, we're all Bills fans and know full well how to handle the emotional roller coaster that is the NFL season.

Can you explain to me the point of starting a thread like this?

the only "I told you so" thats happening is that I told you that OPiv will have a miserable week because the bills won. This thread is proof. He wants us all to be miserable like him.

[justasportsfan]

I've been right a hell of a lot more than I've been wrong. Funny how you never bring up any of the games I called correctly...

doesn't matter. you look like a moron now.

[feldspar]

doesn't matter. you look like a moron now.

Made me chuckle.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

This is my prediction: Bills win Sunday. ESPN/NFL Network/Talking heads will talk Bills non stop. Tyrod will have to give 30 interviews to TV/Radio shows/magazines/Websites/bloggers. Then they lose to Miami and OP will jump out and say "I Told You So".

[BrianCarr]

People comparing us to the 85 Bears look like morons.
People acting like we finally found the answer at QB after one game against a bad DL look like morons.
People saying we are going to beat a team that has dominated us for 15 years because of one good game look like morons.

And I'm not being a "Debbie downer" by pointing out that we've had big wins before that didn't lead to jack ****. Reality is what it is and that's what happened. You claim you remember what happened without my help, but if you actually remembered reality you wouldn't accuse someone of being a "downer" for bringing up something that actually occurred multiple times.Then you're not really a fan. You're a wannabe analyst who wants to be "right" all the time.

[Ingtar33]

2002- Started 5-3, ended 8-8
2003- Started 2-0 with two huge victories, finished 6-10
2005- Won the first game and everyone was excited about Losman, finished 5-11
2008- Started 4-0, finished 7-9
2011- Won the first 3 and got to 5-2, finished 6-10 (lost 7 straight and 8 of the last 9)
2014- Won the first 2, got to 5-3, finished with a winning record of 9-7 but still missed the playoffs

In each of those seasons, some off-season changes and early success got the national hype machine going, and the team failed to live up to the hype every single time.

the difference? almost all of those starts featured the bills beating up bad football teams. if we can get out of the first 4 games at 2-2 we'll have a playoff run by the end of the season, the rest of the schedule is VERY WEAK. all the tough stuff is up front. I think it quite possible to win 7-10 straight games in the middle of the schedule. And thats even considering we might be "overrated". I didn't think we'd beat the colts and i predicted an 11-5 season. This typically means we'll lose to some bottom feeder on the schedule at some point, but otherwise i think this season looks very nice right now.

At no point in the past 15+ years did i predict a playoff run, i'm predicting one this year. I love the makeup of this roster, and baring some catastrophic injury bug we should do very well this year.

[OpIv37]

is that what you really want, to be right? weird, id rather have a Bills win.

No, what I really want is people to look at my record on this site to see that I'm not negative- I'm realistic. And I want to be able to discuss the team without being called a "debbie downer" or a "negative nancy" because people can't handle reality.

[OpIv37]

the only "I told you so" thats happening is that I told you that OPiv will have a miserable week because the bills won. This thread is proof. He wants us all to be miserable like him.

Nah I just want some of you to stop eating the **** sandwich this team serves while calling it caviar and getting upset with anyone who points out that they're eating a **** sandwich.

[OpIv37]

Then you're not really a fan. You're a wannabe analyst who wants to be "right" all the time.

I'm not a fan because I don't mindlessly believe the team is going to win every game and freak out like we're super bowl champs after one win? Go **** yourself.

[chris66]

What I don't get is why some people take this game so serious. It's a game played by guys that don't have a clue who we are. Whether any team wins or loses should have no bearing on our lives. Unless your 15 years old.

[Novacane]

Nah I just want some of you to stop eating the **** sandwich this team serves while calling it caviar and getting upset with anyone who points out that they're eating a **** sandwich.


You don't know this is another **** sandwich. Why can't you just take 1 game at time and see what happens?

[Goobylal]

I like the fact that the defense and ST's are as good as, if not better than, the units that led the Bills to a 9-7 record last year. Add in the upgrades on offense and I'll be incredibly enthusiastic until proven otherwise.

[CoolBreeze]

No, what I really want is people to look at my record on this site to see that I'm not negative- I'm realistic. And I want to be able to discuss the team without being called a "debbie downer" or a "negative nancy" because people can't handle reality.

Maybe you can't handle reality, or you'd shut your pie hole until the game was actually played. That's because the reality is everyone wants to enjoy the season, without the pessimistic attitude. There's no need for it after a strong opening game against a very good team.

[chris66]

Maybe you can't handle reality, or you'd shut your pie hole until the game was actually played. That's because the reality is everyone wants to enjoy the season, without the pessimistic attitude. There's no need for it after a strong opening game against a very good team.
I wouldn't call the Colts a good team. They have a good qb, but the team itself sucks

[Goobylal]

I wouldn't call the Colts a good team. They have a good qb, but the team itself sucks
That team made the AFCCG last year and was a pre-season favorite to go far in the playoffs again.

[chris66]

That team made the AFCCG last year and was a pre-season favorite to go far in the playoffs again.
Yeah the same team that got smashed 42-7in the afccg. The same team that softer than charmin, the same team that went 6-0 in their crappy division and was.500 out of it.

[Mace]

I dunno, I don't want my enthusiasm tempered, life takes care of tempering in its' own time. You get to points in life where feeling any excitement or enthusiasm for anything is uncommon enough where the thrill of just the chase is worth the pain. I don't even mind unrealistic expectations. I already know they're unrealistic but I want to enjoy the daydream or fantasy before it breaks.

All that tempering my enthusiasm does is deny me the pleasure of having it, so nah, I won't. After week 1, we put down the Colts, we're 1-0 and the sky looks like the limit, whether or not it really is, imho, may as well enjoy the feeling while it lasts.

[Goobylal]

Yeah the same team that got smashed 42-7in the afccg. The same team that softer than charmin, the same team that went 6-0 in their crappy division and was.500 out of it.
You are what your record is and the Colts still had to beat teams to get to the playoffs and make it to the AFCCG? What teams in the NFL looked unbeatable to you in week 1?

[chris66]

You are what your record is and the Colts still had to beat teams to get to the playoffs and make it to the AFCCG? What teams in the NFL looked unbeatable to you in week 1?
None it's week 1 everyone looks a little rusty. Nfl won't start sorting itself out till around week 8.

[justasportsfan]

Nah I just want some of you to stop eating the **** sandwich this team serves while calling it caviar and getting upset with anyone who points out that they're eating a **** sandwich.
this may be a crap sandwich to you but not to us. The only moron is the one who keeps coming back to eat what he thinks is crap sandwich.

[justasportsfan]

Btw, this is about a "it's all about me thread " Op.

[OpIv37]

You don't know this is another **** sandwich. Why can't you just take 1 game at time and see what happens?

Why can't the people who are comparing us to the 85 Bears do the same thing?

[OpIv37]

the difference? almost all of those starts featured the bills beating up bad football teams. if we can get out of the first 4 games at 2-2 we'll have a playoff run by the end of the season, the rest of the schedule is VERY WEAK. all the tough stuff is up front. I think it quite possible to win 7-10 straight games in the middle of the schedule. And thats even considering we might be "overrated". I didn't think we'd beat the colts and i predicted an 11-5 season. This typically means we'll lose to some bottom feeder on the schedule at some point, but otherwise i think this season looks very nice right now.

At no point in the past 15+ years did i predict a playoff run, i'm predicting one this year. I love the makeup of this roster, and baring some catastrophic injury bug we should do very well this year.

So we know that the colts are a good team? I think they are despite the loss to us, but this wouldn't be the first time that a victory that seemed impressive in week 1 or 2 was over a team that turned out to not be as good as advertised.

[Captain gameboy]

Jeepers Op. Life isn't about avoiding pain. It is about enjoying the day to day.

Quit worrying about potential disappointment.

I am so jacked about this game that I am ready to travel down isles in the grocery store I have never traversed.

I cannot wait until Sunday, but Monday I will be OK.

[BrianCarr]

I'm not a fan because I don't mindlessly believe the team is going to win every game and freak out like we're super bowl champs after one win? Go **** yourself.I take that back.

You're just an ass hole

[swiper]

I take that back.

You're just an ass hole

Why? Because he's not drooling all over a one win team? LOL.

[BillsOwnAll]

Jeepers Op. Life isn't about avoiding pain. It is about enjoying the day to day.

Quit worrying about potential disappointment.

I am so jacked about this game that I am ready to travel down isles in the grocery store I have never traversed.

I cannot wait until Sunday, but Monday I will be OK.

amen. threads like this make it hard to even discuss anything on this board these days. No matter what you say there is someone already hating what you have to say before you say it. Some people just hate being happy.

Sports is "an escape from reality" You watch the game on sundays and forget about everything else for 3 hours. When your team wins you celebrate with fellow fans talking up how good they are; when they lose you all have the same thing to complain about and as the old cliche goes "misery loves company".

Just sit back enjoy the game, Hope they win and if they dont then people will want to ***** with you. As of right now THIS YEARS bills team has given very very little to ***** about if any.

[Mad Max]

2002- Started 5-3, ended 8-8
2003- Started 2-0 with two huge victories, finished 6-10
2005- Won the first game and everyone was excited about Losman, finished 5-11
2008- Started 4-0, finished 7-9
2011- Won the first 3 and got to 5-2, finished 6-10 (lost 7 straight and 8 of the last 9)
2014- Won the first 2, got to 5-3, finished with a winning record of 9-7 but still missed the playoffs

In each of those seasons, some off-season changes and early success got the national hype machine going, and the team failed to live up to the hype every single time.


Op, normally I think you are overly vilified here. You're a realist, I get it, I am as well.

BUt...in this case kindly stfu please and just enjoy the ride. Why not celebrate when you have a chance, if we end up sucking again so be it...but for now there's more hope and legitimate optimism than we've had in years.

[justasportsfan]

Why? Because he's not drooling all over a one win team? LOL.

One game at a time. We can drool over the recent game that was won. Doesn't mean we're drooling over the entire season after 1 win.

[Captain gameboy]

Something magic is going to happen this Sunday.

I know it.

[casdhf]

Ops heart is going to grow three times that day?

[OpIv37]

I take that back.

You're just an ass hole

That I can accept.

[Captain gameboy]

Prepare for magic Op.

[OpIv37]

amen. threads like this make it hard to even discuss anything on this board these days. No matter what you say there is someone already hating what you have to say before you say it. Some people just hate being happy.

Sports is "an escape from reality" You watch the game on sundays and forget about everything else for 3 hours. When your team wins you celebrate with fellow fans talking up how good they are; when they lose you all have the same thing to complain about and as the old cliche goes "misery loves company".

Just sit back enjoy the game, Hope they win and if they dont then people will want to ***** with you. As of right now THIS YEARS bills team has given very very little to ***** about if any.

escape from reality? No such thing. You don't get to label something "an escape from reality" and magically have it be good all the time. Sometimes the bbq gets rained out, sometimes a drunk friend ruins what started out as a good night at a bar and sometimes (usually for us) football teams suck. Deal with it instead of trying to escape it and criticizing anyone who is capable of accepting it.

[OpIv37]

Op, normally I think you are overly vilified here. You're a realist, I get it, I am as well.

BUt...in this case kindly stfu please and just enjoy the ride. Why not celebrate when you have a chance, if we end up sucking again so be it...but for now there's more hope and legitimate optimism than we've had in years.


Because it's exhausting to celebrate a couple of wins at the beginning of the year only to watch the good teams get to celebrate in December and January time and time again. I don't think there is any such thing as "legitimate optimism" with this team anymore. "Cautious optimism" is as good as it gets.

[Mace]

Because it's exhausting to celebrate a couple of wins at the beginning of the year only to watch the good teams get to celebrate in December and January time and time again. I don't think there is any such thing as "legitimate optimism" with this team anymore. "Cautious optimism" is as good as it gets.

It's more exhausting to purposely not enjoy yourself a week at a time, Mr. Frownyboy. I blame your outlook on your punk music roots. Be cautiously optimistic and have some cautious fun. Every season brings plenty of time to be cranky later. Defer...

[MikeInRoch]

2002- Started 5-3, ended 8-8
2003- Started 2-0 with two huge victories, finished 6-10
2005- Won the first game and everyone was excited about Losman, finished 5-11
2008- Started 4-0, finished 7-9
2011- Won the first 3 and got to 5-2, finished 6-10 (lost 7 straight and 8 of the last 9)
2014- Won the first 2, got to 5-3, finished with a winning record of 9-7 but still missed the playoffs

In each of those seasons, some off-season changes and early success got the national hype machine going, and the team failed to live up to the hype every single time.

Do you keep those in a word doc somewhere so you can trot them out every time you want to show those who would like to have optimism that they should instead ALWAYS THINK WE SUCK?

[BillsOwnAll]

escape from reality? No such thing. You don't get to label something "an escape from reality" and magically have it be good all the time. Sometimes the bbq gets rained out, sometimes a drunk friend ruins what started out as a good night at a bar and sometimes (usually for us) football teams suck. Deal with it instead of trying to escape it and criticizing anyone who is capable of accepting it.

I guess theres two type of people in this world.

the ones who party in the basement when the bbq gets rained out.

The ones who drop the friend off and go back out and kill it even harder.

the ones who ride the ups and downs of thier favorite football team.

Minus the 2nd one which isnt comparable to the other two, they have one thing in common. YOU HAVE NO CONTROL OF THE OUTCOME. If it rains it rains. But right now in western new york IT AINT RAINING. ENJOY THE BBQ ITS SUNNY AND 85 OUT THERE! THE BEERS COLD THE FOODS GREAT AND GRANDMAS DRUNK AGAIN.

enjoy the ****ing bbq when the suns out.

[BADTHINGSMAN]

Op eat a Snickers, you get a little hostile when you're hungry.

[BertSquirtgum]

2002- Started 5-3, ended 8-8
2003- Started 2-0 with two huge victories, finished 6-10
2005- Won the first game and everyone was excited about Losman, finished 5-11
2008- Started 4-0, finished 7-9
2011- Won the first 3 and got to 5-2, finished 6-10 (lost 7 straight and 8 of the last 9)
2014- Won the first 2, got to 5-3, finished with a winning record of 9-7 but still missed the playoffs

In each of those seasons, some off-season changes and early success got the national hype machine going, and the team failed to live up to the hype every single time.

Don't tell me what to do.

[BuffaloRedleg]

If we ever become good and win a Superbowl, you shouldn't get to enjoy it.

I wish there was a way to hold people like you accountable when the day comes.

[CuseJetsFan83]

See watching other teams fans have success every year, it does get exciting when you start the season with a rather strong win at home, against what is a cliched super bowl pick by some which they threw off as an "off day" for the team.

The bills are a highly competitive team, with a coach who can be foot in the mouth, pun intended. But Rex has his players back, and it shows on the field.

The best analogy I can give is treat every game like the playoffs, or a season opener, 0-0 all the excitement and pageantry. I would recommend that you do not temper the enthusiasm, but channel it. You guys have a rather winnable schedule and if you can get by the next 3 weeks 2-1 or better... you will be in the drivers seat for that elusive berth since what 1998/99?

[TheBrownBear]

I dunno, I don't want my enthusiasm tempered, life takes care of tempering in its' own time. You get to points in life where feeling any excitement or enthusiasm for anything is uncommon enough where the thrill of just the chase is worth the pain. I don't even mind unrealistic expectations. I already know they're unrealistic but I want to enjoy the daydream or fantasy before it breaks.

All that tempering my enthusiasm does is deny me the pleasure of having it, so nah, I won't. After week 1, we put down the Colts, we're 1-0 and the sky looks like the limit, whether or not it really is, imho, may as well enjoy the feeling while it lasts.

You are a wise man.

[emoulds80]

if tyrod taylor keeps playing at this level, the bills will go deep in the playoffs. simple as that.... imo

- - - Updated - - -

the o has 7 new starters.... its going to get better. the team will go as far as taylor can take them. either way with great d, we should be in every game

[emoulds80]

buddy nix and his scouts built this team btw

[OpIv37]

I guess theres two type of people in this world.

the ones who party in the basement when the bbq gets rained out.

The ones who drop the friend off and go back out and kill it even harder.

the ones who ride the ups and downs of thier favorite football team.

Minus the 2nd one which isnt comparable to the other two, they have one thing in common. YOU HAVE NO CONTROL OF THE OUTCOME. If it rains it rains. But right now in western new york IT AINT RAINING. ENJOY THE BBQ ITS SUNNY AND 85 OUT THERE! THE BEERS COLD THE FOODS GREAT AND GRANDMAS DRUNK AGAIN.

enjoy the ****ing bbq when the suns out.
The sun was out long enough to light the grill. We don't know that it's going to be out long enough to cook and eat the food but some people are already talking about how great the food is...

[OpIv37]

If we ever become good and win a Superbowl, you shouldn't get to enjoy it.

I wish there was a way to hold people like you accountable when the day comes.

Actually it's the complete opposite. I've been the one calling this team out for all their bull**** over the years and I was right a lot more than I was wrong.

The people who shouldn't get to enjoy it are the ones who defended the owner, coaches, GM's and players who were holding this team back and criticizing me for calling them out.

[BertSquirtgum]

Actually it's the complete opposite. I've been the one calling this team out for all their bull**** over the years and I was right a lot more than I was wrong.

The people who shouldn't get to enjoy it are the ones who defended the owner, coaches, GM's and players who were holding this team back and criticizing me for calling them out.

Maybe in your world not real life

[OpIv37]

Maybe in your world not real life
In real life the people who defend ****ty ownership, GM's coaches and players simply because they are on the team are blinded homers who deserve the losing.

[BillsOwnAll]

The sun was out long enough to light the grill. We don't know that it's going to be out long enough to cook and eat the food but some people are already talking about how great the food is... the Suns been out for almost 5 days now. You're a slow cooker. Maybe it'll rain next Sunday but it's a full week of sun.

[Lucidvizion]

In real life the people who defend ****ty ownership, GM's coaches and players simply because they are on the team are blinded homers who deserve the losing.

Homers deserve the losing!

I just wanted to repeat that simply because it's the most absurd statement I've read in a long time.

[justasportsfan]

Actually it's the complete opposite. I've been the one calling this team out for all their bull**** over the years and I was right a lot more than I was wrong.

The people who shouldn't get to enjoy it are the ones who defended the owner, coaches, GM's and players who were holding this team back and criticizing me for calling them out.

the Patriots could win this game after all, they are the defending champs but it doesn't take a genius to know that argument is stupid . It's a different team now Different owner, different coach.

[OpIv37]

the Patriots could win this game after all, they are the defending champs but it doesn't take a genius to know that argument is stupid . It's a different team now Different owner, different coach.

And the point of this thread is that everything except ownership has changed in the past, yet the results remain the same. History shows that different isn't necessarily better.

[OpIv37]

Homers deserve the losing!

I just wanted to repeat that simply because it's the most absurd statement I've read in a long time.

Why is it absurd? People who defend those responsible for the losing deserve the losing.

[psubills62]

No, what I really want is people to look at my record on this site to see that I'm not negative- I'm realistic. And I want to be able to discuss the team without being called a "debbie downer" or a "negative nancy" because people can't handle reality.
No, you're not.

[alohabillsfan]

I think OP Took the week off just so he can reply to this moronic thread. Yes we are all dumb and have no memories at all! Thanks for the reminder! If the Bills win. Please remind us again next week that we beat them with fitzy! If we lose please start another thread that's title I told you so.....

[MikeInRoch]

I'm realistic.

Your 38-3 prediction for game one was completely not realistic.

[OpIv37]

Your 38-3 prediction for game one was completely not realistic.

Disagree. Predictions are made with imperfect information. We had a qb making his first career start,mnew offensive and defensive systems and two defensive starters out going against a pass happy team that made the conf championship game last week. Predicting a team to get whooped in that situation is not unrealistic at all. Obviously that's not what happened, but if every game could be predicted there would be no reason to play them.

[psubills62]

Disagree. Predictions are made with imperfect information. We had a qb making his first career start,mnew offensive and defensive systems and two defensive starters out going against a pass happy team that made the conf championship game last week. Predicting a team to get whooped in that situation is not unrealistic at all. Obviously that's not what happened, but if every game could be predicted there would be no reason to play them.
Only when you have the tunnel vision to solely consider potential negative aspects of the situation. Which makes it...drum roll please...unrealistic.

[OpIv37]

Only when you have the tunnel vision to solely consider potential negative aspects of the situation. Which makes it...drum roll please...unrealistic.

what positives? Fancy new toys at WR and RB? Those are negated by inexperience at QB and a patchwork OL. You think I don't consider them when in reality you aren't considering that the negatives outweigh the positives.

[gebobs]

Disagree. Predictions are made with imperfect information. We had a qb making his first career start,mnew offensive and defensive systems and two defensive starters out going against a pass happy team that made the conf championship game last week. Predicting a team to get whooped in that situation is not unrealistic at all.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by realistic. Does it mean "at all possible"? In that case, any score is "realistic". If it means what is sensible to expect, probably not.

Of 512 games played in the last two season, 10 were decided by 35+ points (my favorite was in Week 12 last year). The worst beating the Bills took over that period, was by 21.

[Historian]

I don't think there is any such thing as "legitimate optimism" with this team anymore. "Cautious optimism" is as good as it gets.

OP even WYS wrote an optimistic piece about this team.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Disagree. Predictions are made with imperfect information. We had a qb making his first career start,mnew offensive and defensive systems and two defensive starters out going against a pass happy team that made the conf championship game last week. Predicting a team to get whooped in that situation is not unrealistic at all. Obviously that's not what happened, but if every game could be predicted there would be no reason to play them.

You said we would lose by 35, we ended up winning by 13. Your estimate was just as realistic as someone who guessed we would win 51-3.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Back on topic, I too remember last season after beating the Bears on the road and EJ looking good, we were pretty stoked about making the playoffs.

Let's beat New England first then I'll be optimistic. Now I'm just nervous as hell.

[psubills62]

what positives? Fancy new toys at WR and RB? Those are negated by inexperience at QB and a patchwork OL. You think I don't consider them when in reality you aren't considering that the negatives outweigh the positives.
How do you think we actually won, then? Let me guess, Bills didn't do anything right, Colts just messed up.

Or maybe I'm considering the overall talent on our roster is very good and has been for over a year. The fact that we now have a run-heavy system as well as a lot of personnel that fits it. Also that both of the "new systems" have had a lot of success with less overall talent and Greg Roman is a good playcaller.

While I'm not sold on Taylor, he could certainly do well at least until teams get tape on him. If he can pass well (and he did in preseason), then his skillset is not an easy one to defend. Maybe he's inexperienced, but he's been in the league for several years, and that counts for something.

How are you even arguing this? You can't even think of positives after watching this team beat Indy like that? Even your hindsight isn't 20/20. Like I said, tunnel vision. There's a number of positives to see about this team. It's incredibly unrealistic to refuse to even consider that there are any.

[psubills62]

You said we would lose by 35, we ended up winning by 13. Your estimate was just as realistic as someone who guessed we would win 51-3.
If someone predicted we will beat the Pats 38-3 and they end up winning 27-14, then there's no way he'd call that prediction "realistic." Because it doesn't fit his narrative.

[OpIv37]

You said we would lose by 35, we ended up winning by 13. Your estimate was just as realistic as someone who guessed we would win 51-3.

You're confusing inaccurate with unrealistic. I made a realistic estimate with the imperfect information available at the time. Being wrong doesn't mean being unrealistic.

[OpIv37]

If someone predicted we will beat the Pats 38-3 and they end up winning 27-14, then there's no way he'd call that prediction "realistic." Because it doesn't fit his narrative.

It's not my narrative that it wouldn't fit. It wouldn't have fit the narrative of the information available at the time the prediction was made for reasons I already stated.

And there is no "narrative." You can make it about me all you want but the reality is that the results for this team have been the same since this website has existed. The so called "narrative" is reality.

[justasportsfan]

And the point of this thread is that everything except ownership has changed in the past, yet the results remain the same. History shows that different isn't necessarily better.

Everything but ownership? I didn't realize Rex was our coach for the last 15 years. I didn't know TT was our qb and Shady was our RB too.

The results have remained the same after 1 game in which we just beat a team that went to the AFC championship? That was a dumb post.

Here's one even dumber, based on your original post, you tell us to temper our enthusiasm based on the past where a few games have already been played early in the season yet you already know that's results are the same after 1 game? That was stupid.

[OpIv37]

Everything but ownership? I didn't realize Rex was our coach for the last 15 years. I didn't know TT was our qb and Shady was our RB too.

The results have remained the same after 1 game in which we just beat a team that went to the AFC championship? That was a dumb post.
You read it completely backwards. In the past we've changed coaches, GM's and players everything except ownership until now. But the results are always the same.

[justasportsfan]

Disagree. Predictions are made with imperfect information. We had a qb making his first career start,mnew offensive and defensive systems and two defensive starters out going against a pass happy team that made the conf championship game last week. Predicting a team to get whooped in that situation is not unrealistic at all. Obviously that's not what happened, but if every game could be predicted there would be no reason to play them.

now that FACTS are out, 38-3 was stupid.

[psubills62]

It's not my narrative that it wouldn't fit. It wouldn't have fit the narrative of the information available at the time the prediction was made for reasons I already stated.

And there is no "narrative." You can make it about me all you want but the reality is that the results for this team have been the same since this website has existed. The so called "narrative" is reality.
You can't possibly be a real person.

You're going in a logical circle. You say it was realistic based on the information at the time. But you only considered the negative information, which makes it realistic in your mind. Thus...it's your narrative.

9-7 last year didn't fit your narrative.

[justasportsfan]

You read it completely backwards. In the past we've changed coaches, GM's and players everything except ownership until now. But the results are always the same.
my bad. at work but my point stands. There is not enough information to say that the results are or will be the same in this case. I doubt in the past we would have dominated a colts team like we did last Sunday.

[OpIv37]

You can't possibly be a real person.

You're going in a logical circle. You say it was realistic based on the information at the time. But you only considered the negative information, which makes it realistic in your mind. Thus...it's your narrative.

9-7 last year didn't fit your narrative.

I didn't only consider the negative. I considered everything and concluded that the negatives outweighed the positives. You can say I only considered the negative as many times as you want but you won't make it true.

And yeah I was off a little last year but again, I've been right far more than I've been wrong. No one ever seems to remember that

[Joe Fo Sho]

Being wrong doesn't mean being unrealistic.

It means you were more unrealistic than someone who was right, though.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Just gave my tickets away to a co worker.

Thanks OP for saving me from having fun!!!! :bf1:

[jamze132]

Rex and all the off-season moves bringing national attention, all the national guys talking up the D and Taylor, a big victory over a good team, Sportscenter broadcasting from the stadium....

This has all the makings of a typical Buffalo sports let down.

But what if Taylor actually plays well and turns into a good QB...

[Lucidvizion]

Why is it absurd? People who defend those responsible for the losing deserve the losing.

I don't even know where to start. Do people who defend those responsible for the winning deserve the winning?

[gebobs]

No, 38-3 is not realistic. Not even for Jacksonville or Oakland. Blowouts like that happen maybe a handful of times in a whole season.

[psubills62]

I didn't only consider the negative. I considered everything and concluded that the negatives outweighed the positives. You can say I only considered the negative as many times as you want but you won't make it true.

And yeah I was off a little last year but again, I've been right far more than I've been wrong. No one ever seems to remember that
Then name the positives for me. I don't believe for a second that you considered them at all in any way. You've never once mentioned them. If you did consider them, then you're really awful at judging anything related to football.

And you can say that you're being realistic as many times as you want, doesn't mean it's true.

When you root for a team that's generally bad (and the Bills have been) while always being negative, then of course you're going to be more right than wrong. And the uber homers on the Pats board are going to be more right than wrong. It's not some amazing feat. The key is being able to predict the good as well as the bad, which you've proven incapable of doing. Check CGal's profile - I won the record prediction contest during one of the 6-10 years and have been maybe 1 game off the other years. I predicted 8-8 last year because I could see what the positives were about this team and how they are improving. That's realistic. You're just negative.

[Mr. Miyagi]

How many times have we had this argument? Op is a sad sad little pessimist who fancies himself as a realist. Most negative nancies do. And when we lose, he's the first one to jump up and down and say I told you so, even though he says he wishes he was wrong. Deep down inside he is a true fan just like us, and he wants the Bills to win just like us, only that he's too afraid to be disappointed yet again by the team to allow himself to have any hope. So he puts up this front to protect himself.

Poor Op.

[BillsOwnAll]

I love how you say "why do you think were better cause our shiny new toys?"...

ummmmm yah...playmakers at the skill postions usually make a team better.

Tyrod sat and learned under a super bowl winning QB for 4 years. Thats how QBs used to be made. Its only been recently that teams just draft and start.

The defense was great last year, can you admit that? We lost 1 guy and gained rex. How can you turn that into a negative?

patch work OL? We had good tackles and no guard, We got a ex pro bowler who was only out of the league casue he was a "bully"? give me a break grow up. And another guard who showed talent in practice and all of preseason.

Like I said the suns out and you choose to not be happy people like you are sad, i genuinely feel bad for you that you cant be happy.


How many games will it take for the bills to win this year for you to be satisfied? a 9-0 start? 10 11? casue i know if were 6-2 halfway thruough all well hear about it a collasape is coming.

[BrianCarr]

Why? Because he's not drooling all over a one win team? LOL.Well, I am not drooling. Beating a team that was in the final four last year is certainly a reason for optimism.

Of course, there is no middle ground.

[OpIv37]

Then name the positives for me. I don't believe for a second that you considered them at all in any way. You've never once mentioned them. If you did consider them, then you're really awful at judging anything related to football.

And you can say that you're being realistic as many times as you want, doesn't mean it's true.

When you root for a team that's generally bad (and the Bills have been) while always being negative, then of course you're going to be more right than wrong. And the uber homers on the Pats board are going to be more right than wrong. It's not some amazing feat. The key is being able to predict the good as well as the bad, which you've proven incapable of doing. Check CGal's profile - I won the record prediction contest during one of the 6-10 years and have been maybe 1 game off the other years. I predicted 8-8 last year because I could see what the positives were about this team and how they are improving. That's realistic. You're just negative.

Holy ****, I've been over this a thousand times. Poor OL, unproven QB. Yeah, we got Watkins and Shady, but Watkins is useless without a good QB, and Shady is useless with a poor OL, and without a QB, they'll put 8 in the box and make him even more useless. I've been saying it all off-season, so yeah, I considered it.

[OpIv37]

I love how you say "why do you think were better cause our shiny new toys?"...

ummmmm yah...playmakers at the skill postions usually make a team better.

Tyrod sat and learned under a super bowl winning QB for 4 years. Thats how QBs used to be made. Its only been recently that teams just draft and start.

The defense was great last year, can you admit that? We lost 1 guy and gained rex. How can you turn that into a negative?

patch work OL? We had good tackles and no guard, We got a ex pro bowler who was only out of the league casue he was a "bully"? give me a break grow up. And another guard who showed talent in practice and all of preseason.

Like I said the suns out and you choose to not be happy people like you are sad, i genuinely feel bad for you that you cant be happy.


How many games will it take for the bills to win this year for you to be satisfied? a 9-0 start? 10 11? casue i know if were 6-2 halfway thruough all well hear about it a collasape is coming.

See post above. Skill positions with no OL and no QB does not make a team better. You can't build on a rotten foundation.

Yeah, the D is good. The D was good the last two seasons. It was good in 03 and 04. Got us nothing.

He's an ex pro bowler who hasn't played in a year and a half.

[OpIv37]

my bad. at work but my point stands. There is not enough information to say that the results are or will be the same in this case. I doubt in the past we would have dominated a colts team like we did last Sunday.

But that's my point. Look at my initial post. I never said the team would be bad. I simply said people shouldn't be acting like this team is good already because we've made changes and started strong before with the same dismal results. Will that happen this time? I don't know. I do know that comparisons to the 85 Bears and all this hype over Taylor are premature. I do know thinking we are ready to beat the SB champs who have dominated us for 15 years is premature.

[BillsOwnAll]

See post above. Skill positions with no OL and no QB does not make a team better. You can't build on a rotten foundation.

Yeah, the D is good. The D was good the last two seasons. It was good in 03 and 04. Got us nothing.

He's an ex pro bowler who hasn't played in a year and a half. You act like if they put 8 in the box tyrod cant beat him with his arm. You act like hes a proven inaccurate passer like weve had in the past. The preseason and week 1 showed he has some promise to be the accurate passer we need.

you also act like icognito hasnt played in a year and a half becasue he couldnt play anymore. Hes still an above average nasty guard.

You act like were the only team that wont mesh better as the season goes on.

like i said. you choose to not be happy and only see one side of things, be positive one whole day, look at the bright side of everything one day, youll enjoy live more. temper you anger and pessimism.

[Ginger Vitis]

[QUOTE=OpIv37;4132547] I never said the team would be bad. /QUOTE]

Last years Buccaneers lost 14 games and only lost 2 of those games by 28+ points and last years Patriots won 2 games by 28+ points you really have no clue how close teams are in the NFL... To predict the Bills would los e 2 games in a row at home by 28+ point differentials is dumb****ery

[feldspar]

I never said the team would be bad.

No, you just predicted that the Bills would lose the first two games by a combined score of 73-10.

Would even a mediocre team get outscored by NINE touchdowns over their first two games?

[psubills62]

Holy ****, I've been over this a thousand times. Poor OL, unproven QB. Yeah, we got Watkins and Shady, but Watkins is useless without a good QB, and Shady is useless with a poor OL, and without a QB, they'll put 8 in the box and make him even more useless. I've been saying it all off-season, so yeah, I considered it.
These are the positives I said you should list?

[OpIv37]

No, you just predicted that the Bills would lose the first two games by a combined score of 73-10.

Would even a mediocre team get outscored by NINE touchdowns over their first two games?

We were playing good, established teams who are bad matchups (on paper) for reasons I already stated, one of whom has a history of beating the ever-loving **** out of us.

I mean really. No one should be shocked about picking the Pats to crush the Bills because they've proven they can do it time and time again.

[OpIv37]

These are the positives I said you should list?

The positives are WR's and RB's and a good D.

As I've already pointed out, we've had great D's in the past and it didn't get us playoffs. And WR's and RBs are offset by the lack of an OL and QB.

So far, the OL was Ok and the QB was good so those positives weren't offset. I still have concerns about the OL (and I'm not the only one- there is a whole thread about it that wasn't started by me) and I don't trust a QB with one career start against a Bellicheck D that had extra time to prepare.

[OpIv37]

You act like if they put 8 in the box tyrod cant beat him with his arm. You act like hes a proven inaccurate passer like weve had in the past. The preseason and week 1 showed he has some promise to be the accurate passer we need.

you also act like icognito hasnt played in a year and a half becasue he couldnt play anymore. Hes still an above average nasty guard.

You act like were the only team that wont mesh better as the season goes on.

like i said. you choose to not be happy and only see one side of things, be positive one whole day, look at the bright side of everything one day, youll enjoy live more. temper you anger and pessimism.

I didn't think Taylor could beat them with his arm. He's never proven he can do it. He did it against Indy- I don't think he will be so lucky against a Bellicheck team with extra time to prepare.

The reason Incognito was out is irrelevant. He was out for a year and a half and anyone out that long is bound to be rusty. Plus he's a year and a half older.

I don't choose to see or not see anything. I see what's there. You're trying to pretend that not playing for so long isn't a concern, which is absurd.

[bleve]

Wow. Long thread.

I agree with the premise of the thread. Yes, we've seen this movie before, at least the trailer.

I'm in sales, and I always look first for the reason a prospect would not want to buy. I guess it's ingrained in me.

So, I agree with Drew Magary (http://deadspin.com/why-trent-dilfer-was-the-worst-color-man-in-history-1731335287) of Deadspin when he says:


I refuse to buy into them until all possibilities for tragedy have been exhausted.

So let's see how it plays out in the next couple of games before I get too excited.

[SpikedLemonade]

If we go 3-0, I guarantee we will make the play-offs.

[Mace]

I had fun this week looking forward to this game no matter how it turns out. It's been a lot better than not looking forward to this game no matter how it turns out. I figure at least I enjoyed the possibilities while they were still possibilities in the worst case.

Enjoy the fun while there is some. It's not a trip to court and you're shorting yourself if you treat it like one.

[BillsOwnAll]

So tyrod never proven he can beat someone with his arm.. Has he proved he can't? How is bielive he can any less real then bieliving he can't ???

[SpikedLemonade]

Enjoy the fun while there is some. It's not a trip to court and you're shorting yourself if you treat it like one.

A trip to court would be a pleasure compared to the trip to the hospital for surgery which I did yesterday morning and overnight.

Thank you Lord for painkillers.

[Mace]

A trip to court would be a pleasure compared to the trip to the hospital for surgery which I did yesterday morning and overnight.

Thank you Lord for painkillers.

How's the leg ?

[SpikedLemonade]

How's the leg ?

In a quasi cast, elevated and now straightened hopefully.

Much rehab in my future even before I am weight bearing again.

This has been a long process since the accident.

[Mace]

In a quasi cast, elevated and now straightened hopefully.

Much rehab in my future even before I am weight bearing again.

This has been a long process since the accident.

I remember you telling me it would be, hombre. Hope the process is a lot shorter now.

[SpikedLemonade]

I remember you telling me it would be, hombre. Hope the process is a lot shorter now.

Yeah thanks for that. I think I see light at the end of the tunnel.

[BuffaloRedleg]

Actually it's the complete opposite. I've been the one calling this team out for all their bull**** over the years and I was right a lot more than I was wrong.

The people who shouldn't get to enjoy it are the ones who defended the owner, coaches, GM's and players who were holding this team back and criticizing me for calling them out.

I'm not talking about that.

I'm talking about people who start threads like this.

Don't be coy, you know exactly what you are doing. You must be self aware on some level based on your good taste in music.

[OpIv37]

So tyrod never proven he can beat someone with his arm.. Has he proved he can't? How is bielive he can any less real then bieliving he can't ???

Why would you ever believe someone is capable of something before they have proven they can do it? The last 15 years of Bills football has proven that sentiment to be a fallacy tome and time again.

[emoulds80]

:jam:

[Ginger Vitis]

Disagree. Predictions are made with imperfect information.

The information you're using is definitely imperfect you were off by 48 points lol

[BillsOwnAll]

Why would you ever believe someone is capable of something before they have proven they can do it? The last 15 years of Bills football has proven that sentiment to be a fallacy tome and time again.
This quote right here defines you're a pessimist and not a "realist" you want to have no faith even though in practice and preseason he's CAPABLE of doing it. You just choose to bielive he will more probable then not fail.

[OpIv37]

This quote right here defines you're a pessimist and not a "realist" you want to have no faith even though in practice and preseason he's CAPABLE of doing it. You just choose to bielive he will more probable then not fail.
Doing it against third stringers in practice and preseason doesn't prove he can do it in real games. That has been proven time and time again. The fact that you think he can do it in the regular season because he did it in preseason means you are hopelessly optimistic because you selectively forget all the preseason monsters who failed in the regular season.

Hey Jeff Tuel had a good preseason game- let's cut Cassel and EJ and bring him back as the back up!

[OpIv37]

This quote right here defines you're a pessimist and not a "realist" you want to have no faith even though in practice and preseason he's CAPABLE of doing it. You just choose to bielive he will more probable then not fail.

Oh and not believing something is possible until it's proven doesn't make someone a pessimist. That's just an absurd thing to say.

[BillsOwnAll]

Oh and not believing something is possible until it's proven doesn't make someone a pessimist. That's just an absurd thing to say.
Possible and capable are two different things. We know he is capable of doing it. Saying its not possible is absurd. If he did it agaianst 2nd and 3rd stringers and has yet to give the chance to do it against 1st teamers then it is possible and that's why we have faith. It's why the play the game. Tom Brady never did it before he got a chance he'll he barely played in college. You only see things one way and that will never change. But if it's hopeless optimistic then I guess that means it's hopeless bills will ever find a qb why do we even watch?

[OpIv37]

Possible and capable are two different things. We know he is capable of doing it. Saying its not possible is absurd. If he did it agaianst 2nd and 3rd stringers and has yet to give the chance to do it against 1st teamers then it is possible and that's why we have faith. It's why the play the game. Tom Brady never did it before he got a chance he'll he barely played in college. You only see things one way and that will never change. But if it's hopeless optimistic then I guess that means it's hopeless bills will ever find a qb why do we even watch?

Okay possible was the wrong word to use. Sure, it's possible. But I'm not going to believe he's capable of doing it in an NFL game until he's proven he can do it. If you've been paying attention to this team for the last 15 years, you shouldn't need an explanation as to why. We've had lots of guys who could possibly play well, especially at the QB position, and most of them did not.

And when it comes to QB, this isn't just a Bills thing. At any given time there are only 32 NFL starting qb's in the world, and probably 10-12 of them aren't really good enough to win with anyway. That's why I don't believe he can do it until it's proven.

[BuffaloRedleg]

This is a total straw man setting up the inevitable I told you so.

Telling Bills fans to temper their expectations and then gloating when you are right is like poking fun at the people who think the world is going to end every year.

It's low hanging fruit and nobody is really impressed. Of course there is a good chance the Bills are going to blow it. This is the Bills! Why can't you let people enjoy it?

Part of the fun is enjoying and embracing the ride. There is a scientific fact that thinking about positive things like the Bills winning the Superbowl releases the same endorphins as the Bills actually winning the Superbowl. We actually derive the same pleasure from thinking about something as we do from actually getting the thing we're thinking about.

I know that I am absolutely enjoying the image of the Bills winning on Sunday, slaying the evil dragon and the Bills becoming national heroes for finally putting down the Patriots. It's a wonderful image.

Why is it so important to try and destroy that for you? Don't you see how immature that is to be so obsessed with ruining other people's fun? Most people don't have a lot in their lives and greatly look forward to these games and rallying around the Bills. It's a fun experience and builds comraderie among fellow Buffalonians. Believing in the Bills has no negative effects, only positive.

We're not stupid, we don't need you to tell us what the odds are.

But like Han Solo said, never tell me the odds. If you won't listen to me, at least listen to your buddy Han.

[OpIv37]

Fun? Losing isn't fun. You don't get to call something "fun" and magically have the negative aspects of it disappear.

I'm enjoying the image too but I'm sick and tired of it always being an image instead of reality, especially when I know that that we are unlikely to win.

You say you're not stupid. You say you know what the odds are, but time and time again you forget about the odds and you basically admitted to mind-****ing yourself to release endorphins that feel like winning without actually winning. That's pretty ****ing stupid.

[BillsOwnAll]

This is a total straw man setting up the inevitable I told you so.

Telling Bills fans to temper their expectations and then gloating when you are right is like poking fun at the people who think the world is going to end every year.

It's low hanging fruit and nobody is really impressed. Of course there is a good chance the Bills are going to blow it. This is the Bills! Why can't you let people enjoy it?

Part of the fun is enjoying and embracing the ride. There is a scientific fact that thinking about positive things like the Bills winning the Superbowl releases the same endorphins as the Bills actually winning the Superbowl. We actually derive the same pleasure from thinking about something as we do from actually getting the thing we're thinking about.

I know that I am absolutely enjoying the image of the Bills winning on Sunday, slaying the evil dragon and the Bills becoming national heroes for finally putting down the Patriots. It's a wonderful image.

Why is it so important to try and destroy that for you? Don't you see how immature that is to be so obsessed with ruining other people's fun? Most people don't have a lot in their lives and greatly look forward to these games and rallying around the Bills. It's a fun experience and builds comraderie among fellow Buffalonians. Believing in the Bills has no negative effects, only positive.

We're not stupid, we don't need you to tell us what the odds are.

But like Han Solo said, never tell me the odds. If you won't listen to me, at least listen to your buddy Han.
Perfectly said. If he doesn't get that then so be it. I'm done with this discussion.

[FlyingDutchman]

Fun? Losing isn't fun. You don't get to call something "fun" and magically have the negative aspects of it disappear.

I'm enjoying the image too but I'm sick and tired of it always being an image instead of reality, especially when I know that that we are unlikely to win.

You say you're not stupid. You say you know what the odds are, but time and time again you forget about the odds and you basically admitted to mind-****ing yourself to release endorphins that feel like winning without actually winning. That's pretty ****ing stupid.

Says the guy who says the Bills will get beat by 28 when the ODDS say it will be extremely close

[OpIv37]

Says the guy who says the Bills will get beat by 28 when the ODDS say it will be extremely close
Who made those odds and what was their methodology? How did they quantify Taylor's inexperience and Bellicheck's coaching superiority and extra time to prepare?

[HAMMER]

You guys are playing right into Op's hands. Just let it go and the game will answer the questions.

[FlyingDutchman]

Who made those odds and what was their methodology? How did they quantify Taylor's inexperience and Bellicheck's coaching superiority and extra time to prepare?

Professional cappers who do this for a living. Not some negative nancy on a message board. They probably quantified it the same way they did it for the rookies on NE's oline as well as weak defensive line. Or do you think they were only looking at the game like you do? Get off the "extra time to prepare" crap. It's not like they had a bye week.

Are you married? If so, I can't imagine how you EVER got yourself to do that with the failure rate of marriages. You should temper your expectations that you'll live happily ever after

[delectrolux]

Truthfully, I'm with OP on this one. What did Buddy say? Show me the Baby. I'll give this team credit and faith when they've earned it. The first step was last week. The next (and the BIG) step comes on Sunday. This defense is legit - but I've been burned before by this team so many times, I think it's valid to withhold my full optimism until they prove it. There's been starts before - Edwards, Fitz, even Bledsoe. I'm cautiously optimistic about this team - but I'm not allowing myself to fully hope or dream until they've done it a few times in a row – until they've done it with some tape in the library for other teams to game plan with.

[psubills62]

The positives are WR's and RB's and a good D.

As I've already pointed out, we've had great D's in the past and it didn't get us playoffs. And WR's and RBs are offset by the lack of an OL and QB.

So far, the OL was Ok and the QB was good so those positives weren't offset. I still have concerns about the OL (and I'm not the only one- there is a whole thread about it that wasn't started by me) and I don't trust a QB with one career start against a Bellicheck D that had extra time to prepare.
Nobody's saying you shouldn't have concerns. I have concerns, everyone has concerns. Yet we can still talk about the positives without dismissing them as simply being negated by this or that. It's amazing how you positively dwell on negatives and dismiss any positives so flippantly.

Belichick had a whole offseason to prepare for a Steelers O without their second best WR and without their starting RB, who also has had a mediocre to bad OL. Pittsburgh still scored 21 points and that's with two missed FG's. The Steelers also averaged 5.4 YPC with a washed-up Deangelo Williams as their starter. It's hardly impossible for our offense in kind to move the ball, even if it's against "a Belichick D that had extra time to prepare."

[psubills62]

It comes down to the fact that I will never understand why Op even follows the Bills at this point. Football is entertainment for crying out loud. We just beat a playoff team by multiple scores, and you can't even enjoy that kind of win, then what's the point? If all you're going to do is be Chicken Little about the impending doom, why even follow? My response to this thread should have been "misery loves company" and just left it at that.

I'm done.

[FlyingDutchman]

It comes down to the fact that I will never understand why Op even follows the Bills at this point. Football is entertainment for crying out loud. We just beat a playoff team by multiple scores, and you can't even enjoy that kind of win, then what's the point? If all you're going to do is be Chicken Little about the impending doom, why even follow? My response to this thread should have been "misery loves company" and just left it at that.

I'm done.

Agreed. I realistically expected to start off 0-2 but still have a decent season. It's not unrealistic to think we can beat the Pats. It is unrealistic to think they come in and blow us out like the Dick Jauron years

[OpIv37]

Professional cappers who do this for a living. Not some negative nancy on a message board. They probably quantified it the same way they did it for the rookies on NE's oline as well as weak defensive line. Or do you think they were only looking at the game like you do? Get off the "extra time to prepare" crap. It's not like they had a bye week.

Are you married? If so, I can't imagine how you EVER got yourself to do that with the failure rate of marriages. You should temper your expectations that you'll live happily ever after

You mean the guys who write betting lines trying to make bad bets sound enticing so they make money off of gamblers? Yeah ok... Always trust people who stand to profit because they're always truthful.....

[psubills62]

Agreed. I realistically expected to start off 0-2 but still have a decent season. It's not unrealistic to think we can beat the Pats. It is unrealistic to think they come in and blow us out like the Dick Jauron years
I don't expect to beat the Pats, but there's no reason we can't be competitive.

[gebobs]

You mean the guys who write betting lines trying to make bad bets sound enticing so they make money off of gamblers? Yeah ok... Always trust people who stand to profit because they're always truthful.....

Bettors make the lines, not the bookies.

[OpIv37]

It comes down to the fact that I will never understand why Op even follows the Bills at this point. Football is entertainment for crying out loud. We just beat a playoff team by multiple scores, and you can't even enjoy that kind of win, then what's the point? If all you're going to do is be Chicken Little about the impending doom, why even follow? My response to this thread should have been "misery loves company" and just left it at that.

I'm done.

For a reason that you and many other people on this board will never understand: I can flow the team without mind-****ing myself into ignoring the reality of how they are.

And I NEVER said anything about not enjoying the win. I simply pointed out that history has proven that it's premature to extrapolate the win into anything more than a single win.

[starrymessenger]

IMO there is reason for optimism. It looks as though Taylor can game manage and do what the coaches want him to do while on a short leash. Over time he may show that he can be a playmaker making clutch throws downfield into narrow windows. He has as yet not in any way shown that he can't do that, so really there is no reason to be pessimistic.

[OpIv37]

Agreed. I realistically expected to start off 0-2 but still have a decent season. It's not unrealistic to think we can beat the Pats. It is unrealistic to think they come in and blow us out like the Dick Jauron years

With Brady and Bellicheck, they've blown us out against Williams, Mularkey, Jauron, Gailey and Marrone.

And while Rex's Jets usually played them tough, the Pats blew them out a couple times too.

So no, it's not unrealistic.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Okay possible was the wrong word to use. Sure, it's possible. But I'm not going to believe he's capable of doing it in an NFL game until he's proven he can do it.

Man, you'd be a fun Coach.



"Hey uh, coach? Why have all of our rookies been riding the bench for the last 2 years?"

"THEY WILL BE BENCHED UNTIL THEY PROVE THEY ARE CAPABLE OF STARTING."

"How can they prove that to you?"

"BY STARTING AND SHOWING ME THEY ARE CAPABLE."

"Ummm..."

[OpIv37]

Man, you'd be a fun Coach.



"Hey uh, coach? Why have all of our rookies been riding the bench for the last 2 years?"

"THEY WILL BE BENCHED UNTIL THEY PROVE THEY ARE CAPABLE OF STARTING."

"How can they prove that to you?"

"BY STARTING AND SHOWING ME THEY ARE CAPABLE."

"Ummm..."
You are making a terrible assumption that I would act the same as the coach as I do as a fan.

[Joe Fo Sho]

You are making a terrible assumption that I would act the same as the coach as I do as a fan.

Well until you show me you are capable of being a coach, this is how I'm going to think.

[OpIv37]

Well until you show me you are capable of being a coach, this is how I'm going to think.

Being capable of coaching and how one would act as a coach are two completely separate things.

[OpIv37]

Oh and I never said Taylor should be benched. I said we should temper our expectations until he proves he can do it. Again, two different things.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Being capable of coaching and how one would act as a coach are two completely separate things.

Yes, I know. I'm just giving you a hard time because I think you're reasoning is a bit ridiculous.

[FlyingDutchman]

You mean the guys who write betting lines trying to make bad bets sound enticing so they make money off of gamblers? Yeah ok... Always trust people who stand to profit because they're always truthful.....

They set the lines and then the betting public is what creates the movement. So needless to say, if you set your line at Buffalo +28, you wouldn't be in business one weekend

[feldspar]

Oh and I never said Taylor should be benched. I said we should temper our expectations until he proves he can do it. Again, two different things.

Until then, we should figure that the Bills will get beat by a combined score of 73-10 over their first two games.

Reality check.

[FlyingDutchman]

With Brady and Bellicheck, they've blown us out against Williams, Mularkey, Jauron, Gailey and Marrone.

And while Rex's Jets usually played them tough, the Pats blew them out a couple times too.

So no, it's not unrealistic.

Yes, it's completely unrealistic. This team has had some hard changes in MANY crucial areas....

How about this....You give me the Bills +21...not even your full 28...if they get beat by more than 21, I'll give you all of my zone bucks...(id bet you a thousand dollars in real life if it was possible)...if they lose by less than 21, you give me all of your bucks

[OpIv37]

Yes, I know. I'm just giving you a hard time because I think you're reasoning is a bit ridiculous.

You think it's ridiculous to have low expectations of a player until he's proven he can play? Why?

Think about the number of players who came through here with high expectations and failed. And Taylor was a sixth round draft pick who rode the line for 4 years. I understand that the reason he was the back up was because the Ravens have a SB-winning starter but he plays the most difficult position on the field and has no experience.

If anything, watching this team for the last 15 years should show you why you shouldn't believe a player can do something until he proves it. Far too many guys never live up to the expectations.

[FlyingDutchman]

Is there zone bucks anymore...It's been a while since Ive been on here

[OpIv37]

Yes, it's completely unrealistic. This team has had some hard changes in MANY crucial areas....

How about this....You give me the Bills +21...not even your full 28...if they get beat by more than 21, I'll give you all of my zone bucks...(id bet you a thousand dollars in real life if it was possible)...if they lose by less than 21, you give me all of your bucks

I believe zone bucks don't work right now.

[Joe Fo Sho]

You think it's ridiculous to have low expectations of a player until he's proven he can play? Why?

Think about the number of players who came through here with high expectations and failed. And Taylor was a sixth round draft pick who rode the line for 4 years. I understand that the reason he was the back up was because the Ravens have a SB-winning starter but he plays the most difficult position on the field and has no experience.

If anything, watching this team for the last 15 years should show you why you shouldn't believe a player can do something until he proves it. Far too many guys never live up to the expectations.

It is ridiculous...you are being ridiculous.

There's a difference between having low expectations for a single player and thinking we will get beat by a combined 73 - 10 in our 1st 2 games. That is absurd.

[FlyingDutchman]

But you're cynical of the betting line being NE -1? So you think this is some sort of trap? If those cappers are tricksters, wouldn't they have Buffalo -14 or something like that?

[OpIv37]

It is ridiculous...you are being ridiculous.

There's a difference between having low expectations for a single player and thinking we will get beat by a combined 73 - 10 in our 1st 2 games. That is absurd.

Ok now you're switching topics. At first you were talking about low expectations being ridiculous and now you are saying my predictions are ridiculous. They aren't, for reasons I already stated regarding how we match up with these specific teams.

[OpIv37]

But you're cynical of the betting line being NE -1? So you think this is some sort of trap? If those cappers are tricksters, wouldn't they have Buffalo -14 or something like that?

I don't know how those betting lines are created or by whom,and people stand to make or lose a lot of money on them, so that alone is reason for skepticism.

I made my prediction for reasons I already stated I really don't care what the betting line is because it doesn't change the stated reasons.

[FlyingDutchman]

GOD I wish you were my bookie

[OpIv37]

GOD I wish you were my bookie

You seem incapable of making a distinction between a betting line and a predicted score.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Ok now you're switching topics. At first you were talking about low expectations being ridiculous and now you are saying my predictions are ridiculous. They aren't, for reasons I already stated regarding how we match up with these specific teams.

Everything is ridiculous.

[FlyingDutchman]

You seem incapable of making a distinction between a betting line and a predicted score.

What do you think the betting line is? Same with the under/over? It IS a prediction of the score based on cappers and then fluctuated by the betting public.

[Oaf]

Honestly though, was this "friendly" in nature?

[trapezeus]

i have to say that now that the chiefs had the meltdown that the bills normally have against the pats, it's got to be hard to have that finish twice in the same week. so this should sway the chances of the bills winning to being more positive.

i envision the bills losing on an utter BS play or series of plays. so the fact its already happened this week should mean its less likely to happen twice.

[starrymessenger]

You think it's ridiculous to have low expectations of a player until he's proven he can play? Why?

Think about the number of players who came through here with high expectations and failed. And Taylor was a sixth round draft pick who rode the line for 4 years. I understand that the reason he was the back up was because the Ravens have a SB-winning starter but he plays the most difficult position on the field and has no experience.

If anything, watching this team for the last 15 years should show you why you shouldn't believe a player can do something until he proves it. Far too many guys never live up to the expectations.

Having no expectations is not the same thing as having low expectations. There may not be enuf there yet to have high expectations (tho clearly there is justification for feeling somewhat positive about things IMO) but there is no reason based on what we have seen to have low expectations either.

[justasportsfan]

here is what OP is trying to say....... it's very understandable, but since it's coming from him, it's viewed in a different way because he has proven to whine for the sake of whining.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000532919/article/bills-ready-to-make-statement-vs-patriots-plus-week-2-subplots

[OpIv37]

2002- Started 5-3, ended 8-8
2003- Started 2-0 with two huge victories, finished 6-10
2005- Won the first game and everyone was excited about Losman, finished 5-11
2008- Started 4-0, finished 7-9
2011- Won the first 3 and got to 5-2, finished 6-10 (lost 7 straight and 8 of the last 9)
2014- Won the first 2, got to 5-3, finished with a winning record of 9-7 but still missed the playoffs
2016- Lost the first 2, won 4 straight to get to 4-2, still finished 7-9

In each of those seasons, some off-season changes and early success got the national hype machine going, and the team failed to live up to the hype every single time.

This needs a bump and an update based on the reactions some of you are having. Yes, I know those results were with different coaching staffs/players than we have now. Yes, I know Beane and McD aren't responsible for the past. But those examples above represent 4 different coaching staffs and and at least 3 different GM's with the same results.

I'll admit that the team has been better than I thought they'd be so far, particularly in the secondary. But let's not get ahead of ourselves.

[Wally The Barber]

But this year will be different :drive:

[justasportsfan]

I'll admit that the team has been better than I thought they'd be so far, particularly in the secondary. But let's not get ahead of ourselves.
Darby! Darby!

[endzone]

Well, as a fan for many, many decades, I'm real excited.

I have never looked "like a moron" on Monday.

This is a professional sports team, in the community I grew up in. I couldn't be more excited.

Super excited. Totally excited.
ME TOO! I am also excited to see a well coached, organized and disciplined team.

[OpIv37]

Darby! Darby!

You seem to be missing the entire point. It's too early to draw conclusions. Gaines has had 3 good games for us- I didn't watch him last year but statistically, he graded out as one of the worst QB's in the league (I think a bunch of places had him as THE worst). So, he has 3 good games vs a full year of suckage. I'm hoping he was either used wrong before or he finally figured it out, but there are a lot of mediocre to bad players who have had good 3 game stretches.

White was ok in the first two games, terrible in the first half on Sunday and great in the second half on Sunday. Again, a lot of really bad players have put together a good half. So is he a rookie who is starting to put it together, or is he a mediocre to bad player who got lucky for a half? Again, it's too early to draw conclusions.

And btw, even if it works out: this FO replaced two established (albeit overrated in Gilmore's case) corners with a guy who was one of the worst in the league last year and a rookie. That's one hell of a gamble.

[YardRat]

Jesus Christ, Op, give it a rest and try to enjoy the journey.

[OpIv37]

Jesus Christ, Op, give it a rest and try to enjoy the journey.

Give what a rest? Facts are facts.

[YardRat]

Give what a rest? Facts are facts.

Pretty sure nobody needs to be reminded of the 'fact' that this team hasn't made the playoffs yet this century, and the only 'facts' that matter are the ones that haven't happened yet...everything else is irrelevant.

[Mr. Miyagi]

2002- Started 5-3, ended 8-8
2003- Started 2-0 with two huge victories, finished 6-10
2005- Won the first game and everyone was excited about Losman, finished 5-11
2008- Started 4-0, finished 7-9
2011- Won the first 3 and got to 5-2, finished 6-10 (lost 7 straight and 8 of the last 9)
2014- Won the first 2, got to 5-3, finished with a winning record of 9-7 but still missed the playoffs

In each of those seasons, some off-season changes and early success got the national hype machine going, and the team failed to live up to the hype every single time.
Normally I disagree with your constant pessimism, but we did win a trap game for Denver at home, and not that convincingly either.

Now, if we go to Atlanta next week and be competitive, even if we lose a close heartbreaker, I'd be much more comfortable feeling good about this team.

[Ginger Vitis]

OPIV has never predicted a Bills win in weekly game predictions... The game against the jets he didnt make a prediction... He just cant bring himself ever to predict a Bills victory

[psubills62]

I don't know what reactions you're talking about, Op.

[Night Train]

Give what a rest? Facts are facts.

Doesn't mean a damn thing to McDermott, Beane and Co. They are 2-1.

[OpIv37]

Pretty sure nobody needs to be reminded of the 'fact' that this team hasn't made the playoffs yet this century, and the only 'facts' that matter are the ones that haven't happened yet...everything else is irrelevant.

Well there are a lot of people excited about this start, talking playoff. Justa already thinks we solved the secondary issue. So yeah, they do need a reminder that we've been here before.

[OpIv37]

OPIV has never predicted a Bills win in weekly game predictions... The game against the jets he didnt make a prediction... He just cant bring himself ever to predict a Bills victory
We'll see there's where you're wrong. In the very early days of this site, I tried to make a realistic prediction, but every time I picked the Bills to win, they'd lose, even in games against weak opponents. So Inatopped picking them to win. I know it's superstition and it's probably nonsense but I do it anyway.

- - - Updated - - -


Doesn't mean a damn thing to McDermott, Beane and Co. They are 2-1.

Uh huh. Heard that with Mularkey, Jauron, Gailey, Rex.

[OpIv37]

I don't know what reactions you're talking about, Op.

Start here.
http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php/239216-We-jumped-6-spots

[psubills62]

Start here.
http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php/239216-We-jumped-6-spots
Because those posters all sound 100% serious.

Follow Aaron Rodgers' advice and r-e-l-a-x. The only sentiments I've seen are the exact same as what you posted - Bills are better than expected. I don't really see anything talking about how the season will end, because we all know it's still early.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Normally I disagree with your constant pessimism, but we did win a trap game for Denver at home, and not that convincingly either.

Now, if we go to Atlanta next week and be competitive, even if we lose a close heartbreaker, I'd be much more comfortable feeling good about this team.

If we lose a close heart breaker, I'd be more convinced that this team is the same team as the last 20 years. Losing a close game to a good team is nothing new for the Bills.

[Historian]

I think you can generally gauge a team by how they play in the first quarter of the season.

Assuming we get a dose of reality against Atlanta, they will be 2-2, with a very good defense.

About what most here predicted. (not me I said 3-13)

A decent team, that at least has the potential to win...who will draft somewhere in the early teens.

[justasportsfan]

You seem to be missing the entire point. It's too early to draw conclusions. Gaines has had 3 good games for us- I didn't watch him last year but statistically, he graded out as one of the worst QB's in the league (I think a bunch of places had him as THE worst). So, he has 3 good games vs a full year of suckage. I'm hoping he was either used wrong before or he finally figured it out, but there are a lot of mediocre to bad players who have had good 3 game stretches.

White was ok in the first two games, terrible in the first half on Sunday and great in the second half on Sunday. Again, a lot of really bad players have put together a good half. So is he a rookie who is starting to put it together, or is he a mediocre to bad player who got lucky for a half? Again, it's too early to draw conclusions.

And btw, even if it works out: this FO replaced two established (albeit overrated in Gilmore's case) corners with a guy who was one of the worst in the league last year and a rookie. That's one hell of a gamble.

No I get the point. No one is saying that Gaines is the next Revis. I'm not even saying he's going to the probowl. Just that Darby seems to have been replaced.



Who cares about grading? JP Losman was graded the 13th best qb at one point. Tyrod was graded well vs. Carolina. Darby wasn't all that great either last year, so his numbers or play can easily be replaced.

You're arguing with yourself again. Too early to draw conclusions , yet you already stated we haven't replaced Darby before a snap was even played.

[justasportsfan]

Start here.
http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php/239216-We-jumped-6-spots

No one has stated we're winning the division. I know you get bent out of shape when people get excited about the bills winning .Some things never change.