Player Evaluations | Cyrus Kouandjio - Cover1.net

[daryls61]

What will the Bills do with CK next season???
If you had told me that tackle Cyrus Kouandjio would start at left tackle for 5 games and play considerable snaps in other games going into the 2016 season, I would have been extremely worried. I’ll admit it. I was not happy when GM Doug Whaley drafted him in the second round of the 2014 draft, mainly because I didn’t believe that he had the feet to be a starting tackle in the NFL.The improvement in his game over the last few years has been tremendous. More specifically, the jump from year two to three under offensive line coach Aaron Kromer has been particularly eye-catching. Most analysts and fans believe that his improvement is due to the shift from right tackle to left tackle. Some will say his struggles at right tackle had something to do with his surgically repaired left knee (post leg) and how it may hinder his ability to kick slide. However, I’m not so sure that any of those theories are correct, and they may be failing to give credit where credit is due. To me, there’s a simple conclusion that I’ve come to after breaking down several of Cyrus’s games: Cyrus is simply developing as a player.

http://www.cover1.net/2017/01/player-evaluations-cyrus-kouandjio/

[k-oneputt]

I thought he played well this past season.
He's improving. We need to be patient with him. Wasn't he only 20yrs old when we drafted him ?
I'm encouraged by both him and Miller.
Rt is a different story. I still say keep Kouandijio at Lt and move Glenn to rt.

[coastal]

Cue "kick Glenn into guard" in...

3.

2.

1.

[SpikedLemonade]

I think CK would be a great Short Order Cook at The Anchor Bar.

[YardRat]

I think the oline has better talent than some give them credit for...KuJo held his own for the most part when he was put into action, and nobody missed Wood when he was replaced by Groy.

[swiper]

Miller was terrible this past year.

Groy, however, handled center like an old pro.

[Goobylal]

Play Kujo at RT. Keep Glenn at LT. Groy competes with Wood at C. That has the makings of a really good OL.

[swiper]

Play Kujo at RT. Keep Glenn at LT. Groy competes with Wood at C. That has the makings of a really good OL.

The point of the op was that Kuoandijo looked bad playing RT, but good playing LT. If he's truly still developing, I'm certainly not opposed them trying that again however.

[Goobylal]

The point of the op was that Kuoandijo looked bad playing RT, but good playing LT. If he's truly still developing, I'm certainly not opposed them trying that again however.

Actually the article linked by the op goes with what I've been saying all along, i.e. that how Kujo looked at LT this past season has less to do with his knee (which has been the prevailing theory) and more with that he's just improved as an OT. He was young when he entered the league and is still pretty young, and getting stronger and more acclimated to the pro game.

I wish they'd tried him at RT in the season finale to see if he had improved there. Because you don't know if he can't handle the right side (because of his knee), meaning you either go into next season hoping he can, which isn't ideal, or have to commit resources to get a new RT. I've written Henderson off because I don't think he can/wants to stay off the pot.

[The Beef]

Sal has said that Kuno's knee issue doesn't allow him tonolant and anchor the same way on the right side.

The thing is they should be playing the 5 best OL.

Larry Allen was a fuxking beast. Best LT in the league but when the Cowboys had I believe it was Erick Wilkiams they slide Allen to LG and he a superf ****ing beast. Kujo amd Glenn on left aide, slide Richie to RG.

[Goobylal]

He broke his hip. Never mind.

- - - Updated - - -


Sal has said that Kuno's knee issue doesn't allow him tonolant and anchor the same way on the right side.

The thing is they should be playing the 5 best OL.

Larry Allen was a fuxking beast. Best LT in the league but when the Cowboys had I believe it was Erick Wilkiams they slide Allen to LG and he a superf ****ing beast. Kujo amd Glenn on left aide, slide Richie to RG.

Again, it's a theory about not being able to play RT. Unless they play him there again, you won't know. And playing him at LT just increases the cost to re-sign him.

[Mace]

He broke his hip. Never mind.

- - - Updated - - -



Again, it's a theory about not being able to play RT. Unless they play him there again, you won't know. And playing him at LT just increases the cost to re-sign him.

Surgery will keep him from minicamp and ota's though he'll be ready for training camp. He's best as depth.

[Goobylal]

Surgery will keep him from minicamp and ota's though he'll be ready for training camp. He's best as depth.

Maybe. He could also be coming into his own as a LT. As for RT, the problem is the draft and FA are before they go to minicamps and OTA's anyway, so you're either rolling the dice with thinking he can play RT, or drafting/signing one anyway to play RT, so the injury doesn't affect much in that regard.

I would look to trade Kujo once he's healthy to at least get something for him before he leaves. Because he'll want LT money in FA.

[swiper]

How can he ask for LT money when he's yet to prove himself at that position?

[Goobylal]

How can he ask for LT money when he's yet to prove himself at that position.

Because he played well at LT this past season, that's what he he played in college, and that's where he sees himself. I think when the Bills come calling to extend him, he'll be asking for more than they want to pay because he views himself as a LT. He probably won't get what he's looking for on the market, but if he makes it to FA, he's gone.

[Mace]

Maybe. He could also be coming into his own as a LT. As for RT, the problem is the draft and FA are before they go to minicamps and OTA's anyway, so you're either rolling the dice with thinking he can play RT, or drafting/signing one anyway to play RT, so the injury doesn't affect much in that regard.

I would look to trade Kujo once he's healthy to at least get something for him before he leaves. Because he'll want LT money in FA.

He's entering the last year of his rookie contract. I'm more than happy with him going Demetress Bell and maybe coming into his own as an LT for someone else.

Because see...he still might also be the same achy iffy guy who couldn't win a RT spot from a journeyman.

[YardRat]

I see reports of him having hip surgery, but nothing about it being broken. Regardless, a hip injury isn't good news for a lineman.

[Mace]

I see reports of him having hip surgery, but nothing about it being broken. Regardless, a hip injury isn't good news for a lineman.

You sort of don't see a lot of NFL players falling down in the offseason and needing hip surgery, though you see it happening to a lot of old brittle people.

[Goobylal]

He's entering the last year of his rookie contract. I'm more than happy with him going Demetress Bell and maybe coming into his own as an LT for someone else.

Because see...he still might also be the same achy iffy guy who couldn't win a RT spot from a journeyman.

Maybe, maybe not.

[Mace]

Maybe, maybe not.

Great risk entering his 5th year, eh ? 50/50, woo, they nailed another one ! Oh that's worth a bunch of cap space.

[Goobylal]

Great risk entering his 5th year, eh ? 50/50, woo, they nailed another one ! Oh that's worth a bunch of cap space.

He just finished his third season. And he started five games and played very well in them, and played well in parts of others. I don't think. No reason to think no that was a fluke. So I'd say getting a starting caliber LT in the 2nd round is pretty good, even if it took 2 years to realize.

I don't know how much she's worth it on the market, but the arrow is pointing up with him. Or at least it was. It will be interesting to see what effect, if any, this injury has on him.

[Mace]

He just finished his third season. And he started five games and played very well in them, and played well in parts of others. I don't think. No reason to think no that was a fluke. So I'd say getting a starting caliber LT in the 2nd round is pretty good, even if it took 2 years to realize.

I don't know how much she's worth it on the market, but the arrow is pointing up with him. Or at least it was. It will be interesting to see what effect, if any, this injury has on him.

So...you think his arrow his pointing up because he subbed well for 5 games and just got hurt in the offseason, not football related, couldn't beat a journeyman or 7th round pick to start at RT, and you'd gamble this on extending his rookie contract because you figure he could be a gem of an LT ? Looks like he's a good sub swing tackle to me. But to you he's endless potential ?

Endless potential is how we got here with a roster full of achy guys who "maybe".

I don't think his arrow is pointing anywhere near as up as you think it is. He subbed 5 games and hurt himself in the offseason. He can get his LT money elsewhere and good luck on it.

Glenn is supposed to be a fine RT after being a successful LT, but Kouandjio is supposed to be a fine LT after being unable to start at RT over a 7th round pick and a journeyman.

Doesn't make sense.

[SpikedLemonade]

CT will be gone soon enough.

He is another talentless JAG.

[Mace]

CT will be gone soon enough.

He is another talentless JAG.

Someone will grab him on potential. He'll always have that until he retires.

[SpikedLemonade]

Someone will grab him on potential. He'll always have that until he retires.

Sure but he will never be a starter.

On the other hand, he could be in charge of Starters at the Anchor Bar if he applies himself to his kitchen skills.

[swiper]

I think the coaching staff has to take a good, close look at his play in camp. I hope gooby turns out to be right.

[Goobylal]

So...you think his arrow his pointing up because he subbed well for 5 games and just got hurt in the offseason, not football related, couldn't beat a journeyman or 7th round pick to start at RT, and you'd gamble this on extending his rookie contract because you figure he could be a gem of an LT ? Looks like he's a good sub swing tackle to me. But to you he's endless potential ?

Endless potential is how we got here with a roster full of achy guys who "maybe".

I don't think his arrow is pointing anywhere near as up as you think it is. He subbed 5 games and hurt himself in the offseason. He can get his LT money elsewhere and good luck on it.

Glenn is supposed to be a fine RT after being a successful LT, but Kouandjio is supposed to be a fine LT after being unable to start at RT over a 7th round pick and a journeyman.

Doesn't make sense.

Based on his play in 5 starts and a lot of other action at LT, I'd be comfortable with Kujo as the Bills' starting LT (that is, if his recent injury doesn't affect his play). I'd rather see Glenn there since they're paying him all that money, but if the best option is to play Kujo at LT and Glenn at RT, so be it. Again I'd rather keep Glenn where he is and play Kujo at RT. But the Bills will have to make a decision about RT before we get to see these potential changes, so I think we're looking at keeping Kujo as a backup LT and probably losing him at the end of the season.

[YardRat]

I'd be OK with a line of KuJo-Incognito-Groy-Rookie/Free agent-Glenn (from left to right, obviously) at the start of this season.

[Mace]

Based on his play in 5 starts and a lot of other action at LT, I'd be comfortable with Kujo as the Bills' starting LT (that is, if his recent injury doesn't affect his play). I'd rather see Glenn there since they're paying him all that money, but if the best option is to play Kujo at LT and Glenn at RT, so be it. Again I'd rather keep Glenn where he is and play Kujo at RT. But the Bills will have to make a decision about RT before we get to see these potential changes, so I think we're looking at keeping Kujo as a backup LT and probably losing him at the end of the season.

Maybe you would, and that's fine, but I wouldn't. Saying Kouandjio even becomes dependable as an LT in a full season, and you're paying two tackles LT money, assuming Glenn is ok at RT, you eventually have to renegotiate Glenn, he's going to say "I don't think so", well, because he was fine as a starting LT and someone will pay him. So, you again need an RT.....maybe someone shows promise filling in for Kouandjio, well, you can always put Cyrus at RT ....oh....no you can't.

I'm still of the mind you don't mess with what works. We have a starting LT, and we have a decent swing tackle. Just get an RT and leave what works alone. Being clever has never worked out well for this team, because sometimes the obvious is the obvious.

Draft Ramczyk or Pocic, start them at RT, Glenn remains LT which is very obvious to me, and Kouandjio remains where he belongs, swing tackle stopgap.

[YardRat]

I'm not OK with Glenn-Incognito-Wood-Question Mark-Rookie/Free Agent.

[Mace]

I'm not OK with Glenn-Incognito-Wood-Question Mark-Rookie/Free Agent.

But you're saying you're ok with LT?-Incognito-C?-Miller-RT? Kouandjio has never played a full season, nor Groy, and Glenn has never played RT in the nfl. Your line has more question marks than mine does.

I'm absolutely ok with Glenn-Incognito-Wood-Miller-Pocic/Ramczyk/Moton.

[jimmifli]

But you're saying you're ok with LT?-Incognito-C?-Miller-RT? Kouandjio has never played a full season, nor Groy, and Glenn has never played RT in the nfl. Your line has more question marks than mine does.

I'm absolutely ok with Glenn-Incognito-Wood-Miller-Pocic/Ramczyk/Moton.
Add Kouandijio as the backup LT/RT + competes for RT job and I like your line. Too much to ask for some competition for Miller?

[Mace]

Add Kouandijio as the backup LT/RT + competes for RT job and I like your line. Too much to ask for some competition for Miller?

That's where I see Kouandjio doing fine, backup swing tackle, give him a shot at right. Groy is also good depth. As much as I want competition for Miller at RG, it might be too much to ask for. Miller, imho is still in the rookie-contract, possibility zone. I'm not sure he's good, but I'm not sure he's not good, and I think solving the revolving door at RT and giving him a shot with someone decent on his shoulder might give a better idea. At the least, Miller seems to hold up, and if he's inadequate, might be easier to replace when the RT issue is fixed.

I'm thinking RT is compelling with RG up after that for scrutiny.

[Goobylal]

Maybe you would, and that's fine, but I wouldn't. Saying Kouandjio even becomes dependable as an LT in a full season, and you're paying two tackles LT money, assuming Glenn is ok at RT, you eventually have to renegotiate Glenn, he's going to say "I don't think so", well, because he was fine as a starting LT and someone will pay him. So, you again need an RT.....maybe someone shows promise filling in for Kouandjio, well, you can always put Cyrus at RT ....oh....no you can't.

I'm still of the mind you don't mess with what works. We have a starting LT, and we have a decent swing tackle. Just get an RT and leave what works alone. Being clever has never worked out well for this team, because sometimes the obvious is the obvious.

Draft Ramczyk or Pocic, start them at RT, Glenn remains LT which is very obvious to me, and Kouandjio remains where he belongs, swing tackle stopgap.

I already said that the Bills don't know if Kujo can play RT, which means they still have to find a new one since the draft and FA are well before training camp (or even minicamps/OTAs, if he didn't injure himself). And I never said the Bills should pay Kujo LT money. What I am saying that since he played it in college and this past season and did well, he'll be looking for more than RT money from the Bills. Meaning he's gone after the season even if the Bills play Glenn at RT. And no, they won't approach Glenn about a paycut if he plays RT.

[YardRat]

But you're saying you're ok with LT?-Incognito-C?-Miller-RT? Kouandjio has never played a full season, nor Groy, and Glenn has never played RT in the nfl. Your line has more question marks than mine does.

I'm absolutely ok with Glenn-Incognito-Wood-Miller-Pocic/Ramczyk/Moton.
I think KuJo acquitted himself well enough I'm willing to see what he can bring on a full time basis at LT. If he fails to progress, or regresses, we flip Glenn back to LT. Incognito is a given, although he is getting long in the tooth. I didn't see any drop off at all when Groy replaced Wood, plus he's younger and cheaper. RG is a concern, regardless of the other four positions. I don't mind paying Glenn and having him line up on the right, the difference between expectations of the two tackles isn't as drastic as it used to be. IMO if you're going to put the five best guys on the field at once, atm it's CK-RI-RG-??-CG. Any other combination and it's LT-RG-C-??-??. One ? is better than two, and as I said if Kujo can't hack it we're back to two ? anyway. If he can, we're pretty solid.

That being said, if Miller somehow miraculously elevates his play above the level of 'disappointing', I'd also be OK with CG-RI-RG-JM-Rookie and CK as the swing tackle back-up, but I have less confidence in him than KuJo to be able to swing it.

[YardRat]

That's where I see Kouandjio doing fine, backup swing tackle, give him a shot at right. Groy is also good depth. As much as I want competition for Miller at RG, it might be too much to ask for. Miller, imho is still in the rookie-contract, possibility zone. I'm not sure he's good, but I'm not sure he's not good, and I think solving the revolving door at RT and giving him a shot with someone decent on his shoulder might give a better idea. At the least, Miller seems to hold up, and if he's inadequate, might be easier to replace when the RT issue is fixed.

I'm thinking RT is compelling with RG up after that for scrutiny.
Don't you think having Glenn at RT might help Miller, then?

[Mace]

Don't you think having Glenn at RT might help Miller, then?

He's never played RT. You don't really want to help Miller by weakening the left side do you ?

There's one obvious hole, RT. Fill the one hole and don't potentially make more of them elsewhere. How does this not make sense because it's pretty much the same thing everyone always complains we never do ?

You get pretty upset too when we have one hole and instead make more of them, it's the same pointless cycle you disagree with.

[SpikedLemonade]

This is a discussion of how much chicken crap we should put in our chicken crap sandwich.

In the end, it is still a chicken crap sandwich.

There is not OL talent on this team no matter how we shuffle them.

[jimmifli]

He's never played RT. You don't really want to help Miller by weakening the left side do you ?

There's one obvious hole, RT. Fill the one hole and don't potentially make more of them elsewhere. How does this not make sense because it's pretty much the same thing everyone always complains we never do ?

You get pretty upset too when we have one hole and instead make more of them, it's the same pointless cycle you disagree with.
Glenn was talked about as a RT during the draft because it was thought he was too slow for LT. And people have been talking about moving him to RT since he got here. Well he proved that wrong. Him and Richie are great on the left, let them be great. It seems we've got two average C's, that's nice if we can afford it. Miller was pretty good in run blocking, and upped his pass blocking from pitiful to sad throughout the season. If that trend keeps going he'll be meh by midseason next year.

I don't buy the CK can only play LT theory, if the light finally went on, he'll win the job at RT and we'll have a solid line... but I don't think we can depend on that. We need another RT, I'd like to see an early draft pick. If Kouandijio does win the RT job, we can let the draft pick compete for the RG spot with Miller. Worse case we've got a solid left side that can pass block and dominate in the run, and a rights side that can run block OK and be below average in pass blocking. That'd be a big upgrade over last season, and the upside is if the draft pick and/or CK are for real we have a very goo line.

I just don't see any situation where moving our second best OL from the most important position on the line to a less important position he's never played, so that a guy that's sucked since he was drafted except for five games can start at the most important position on the line,.... I just don't see any situation where that makes sense.

[YardRat]

He's never played RT. You don't really want to help Miller by weakening the left side do you ?

There's one obvious hole, RT. Fill the one hole and don't potentially make more of them elsewhere. How does this not make sense because it's pretty much the same thing everyone always complains we never do ?

You get pretty upset too when we have one hole and instead make more of them, it's the same pointless cycle you disagree with.
I guess I look at it as filling holes, not making more. My perception of the oline right now is LT-LG-C-Hole-Hole. RG is just as much of a concern for me as RT. Even if KuJo isn't better (maybe even a slight downgrade) than Glenn at LT, we already know he can't play RT. Really, nobody we have, except for maybe Glenn, can. So to me it isn't creating a hole at LT by plugging in KuJo over there, it's filling a hole by moving Glenn to RT. If the situation at RG were different, I would probably feel differently. We give a little bit at LT to gain a lot at RT.

[YardRat]

Glenn was talked about as a RT during the draft because it was thought he was too slow for LT. And people have been talking about moving him to RT since he got here. Well he proved that wrong. Him and Richie are great on the left, let them be great. It seems we've got two average C's, that's nice if we can afford it. Miller was pretty good in run blocking, and upped his pass blocking from pitiful to sad throughout the season. If that trend keeps going he'll be meh by midseason next year.

I don't buy the CK can only play LT theory, if the light finally went on, he'll win the job at RT and we'll have a solid line... but I don't think we can depend on that. We need another RT, I'd like to see an early draft pick. If Kouandijio does win the RT job, we can let the draft pick compete for the RG spot with Miller. Worse case we've got a solid left side that can pass block and dominate in the run, and a rights side that can run block OK and be below average in pass blocking. That'd be a big upgrade over last season, and the upside is if the draft pick and/or CK are for real we have a very goo line.

I just don't see any situation where moving our second best OL from the most important position on the line to a less important position he's never played, so that a guy that's sucked since he was drafted except for five games can start at the most important position on the line,.... I just don't see any situation where that makes sense.
It makes sense because we have absolutely nobody at RT. Add into that we have almost nobody at RG.

For the record, I was pretty vocal at the time against those who insisted Glenn was much better suited for RT and wouldn't be able to hack it as an LT at this level.

If we can manage to score an upgrade at RT AND RG this off season, great...keep Glenn on the left and KuJo as depth. I'm just not confident we can fill two holes with outsiders, especially considering we're not going to be able to compete that much in free agency.

[Mace]

I guess I look at it as filling holes, not making more. My perception of the oline right now is LT-LG-C-Hole-Hole. RG is just as much of a concern for me as RT. Even if KuJo isn't better (maybe even a slight downgrade) than Glenn at LT, we already know he can't play RT. Really, nobody we have, except for maybe Glenn, can. So to me it isn't creating a hole at LT by plugging in KuJo over there, it's filling a hole by moving Glenn to RT. If the situation at RG were different, I would probably feel differently. We give a little bit at LT to gain a lot at RT.

I don't see Miller as a hole. I don't see him as the rock of ages either, but he's adequate. Can be improved upon, but he's got a hole to his side. Fill the hole, see if that helps him, if not, address him. Miller is a 2 year starter and has, imho, shown more than I've seen from 3 years of Kouandjio. He hasn't had good RT's next to him, or even one guy. He hasn't been terrible, benefit of the doubt (to me).


maybe Glenn, can

This is the thing. Maybe you just weakened two positions, and swing tackle makes three, instead of just addressing the obvious one. Then you have again put off just addressing the obvious one.

Well just move them back ? That disrupts. Continuity is very good and important on an o-line. There will still be the RT issue.

This doesn't have to be elaborate. We have a good starting LT, and a good swing tackle/backup. RT needed, only one move required.

You know, yourself, that when they complicate things, they just complicate things for the sake of it.

[YardRat]

I don't see Miller as a hole. I don't see him as the rock of ages either, but he's adequate. Can be improved upon, but he's got a hole to his side. Fill the hole, see if that helps him, if not, address him. Miller is a 2 year starter and has, imho, shown more than I've seen from 3 years of Kouandjio. He hasn't had good RT's next to him, or even one guy. He hasn't been terrible, benefit of the doubt (to me).



This is the thing. Maybe you just weakened two positions, and swing tackle makes three, instead of just addressing the obvious one. Then you have again put off just addressing the obvious one.

Well just move them back ? That disrupts. Continuity is very good and important on an o-line. There will still be the RT issue.

This doesn't have to be elaborate. We have a good starting LT, and a good swing tackle/backup. RT needed, only one move required.

You know, yourself, that when they complicate things, they just complicate things for the sake of it.
Those are all fair points, and I'm certainly not taking a 'I'm right and your wrong' approach to the discussion. We just have different perceptions of Miller and KuJo. At least we both agree that RT is an issue, I just don't see the harm in trying to address that issue by moving the tackles around a little bit and drafting a guard/center (or getting one in free agency) to try to get the best five guys on the field. As I said earlier, if we could manage to bring in a couple of guys to address both positions to the right of center, Glenn stays at LT and KuJo stays as swing, I certainly wouldn't have a problem with that.

[Mace]

Those are all fair points, and I'm certainly not taking a 'I'm right and your wrong' approach to the discussion. We just have different perceptions of Miller and KuJo. At least we both agree that RT is an issue, I just don't see the harm in trying to address that issue by moving the tackles around a little bit and drafting a guard/center (or getting one in free agency) to try to get the best five guys on the field. As I said earlier, if we could manage to bring in a couple of guys to address both positions to the right of center, Glenn stays at LT and KuJo stays as swing, I certainly wouldn't have a problem with that.

We'll just agree to disagree about Miller, Kouandjio and moving Glenn then, and see what they do with the draft/fa.

For certain, Kuandjio is behind the 8-ball by not being able to participate in a new system until training camp though.