Orton's stats

[yordad]

Re: Orton's stats

those metrics the OP cited are going to be better for a guy who's played 4 games than the QB's who've played 8. That being said, he's thrown for a lot of yards and is top 30 QB despite playing half the number of games of the guys ahead of him. If he had the same production in first 4 games (unlikely since he joined the team in the last week so it'd have been hard to run the offense at all in the first week or 2) he'd be in the top6 of QBs.

I think he'll regress some and be closer to his .500 average, 60% completion qb that he's always been. but i hope he isn't. it'd be fun it he can only get better and carry the team for a long run. but it seems like a long shot.

i still think, regardless of his stats, he's an enjoyable guy to root for.

Why would they be better for a guy who played 4 games as opposed to 8? That is simply not true. It could just as easily be worse.

That said, the Vikings, the Pats and the Lions are all TOP 5 in passing defense. TOP FIVE. The Jets are 14th.

Botttomline... if Orton is top 10 vs good defenses in his first 4 starts in a new system with all new wide receivers and behind the crappiest O-line in the NFL.... I think we got a damn good bargain.

[Fletch]

Re: Orton's stats

i still think, regardless of his stats, he's an enjoyable guy to root for.

He is enjoyable to root for.

He's also hardly the weak link on a team with the issues that we do have.

[Meathead]

Re: Orton's stats

hes no kelly holcomb or nick rolovich but he'll do

[Fletch]

Re: Orton's stats

It shows our line sucks, not that Orton isn't a top ten QB like you imply based on this. In fact, it is an argument in favor of Orton if anything.

Not sure that I was implying anything other than his stats from the Jets game skews everything.

Think about it, in the Detroit game 308 yards passing, 17 offensive points, 9 from FGs. 1 passing TD.

In the New England game 299 passing, 1 passing TD, 22 offensive points.

In the Minnesota game 283 passing, 2 passing TDs, 17 offensive points.

In the Jets game, 238 passing, 4 passing TDs, 43 offensive points.

Let me ask you a question, would you start Orton every week in FFL? I mean if he's a top-10 QB he would and should be starting on most ffl rosters, right?

Otherwise I was just posting some data and asking some questions. Apparently no one seems to think that when we get sacked that it means much, but many of those same people will build a case out of a defense being tops because of sacks. I don't see how that can possibly be. Either sacks matter or they don't. But they would have to have a similar impact both ways.

[trapezeus]

Re: Orton's stats

Why would they be better for a guy who played 4 games as opposed to 8? That is simply not true. It could just as easily be worse.

That said, the Vikings, the Pats and the Lions are all TOP 5 in passing defense. TOP FIVE. The Jets are 14th.

Botttomline... if Orton is top 10 vs good defenses in his first 4 starts in a new system with all new wide receivers and behind the crappiest O-line in the NFL.... I think we got a damn good bargain.

it could be worse. my point is that those metrics can be skewed either way with a smaller sample size. i think his total yards being high is impressive. I think his targets of 8-10 receivers a game is impressive. i think 3-1 is impressive.

but i am not sold until i see the sesaon. he could be worse, he could be better. the 10 year record is that he tends to even out. if he breaks out in a full season (or 12 games in his case) and takes us to the playoffs, i'm fully on board for a 3-4 year contract, front loaded to make him a starter. i wouldnt do a longer stretch because i would be afraid he'd regress back to his norms.

[BuffaloRedleg]

Re: Orton's stats

He doesn't pass the eye test but those are some great stats. Usually the eye test in the end is correct.

The next 2 games well tell us a lot.

[Guest]

Re: Orton's stats

Orton gives a chance to win games that EJ could not.

I'm rooting for him.

We have to win 3 of the next 4 games. 3 of those games are at home.

Let's see him lead us to those victories.

[Ed]

Re: Orton's stats

Orton has definitely been better than I expected and I'm actually excited to see what he can do the rest of the way. The only thing keeping him from making more plays and being more consistent is better pass protection. Orton looks like he has cement blocks for feet and zero ability to avoid sacks. I'd like to say he could do a better job of getting rid of the ball, but that would require actually getting out of the pocket. His mobility will always be a limitation, so the O-line really needs to find a way to step up. Right now, the O-line is really the only major concern I have about this team.

[TacklingDummy]

Re: Orton's stats

It shows our line sucks, not that Orton isn't a top ten QB like you imply based on this. In fact, it is an argument in favor of Orton if anything.

Just goes to show you, even with a line that "sucks", teams can win if the QB produces.

[CommissarSpartacus]

Re: Orton's stats

hes no kelly holcomb or nick rolovich but he'll do

Actually, what's gone on is VERY similar to 2005.

Remember, Losman, a secod year first round pick, was anointed the starter that year and Holcomb was signed to play backup.

Losman won his first game, then stunk for 3 games in a row. Holcomb went in and the team immediately improved.

The difference between 2005 and now is that EJ doesn't have REMOTELY the same number of rabid fans as Losman had. Why that is is a matter of opinion.

Maybe it's because the Losmaniacs are 9 years older and so at least SOME are wiser.

[cookie G]

Re: Orton's stats

Orton gives a chance to win games that EJ could not.

I'm rooting for him.

We have to win 3 of the next 4 games. 3 of those games are at home.

Let's see him lead us to those victories.

With the running game the way it is, and Manuel's inability to hit a moving WR, I cringe to think where this offense would be had he not been named the starter.

[better days]

Re: Orton's stats

Actually, what's gone on is VERY similar to 2005.

Remember, Losman, a secod year first round pick, was anointed the starter that year and Holcomb was signed to play backup.

Losman won his first game, then stunk for 3 games in a row. Holcomb went in and the team immediately improved.

The difference between 2005 and now is that EJ doesn't have REMOTELY the same number of rabid fans as Losman had. Why that is is a matter of opinion.

Maybe it's because the Losmaniacs are 9 years older and so at least SOME are wiser.

Well, Orton is a much better QB than Holcomb as well.

I don't think Holcomb was any better than Losman at all, just different.

[Fletch]

Re: Orton's stats

Orton has definitely been better than I expected and I'm actually excited to see what he can do the rest of the way. The only thing keeping him from making more plays and being more consistent is better pass protection. Orton looks like he has cement blocks for feet and zero ability to avoid sacks. I'd like to say he could do a better job of getting rid of the ball, but that would require actually getting out of the pocket. His mobility will always be a limitation, so the O-line really needs to find a way to step up. Right now, the O-line is really the only major concern I have about this team.

I lean toward it being a combination of things. This OL should be better than it was last season and in past seasons. Should be.

Orton's taking sacks at nearly twice the rate at which he took them as a starter in either Chicago or Denver. His O-lines there didn't seem to be better than here, if anything I'd say worse. It's not like he had a bunch of pro-bowlers protecting him except for Kreutz in Chicago.

I'm thinking it comes down to play-calling impacting the line's requirements and Orton being older and not having played in several years.

It will be interesting to keep an eye on during the second half of the season.

[Fletch]

Re: Orton's stats

He doesn't pass the eye test but those are some great stats. Usually the eye test in the end is correct.

The next 2 games well tell us a lot.

Well, to be fair, his stats in the first three games were completely the opposite of the way they were with the Jets.

It was kind of like Spiller in 2012 where he started with 29 carries for 292 rushing yards and 3 rushing TDs. He really didn't have another game like either of those two first games and his next 100-yard game wasn't until 10 games later or something, but it set the tone for expectations that he couldn't live up to. After those two games Spiller was averaging over 10 yards per carry. The rest of the season he averaged just over half of that.

I view the Jets game like that. If people are really expecting top-10 play from Orton I think that they'll be disappointed. Of the stats used to start this thread, other than the longest pass stuff, the only time that he's finished in the top-10 of any of the other categories in his career was in 2010 when he finished 4th in yards/game. Fitzpatrick had more TDs on over 600 fewer yards in the same number of games that season.

The dust is going to settle from that Jets game which was one of the strangest we've played in years. When it does Orton will more than likely revert to the QB he was in the first three games he played here. It's wise to expect more production along those lines.

[CommissarSpartacus]

Re: Orton's stats

Well, Orton is a much better QB than Holcomb as well.

I don't think Holcomb was any better than Losman at all, just different.

You were a Losman fan, right?